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@ResurgetExFavilla
I respect Thett3 and Triangle
I have not interacted with Thett3 in a long time due to me mainly being active in the debates section of the site, but he's a good choice. Ironically, he is someone who just pointed out how we may have too many moderators right now.
Would you mind giving me a link to Triangle's user page?
I consider myself an extremist, but I don't think that you need to be an asshole to random people to be one.
We may define extremist differently... Generally if I picture the word in my head, you are not the type of person who would come to mind on account of the not being "an asshole to random people" thing.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
@Everyone
Why should conservative or traditionalist members trust a forum mod team composed entirely of progressives to be ideologically neutral?
One of the first day internal discussions we had was measures to increase transparency, and in such efforts getting the check and balance of at least one conservative member involved in moderation in at least an advisory capacity (I will not say who the top of our lists were).
So I need to ask (this particularly pertains to conservative members), which conservatives here do you respect the most?
...
I will also say that politically my favorite politician was John McCain. My favorite author is Orson Scott Card.
I do of course hate political extremists on all sides. I've been decried as a "baby killer" for literally saving the lives of children in Iraq (I was a combat medic in the US Army); and similarly that I've apparently committed treason for suggesting a president honor the campaign promise of closing his Twitter (which if you didn't know, is literally the same thing as saying he should be publicly executed... And no, I do not understand this either).
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A couple relevant lead ups to this AMA...
First, the moderation team is as follows (I advise tagging them with questions):
Second, everyone has a pardon (I am building an issue tracking spreadsheet, and zero previous incidents are going into it):
My first official act as chief moderator is to give everyone a full amnesty with the expectation that you improve your behavior. Everyone will be starting over with a clean slate.-Virt
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@bsh1
Out of curiosity, why are only the users given write-ups?
Write-ups for the other categories seem almost more important, at least if I'm correct in assuming we desire new users to read them (or at least understand why they're in the HoF).
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@airmax1227
I think we all know how DDO is doing, and otherwise a quick glance at it should reveal those answers
I think my computer screen just caught an STD. 😂
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I'm pretty satisfied with my previous voting (except for threads, I remembered a great one from Imabench which I would totally point someone to every election season, but it's too late now).
USERS:
With the limit of three inductees, I believe the moderators have all earned it, but I am prioritizing just one to give other users recognition outside of that position. Nor would I vote for someone based on bias for their contributions on another website.
- I’ve done the math, at 27.5% of the active votes, he’s by far our best voter. Nearly all of us have him to thank for not having more unvoted tied debates. He’s basically done to tied debates what the CDC did to measles. For this alone he deserves our highest recognition.Additionally, he serves as a vote moderator, greatly decreasing the time he has available to vote, by cleaning up bad votes on our debates.As a serious bonus, while always working hard to raise the quality of the site, he's respectful but entertaining.___
- He's excellence which every member should strive to emulate. Not every user needs to reinvent the wheel (as much as I'm sure he'd accept a debate on better wheel designs). He's a solid and active voter, a damn fine debater able and willing to delve deep into very technical ones (GPS, engine types, etc.). He earned the top slot in the leader-boards, but regularly jeopardizes it with risky debates.When playing Mafia against him, I was left arguing against killing him when it made tactical sense, because of how much more fun the game was with his steady analysis (better to lose to the best, than to win against idles).
DEBATES:
- An excellent troll debate done in jest as if sincere. I am loath to nominate my own debate, but we also have a dire shortage on comedic debates. I even publicly asked but no one pointed to others worth reading; so I am nominating the best offering from the first year or so of the site.
- A fantastic example of what policy debates can be. It came from an exceptionally good starting place of mutual disagreement with the status quo and agreement that either side would be a marked improvement. This was easily among the closest debates I’ve ever graded, with both sides losing some of their points.___
- An odd addition from me, since [insert elitist talk against rap battles here]. However...P1: If the main user base enjoys rap battles, rap battles should be honored the same as any other debate type.P2: Various users have contributed to creating literally 75 debates titled *rap battle* (plus an additional 19 with rap otherwise in their title).C: The best rap battle should be honored with induction into the HoF.I believe the HoF should include a wide variety in types of offerings, and this one is very distinct from the rest.Admittedly, I am in part voting for this as a backdoor vote of support for the two participants (Supa, and presumably BLT).
