Chess Mafia DP2

Author: AustinL0926
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#301
Moozer325
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@whiteflame
I’ll vote for Vader, Luna, or pie if I know I have the enough votes behind me. I wouldn’t go for Barney, probably just because I think he has a pretty good claim, but change my mind by a means.

#302
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@Moozer325
I’ll vote for Vader, Luna, or pie if I know I have the enough votes behind me. I wouldn’t go for Barney, probably just because I think he has a pretty good claim, but change my mind by a means.
Alright. Right now, it's looking like the momentum is behind lynching Vader, so your wagon might be joined soon enough, though I'm considering it more deeply before pursuing it myself.

#303
ILikePie5
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@Moozer325
Who would you have me use it on?
Think about it hard. Use your intuition
#304
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@whiteflame
I've been convinced for a little while that the scum team is either you and Luna, who claim to have largely confirmed each other, or Barney and Vader. PoE comes down to you four at the moment, with Moozer as a less likely outlier. So the flip should be informative regardless, particularly if Moozer uses his role.
My confirmation tomorrow will get rid of me at the very least. Supa theoretically could confirm himself as well. You said you are confirmable. Lunatic is with me for reasons I will mention tomorrow. That leaves Barney who’s role is negative utility anyways.

I'll have a decision on this by the end of the day. I don't plan on letting the DP go by without a lynch, regardless.
I agree
#305
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@Moozer325
I wouldn’t go for Barney, probably just because I think he has a pretty good claim, but change my mind by a means.
Can you explain this first before I go Steven Crowder on you?
#306
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@ILikePie5
Like i said before, it’s mostly just that he did give us his role (albeit after a little proding), but his claim seems pretty solid to me, but like said, change my mind.
#307
Lunatic
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@whiteflame
I don't think Barney is confirmed by any means, but I'd need that kind of information to give me more reason to push on him
Smh all that back and forth and wall of text just for you to say this. What a waste of time. This was all I needed you to say. That said Barney is still my top scum read. I guess pie said the same things but it hurt your ego less so your okay with agreeing? I’ll remember to speak more softly with you in the future lol.
#308
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@whiteflame
As far as cinfirmable roles go, most roles in mafia aren’t going to be confirmable. We can’t always rely on them to win a mafia game. We already wasted a mislynch lynching joebob who was unconfirmable, and I’d like to remind you that neither me you or Barney are cinfirmable. Pie actually is role confirmable at least. I give your claim credit because if the cop investigation and we have a flipped miller but even then the cop was reportedly given to you, not your own, so you could have faked that result if scum.

Point is, being unconfirmable is a pretty trash reason to lynch someone alone. If you want to admit that I hurt your ego by challenging your “flawless” mod confirmed logic and it possed you off enough to omgus me, I’ll buy that. At least that’s honest.
#309
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Anyways we have limited time remaining. I agree with suspicion on supas role but I’m honestly still pretty convinced Barney is scum and supa can be lynched tomorrow if he doesn’t yield results or if the results don’t make any sense. I don’t think my vote is moving into anyone else besides maybe mixer this day phase for buddying Barney and overall just lack of contribution to the game
#310
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@ILikePie5
Barney just rubs me off the wrong way and has been this entire game.
#phrasing

#311
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@whiteflame
@Moozer325
Like i said before, it’s mostly just that he did give us his role (albeit after a little proding), but his claim seems pretty solid to me, but like said, change my mind.
Sure—here are a couple reasons

1) He claimed Pin. Pinning a piece in chess is a negative for the person in the pin. The pinned piece cannot move. So for example. Let’s say say there’s a Queen in between her own king and an enemy rook. The enemy rook is protect by the other enemy rook. The queen is pinned and cannot move because moving the queen would be an illegal move. 

2) Barney claimed weak investigator roleblocker hybrid. But the first part is that someone has to move before a second person can be roleblocked. Now, we know that there is a redirector/bus driver/etc in the came based on the roles of two people (yourself and Lunatic) and Austin’s message to Whiteflame. Three people cannot be scum. With you, you strengthen and protect the same person if I read correctly, so the target is only one person. Barney can target two people (and conveniently still hasn’t answered whether his action counts as visiting two people).

3) We also know that Barney said he visited Whiteflame. That means 2 people visited Whiteflame—Barney and Earth (presumably). Whiteflame is the only convenient person Barney can visit, which is odd. He didn’t know that Whiteflame had an action that would cause him to move, while he knew that you did, yet he targeted Whiteflame instead of you? As town, his utility would be to stop a NK with his subsequent roleblock. Why did he not target you? It’s convenient that Whiteflame got the message after the DP and everything started, so we know Barney had to have visited Whiteflame
#312
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@Lunatic
Anyways we have limited time remaining. I agree with suspicion on supas role but I’m honestly still pretty convinced Barney is scum and supa can be lynched tomorrow if he doesn’t yield results or if the results don’t make any sense. I don’t think my vote is moving into anyone else besides maybe mixer this day phase for buddying Barney and overall just lack of contribution to the game
I agree. Barney today and Supa tomorrow
#313
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Moozer not mixer, damn auto correct lol
#314
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@Lunatic
I’m not going to get into the differences between how you posed it and how Pie did. It doesn’t make any difference at this point, so save it for the Endgame. I will, however, point out that I never said Barney was town confirmed. That was always your characterization of my position. The most I said is that I’m not voting him this DP because I townread him.

