Where in the Bible does it say that sex with a child is wrong?

Author: Best.Korea

Posts

Total: 167
Topic's author
#91
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@hey-yo
I use the words of those who created the bible and sustained tradition for thousands of years. They wrote it, they can explain it.  Just as any author can explain his or her own written book.
Okay, it seems that you are still confused about the topic.
If author's explanation isnt found in the book, then it stands true that book does not say what the author says.
The topic isnt "author's explanation of the Bible". The topic is "Bible says".


Too much evidence that conflicts with o.p. We can'ts have that now.  We mustn't negate precious! Silly hobbits.
What the fuck
#92
hey-yo
hey-yo's avatar
Debates: 25
Posts: 382
1
2
4
hey-yo's avatar
hey-yo
1
2
4
-->
@Lemming
We cant reproduce many technologies and buildings that ancient peoples had. Like roman concrete. Sometimes their things were better. 
#93
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,437
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@Best.Korea
There does seem to be a certain age - around 20 when children become adults and responsible for their actions.
The Bible does not say that sex before the age of 20 is wrong, so when saying "responsible for their actions", the Bible does not tell us anything about sex with children being wrong. 
Well, I think the argument could be made. After all, if persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for their actions, then they cannot be said to consent to sexual intercourse.  Hence, it would be considered rape.  Rape is forbidden. 

The Bible seems to indicate that when a nation is cursed and punished by God for its disobedience that its children would be killed by the enemy, or taken into captivity to become slaves at the whim of society and its laws.  Hence, it may be arguable that putting children into such a situation is a curse due to their sin. 
That is about slavery, not marriage. Nowhere does the Bible say that marriage is slavery. Even if it did, the Bible does not exactly condemn slavery.
I never said marriage is slavery. The question must be considered though. How did any such marriage occur? Was it lawful or not? It is clear that ALL unlawful marriages are forbidden by the Bible.  And if someone under the age of 20 cannot consent, then clearly it must have been unlawful. 

The Bible clearly prohibits sex with one's own children, siblings, mother-in-law, and other close family relationships.  It NEVER condones the violation of the vulnerable. It never condones "forcing oneself on another".  Yes, there are examples where it happens, but they are soundly condemned. 
Can you show us where the Bible says that "sex with children is wrong"?
I did above. Thank you very kindly. 

I know that Bible says how incest is wrong, but what does the Bible say in cases that arent incest?
Forbidden since they would be unlawful. 
#94
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,437
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@IlDiavolo
There does seem to be a certain age - around 20 when children become adults and responsible for their actions. 
Lol. Mary, the mother of Jesus, got married at around 13yo according to some studies, which was very common back then.
yes, I have read the speculative stories. 

I don't give them much plausibility. 

After all, this would be the situation in that culture.  In Middle Eastern ancient cultures, teenagers did not exist. I am not saying that people didn't reach teenage years but that society was not divided into what we in the modern world understand children, teenagers and adults. Back then they had children and adults.  Once a child became an adult in Israel then they were treated as an adult.  The question of course is when was that line drawn in the sand? Was it individual based upon the unique circumstances, of the person or was there a set time, such as we do today in modern society?

I happen to take the view that they drew a line in the sand at the age of 20.  Hence, kids might have been betrothed prior to adulthood, in accordance with the customs of arranged marriages, but not consummated until  they were of age. 


The problem with this thread is that BK assumes the bible was written by God's inspiration, so he expects to find everything on it, which is ludicrous. 
No, the problem with this thread is that the author is trying to get a rise out of people with his racist and bigoted and foolish ideas. It has nothing to do with the truth or not of the bible. 

And I think that proves Christianity has no solid foundations. A pedophile could be a Christian and abuse children at the same time given that "the bible doesn't condemn it". 
That is an absurd proposition. 
#95
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,616
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
@Best.Korea


And can you define "child" in the biblical sense?
Person under 10 years of age is a child.

And where does the KJ bible define a child as anyone under the age of 10?