THREADS:
- vetoI know this is meaningless but after reviewing the nominees, the only ones I can imagine being worthwhile to tell new members they must read a year from now, are ones already pinned and thus in no need for extra recognition. This is much like why we did not do a HoF a year ago...
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It would need to be done carefully to avoid accidents, with possibly a time window before it takes effect; during which it can be reversed.
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I previously held back some of my votes (one user, and three forum threads). So now I would like to append the following:
USERS:
- He's excellence which every member should strive to emulate. Not every user needs to reinvent the wheel (as much as I'm sure he'd accept a debate on better wheel designs). He's a solid and active voter, a damn fine debater able and willing to delve deep into very technical ones (GPS, engine types, etc.). He earned the top slot in the leader-boards, but regularly jeopardizes it with risky debates.When playing Mafia against him, I was left arguing against killing him when it made tactical sense, because of how much more fun the game was with his steady analysis (better to lose to the best, than to win against idles).
THREADS:
- vetoI know this is meaningless but after reviewing the nominees, the only ones I can imagine being worthwhile to tell new members they must read a year from now, are ones already pinned and thus in no need for extra recognition.
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@Wylted
@oromagi
@bmdrocks21
@Trent0405
@AvoidDeath
Ragnar handed me my first defeat on DDO six years agoand has served as my hallmark of quality debating ever since as well aswho I look to for model behavior on this site- active, generous, smart, funny,undefeated, second most important voter. The fact that he's an immigrantveteran Iraqi War Medic who picked up the nickname "Rabbit's Foot"because he's that lucky and jumps out of planes with broken ribs just makes himone cool as fuck badass in my book.
And double thanks for also nominating my satirical debate on fetuses.
@Trent
Thank you for nominating me, and for the write-up.
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Thank you for nominating me, and for the write-up.
Ragnar is a very well rounded user, he holdsthe 2nd most amount of votes that are consistently useful to both debaters, hemaintains incredible conduct toward his opponents. His debating and Kritiqueguide further implore me to place him on my small list of nominations, they'vebeen vital in improving the debate quality on the website. He is one of themost impressive debaters on the website, being undefeated in 22 debatescurrently, his commitment to debating and abstaining from forfeitures is againstupendous. His forum topics are few but maintain incredible quality thatassist in the forums environment and discussions. A debater I respect a ton.
Out of curiosity, who was your fourth nominee?
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@bmdrocks
Thank you for nominating me, andfor the write-up.
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Thank you for nominating me, andfor the write-up.
He is a veteran, and he likes Richard Nixon. Each of those aloneis enough to win my respect :)
He is a very active voter, experienceddebater, and a pleasure to talk to. Truly a pillar of the community.
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@Wylted
Thank you for nominating my satirical debate on fetuses.
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Thanks for the honorable mention.
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Not a suggestion, but my mind goes to what the outcome would be if voting for contributions instead of user names.
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@DebateArt.com
...could be neat is a set of length indicator icons to imply the total character count for the debate (related, but not to be confused with character limits per round).Could you please elaborate on this one? Do you mean character count from all the published arguments?
The sum total yes, as that in turn informs any readers of how long they should budget.
Another thing that would be unendingly useful is their pronouns listed in a similar location (could be an icon under their avatar or one one corner of it?). As safe as the hetero-normative assumptions are currently, making users who are different feel welcome and reminding us to call them something other than HE would be a nice touch (I expect it could slightly contribute to retention of said female and other users).I am afraid you lost me on this one, could you please elaborate?
An indicator if the author is male/female/other.
And thanks a lot, I really appreciate the feedback!
You're most welcome.
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In consideration of these matters, there were enough quality in most things to more or less make it about which to delay...
USERS:
With the limit of three inductees, I believe the moderators have all earned it, but I am prioritizing just one to give other users recognition outside of that position.
- I’ve done the math, at 27.5% of the active votes, he’s by far our best voter. Nearly all of us have him to thank for not having more unvoted tied debates. He’s basically done to tied debates what the CDC did to measles. For this alone he deserves our highest recognition.Additionally, he serves as a vote moderator, greatly decreasing the time he has available to vote, by cleaning up bad votes on our debates.
