The taboo Western left-wing reason to thank the right wing.

Author: RationalMadman
Islam
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#1
RationalMadman
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Warning, this is a hot take

I have been a significantly worried left wing progressive due to the increased population and influence of Islamic immigrants in western culture for some time and kept my mouth shut for fear of bigotry calls but it is not just them at all.

The actual cultures and ideologies that the left of US wing defend immigrating heavily to their nations are as far right as it gets.

Who?

Mexico? Syria? Brazil? Argentina? Peru? Puerto Rico? Ukraine? Pakistan, India (which has Muslims and even the Hindus are quite right-wing depending on subculture variation, the Sikhs lean left).

I support the immigration, I do and I love the refugee influx from Ukraine (but resent that Ukraine hasn't allowed its men to surrender and flee, they are trapped for slaughter or capture at this point, I am a realist not a fairytale writer, I loathe Putin but a lost war is a lost war). 

I support the immigration, I repeat it to make it clear.

I do not support the lack of direct integration. Only Scandinavia does direct integration, they force the immigrants to study for exams on western, leftist values if they wish to become true citizens at any point and even to do business and long-term work there they need to do it.

This is something the left puke at but do you really think no immigrants are voting for Republicans? These are severely conservative Christians and Muslims, use your damn head! 

We must realise that we, the Left, fucked ourselves over by embracing the most homophobic, anti contraceptive, anti-abortion, anti-social-democracy cultures out there.

It is time to seriously sit and consider if it remains a smart idea to amicably be embracing the same ideology that all Sharia nations are based on and the very Christian conservative cultures of South America, which are anti-LGBT, anti,-abortion, brutally anti-feminism and basically anti-left altogether.

I am saying we need to show them respect, not disrespect. We must respect their core values are deeply right wing and conservative and ponder if the right wing has actually been inadvertently been a taboo deterrent to their own agenda's success.

If this offends you, I dont say this irl for a reason. Please let me have a safe space here free from cancel culture.
#2
FLRW
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@RationalMadman

So you don't think the Muslim Dr. Oz should be a Senator from Pennsylvania?
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#3
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@FLRW
I do not know much of the individual agenda of Oz, so I will not comment. I can tell you that Islam is a fundamentally problematic ideology for left-wing Progressives and Liberals in theory and practise. Sharia is as right-wing as it gets, point blank period.
#4
bmdrocks21
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You’re welcome! Now let’s work together to keep out these evil right-wing Muslims and third world immigrants 🤗 

#5
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@bmdrocks21
Too late.

You're a mongrel Nation founded on right wing Christianity.

And gun toting paranoia.

A bit like Russia in a way.
#6
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@RationalMadman
I do not support the lack of direct integration. Only Scandinavia does direct integration, they force the immigrants to study for exams on western, leftist values if they wish to become true citizens at any point and even to do business and long-term work there they need to do it.

This is something the left puke at but do you really think no immigrants are voting for Republicans? These are severely conservative Christians and Muslims, use your damn head! 
You are talking about filtering the ethnic composition of the nation in order to preserve a certain ideological and cultural outcome. It's an indirect form of eugenics.

Parallel things were done in what is called the "Nordic model" today, and it is directly tied to fascism, the consolidation of the corporate monopoly state, as well as colonialism. You are promoting a form of social darwinism.
#7
rbelivb
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Why not just skip the pretense and give everyone in the population an "IQ" test? Only the smartest people get to be citizens, everyone else is kicked out. It'll be like Squid Game, only with nation states.
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#8
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@rbelivb
If you believe Scandinavia is doing eugenics despite it being among the most genuinely liberal and progressive places on Earth, be my guest and make a fool of yourself.

A nation ensuring the people entering respect its values is not eugenics. Every single country that the aforementioned cultures are, restrict immigration and demand respect to the local culture.
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#9
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@bmdrocks21
I do not think they are evil, I believe they come in with ingrained extreme right wing views and have not had their minds opened yet. In fact many come to the US as it is reputed as a capitalist haven to get rich in (at least they see it that way). 

If they stay inside the nation and they and their children influence it, over time the values will shift to social conservatism unless truly active integration is done.
#10
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You are talking about filtering the ethnic composition of the nation in order to preserve a certain ideological and cultural outcome
The entire purpose of a nation is to safeguard a culture from destruction.  If the culture is inherently unfit, the nation fails, as happened countless times in history.
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#11
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@zedvictor4
The UK was extremely Christian until recently but the reason its gun toting gangsters were limited is because it was an island and guns were not affordable for just run of the mill criminals to make it worth.

