Melcharaz

I say both. why? because the precepts of the scriptures are logical, however they don't readily explain the unobservable through observation as we define it. It explains it through metaphysical properties that must be believed in order to observe through a spiritual nature which, again, is not incorporated through human observation.   Other words, humans can partake of spiritual understanding through metaphysics in order to observe in a spiritual nature which is not natural.

I would argue that scripture would be incorporated with logic however! as it uses logical principles in explaining the unknown.

Paul was anointed by the holy spirit to write what God would reveal to us. He isn't a person more important than anyone else if thats what you are asking!

What do you mean like what? It would be beyond my observation to give a realistic example.  a metaphysical example however....

I'm surprised they made a word for it.

Id argue against that, unless you are referring to translation errors, then i would agree, I hold that scripture is inerrant and flawless.

None.

Karma and reaping and sowing are not the same, especially when you enter eastern religion and philosophy.   We do reap what we sow, the concept of animal sacrifice was to help keep us from being destroyed by the justice so we might have mercy.  well, the jews anyways.

To assert that shows you don't understand the wrath of God against sin. Animal sacrifice rolled back the sin for a year other wise God would have destroyed the jews.

The concept of logic is based on our observation and shared agreement of what we observe through our senses.   Our logic is undone when we cannot perceive God or the ideal of what is beyond our observation.  There are new rules that our current logic may not apply to.   No doubt there are things we think that are logical, because we are basing our thoughts only on what we know and observe.  Rationality cannot touch the unknown.

That's a large misunderstanding of what i just posted. Also it is evidence as it is backed by scripture.  I wouldn't say animals were abused, simply sacrificed to roll back the sin for a year.  God is not controlled by wrath, but justice demands that something pay for sin. Since God has mercy on his own creation, he was willing to kill sinless animals until the time of Christ where death and hell's ownership would be transferred to Jesus Christ.

Preordained and i know nothing about calvinism, i'm simply refering to the bible.   But i would contend otherwise, that disobedience does play a role in where a person's soul goes. Not a 1 time disobedience mind you, but a continual rejection of God and his ways.

Im actually doing a debate about it if you wanna watch and comment!

Is God incapable of appeasing his wrath in some other way?

A very good question! in order for us to understand why a man had to die instead of goats and sheep and oxen like in the old testament, you have to understand the nature of sin, God and what animals lack compared to mankind.

Basically, Animals have a soul, but no spirit, they were made by the word of God, just like everything else except for 1 thing.  Mankind. Man was made by God's own hands and had God's breath breathed into him and was made in his image.  God is a spirit.

So it was not possible that animals who could not sin should take away sin from humans who chose to sin against the will of God. That's why a man had to be sacrificed, but not just any man, a sinless man.  That way, the lord could express his wrath on that body for the sake of all humanity so that they wouldn't be bounded by sin nor by the demand of justice regarding sin.   God before Christ winked at ignorance but now calls all men everywhere to repent of their sin.  Why? because back then all were guilty of sin and God would only roll back the sin a year with the yearly sacrifice. But now that sin is sacrificed for, there is no need for anyone to be ignorant or for just the jews to have the chance for salvation.

God knows that fred would make such a choice and he uses even the disobedient for a reason! who knows if fred's adamant stance against God might spark anger in someone who was on the fence in believing in God?   The disobedient are reserved for the day of wrath and destruction. But they also made the choice to be disobedient.   Yes, fred would go to Gehenna for his willful disobedience. 

The reason we don't see predestination is because it was hidden from the old testament. Once Jesus came on the scene and died and gave the holy ghost, the mystery of the world was no longer veiled, God fore ordained all things.

Id word it differently, Id say God knew fred would choose to go to hell and he would be merciful to fred regardless of how evil or disobedient fred was.

Ah! you wish to understand the prescribed will of God and the ultimate plan of God?  Like how God told moses he was gonna destroy israel and make of Moses a great nation and how it seems moses changed his mind? 

or perhaps when King hezekiah of Judah was about to die as proclaimed by God through the prophet Isaiah and then he weeped and prayed to God to spare him and God added 15 years to his life?

God is Lord of the spirits, he knows how people feel because he allows them to feel it. You think that everyone who acts rebelliously is something God had no hand in?  He allows us to choose whether to submit to that spirit or to another, and once we have chosen to hate and disobey God, he gives us over to that spirit whereby we don't even know what is godly anymore.  Romans 1 and romans 9 work really well to discribe sin and its nature and predestination.

There are multiple verses that support fatalism if you would wish to discuss them!

simple, because the wrath of God needed to be appeased. Justice cannot just be swept under the rug. even if mercy is given, it is written "God is not mocked, whatever a man soweth, that shall he reap."

Of course it wasn't just. Jesus did nothing wrong.  But to understand why it was needed and so important for God to not just "Forgive" you have to understand what sin is to God.  he hates it.  I mean really hates it.  If you have sin, you are an enemy of God and deserve wrath and Justice would agree with that.

According to fatalism, you would essentially be correct, however it was also their choice to agree with it and refused to love or serve God.  Fatalism simple refers to the destiny of the people, that it is predetermined, but it doesn't address the willful choices of the people to march into that destiny.

