GnosticChristianBishop

I read English.

Try writing it, if you want to be understood, stupid.

Regards

DL 

Noetic Science will cover telepathy and it's proofs or evidence.

I am just a guy with a victim to prove my testimony.

Google will get you the toys. 

I used one about a year ago, and our military have been using that same technology for weapons deployment and tracking.

Regards

DL

IOW, you were talking out of your large ass.

Get your dad. I like to speak to adults.

Regards

DL

Where have I erred?

Regards

DL

You must be well read.

Where do I differ with the usual Gnostic Christian?

Regards

DL

"There is indoctrination into everything."

Yes, but I dislike how so many are indoctrinated by religions into homophobia and misogyny and the notion that a genocidal God is somehow a good God.

Regards

DL

There is also indoctrination into immoral religions, that force parents to hate their gay or female children.

Regards

DL.

"More importantly, how were those ethical systems arrived at?"

By argument, before the stupidity of supernatural belief put Christianity in the Dark Ages, where those fools remain.

I hope you can see how intelligent the ancients were as compared to the mental efforts that modern preachers and theists are using with the literal reading of myths.
 
https://bigthink.com/videos/what-is-god-2-2
 
Further.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/03132009/watch.html
 
Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."
 
Please listen as to what is said about the literal reading of myths.
 
"Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."
 
Matt 7;12 So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.
 
This is how early Gnostic Christians view the transition from reading myths properly to destructive literal reading and idol worship.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D
 

===========

I have enjoyed listening to many of his works.

I like intelligent apologists for my side.

It is too bad that there are no decent religious apologists about these days.

I used to learn the odd thing from Christian apologists  but atheists are the better source today, --- strangely.

I guess it is all about knowing your enemy.

Regards

DL

"That is a low IQ take, but it's your choice. "

It is the moral choice, so end in hell with you immoral genocidal prick of a God.

Moral men will pity you for being so morally low and stupid.

Regards

DL

Sure, but it is also what some call the root of Western thinking and law under our Judeo Christian inheritance.

It is, in a small part, with much of the garbage policies in Christianity taken out, due to our secular laws ignoring the more immoral and vile homophobic and misogynous policies.

If we had not brought Christianity to heel, the secular would have had to form their own inquisitions and jihads to rid ourselves of that immoral creed.

I have links if you need education.

Regards

DL

 

"I do fight evil every day.  I fight against Atheism and its lies and deceptions."

What deception are you seeing?

I see more lies and deception in the God religions.

Have you not seen the stats that show atheists to be way more moral peaceful and law abiding than believers? 

Regards

DL

"I agree with the 10 commandments.  Not following the 10 commandments is sinful. The question is - whether all sin is evil or not? Certainly sin is not good. But does that lead ergo to evil? " 

I did not take you to be a Christian.

Only a fool would like the 10 evil commandments.

As to sin being evil, have you not sung along with Christians --- of Adam's sin being a happy fault and necessary to God's plan?

God, in the bible I read, says that he created both good and evil for his pleasure.

What pleasure do you see God gaining by creating and doing evil?

Regards

DL

"God does not control everything."

Who does, given that scriptures say God controls our desire to believe or not by his application, or not, of grace.

Read this old O.P. before your reply.

Are non-believers doomed by Divine Design?
 
Scriptures say that God decides if a person will be a believer or non-believer. Those scriptures are shown in this link.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byHYeHN4ZUQ
 
Those quotes seems to really screw up the free will notion that Christians say God gives us.
 
The free will that God offers is kind of a joke anyway given the number of people whose free will to live is ignored in the billions of adults, children and babies that God is shown to torture and murder in scriptures.
 
If the bible and Yahweh are to be believed, and as a non-believer, I, of course, cannot believe it, thanks to God, by God’s design and will against me, then why did God deny me belief or faith?
 
Even more important to believers, might be to answer the question of; did God make you a believer in things that you can only hope exists and can never confirm?
 
Are you happy with God ignoring or negating your free will to think as you please?
 