The Biblical definition of a child is irrelevant to the topic. You were given the definition you can use. Now please stick to the topic.

Nope.  One simple question and you are in retreat already. 


Now please stick to the topic.

 I am sticking with the topic, you clown.  Your topic concerns sexual intercourse with a "child"#1. YOU gave us the biblical definition of  the word "child" #82 from YOUR "preferred bible" KJV- yet failed to support your claim using the very bible of YOUR OWN preference.

I have also asked you where in YOUR "preferred bible" KJV- does it say that Jesus died on the cross?
  But you are far too thick and dense to understand that this is a related question to YOUR own question i.e "where in the bible does it say"? Suggesting that if it is not in the bible then it must be right and correct and sanctioned by god to have sex with a "person under ten years old" because the bible of your own choosing and "preference" doesn't say  that it prohibits the vile sick acts with a child  that you appear to be attempting to promote.



So I suggest that you go back to post #1 and read this thread- YOUR OWN thread - very carefully, thicko.

 Or simply request that this sick thread - YOUR thread- be locked.

Topic's author
#96
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Tradesecret
After all, if persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for their actions, then they cannot be said to consent to sexual intercourse.
First, you still didnt show us the verse in the Bible that says how persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for any actions they do.

Second, you need to show us where the Bible says that not being held accountable means not being able to consent.
Third, show us where the Bible says that rape is wrong.
Finally, show us where the Bible says that sex with a person who cannot consent is rape.

If a child breaks a window, Bible will not say that "a child couldnt have broken the window because children arent held accountable".

The Bible does say to correct children with rod, so Bible obviously doesnt talk about not being held accountable for any action.

Not being held accountable, even if true by the Bible, does not mean that Bible says it means not being able to do something.
Topic's author
#97
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Stephen
Please stop lying and stick to the topic.
Topic's author
#98
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Tradesecret
After all, if persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for their actions
Adding your words to the Bible is strictly forbidden by the Bible itself. You are supposed to know this.

Plus, you are making Christianity look very bad, because you are saying that the Bible says that 18 year old who rapes and kills a 2 year-old girl is not to be held accountable for what he did.
#99
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Best.Korea

Best.Korea,

YOUR QUOTES TO THE #1 BIBLE STUPID FOOL MISS TRADESECRET:  "Third, show us where the Bible says that rape is wrong.
Finally, show us where the Bible says that sex with a person who cannot consent is rape."

You have to learn, that Miss Tradesecret doesn't have the recognition of being the #1 Bible Stupid and ignorant fool in this Religion Forum for nothing! Remember, she only gives "OPINIONS" and never backs them up with actual Jesus inspired passages, understood?!

Therefore, to save Miss Tradesecret further embarrassment because of her outright Bible stupidity, here are some passages showing that rape is wrong to the point of murdering the wrongdoer man and paying the going "bride price" for marriage after the rape:

“But if in the open country a man meets a young woman who is betrothed, and the man seizes her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; she has committed no offense punishable by death. For this case is like that of a man attacking and murdering his neighbor, because he met her in the open country, and though the betrothed young woman cried for help there was no one to rescue her." (Deuteronomy 22:25-27)

“If a man seduces a virgin who is not betrothed and lies with her, he shall give the bride-price for her and make her his wife. If her father utterly refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money equal to the bride-price for virgins." (Exodus 22:16-17)

.


Topic's author
#100
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
The first verse talks about the rape of a married woman, not rape in general. Big difference.

 The second verse does not say that rape is wrong. It just says that the man must marry the girl he seduced.

This verse in the Bible says that man must marry the virgin girl if he raped her and if she is not already married:

"If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives." - Deuteronomy 22:28
Topic's author
#101
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
As we can see, the Bible does not say that the rapist should be punished with death or prison. Bible says that rapist should marry his victim and that the victim can never divorce her rapist.
Topic's author
#102
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
Now let us read full verse and context, so that we see what the Bible really says.