It was mercy and pardon directed to humanity. Humans were bound and enslaved to death through sin. A sacrifice was needed so that the wrath of God could be put away. This has reference to the pushing back of sin through the Offering and sending the Goat into the wilderness. 

Specifically God of the bible.  also known as Yahweh, Jehovah, Yahuah or Jesus/Yushua.

foreordain or preordain means that God has created the sequence of events of creation.  aka, he already knows if you are going to heaven/hell and there is nothing you can do about it.

Or does he simply see the future and reacts based on how he sees things?

The video you first mentioned actually reminded me of Vsauce video and he explains how that we are constantly remade and therefore not "Actually" what we were.  Idr how long it takes for nerve cells to regrow though.

I have 1 God, that's it. But there are many Gods that God is chief over.  They aren't equal with him or share any of his glory though.  Satan is quoted in the bible as the "God of this world" by Paul in the new testament.

no, it was mercy. Mercy pardons and is freely given, whereas justice is strict and is demanded of all.

yes

Belief is right? Yes

One main problem about believing in a God (Especially in an omnipotent, omniscience and invisible one) is that there are forms of observation that we don't have access to that they might, or that we cannot know things that these beings might know.  So what do we do with information we are given that we don't understand? Logic won't work until we learn and observe what we don't know, emotions are often wrong. What can show the nature of Gods as they proclaim themselves? Most likely those who are representatives of the said God should have understanding of the God's nature.

Id say spiritual knowledge, which comes from (Spirits, Ie, God/Gods) manifesting themselves so we can detect and understand them.

its not just for a person who did no wrong to be punished for it.

The Holy Spirit being received by man signifies that Jesus Christ is Lord.  If the holy spirit exists then there can only be 1 God who is above all Gods. And it does exist, I can say that because i received it.

and what he sees above him is heaven.

the bible is my proof of paradise. Its more than just rest obviously, but its main feature is rest in righteousness and rest from sin. it is to be present with the Lord Jesus Christ.

Sorry, i meant sheol. And because of the account of lazerus and the rich man. Psalms where david said thou wilt not leave my soul in hell neither wilt thou suffer thy holy one to see corruption. Accounts of paul, daniel and revelations

 

The bible says that what a man sows, that shall he reap. and that every man will be judged according to their works.  It is not just for someone to be punished who didn't know sin.  This of course is show in Jesus Christ, he did no sin and yet the wrath of God fell on him. Therefore it was mercy that intervened for our sake that we might be free from sin.  It is just if everyone who ever committed sin was thrown into the lake of fire and burned for eternity. yet we live, though by our nature we are enemies of God.

The Lord raised them from the Grave with his death, because the wrath of God was fulfilled and the bodies were raised up so that they were free from gehenna and be translated to paradise when they died again. Which happened the same day as Jesus said "This day" when he told the thief that he would be with him in paradise.

Lucifier/Satan has no power to raise believers from the dead, but only to claim those who were in bondage by sin unto death.  Jesus took the keys of death and hell from satan, meaning he has now authority over who dies and their ressurection to paradise regardless of the bondage of sin.

The muslims assert that Allah is God, however if you read about them, there is clearly a difference in nature, attitude and authority between them. Jesus and God are one. When you speak of the creator, it is Jesus as testified by the bible. And he does all that pleases the Father(Yahuah/yahweh) Who is a Spirit.

according to the bible, paradise is where all the souls go that believed on Jesus and repented and recieved him. note the thief on the cross next to jesus.  Paul made reference to the third heaven when his spirit heard things "Not lawful for man to utter." for they were spiritual.  Paradise is just a resting place.

The bible says what the heavens is. Psalms 8:3

There is a spiritual revealing of heaven and then there is the observable portion of it.  The spiritual cannot be seen through normal observation but requires a spiritual connection to understand it. A good example is the account of revelations, John was caught up by the spirit to heaven, doubtless his body remained on earth.

After that, it depends on how you got there. if you are a christian or an old testament saint and believed on him before the rapture then you will move from the 3rd heaven, paradise to where jesus and the throne of God is and be the bride of christ.  After the rapture there will come in the great crowd and the 144k people who made it through the tribulation AFTER the rapture, along with those who refused the mark of the beast and didn't worship the image and were beheaded.  Then there will come the 1k year reign of christ where the christians/saints of God will reign with him on earth for 1k years. then The judgement of all the souls in sheol, gehenna (hell) and those who weren't christians before and after the rapture. and then the ones rejected are sent to the lake of fire for refusing to believe in God.  then the new heavens and new earth will be made and the new jerusalem will come down from heaven to be on the earth (or above it, im not quite certain) and so shall we ever be with the Lord, an eternity of pleasure, peace, joy etc and no pain, sin etc.  And we will know God in a way we never could as flesh and blood.

according to the bible, God has preordained people to heaven or hell. There are multiple places i can point you to in the scriptures of it.

John 6:37-40, 44-45  romans 1:16 romans 9:10-24 ephesians  1:4-14  and other places and 1 john talks about the attitude that those who are predestined have.

You are correct about hell, it is a place of torment and waiting, but not an everlasting one. The lake of fire is that. revelations 20:13-15