Also, this:

I’d like to remind you that neither me you or Barney are cinfirmable
is wrong. I’ve stated that I am confirmable, and not based on the Cop investigation. Just because I haven’t confirmed myself yet (neither has Pie), doesn’t mean I’m not confirmable.
#315
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I’m gonna read into everything. I have some hours free right to dive into anything but I see a “if not Barney then Supa”, which is pretty illogical I will say
#316
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@Barney
Barney, pie made some good points, so I’ll give you a chance to represent yourself here.

#317
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@whiteflame
did you have a chance to read my post to Moozer
#318
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@whiteflame
That doesn’t touch the point I was trying to make though whiteflame. You can’t expect every town role to be confirmable, or expect to win a game by lynching every role that isn’t. We did it to joebob though that was literally only one aspect of why we lynched him, in the day phase we could most afford to do it. Savant could have been on your chopping block for the same reason. So could moozer. Hell even some confirmable roles have to be taken with a grain of salt, mafia can fake claim protective roles by forfeiting night kills. Etc etc.

Point I am making, the hill I’m always dying on, is behavior should always be a factor. We can’t rely on the game to solve itself, and the problem with dart players is that many expect that to happen because so many mods cater to that mindset. 
#319
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@Earth
@Lunatic
@whiteflame
@Moozer325
I asked Austin whether a non-active role usage would count as a visit, and he said no.

I also asked whether a hypothetical hybrid role would count as visiting one or two players. He just said if you do any active action to another player, it counts as a visit, which doesn’t really answer the question 
#320
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@Earth
@whiteflame
What is stopping you both from voting Barney at this juncture?
#321
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@Lunatic
Dude, I’m sincerely so tired of you mischaracterizing my argument that, at this point, I just want to drop it. None of what you’re saying here has been my position. I called out the issue with having so many confirmable roles earlier, and how that means not all of them can be town. I haven’t discounted behavior, either, but I do (and should) take results and actions into account. Just because you disagree with what I’m prioritizing in my reads doesn’t mean I’m dismissing large swaths of information, or expecting the game to solve itself, and sincerely, I resent that you think that’s my mindset.
#322
whiteflame
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@ILikePie5
What is stopping you both from voting Barney at this juncture?
Just… could you wait? I’ve been on here all morning and I’m still trying to process a good deal of information. If it gets near to the end of the DP and the votes are as they currently stand, unless I come to a very different conclusion than I am now, I’ll hammer.
#323
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@Lunatic
@whiteflame
Dude, I’m sincerely so tired of you mischaracterizing my argument that, at this point, I just want to drop it. None of what you’re saying here has been my position. I called out the issue with having so many confirmable roles earlier, and how that means not all of them can be town. I haven’t discounted behavior, either, but I do (and should) take results and actions into account. Just because you disagree with what I’m prioritizing in my reads doesn’t mean I’m dismissing large swaths of information, or expecting the game to solve itself, and sincerely, I resent that you think that’s my mindset.
I genuinely think this is town v town situation and we’re getting diverted. You both are on the same page that Barney is not affiliation confirmed. The only thing that is confirmed is that Barney visited Whiteflame.
#324
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@whiteflame
Just… could you wait? I’ve been on here all morning and I’m still trying to process a good deal of information. If it gets near to the end of the DP and the votes are as they currently stand, unless I come to a very different conclusion than I am now, I’ll hammer.
Aight 
#325
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@ILikePie5
The only thing that is confirmed is that Barney visited Whiteflame.
I mean… no? Did anyone confirm that? Earth visited me, Barney claims he did.
#326
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@whiteflame
I mean… no? Did anyone confirm that? Earth visited me, Barney claims he did.
The message you got from Austin wouldn’t have come if someone other than Earth visited you. If Barney is scum, which is likely, either he or his partner visited you
#327
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@ILikePie5
The message you got from Austin wouldn’t have come if someone other than Earth visited you. If Barney is scum, which is likely, either he or his partner visited you
I wouldn’t call that confirmation, just odds on, but alright.
#328
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@whiteflame
I’m referring to the post you voted me for not being a confirmable role. How is that a mis characterization when that’s literally the reason you voted for me?

#329
Lunatic
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If the logic is there is too many confirmable roles that should almost work more in my favor than against it lol
#330
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@Lunatic
I was seeking your claim at the time, as I explicitly stated. I was not, at that time, scumreading you. So, no, it was not the mere existence of an unconfirmable role that led me to sus you, believe it or not.