- P1: It is prima facie that critical thinking is useful.P2: Syllogisms and the logical form help express and encourage critical thinking.P3: semperfortis raised the frequency of those techniques even outside his own debates.C: semperfortis should be inducted into the HoF.
- Reserved for later consideration.
DEBATES:
Due to the HoF serving as examples to be pointed to for years to come, I am not voting for anything with forfeitures, character limit violations, etc.
- An excellent troll debate done in jest as if sincere. I am loath to nominate my own debate, but we also have a dire shortage on comedic debates. I even publicly asked but no one pointed to others worth reading; so I am nominating the best offering from the first year or so of the site.
- A fantastic example of what policy debates can be. It came from an exceptionally good starting place of mutual disagreement with the status quo and agreement that either side would be a marked improvement. This was easily among the closest debates I’ve ever graded, with both sides losing some of their points.
- While drilling down to one core issue, this was possibly the most in depth religious debate we’ve had. The educational value of this debate cannot be overstated.
THREADS
As someone who has only made about as many forum posts as votes cast (votes got set behind by playing Mafia...), I’m not sure what is and is not quality to be celebrated in this area. So, I’ll reserve these for later consideration to nominations others support.
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@DebateArt.com
A couple things which I believe would be useful inside debates themselves...
First as a reminder, a forfeited icon would be useful. Something related that could be neat is a set of length indicator icons to imply the total character count for the debate (related, but not to be confused with character limits per round).
I've said it before, but people sometimes overlook the color coding. So please add text for pro/con near the top of the debate. Such as on this debate, instead of "Celeb" and "Ragnar" ... "Celeb - Pro" and "Ragnar - Con" ... Probably way too late, but Neg would be a decent term substitute for Con to decrease confusion with contender on the debate setups.
Another thing that would be unendingly useful is their pronouns listed in a similar location (could be an icon under their avatar or one one corner of it?). As safe as the hetero-normative assumptions are currently, making users who are different feel welcome and reminding us to call them something other than HE would be a nice touch (I expect it could slightly contribute to retention of said female and other users).
On the add vote tab, a link to the voting rules would be good (perhaps not the current page of all site rules, but an abbreviated page of the eligibility requirements and gist of the categorical standards).
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@drafterman
@oromagi
What was the point of having us all do "I win with the town" DP2?
I'll answer that for him...
I think that was DP3, but anyway it was a mass lie detector test. Since people knew I used a lie detector for Oro previously, scum would delay answering it (or bury their answer in a wall of text... One person did that a later day when the risk was gone, which was kinda funny). Granted the only valid scum play there is just to roll the dice and do it, relying on the limited number of devices available. Plus, I accurately predicted a repeat of that device was not assured (had I known the three day limit on devices, or that lie detectors could not repeat, Oro would not have been killed... so good play there getting us to use a valuable NK on a vanilla).
I think that was DP3, but anyway it was a mass lie detector test. Since people knew I used a lie detector for Oro previously, scum would delay answering it (or bury their answer in a wall of text... One person did that a later day when the risk was gone, which was kinda funny). Granted the only valid scum play there is just to roll the dice and do it, relying on the limited number of devices available. Plus, I accurately predicted a repeat of that device was not assured (had I known the three day limit on devices, or that lie detectors could not repeat, Oro would not have been killed... so good play there getting us to use a valuable NK on a vanilla).
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@Greyparrot
@warren42
@oromagi
@A-R-O-S-E
A little of my day one analysis from the scum group chat (I think we're allowed to copy/paste things now):
So tactics...
Arose: I don't trust killing the encrypted person (pretty sure there's a role with the mission of dying!).
Oro: The most active player, I feel like the game would be less fun with them removed (tactically we should, but just tactics are not the whole point).
Warren: Pretty sure they're Black Widow, so them staying alive helps my cover (if they don't investigate me).
Grey: Claims to be Aunt May with a useless power. Things could change over the next day or so, but this is who I am leaning towards murdering.
I would make different analyses now. However, I'll definitely stand by being hesitant to kill the most enjoyable people to play with too early; I can imagine winning against AFKs, but that doesn't sound like a victory to me any more than were I to accept the dozen open Bill debates for free wins.
Also oromagi and Greyparrot: I genuinely did enjoy being in a team with you all hunting the scum; and am quite glad we got the worst of them before we died. What do you each think of the idea of including more links in the updating player list? Such as "verified by X" linking what post verified someone.