Bible says:
"If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the young woman because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man’s wife. You must purge the evil from among you.
25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, 27 for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives."

Therefore, we see that Bible says that rapist should be punished with death if he raped another man's wife.
But if he rapes a girl who is not married, then Bible doesnt say that there should be any punishment. Bible says that they are to be married even if the victim doesnt want to marry her rapist. So in a way, Bible says that rapist is to be rewarded.
#103
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,437
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@Best.Korea
After all, if persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for their actions, then they cannot be said to consent to sexual intercourse.
First, you still didnt show us the verse in the Bible that says how persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for any actions they do.
correct. I didn't show a verse that said that. I did however give you the credit for the ability to look it up.  But let me give you a clue. In the first five books of the Bible. It shouldn't take you too long. Such a scholar and all. 

Second, you need to show us where the Bible says that not being held accountable means not being able to consent.
Why? 

Third, show us where the Bible says that rape is wrong.
Try the book of Exodus. 

Finally, show us where the Bible says that sex with a person who cannot consent is rape.
The definition of rape is "no consent". 

If a child breaks a window, Bible will not say that "a child couldnt have broken the window because children arent held accountable".
They didn't have glass windows in the times of the bible. So silly comparison. And besides the argument is not that it did not happen. It is that such an action would be illegal. And the illegality is on the part of the child, but the adult. 

The Bible does say to correct children with rod, so Bible obviously doesnt talk about not being held accountable for any action.
Correction is not the same as holding some accountable. 

Not being held accountable, even if true by the Bible, does not mean that Bible says it means not being able to do something.
Again, we are not talking about whether bad things happen. Murders happened in the OT, and we all know what the 6th commandment was. 

#104
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,437
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@Best.Korea
After all, if persons under the age of 20 are not held accountable for their actions
Adding your words to the Bible is strictly forbidden by the Bible itself. You are supposed to know this.

Plus, you are making Christianity look very bad, because you are saying that the Bible says that 18 year old who rapes and kills a 2 year-old girl is not to be held accountable for what he did.

LOL @ you attempt at humour.  I haven't added anything to the bible.  I have merely indicated that persons under 20 are children. And that as such - consent is an issue. 

I am not making Christianity look bad. You are doing a fine job all by yourself. Even as a Hindu.  And I never indicated anything along the lines of what you said. 


#105
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,078
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Tradesecret
@Best.Korea
Please stick to the topic.

Persons over here under the age of 16 are considered  to be stupid to think for themselves and are at it like rabbits

And younger people under and over the age of 16 think that adults are stupid.

And some people will f**k anything that moves.

A bit like GODDO and his penchant for raping virgins.

And Jesus's propensity for boys only clubs.

How old was Mary by the way?
#106
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,616
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@zedvictor4
How old was Mary by the way?

 Most biblical scholars put the "immaculate conception" at 12. Regardless, she had no say in the matter going by BIBLICAL accounts. She was too young to understand what the fk was going  on, the BIBLE attests to this too, Vic lad.
#107
hey-yo
hey-yo's avatar
Debates: 25
Posts: 382
1
2
4
hey-yo's avatar
hey-yo
1
2
4
-->
@Best.Korea
What the fuck

My sentiment exactly. 

The topic isnt "author's explanation of the Bible". The topic is "Bible says".
Irrelevant! The bible is no different then any book or message in the sense that it is a message written by an author who developed a medium for their message. Regardless to whom or who or what ever that message is interpreted in order to be conveyed. 


If we are trying to convey the author's message (what the bible says) then we look to the author. Although the bible has many author and spans thousands of years, we can still maintain author's message and intent. 
#108
hey-yo
hey-yo's avatar
Debates: 25
Posts: 382
1
2
4
hey-yo's avatar
hey-yo
1
2
4
-->
@Best.Korea
Okay, so show us where the Bible says that.
You want me to show you where in the bible it says who is of a marrying age? 


You know, it would be very nice if you stopped confusing your words with words of the Bible.
Ditto. 


