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@Barney
Please clarify if vigilante shoots at day or night.
UPick Mafia DP1
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675
Can you give me my vote back?
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@Earth
I can use it however I (or you) want. I'll just vote however you do.
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@Savant
Sorry, keep forgetting to @ people.
I'm going to officially say that we should ignore the shirt vote. I don't trust Savant. However, I am tired so I am going to bed. Don't lynch Savant yet.
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@Earth
Anyway Pie is acting town, and I don't care who gets the shot, as long as town collectively decides who is the target. If, say, Joe hammers and town all says to shoot Moozer, but he shoots Pie instead, we can lynch Joe. Honestly? This is just another source of headache for town. It's scummy that Savant just stole my vote, but I'm too tired to think if he's scum or just eager Town. Perhaps we can arrange that Savant is shot and maybe we can VTNL.
Eager scum trying to get town cred, who has zero scum reads and has been doing zero scum hunting.
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@Savant
It's a strong possibility that scum can roleblock. Or save the shot for later and claim they were roleblocked.
So now you don’t want to give it to Wylted if he confirms, and now just want to let it die.
Okay, I looked back through the thread and this whole altercation started when Pie accused Savant of claiming a scummy role and doing scummy behavior by stealing Earth's vote despite not suspecting him. I don't necessarily scumread Savant for assuming that being confirmed as the vote thief would put him in the clear, but I do think the fact that he suggested not giving the vig power to anyone at all, combined with him stealing Earth's vote, makes him tilt a bit scum. I'd be fine with doing a VTNL, but I actually think Savant has a point in bringing up the fact that the mafia could potentially roleblock/redirect the vigilante kill and then everything will have been a waste. I also don't want us to waste the vig though. For now, I'm not going to vote, but I do think we still should lynch somebody and find somebody to give the 'shirt' to. Moozer and Pie are my top townreads right now, but Savant obviously won't agree on giving it to pie, so maybe we give it to Moozer.
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@Savant
Also, if I was scum, why wouldn't I just steal the vote anonymously and hammer at the last minute lol?
Well this is WIFOM. Or it could be that you were afraid to fake claim. Or it could be that you straight wanted to gain town cred, which is what I’ve been saying.
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@ILikePie5
now you don’t want to give it to Wylted if he confirms,
If he confirms, then we may as well give it t him if we know he's town. Roleblock wouldn't change that.
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@Casey_Risk
Okay, I looked back through the thread and this whole altercation started when Pie accused Savant of claiming a scummy role and doing scummy behavior by stealing Earth's vote despite not suspecting him. I don't necessarily scumread Savant for assuming that being confirmed as the vote thief would put him in the clear, but I do think the fact that he suggested not giving the vig power to anyone at all, combined with him stealing Earth's vote, makes him tilt a bit scum. I'd be fine with doing a VTNL, but I actually think Savant has a point in bringing up the fact that the mafia could potentially roleblock/redirect the vigilante kill and then everything will have been a waste. I also don't want us to waste the vig though. For now, I'm not going to vote, but I do think we still should lynch somebody and find somebody to give the 'shirt' to. Moozer and Pie are my top townreads right now, but Savant obviously won't agree on giving it to pie, so maybe we give it to Moozer.
Glad you see the light. But, why is Moozer town to you.
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@WyIted
You better confirm rn, or you will look very suspicious.
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@Savant
If he confirms, then we may as well give it t him if we know he's town. Roleblock wouldn't change that.
So role confirmation =/= affiliation confirmation. Unless you know his affiliation to begin with
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@ILikePie5
role confirmation =/= affiliation confirmation
Depends. Like I don't think scum would have the power to decide the day's lynch, or reveal themselves as the innocent child.
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@ILikePie5
Glad you see the light. But, why is Moozer town to you.
It's one half gut feeling and one half the weird, complex way he described how his role works. Basically, he said there's two different paths it could take and one of them can confirm him as town, but not until DP3. It's the kind of weird thing that I can definitely see being in a highly customized game but that I don't think a mafia likely would have pulled out of thin air.
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@Casey_Risk
It's one half gut feeling and one half the weird, complex way he described how his role works. Basically, he said there's two different paths it could take and one of them can confirm him as town, but not until DP3. It's the kind of weird thing that I can definitely see being in a highly customized game but that I don't think a mafia likely would have pulled out of thin air.
You definitely have potential. Future of mafia is bright. Keep in mind tho that Moozer could have a scum partner that’s helping him, or his role as scum truly works that way, just isn’t scummy like Scum Watcher or something.
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@ILikePie5
Keep in mind tho that Moozer could have a scum partner that’s helping him, or his role as scum truly works that way, just isn’t scummy like Scum Watcher or something.
That's a good point, but like I said it's also one half gut feeling for me. Usually we don't have a whole lot to go off of DP1 anyway, so all of my reads are subject to change.
Logging off for the night, see y'all tomorrow.
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@Savant
Pie is my top scumread rn. Without even posting reads, he expects us to follow him for some reason. Right now either Luna is his scum buddy or he is trying to earn Luna's trust, and I am leaning toward the former. Whether or not you think I am confirmed, giving vigilante powers to a possible scum is a terrible idea, and Pie is basing his guess on one data point (people who went along with my plan). Pie could only be this confident if he knows he is scum and wants to earn Luna's trust by letting him hammer.At first I was town reading Pie despite my annoyance with him because he is usually aggressive, however this time around he is so aggressive at the expense of logic that it doesn't make sense. Then I realized he is probably scum trying to do what he usually does as town but going a bit overboard.
