Indian Politicians Mafia DP2

Effectively, yes. I don’t know what specific message would be sent, but regardless of what it is, I don’t think it would be this specific.

So he either

1: guessed correctly

2: is mafia scout and saw him move

3: is mafia moozer and know he visited someone and used this to try and confirm him self

Either way it implicates him as scum so yeah I’m down if banana wants to lynch him

I'll note that it's not guaranteed. Earth informed me just a few posts back that in his game where he'd made Pie the Motion Detector, he had said Pie would get distinct information based on whether he visited or was visited, so it's possible that that's his actual role. The lack of any investigative role claimed so far makes me hesitant to pull the trigger here as well.

I'd like to start discussing PoE more broadly at this point. We should at least be able to agree on a pool of potential scum based on what we know so far, though I'd really like if Owen could make an appearance and give any results he has. 

First, the claims so far (I'll build from Luna's breakdown - let me know if I missed anything):

JoeBob - Amit Shah - Motion Detector - NP1: used on Moozer, said he performed some action

Moozer - Mansukh Mandaviya - 1X Doctor - NP1: used on Whiteflame

Casey - Narendra Modi - 1x Kingmaker - NP1: crowned Banana Queen

Banana - Shivraj Singh Chouchan - Popular Townie - NP1: N/A 

Earth - Bhupendrabhai Patel

Lunatic - BJP 

Whiteflame - Minister

Owen - TMC

Austin - Yogi Adityanath - Ascetic

So, at least atm, my scum reads are Moozer and JoeBob. I've already spent some time explaining why JoeBob stands out to me with the Motion Detector and the result he says he received, but my stronger read is on Moozer. Anyone else find it strange that he just straight up claimed 1X Doctor rather than stating that he was just the Doctor, essentially claiming that he's now Vanilla since he's used up his role? And without any pressure this DP to boot. If it's the sole protective role in this game, it's strange that it's a single-use role and honestly, I'm not entirely sure why he claims to have used it on me. I seemed like a random choice, and especially if he didn't know who had a PR of substance, it was a strange choice to target me if his sole reasoning was that he thought I was town. I was certainly not the strongest townread coming out of DP1. This scum pool does mean that these two would have tied themselves together with JoeBob having claimed to use his role on his scum partner, but the Motion Detector claim and target seems almost tailored to both validate Moozer's claim and afford JoeBob some distance if he flips scum, since he can just say that it still registered Moozer's action regardless.

Anyway, this post has been long enough and I'd like to get others' thoughts. 

A couple of your points I dis-agree with here, only minor ones.

1. If I was town doctor I would claim only 1x as well, in hopes that mafia might not see me as a threat in future day phases and decide not to kill me. Probably shouldn't be discussing this out loud, but if he is a doctor, I doubt he is actually 1x.

2. I do actually think you were the more widely town read player last day phase. Me, austin, banana were all publicly town reading you, so I actually give him some slight town cred for targeting you.

Also I never really understood the "mistake" he made and his excuse for it seemed genuine. That said, I don't think he is out of the POE yet either. main reason I think this is in Mahabaratta mafia I was a protective role that was not doctor. Savant fake claimed doctor after asking the mod if there was one in the game, and we ended up correctly lynching him for it. Pie doesn't tend to use stereo typical protective roles like "cop" or "doctor" in his games, he uses variant style roles. Actually I was the variant style protective role in his last two games. Brave townie, and Apportioner. There wasn't a doctor in either of these games. So I don't think he's out of hot water yet, if we end up with another protective role claim I think he will be a bit higher on my list for a scum read.

But I agree owen and earth should probably full claim. I am willing to character claim this day phase if needed too, since I know I am in the POE to virtually everyone but you. 

Points taken. I'm less focused on the "mistake" that we've been discussing at this point because I think Moozer's response made sense - that his PM focused more on his character before he changed to Lok Sabha, since that only happened this year. I agree that the Doc claim is inherently at least a little sus at this point.

As for claims, yes, I'd say it's Owen and Earth first and foremost. I hope you won't have to claim, but we'll see.

I am the Self-Watcher. I can only target myself and see who visited me. I was not visited.

Yeah, maybe I wasn't being as obvious as I thought, but basically, despite being primarily known as the prime minister of India, Modi is still technically a member of the Lok Sabha. That's what I was trying to hint at. 

Interesting. I remember there was a role in Villainous Villains that did the same thing, but Luna called it the 'Gramps' instead. What's your justification? 

Pie wrote a whole thesis on this guy about how his background as a Patel and his understanding on local issues made him popular and adept at watching over his community. 

How does that not just make him a regular watcher than if its a whole community, what in the description indicates it would be a self watcher?

you know what, I just read austins description and his link to his role, makes absolutely 0 sense to me. So I am gonna give you a bit of a pass on that front. Though I do agree withwhiteflame its weird that we have a bunch of self visiting roles.

Meh, I don't think the head of a monastery being an Ascetic is that weird. I think Earth's claim is believable at the very least. 

its more that the direct reason isn't really stated

I get how you feel, but you are barking up the wrong tree. 

It seems like the way Pie designed this was meant to offer more opportunities for town to reduce the number of potential scum by PoE rather than find them out directly. Kingmaker is mainly here to self-confirm, same with Popular Townie. Given what I know about Luna's role, it has a similar aim to it. I'm going to remain vague about mine, but while it isn't in this same vein, it's definitely not as direct as a Doctor or Motion Detector. In general, there seems to be a trend towards limited utility roles or roles that could be net positive or negative to town like Austin's Ascetic. I could see the Self-Watcher falling into the limited utility camp at least.

Still waiting on you, Owen.

I already full claimed. I'm thr Self-Watcher.

Sorry, I saw that and then forgot about it. I was looking at Whiteflame claim list from page 2z

Earth - Bhupendrabhai Patel - Self-Watcher - NP1: was not visited

Hi everyone. 

I have nothing to report. Let me read through the chat. 

Who all wants me to claim? 

By my tally: me, Luna, and Moozer, who has you in his scum pool partly due to your lack of claim.

Okay then,  I'll claim. Hold on a moment 

Mamata Benergee. I am Enchantress 

You can see why I was concerned about this. 

I passed the ball to Ana Banana