Bible says to multiply. Children can get pregnant. But you dont see me claiming that Bible says that people should marry children.
Im not sure what you are saying. 
May you clarify by explaining what our take away should be? 

I also have not seen a response to link provided, is there a reason for why? 



#109
hey-yo
hey-yo's avatar
Debates: 25
Posts: 382
1
2
4
hey-yo's avatar
hey-yo
1
2
4
-->
@zedvictor4
Some put Mary's age between 13 to 15. 

Persons over here under the age of 16 are considered  to be stupid to think for themselves and are at it like rabbits
Tad bit different setting no? Age of technology with everyone doing things for you vs. Learning a trade, combat, familial responsibilities, etc. 

I always figured kids stopped being a kid earlier in their lives during ancient times. Definitely died sooner. 
#110
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,078
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Stephen
I guessed as much.
#111
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,078
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@hey-yo
Very true.

My dad left school at fourteen and went to work in an abbatoir.

That was 1934, and 6 years later he went to fight in a war.

And today if you so much as say boo to kids they become psychological wrecks......Well you know what I mean.
Topic's author
#112
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Tradesecret
But let me give you a clue. In the first five books of the Bible.
Sorry, we are not dealing with clues here. Give us the verse.


Try the book of Exodus.
Okay, show us which verse in book of Exodus tells us that rape is wrong.


The definition of rape is "no consent"
Now show us where the Bible says that children cant consent.


They didn't have glass windows in the times of the bible. So silly comparison. And besides the argument is not that it did not happen. It is that such an action would be illegal. And the illegality is on the part of the child, but the adult.
You say that Bible says that child's actions are caused by the child. Now explain where does the Bible say that "not being held accountable" means "not being able to consent".
Also, dont forget to give us the verse regarding the age of accountability.


Correction is not the same as holding some accountable.
Accountable by definition means being guilty of something wrong. Therefore, why does the Bible say that children who are not guilty of anything should be punished for something they are not guilty of?
#113
Deb-8-a-bull
Deb-8-a-bull's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 3,205
3
2
3
Deb-8-a-bull's avatar
Deb-8-a-bull
3
2
3
-->
@zedvictor4
I am but a bad scripture translator. .
I am way to frivolous and much far fetched when it comes to translating scriptures. 
Sooooooooo.  Take note.m
And With this said. 

I can give you a easy dozen  times in wich the bible " CLEARLY " states,  THAT Sex with kids is wrong.
Ill give you ten . 

NUMBER 1.  Pslam. 73 bloody twenty fuckking six.  My flesh and my heart may fail.
So on and so on .
Ya can see what im gonna do cant ya. .

So I now ask you pleas 
( please ,  don't  make me post 10 more totally randomly plucked out scriptures that are in know way connected  to  " god said don't do kids" . 
And then-nnnnnnnnn argue black and mutha fucking blue with any of .you over its meaning.  
Cause i so fucking will.

Soooookoooo
BAD SCRIPTURE TRANSLATORS. 
AND LIKE ummmm . 
BIBLE ILLITERATE TRANSLATORS. 

Are in fact . 
The knew.

GOOD SCRIPTURE TRANSLATORS
AND LIKE UMMM
BIBLICAL SCHOLARS translators .

' places  fingers in ears  ' 
I aint fucking buying it. 

Good  say sir. 

I said good day.
Topic's author
#114
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Tradesecret
LOL @ you attempt at humour.  I haven't added anything to the bible.  I have merely indicated that persons under 20 are children. And that as such - consent is an issue.
First you said that you havent added anything to the Bible. Then in another sentence you say "consent is an issue". Show us where the Bible says that. Show us where the Bible says that children cant consent.


I am not making Christianity look bad. You are doing a fine job all by yourself. Even as a Hindu.  And I never indicated anything along the lines of what you said.
Did you or did you not say that people under 20 are not to be held accountable for their actions? Common, tell us.
Topic's author
#115
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@hey-yo
If we are trying to convey the author's message (what the bible says) then we look to the author. Although the bible has many author and spans thousands of years, we can still maintain author's message and intent.
Okay, you are obviously unable to stick to the topic.