I have assumed that God’s work of creating both believers and non-believers is working. If that is so, and you believers must think it so, just as I as a non-believer cannot think it is working, --- and Jesus said that those with faith could do all he did and more, --- then there is not even one believer or person of faith that has ever existed.
 
Either the bible and Christianity is all a lie, or there must be some who can do what Jesus did.
 
 
What is your choice of those two options?
 
Is the bible and Christianity a lie, or is God just not creating any people with faith, --- which would make all Christians who say they have faith, --- liars.
 
I mean no insult here but someone is definitely lying, if we read what is written and look at reality and listen to Christians.
 
What do you think is the truth?
 
Is it just for God to create people doomed to hell even if they wanted to believe?
 
Regards
DL

" All one has to do join God’s people is accept that Jesus is the Lord and Savior."

True, but that is a sin to do, as it includes you abdicating your responsibility for your own sins as well as ignoring what Jesus himself taught.

On Jesus dying for Christians. Try to think in a moral way.

It takes quite an inflated ego to think a god would actually die for us, after condemning us unjustly in the first place.

Christians have swallowed a lie and don’t care how evil they make Jesus to keep their feel good get out of hell free card.

It is a lie, first and foremost, because, like it or not, having another innocent person suffer or die for the wrongs you have done, --- so that you might escape responsibility for having done them, --- is immoral.

To abdicate your personal responsibility for your actions or use a scapegoat is immoral.

Christians also have to ignore what Jesus, as a Jewish Rabbi, would have taught his people.
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. 
Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.
 
Psa 49;7 None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:

There is no way that Christians would teach their children to use a scapegoat to escape their just punishments and here you are promoting doing just that.
Jesus is just a smidge less immoral than his demiurge genocidal father, and here you are trying to put him as low in moral fiber as Yahweh. Tsk tsk.

Are you ready to sin to be saved?

Regards
DL 

"You'll also still have the opportunity to repent and be with God. "

Why would anyone want to spend eternity with a genocidal, homophobic and misogynous God?

Do you like St. Hitler, and do you want to spend eternity with him as well?

Regards

DL

Are you expressing belief or Christian dogma?

"God will miraculously heal someone but leaves room for doubt."

You have seen this personally have you?

 "Faith is asked for by God and a person only has faith if there's room for doubt."

When and where did this event happen?

Regards

DL

"Is it perhaps a duty in religion, or in some parts of a religious groups, to convince others that your god is real?"

It is indeed a duty and a part of my Gnostic Christian ideology.

If one thinks he has the best God and laws  or rules to live life by, I think one would be duty bound to let others know.

Imagine if it were otherwise.

We would still be living in trees and caves because the better ideas went unspoken.

Regards

DL

"Do you have any evidence/arguments that would prove that humans have souls/immaterial minds?"

About 96% of us think in a material dualism, body/soul, way.

Is a survey evidence? I think so.

Telepathy is also evidence that we have an immaterial consciousness that we can use outside of our own bodies.

There are even toys that are mind controlled.

We live in a dualistic reality, and logic and reason, --- and what we think statistically, --- seem to show this exactly.

Regards

DL

"What religion/s do YOU believe should be abolished?"

All religions that asks/forces parents to hate their gay or female children by preaching homophobia and misogyny.

Regards

DL

Yes.

All moral people will speak against evil or immoral practices.

That excludes all homophobes and misogynists in the right wings of politics and religions.

Regards

DL

Modern Gnostic Christians name our god "I am", and yes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation and “I am”, represents the best rules and laws that we have found to live by.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
   
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail. 
Alan Watts - On The Book of Eli - YouTube
 
Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.
 
On Becoming an Adult - YouTube


The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural and literal reading of myths.

Gnosis enlightens adults.

Regards
DL

Thanks for this, and apologies for my reading a bit too quickly before.

I was going to tell our friend that in philosophical debates, if a general term cannot be address, like good or evil, without a definition argument before hand, it is likely never going to get to the issue and get hung up on the definition arguments.

I think our friend is less than honest and that is why he posted as he did.