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A couple comments...
This was my first full game (the one time I played before, I was lynched DP1 for being a noob and not useful to town). I was genuinely learning the game, without much understanding of what is and isn't a power role.
My social tactic was to play things straight, and believe that will be my SOP. I kept seeing town getting needlessly poisoned by lies. I think I had only three lies throughout the game? First that I was a roll which could visit people at night (needed due to being spotted), second when there was the mass lie detector test (to which I accurately predicted there there was a different gadget anyway), and third at the end when I figured Water would spot me so I baited him into acting incredibly scummy (which I pulled off while enough that the executioner needed a night to sleep on the decision... had that one gambit by me worked, Mafia would have won with a double night kill when people thought they had an auto win due to a pair of invincibles).
IMO Cog did not accidentally step on a land mine, he committed suicide. He never even logged into the team chat (I can guess he received a PM knowing about Nick Fury and Clint Barton, but the odds of the main character of the Marvel universe not being in game, followed by him not being around to defend his claim, it seemed to be a reference to Tony Stark's death).
I do thank Supa and Speed for being my main teachers in this game. It was not until later in the game that I pushed back during disagreements with my teammate (such as Doctor Strange's power not being used, which would have allowed him to carry out the first NK, removing all risk of Supa or I being spotted). NKing Pie the third night when his information was already out was a weird one, given that Supa actually pulled it off and stayed alive a whole extra day after being outed by the mailman.
...And I am out of time. I'll post more later, and hopefully finish reading everything that was posted.
...And I am out of time. I'll post more later, and hopefully finish reading everything that was posted.
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@A-R-O-S-E
"Sadly no one. The person I am most suspicious of is a paranoid gun owner (would that be murder suicide, or how does that play out?). And my previous absolute certainty turned out to be bust (Wylted... his over the top insults at Cog.)"^^ Ragnar's 300 iq play
For obvious reasons I could not say so in game, but thank you so much!
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@A-R-O-S-E
When did I say that? I’ve said quite the opposite for three days now.Ragnar said Mhar wasn't lie detector verified
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@A-R-O-S-E
A couple days ago DP2. Err, I guess three days ago.
https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/2808/post_links/118022
https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/2808/post_links/118022
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@A-R-O-S-E
Yeah. Oro gave me that gadget, I used it when Mharman made a concise town statement when they were otherwise in danger of being lynched.(typing from my phone, so not looking up all the links)
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Were his information legit, he would have come out and said it first thing. Doubly so given that my role can only visit on odd nights. Instead he invented it after I voted to lynch him. This seals matters pretty clearly.
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@Speedrace
@WaterPhoenix
I only get that on odd nights. And hate to say it, but with Arose and Drafter vouching for each other, me having lie detected Mharman...
VTL Water
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At this point I’m confused as hell. Tell me who to use my vigilante ability on, and if between that and the lynch we haven’t nailed the scum, I’ll cast the first vote to lynch myself tomorrow.
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@Speedrace
@WaterPhoenix
Seems best. If he’s mafia I really don’t want them having that final gadget.
VTL Supa
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X. warren42 Scarlet Witch ORACLE (special)
**************
3. Ragnar Clint Barton (HAWKEYE) ODD VIGILANTE
6. Mharman Mantis (MANTIS) 50% ROLEBLOCKER
**************
11. A-R-O-S-E no name! (WASP) WEAK HIDER
9. drafterman no name! (HULK) BULLETPROOF
5. WaterPhoenix Heimdall (HEIMDALL) WATCHER
10. SupaDudz Nick Fury PARANOID GUN OWNER
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@WaterPhoenix
(just dug through the list of my forum posts)
https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/2808/mcu-heroes-mafia-dp2?page=9&post_number=223
https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/2808/mcu-heroes-mafia-dp2?page=9&post_number=223
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@A-R-O-S-E
Who did you Vig?
Sadly no one. The person I am most suspicious of is a paranoid gun owner (would that be murder suicide, or how does that play out?). And my previous absolute certainty turned out to be bust (Wylted... his over the top insults at Cog.).
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Updated this, fixed a bad link, mostly left the order alone (someone else can tackle that).