The topic is not "author's message and intent".

You are unable to tell the difference between "book says" and "author of the book says".
#116
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Best.Korea


Best.Korea,

YOUR QUOTE OF ONCE AGAIN BEING BIBLE STUPID!!!:  “The first verse talks about the rape of a married woman, not rape in general. Big difference.”

RAPE IS RAPE!  Whether it be a married woman or not!  Therefore the verse in question that I gave you is answering your initial question where Jesus, as God, inspired passage says to MURDER the man rapist!  GET IT? Maybe? Just a "little bit?"



YOUR SECOND QUOTE AS DUMB AS YOUR FIRST QUOTE: “ The second verse does not say that rape is wrong. It just says that the man must marry the girl he seduced.”

In the verse in question, IT IS SHOWING THAT RAPE IS WRONG by the rapist man having to marry the girl he raped!  I am showing you that Jesus’ inspired words in the Bible sometimes CONTRADICT each other, understood?  H-E-L-L-O, anybody home today, NOT!


Jesus H. Christ, truer words were never spoken by you when you said that you don’t know why the membership is still conversing with you in an intellectual discussion: “True. I dont know why people still do it.”  LOL!

Take a break like Miss Tradesecret has to do when she continually steps in the proverbial poo all the time, okay?  Thanks!

.

Topic's author
#117
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
RAPE IS RAPE!  Whether it be a married woman or not!
Show us where the Bible says that.


IT IS SHOWING THAT RAPE IS WRONG by the rapist man having to marry the girl he raped!
That verse doesnt say that rape is wrong. Bible just says that rapist must marry his victim, which means that Bible doesnt say that a rapist cant keep raping his victim after he marries her.
Topic's author
#118
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
Bible says:

1 Corinthians 7:

"The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife.
Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer."

Therefore, Bible says that married women cannot say no to sex with their husbands if their husbands wish to have sex.
#119
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Best.Korea


Best.Korea,

MY QUOTE TO YOUR BIBLE STUPIDITY:  "RAPE IS RAPE!  Whether it be a married woman or not!"

YOUR CHILD LIKE RESPONSE TO MY QUOTE ABOVE: "Show us where the Bible says that."

Conversely, show us in the Bible where my quote; "RAPE IS RAPE! Whether it be a married woman or not!" does NOT say that!

BEGIN: 



MY QUOTE TO YOUR BIBLE INEPTNESS AGAIN:  "IT IS SHOWING THAT RAPE IS WRONG by the rapist man having to marry the girl he raped!"

YOUR STUPIDITY HAS NO BOUNDS RESPONSE TO MY QUOTE ABOVE:  "That verse doesnt say that rape is wrong. Bible just says that rapist must marry his victim, which means that Bible doesnt say that a rapist cant keep raping his victim after he marries her."

BEST.KOREA, HEADS UP, it IMPLIES that it was wrong because the rapist had to marry the woman he RAPED!!! 2+2=4, oil and water don't mix, and you are as Bible stupid as Miss Tradesecret!!!

Didn't you learn from Miss Tradesecret, that when you make yourself the continued third world idiot to Bible passages, that you should take a break and go into hiding like Miss Tradesecret has to do from time to time, to save further embarrassment?  Yes?


NEXT OUTRIGHT DUMMY PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN LIKE "BEST.KOREA" THAT DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THE "INTENT" OF BIBLE PASSAGES, WILL BE ... ?
.


Topic's author
#120
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 357
Posts: 10,650
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
it IMPLIES that it was wrong because the rapist had to marry the woman he RAPED!!!
Implies? Sounds like you are adding words to the Bible that arent there.

Bible also says that you have to marry a girl you had sex with. Doesnt mean that Bible implies how sex is wrong.

Please stop adding your words to the Bible.