This reads as omgus, because none of this is an actual reason to scum read pie other than being mad that he doesn't agree that you should be town confirmed by your role. Then again you played this way in the last game too, so you could just be town here. People who don't agree with you =/= Scum
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@Savant
Not seeing me as 100% confirmable is fine. But in that case, we should avoid letting anyone hammer instead of giving a potential scum a night kill. Notice how Pie just called me "scared" without actually contesting my argument.
NO one is confirmed town yet. So literally anyone who hammers is just as likely to be scum as the next. You could argue barney is likely town because why would the mod make a role like that scum, but its still WIFOM
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@Savant
I'm running out of shirt jokes for this game.I think you have them down to a T.
Okay that one was good. We definitely aren't out of shirt jokes yet, or Sew it Seams.
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@ILikePie5
Your opinion is requested.
Eh, I agree that prima facie vote thief is a negative utility role, but austin tends to get most of his alignment-affiliation from sites like mafiascum, so it is possible that it's town aligned. I don't think he should be confirmed town either, but I am not as quick to jump on the "he's scum automatically" train. Also a lot of the people following him are noobs too, so I am not as quick to condemn them as you are. I don't really like savant's omgus towards you here, but he literally just did this in your game as well as town (he happened to be right with austin but he also did it to me to and I was town). So idk how to read that, but I think both of you are jumping the gun a little bit on your scum reads of each other. I don't see this as an either or lynch or anything, both of you are just as likely to be town here imo.
Vote RSVLTS SHIRT
Idc who gets the vigilante, i'd prefer it wasn't a noob. If it's a vet whose scum we can at least pressure them for it if they make a crazy decision. I'd be fine with pie getting the vig too, though I hope he doesn't just shoot savant because of his vote thief claim alone, I'd like to see some behavioral analysis with that read if he's going to yeet him.
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@ILikePie5
Excuse I pointed out that vote thief was scummy prior to you, so no I was not going to be on board with him getting the vig shot. Also if we can't agree we can just ignore the option to get it
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@Earth
Anyway Pie is acting town, and I don't care who gets the shot, as long as town collectively decides who is the target. If, say, Joe hammers and town all says to shoot Moozer,
I am for giving it to pie and fine with that, but no we don't tell who we give it to who to shoot. Scum cannot know where the gun is being aimed to reduce the possibility of funny business
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@ILikePie5
So role confirmation =/= affiliation confirmation. Unless you know his affiliation to begin with
My role confirmation probably does 3 things
1. Confirms I am town
2. Balances out savant role assuming he was scum. I think my role was created first and he is the answer to my role. I am entirely lynch proof up until mylo or lylo. I wouldn't be surprised if his vote thief role also had an accepting like mylo or lylo
3. I forgot what number 3 is but give me the fucking shot since my role ensures I Wil be NKed and out of the game
Also I ruined the utility of my role a bit by claiming it but I trust myself most with the gun
If pie doesn't want to give it to me, I will vote today to give it to him but I thinknits easy to confirm my role immediately and people should be more comfortable, especially since it seems to balance Savant's role
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@WyIted
Excuse I pointed out that vote thief was scummy prior to you, so no I was not going to be on board with him getting the vig shot. Also if we can't agree we can just ignore the option to get it
I am not opposed to this either. I mean it has a higher chance in resulting in a town kill then a mafia kill. With such a low number of players vigilantes are super risky. I'd almost waive if I was the vig unless I just had a super deep scum read on someone anyway.
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@WyIted
I am entirely lynch proof up until mylo or lylo.
I don't see how these roles are ever pro town, but considering that we've seen two or three of these type of roles on the town team lately, I am not gonna FOS it. I am sure pie will want to test this though, and honestly I don't see how testing this hurts town at all. You opposed?
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@Lunatic
Idc who gets the vigilante, i'd prefer it wasn't a noob. If it's a vet who’s scum we can at least pressure them for it if they make a crazy decision. I'd be fine with pie getting the vig too, though I hope he doesn't just shoot savant because of his vote thief claim alone, I'd like to see some behavioral analysis with that read if he's going to yeet him.
Here is why his behavior is also scummy:
If he is a town vote thief, he should be stealing the vote of someone who he thinks is scum. When I asked him if he scumreads Earth, whose vote he stole, he states that he didn’t even think about that. He just wanted the town cred and be “confirmed.,” which is exactly a scum play. As town the thought should have been I want to steal the vote of scum, not a random person. He also hasn’t scum hunted besides the OMGUS on me. Then when I say he’s getting the 1x Vig over my dead body, he said then only Wylted should get it, ignoring the role confirmation =/= affiliation confirmation. Then he pivots to: well if neither of us get it, then no one should.
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@WyIted
Excuse I pointed out that vote thief was scummy prior to you, so no I was not going to be on board with him getting the vig shot. Also if we can't agree we can just ignore the option to get it
I mean you kinda were fine with it for a little while. Also, you said you didn’t want to waste a town directed kill, so what changed now?