Christians are the hardest people to get to discuss morals with, because theirs are so poor.

There were/are good reasons for them to use inquisitions and murder to grow their religion, as they did not have decent moral arguments.

Regards

DL

Reciprocity is fair play, and I agree that like should be returned for like unless it does not suit ones agenda.

To tolerate the intolerant, for instance, is not reciprocity.

If the other cannot see the log in his eye, it should be pointed out.

Most are too obtuse though, especially in religions.

My definition is above.

No one argued against it.

I have a general definition. Don't you?

Regards

DL

"I'm not sure what you mean by this"

I mean that Jews have always put man above God, in recognition that all the notions about any god are man made.

Jesus even asks in scriptures, have ye forgotten that ye are gods?

Most have, but not the intelligent who know what religions are all about.

"-- it certainly isn't a useful reduction of any religious view, especially one as complex as the Jewish approach to the world."

I see the Christian religion as a naturalistic religion, given that both it and nature praise sin and evil as necessary to God's plan to Christians and natures plan to the brighter who have discarded supernatural thinking as garbage thinking.  

See post 4.

Belief in Jewry has always been led by those who preach the oral traditions.

I do not think any Jew has ever been fool enough as to believe in talking serpents and donkeys.

Christians, on the other hand -----

Regards

DL

I have noted that no one wants to utter the name of Yahweh or Jesus in answer to this O.P.

I know why and so do Christians who cannot do decent apologetics for either of those vile and immoral god/s.

Regards

DL

The historic parts in their holy books are not explanations.

Regardless, the author is not here to explain his choice of words and neither is the scholar who quoted it.

I just call it myth and allegory and see it as foolish to believe in a literal way.

The Jews put man above god and that is good enough for Gnostic Christians and the other more intelligent religions that do the same.

They are doing what is intelligent as compared to those who put God above man.

Especially the genocidal, homophobic and misogynous Christian/Muslim god. 

Regards

DL

Thanks for this.

I think I agreed with you in my reply to Stephen.

Let me reprint ---

My simple definition for good and evil is, ----- what I like done to me is good, and what I do not like done to me is evil.

Thanks for this.

My simple definition for good and evil is, ----- what I like done to me is good, and what I do not like done to me is evil.

Regards

DL  

"Is evil real? Is good real?"

If you do not know what evil and good are, can I take it that you do not fight evil?

I think that good and evil are real, and that you and I would likely agree on which side a given situation is good or evil.

About 90 % start our morality with a reciprocity rule and that is why there is so much more good in the world than evil.

Regards

DL

Indeed. 

Please remember that we hold no supernatural beliefs and used our myth for arguing against the Christians when they knew that their story was also a myth.  

The inquisitors did a lot of lying to justify their many murders of better creeds.

I would not say that we see Jesus as divine. 

We see him as an Eastern mystic and hero of 1,000 faces as coined by Joseph Campbell. 

We kept the older and better thinking.

Whose name do you use for the first commandment?

Jesus who said “he comes to cure and not kill the afflicted”.

Yahweh says he will come to kill, not cure the afflicted.

The one who always kills, has some Jews calling Yahweh a evil god.

I think the term suits.

You could name Spirit, if you are a Trinitarian, but the spirit does not speak in the bible, except to those with a Jesus consciousness, or one who has risen to a Christ consciousness.

Gnostic Christians condemned Yahweh to hell way back when Christians had morals.

We put our myth against theirs and called their God evil, and then the good old inquisitions; instead of trying to win the argument.

Jesus and his Armageddon does not seem to be much better than the genocidal Yahweh.

Most who read this might not agree, --- but if you put any name other than yourself, --- as the spirit that judges the good or evil in the Christian God, --- then you might wonder why you venerate an evil God.

I name Spirit God as I will not go to hell where Yahweh and Jesus are bound to end.

 Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be Matthew.

People hate moral questions.

We are all sinners, thank God; who will sin by accepting to follow one of the Christian Gods?

IMO, Christianity had the potential to be the worlds best religion. It changed and is now failing.