TOWN
TOWN
X. oromagi Tony Stark(IRON MAN) Inventor
X. ILikePie5 Stan Lee (VARIOUS) 5X MAILMAN
X. warren42 Scarlet Witch ORACLE (special)
**************
3. Ragnar Clint Barton (HAWKEYE) ODD VIGILANTE
6. Mharman Mantis (MANTIS) 50% ROLEBLOCKER
**************
11. A-R-O-S-E no name! (WASP) WEAK HIDER
9. drafterman no name! (HULK) BULLETPROOF
5. WaterPhoenix Heimdall (HEIMDALL) WATCHER
10. SupaDudz Nick Fury PARANOID GUN OWNER
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@Vader
You say you're innocent. Which gadget did Oro (Tony Stark) give you?
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@DebateArt.com
I suggest some minor forum consolidation (at least if it's click and drag level easy).
Movies and TV
Art, Fashion, and Music (the top two threads in art are about music anyway)
Society and People (perhaps also changing People to Famous People or Celebrities to which the it has the definition of celebrities)
Nature and Science
Technology and Cars (I know cars are already a technology, but it has it's own forum with only 8 threads... Maybe just a Tech forum with Cars listed in the description?)
Personal, I would just change the description to be "Topics related to any personal issues and Ask Me Anythings" (adding the AMA bit on the end, to end confusion about where those belong). I would also move this to the second place (I believe this would decrease the amount of erroneous stuff that ends up on the main forum)
Miscellaneous should be at the bottom.
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With the HoF a few days off, this might not be the best time for a thread like this on the main forum.
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@Vader
You're welcome to use my name and/or likeness for any such things.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
That is one of the best politician answers I have seen.BRT is on the side of the people. he is on your side.
"Vote the right side, because we're on your side."
Don't forget that we need to be on the Right side of history!
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@Wylted
He manipulated the results of the last DDO hall of fame
I admit to not remembering the last DDO HoF, but have enough faith in humanity to assume he has grown in the years since.
It's also stupid to wait until somebody becomes corrupt to complain
To launch a protest against their corruption, them first acting corrupt seems a necessity to not be mistaken for the boy who cried wolf.
handcuffing their actions when they are in positions of authority
No comment.
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@Greyparrot
@oromagi
Just tell me which of those two to VTL, I am having a hard time keeping track.
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@Vader
@warren42
@Mharman
@WaterPhoenix
@A-R-O-S-E
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READS
TOWN
X. ILikePie5 Stan Lee (VARIOUS) 5X MAILMAN
**************
8. oromagi Tony Stark(IRON MAN) NP action (verified)
3. Ragnar Clint Barton (HAWKEYE) ODD VIGILANTE
6. Mharman Mantis (MANTIS) 50% ROLEBLOCKER
**************
11. A-R-O-S-E no name! (WASP) WEAK HIDER
9. drafterman no name! (HULK) BULLETPROOF
5. WaterPhoenix Heimdall (HEIMDALL) WATCHER
10. SupaDudz Nick Fury PARANOID GUN OWNER
7. warren42 Scarlet Witch ORACLE (special)
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Also:
I [oromagi] did make a gadget last night. To that end, EVERYBODY must make this statement in this DP ASAP or suffer consequences:I, [insert username], win with the town.The slower you to do this, the likelier you are scum.I don't want to explain this further, I'm just asking that everybody who is town comply.
Please make it not in a wall of text, so I am doing another post for it.
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@Greyparrot
Can you reveal any of your message so I can translate it?
I can try, but do remember:
PM Etiquette...You may not C/P anything from your PMs into the game or take photos of your PMs...Remember, paraphrasing is your friend. You may only paraphrase PM content. An acceptable paraphrase should substantially change the original wording of the passage, and that change should be noticeably more than mere deletion, addition, or substitution. I am willing to pre-screen your paraphrases if I have time.
He welcomed me as a new player, called me interesting, asked me to post reads on people, and finally insisted I should not reveal that I received a PM (to which I received another message last night telling me to reveal).
From PIE.
I can verify that said phrase was not part of either message.
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@Greyparrot
@drafterman
@oromagi
Ragnar: Did you try to kill anyone last night?