Then eventually a school shooting happened and that led to a ferocious campaign against guns but for some reason the reaction in US is that the criminals will get guns anyway so then if course one wants to be armed against the criminals.
#12
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@RationalMadman
I am talking about the environment in which that culture was established in the Nordic countries such as Denmark etc, in which eugenic sterilization policies were an essential part of that, and directly connected to the same ideology which fostered the formulation of the "welfare state" idea. Now, as you talk about "restricting immigration" that is a continuation of the culture that was established on those grounds, and cannot be disconnected from its history. And if you look at what you are saying, it is just the same logic transferred to the geopolitical sphere, evidenced by Greyparrot:

If the culture is inherently unfit, the nation fails, as happened countless times in history.
You completely ignore the question of how such an ethnically homogenous group was established, so that it is necessary to safeguard the inside-outside distinction that makes the welfare state possible.
#13
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@RationalMadman
A nation ensuring the people entering respect its values is not eugenics
You define "its values" as being open and liberal, then you claim that it must preserve that by maintaining the ethnic homogeneity of that nation, does it not seem like what you are preserving is something other than a "value"? Clearly this concept of values is an abstraction layered on top of the nationalist politics which maintains the closed system, the "closed commercial state" of the corporate system.
#14
rbelivb
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@Greyparrot
The entire purpose of a nation is to safeguard a culture from destruction.  If the culture is inherently unfit, the nation fails, as happened countless times in history.
When you talk about, how their "conservative culture" needs to die out, what you are describing is literally genocide.
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#15
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@rbelivb
'Literally genocide'
#16
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@RationalMadman
When you are talking about "Republicans," obviously you aren't talking about American Republicans. You are talking about the ethnic core of that culture. The "nation failing" as Greyparrot mentioned as part of the social darwinist logic, directly as a result of policies like what you have outlined. You are talking about actively using policy to strategically destroy that ethnicity. What am I missing here?
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#17
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@rbelivb
Hahaha, you picked one of the worst people on the website to try your dirty shit with. I am precisely left wing and astute enough to destroy any strawman and fallacious demonisation you can try.

Let's talk about what literal 'ethnic genocide' in your usage of the term is.

'Ethnic genocide' is used correctly by you only if we realise ethnicity not physical.

So when you say genocide of an ethnicity you are using flavorful language to mean a culture defending itself against unwanted pollution from cultures that have direct core value clashes.

If we understand that you mean that let us then see who does it the most.

I would like you to wonder what happens in the long run if all these cultures defend themselves ethnically (and they do, they are all very ethnocentric internally, set foot in their countries as an immigrant and you will be brutally pressured to accept their way of life and held at arm's length as an outsider, the white supremacy in the western world is the normal nationalist and ethnic pride held in other cultures immigrating to the Western countries).

The Indians, the Chinese, the Kenyans, the South Africans, the Brazilians... keep running down the list and you will find extremely ethnic-pride driven nations that would hate you with a passion if you infiltrated their culture and pushed your (in your case based on your profile) Libertarian values onto them, I assume you are white too and secular, that would get you severely outcasted there and you'd find those that accept you would expect full humility and respect to their ways of life which include resenting abortion, LGBT, loudmouth talk (they have zero respect for wild freedom of speech, chat shit get hit is a common value among them) and certainly not ignoring gender roles.

You may find some feminism in some of course but very clearly women are women and men are men there, they'd react with rage if you tried to ever talk their children and teenagers at school or elsewhere into a trans and feminist agenda of ignoring gender and sex splits.

Many of these cultures have brutal Capitalism as a way of life and adore right wing politics with a burning passion, if you were left wing on top of socially liberal, you'd find many levels of despise towards you for your values and alienation until you keeled and respected them.

I am not an armchair theorist here. I know people of many ethnicities, I met them irl and online throughout my life, I will not specify further. My view is not what I was raised into, it is an observation I came to truly based on interacting with ethnicities and studying about victims of Sharia's way of life and even having travelled.

I am left-wing and progressive to the core and I know that the Conservative white locals in our western cultures are overall tame af in their ideology compared to the equivalent innthe very nations that these immigrants are coming from and it is about time we stop demonising and start uniting and negotiating.

Believe what you wish, I know my stance.
#18
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@rbelivb
what you are describing is literally genocide.
Cultural genocide is a part of evolution. It's a feature of nature, not a bug. Protecting a culture with national borders, a common national language and common national law is also a feature of that culture, not a bug.

Think of a nation as the immune system of a culture.

Nations have been around as long as humans developed the genetic trait to band together as a herd and put the first painting on a cave wall and defended that cave from other herds.
#19
bmdrocks21
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Alright, then. Let's keep out those right-wing extremists so they don't influence the culture.

I can get behind that ^_^
#20
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@zedvictor4
Too late.

You're a mongrel Nation founded on right wing Christianity.

And gun toting paranoia.

A bit like Russia in a way.