I think it a shame that they will drag Gnostic Christianity down with it.

Who do you name for Commandment # 1?

Regards
DL

They all have brains, but ignore the moral part for the fellowship part.

They are poor examples of decent people, as the fathers basically have to hate their gay and female children.

That is a must in their homophobic and misogynous creeds.

Regards

DL

Not surprising, given that her majority of neighbors are likely the religious who dare not judge their god justly.

Regards

DL

Does your ideology include a clause that says you should raise hell against evil religions?
 
Seems like a decent overall ideology.
 
Does your ideology include a clause that says you should raise hell against evil religions?
 
This, --- for evil to grow, all good people need do is nothing, --- is a part of my ideology/theology, given that I call myself a Gnostic Christian.
 
Does yours, and how do you exercise that degrading chore?
 
Regards
DL

Tip of the iceberg.

Gays and women have been religions longest running victims.

Strange how churches still preach that vile harmful garbage.

Who just said something about not complaining or caring about that here?

Regards

DL

 

I think we have ascertained your poor moral worth.

Go find someone of your low status.

Regards

DL

Etrn

There is no justification for genocide from a god who can cure as easily as kill.

Your views are stupid and immoral.

Your morals have been corrupted.

If you admire the biblical savior Jesus, you have never debated his morals. Especially his no divorce for women ansd substitutional punishment policies.

If you had, you would know how vile some of his non-Gnostic thinking is.

When you are ready, let me know.

Genocide is never the best option, even if you like the idea of having Jesus do one.

Regards

DL

Ya.

Let's not mention child rape.

The churches do not like that.

They just like to do it, and latter do the really larger infraction and have parents set the price of the rape.

Let's see, --- slavery is not legal, --- but selling my son or daughter's flesh to my church after their rape is.

Quite the religions, and quite the immoral god forsaken societies that allow it.

Regards

DL

Yet naturalistic thinking leads to a better non-genocidal a hole god.

Regards

DL

"So Christianity - a theistic religion - is a take off of naturalistic thinking which starts with the presupposition that there is no God? Where in the world did you learn that from?"

Now that is stupid, given that we are Gnostic Christians and follow the esoteric Jesus archetype to find God.

My view is that there is a God, and in our material dualism, that God is us.

 
Modern Gnostic Christians name our god "I am", and yes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation and “I am”, represents the best rules and laws that we have found to live by.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
   
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail. 
Alan Watts - On The Book of Eli - YouTube
 
Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.
 
On Becoming an Adult - YouTube


The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural and literal reading of myths.

Regards
DL

Perhaps.

Armageddon makes Jesus quite evil.

I do not like the immoral savior ideas that immoral Christians will ignore.

I do not those who adore an evil genocidal god.

Regards

DL

"Let me clarify. You have given no biblical justification for your assertion that sinlessness will make humans go extinct."

If sin must be in us and be a necessary part of Yahweh's plan, which it clearly is as sung by Christians, and confirmed by scriptures, then without it we go extinct.

If you stop competing, or never start, you would go extinct.

You asked why you should look into evolutionary theology.

Perhaps to learn something.

I learned that Christianity is a take off on naturalistic thinking, which confirms the stupidity of supernatural beliefs. 

Regards

DL 

"What do you mean by "you"?"

Do you think we define that word differently?

Regards

DL

If we are accountable, as you say, then we cannot use a savior or scapegoat. Right?

So much for Jesus saving all.

Do you see it as a sin to abdicate ones responsibility and use Jesus in our steed?

Regards

DL 

Job 2;3 has Yahweh admitting to having been moved to sin by Satan.

It is stupid for you to quote what can be easily refuted or negated.

Regards

DL

"our opinions about what God is or is not has no bearing on reality."

You are not looking at the right places.

The opinions on god that the mainstream hold, has cause churches to preach homophobia and misogyny while our governments preach equality.

 You have a moral duty to fight that shit, but I guess you can't smell it in your reality.

Think of your own family line and you might get it.

Regards

DL