I only get to use that power on odd nights. ... Speaking of which, anyone know the order of operations for nighttime events? Like if I try to kill someone at the same time as mafia tries to kill me, do both happen, or is it whichever event the mod received a PM for first? ... Also no one's corrected me, but quoting messages from here is okay right? (I'm a stickier for organization)
I will say that we shouldn't push Oro too much on gadgets, as he probably built someone something, but I am guessing it changes every day (Iron Man 3 style!); which Mafia not knowing what could be to our benefit.
Regarding our mailman, he sent a letter welcoming me to the game.
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And to maintain quick reference (the only real change I did was moving Pie and Wylted to the new top bracket for mod confirmed town, to match the one at the bottom).
READS
TOWN
X. ILikePie5 Stan Lee (VARIOUS) 5X MAILMAN
**************
8. oromagi Tony Stark(IRON MAN) NP action (verified)
3. Ragnar Clint Barton (HAWKEYE) ODD VIGILANTE
6. Mharman Mantis (MANTIS) 50% ROLEBLOCKER
**************
11. A-R-O-S-E no name! (WASP) WEAK HIDER
9. drafterman no name! (HULK) BULLETPROOF
5. WaterPhoenix Heimdall (HEIMDALL) WATCHER
10. SupaDudz Nick Fury PARANOID GUN OWNER
7. warren42 Scarlet Witch ORACLE (special)
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@Wylted
@Speedrace
Everyone, when doing an official action like VTLing, it is probably best to tag Speedrace (I just assume admins would like a heads up that their attention is required on something).
Anyway, to repeat myself on something Wylted never answered: "Anyone else remember his blatant over reaction during the last DP when Cog committed suicide?"
Also that guy is a cuck. His wife commanded him to go to bed and he did. I put my bitch to bed, not the other way around.
...
VTL Wylted
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@Greyparrot
@oromagi
@WaterPhoenix
@A-R-O-S-E
Does town agree that there must be a lie in here somewhere?
I don't know the roles well yet, but trying to break this down...
WATER watching: If lying, how would he know I visited?
RAGNAR visiting: If lying about visiting, why?
AROSE hiding: If lying about hiding, how did he survive my visit?
GREY innocent: If lying about not doing anything.... Actually I don't know how this ties in, other than him being innocent if hid behind, due to hiders dying if hiding behind mafia.
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@drafterman
I just confirmed my double vote will not conclude it, so I fee safe letting someone experienced decide the outcome (or to tell me to switch where I’m voting)I'm interested in why you voted me, then, if you understood the accusatory parts of his claim to be opinion not validate be the Lie Detector.
You are very suspicious, and I outright confirmed with Speedrace that if voting for you it would not be the deciding vote (unlike if I voted for Mharman). Once Greyparrot told me to unvote, I did precisely that without hesitation.
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(following list is unchanged and unrelated to the above message, I just like having it up top on these pages)
READS
TOWN
8. oromagi Tony Stark(IRON MAN) NP action (verified)
3. Ragnar Clint Barton (HAWKEYE) ODD VIGILANTE
6. Mharman mantis? (MANTIS) 50% ROLEBLOCKER
******************
11. A-R-O-S-E no name! (WASP) WEAK HIDER
9. drafterman no name! (HULK) BULLETPROOF
5. WaterPhoenix Heimdall (HEIMDALL) WATCHER
10. SupaDudz Nick Fury PARANOID GUN OWNER
7. warren42 Scarlet Witch ORACLE (special)
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So I'm seeing some contention over the following from Mharman which Oro and I verified.
ATTENTION: This is a counter claim. Drafterman’s bulletproof claim is BS. Why? Because I am Mantis,, a town 50/50 role-blocker. Last night I roleblocked Drafterman, stopping the NK.
Let's break it down, a lie detector can't say be used on walls of text or our role list to see which are false (if any, I am not trying to open that can of worms). I believe if it was used on the list, Speedrace would at best just check the person who posted it and their role, with the rest being just opinion.
On the lie detected message, there are two statement of opinions which I think can't be tested (that someone else's claim is BS, and that the NK was stopped by said described actions). So we are left with a truthful or not to the clear statement: "...I [Mharman] am Mantis,, a town 50/50 role-blocker. Last night I roleblocked Drafterman..." which was the truth.
Thus I reported: "So he’s telling the truth, at least so far as can be determined. I used a power. I do not know if I wholly trust the logic, but he’s truthful."
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