At least we aren't pansy infidels that are afraid of SCARY guns! *BOO*
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#21
RationalMadman
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@bmdrocks21
Integrate those that accept the progressive values.
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#22
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@bmdrocks21
Maybe fearing guns would save schoolchildren and teachers. Maybe it would save poor people in ghettos. Maybe it would reduce lethality of domestic disputes and make suicide harder.
#23
bmdrocks21
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So literally just accept the ones that will vote Democrat? Lmao, you lost me
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#24
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@bmdrocks21
The only salvation is that Trump was so unlikeable to immigrants, that literally saved Dems in 2020 due to the single issue of immigration and attitudes to foreigners.

The immigrants, no doubt, are going to shift US towards the very outcomes the left wing is now in hysterical fear of.

  1. Pro-life
  2. Anti-LGBT
  3. Sexism/Patriarchy
  4. Religiosity, severely resisting hedonism and secular pleasure-seeking liberal activities and ways of life (such as legalising weed, prostitution etc)
  5. Impoverished-level Capitalism (most immigrate for wealth as in 'a better life', not for values).
These are the values of every single non-'western' culture at the moment and certainly are significant in particular in the cultures immigrating the most to US.

What I ask is why the progressives and liberals are the ones defending that happening without integration or much restriction. It is literally only because of the harsh right wing attitude that immigrants have been deterred thus far.
#25
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@RationalMadman
that literally saved Dems in 2020
lol, it was a supreme curse. Most immigrants fear being poorer than the country they left than meantweet president.

Democrats killed the goose that was laying the eggs, and now they have to clean up the mess.

At least we don't have to worry about securing the border as the stock market continues to freefall.
#26
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@RationalMadman
The only salvation is that Trump was so unlikeable to immigrants, that literally saved Dems in 2020 due to the single issue of immigration and attitudes to foreigners.
This is wrong, Trump was of course unpopular to the majority of immigrants who are Democrat because he was a Republican. That being said, for a Republican he got a far greater than expected turn out. 


While immigrants may have been responsible for some seats in the south, they had relatively less blue impact than they would have had without Trump. 

What saved the Dems in 2020 was not immigration or immigration policy. It was Covid and Trump himself. The Biden campaign (and the rest of the media for that matter) blamed the situation entirely on Trump. Trump's personality compounded this, and it created that classic Trump derangement syndrome in many people both on the left and moderate right. Trump probably would have won if he stopped tweeting, or without the pandemic. 
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#27
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@rbelivb
@Kritikal
Trump was of course unpopular to the majority of immigrants who are Democrat because he was a Republican
Not true. Immigrants actually empathise with many of the Republican values and platform, they are singularly alienated by them due to the very thing that us progressives owe the right wing for.

In fact back in the OG days, it was indeed progressives who were skeptical to encourage immigration from right-wing conservative cultures. It was progressives who were most concerned with border patrol as the modern West developed.

This is how the so-called 'eugenics' that the rbelicb refers to in the Nordic nations maintained them to be the pristine progressive places that they currently are, with more happiness and fairness in their society than seen in any so-called progressive place prior. We need to see that if you allow immigrants in so readily, they will push you to obey their culture unless you also run integration programs to screen out those that won't conform. 

The only cultures and places failing to do this (failing to take an approach of alienating the immigrants that refuse to respect and conform to their culture) are the west so play this over several generations and what you will have is a completely eroded western ethnicity/culture and immigrants shaping what becomes of it with their own cultural values.

What is being seen in the US isn't solely local nationalists pushing for backwards regress, it is actually also a backfiring of enabling the most right-wing cultures on Earth to infiltrate, un-integrated and without a single changed mind and influence platforms, votes and their local community.

These are people from places that are very much in support of the following positions:

  1. Pro-life
  2. Anti-LGBT
  3. Sexism/Patriarchy
  4. Religiosity, severely resisting hedonism and secular pleasure-seeking liberal activities and ways of life (such as legalising weed, prostitution etc)
  5. Impoverished-level Capitalism (most immigrate for wealth as in 'a better life', not for values).
fact-check me on their cultures if you think I'm lying.

You cannot say it is solely 'backwards white conservatives' making the shift, these are precisely the values of people of Sharia, South American and many African cultures as well as Eastern European for that matter (the latter will be 'white' perhaps but not Western in their culture and not 2 or even 3 generations native to America).
#28
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@RationalMadman
For sure.

All the extreme Christians left Europe on boats and headed for the New World.


And give the good guy a gun to defend himself against the bad guy.....Simple.


The thing over here is, every Tom, Dick and Harriet can't just pop down the mall and stick a semi-automatic and some ammo in their trolley.


Though with 400million plus guns kicking around, I think that the U.S. is a bit of a lost cause.
#29
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@bmdrocks21
Looking down the barrel of a gun is scary.

How many you might have is irrelevant, if you can't use them.

BANG!

Though you probably wouldn't hear the bang.


Boys and their sex toys.

All other myriad genders included of course.
#30
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