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To clarify: My character does have variants, but the differences between them are almost entirely cosmetic, so it wouldn't be accurate to call them "tiers."
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VTL Pie
Might as well put that there while I catch up. On the last 24 hours.
(...This isn't a serious vote, to be clear.)
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It's possible to be a category and a subset simultaneously. The Anvil, for instance, could be included in the crafting station "set," but it's also a category of its own in that there are multiple types of anvils (Iron, Lead, etc.). You could make the same case for the Pressure Plate, which could be included in "wiring" or some such, but is also a category in its own right in the sense of having multiple types of pressure plates (Brown, Red, etc.).
Am I making sense?
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Right now, Mikal vs Toaster is giving me town v town vibes.
This is either TMI or just a good call, because I agree. Mikal isn't really fishing in a way that's useful for scum just because of how vague it is. Terraria is a big game with a lot of Things in it, knowing that someone is specifically a category rather than one specific item doesn't change a whole lot.
On the other end, Iron can be a scum role shifting things slightly, but I think they would be able to come up with something better than "3x Cop" if they wanted to be believed, and I find it hard to believe that would be the scum fake claim.
I don't think we should press on the explosion subject for now, especially when there are a few people we haven't heard much from.
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I suppose the Cop could be a reference to the fact that if you hold a pressure plate, you can see wiring in the vicinity... Seems like a bad justification, but my justification is also pretty bad.
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My role is not plural despite technically being a category, it might just be you?
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Ah, I get what you mean now.
That being said, I still don't find it suspicious.
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@irontoaster
@Mikal
Also, Lunatic's claim is a category, no? https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Crafting_stations
"Crafting Station" encompasses a lot.
Iron, just to be clear, you do not have a specific justification for the Cop aspect of your role? The other two make sense, but I don't get that one off-hand.
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How meaningful is a "slip" like that when Mafia has at least one fake claim to work with?
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Oh, we're not all blocks/items? There goes my internal speculation about the Mafia characters. I thought they would be three traps. But I suppose monsters are potentially in play.
I'm an item that can spawn naturally.
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It's been a while.
I have a decent amount of theme knowledge, although I was expecting NPCs, not whatever these characters are.
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@ILikePie5
@Mikal
He's joining the (up to) 180 player MafiaUniverse Anniversary Mash.
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I wasn't expecting Mharman to actually accept the deal I offered. But here we are.
/in
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@Savant
If you're in the MafiaUniverse Discord, you can ask one of the moderators there, like Arapocalypse, to add you to the spectator chat.
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@Savant
For what it's worth, Savant, I thought you played that game fairly well, especially in terms of adjusting to a completely new website and group of people you'd never met before. I was keeping an eye on it from the spectator chat. Most people outside of thread found you decently towny, from what I can tell. You were one of the people who was the least-guessed to be a wolf on N1. It's disappointing that it ended that way.
...It's also the second time in a row that the DART representative got eliminated on Day 4 when someone else really should have died instead. Strange.
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@whiteflame
which is the point you're not addressing.
How do you expect someone to "address" this, exactly? Beyond the two obvious arguments of "There are probably several ways to split the PM claims 7-2" and "This would imply Pie had some sort of checklist for what to include while he was making PMs"?
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You really think I would fake claim without everything ready?
When you post something that has a big bold "Do not speculate on this".... maybe? I still find that hiding that information is strange. If "scum has an extra kill but they don't know the method" is already claimed, how does "a role has a hidden aspect" (paraphrasing) turn the needle information-wise at all?
Despite WF's role PM analysis, I'm starting to believe that Banana is Town just because of how her behavior change vaguely reminds me of how she behaved toward me when she was up against me in Mayday. Maybe not the best arguments, but presented in a stream of thought sort of manner that looks villagery to me.
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I did ask Banana to provide it via our chat on Discord,
... Sorry, what? I thought Banana said her link to Lunatic's private channel didn't work? Did I miss that changing?
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@whiteflame
Whiteflame- Not sure how much this matters to you since you already made your post, but my role mentions:
- I am a great tactician and natural leader.
- I serve as Mason's handler, planning missions and ensuring I get the best out of him.
- I am the one to undo Mason's brainwashing.
That about sums it up.
More to come once I get on my train.
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@Earth
@whiteflame
"A hidden aspect"- is that the exact wording? Seems very unhelpful, although I guess it would make sense with Night 1 if it's meant to be increasing usefulness.
People with more experience than me in Pie games- do you believe that this could be something he would host? It doesn't seem familiar to anything he's done before, from what I recall.
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Right. So I'm saying, if we're going to lynch anyway, then we have one more lynch left afterwards either way, even if scum gets a double kill. So there isn't really a reason to avoid speculation about the double kill, is there? If we were in a normal F5 LYLO, then sure, but we aren't.
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@Mharman
Just a second. If you're not lying and we're forced to lynch today, then the scum having an extra nightkill doesn't really matter, does it?
If we lynch right and go to Final 5, one kill or two kills brings us to Final 3 or Final 4. In either case, we still have another lynch. So I don't see the issue with speculating about it.
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@whiteflame
I did actually check on whether or not Strengthener would work- Pie told me it's basically that if I die, the victim's ability is just gone, so it can't be used in the first place and therefore couldn't be strengthened.
It doesn't fit Pie modpsych to include a role like Strengthener and then not have anything to strengthen against, right? So there must be something wolves have going on under the hood... unless Strengthener was a guess hoping that there existed some Town power that could be strengthened against.
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Hm... does Mharman or Whiteflame coach Banana into going for this sort of play in a world where that's the Mafia team? Earth was vulnerable after Day 2- he was a focus and received negative attention- so it does seem plausible that faking a red might be a choice there.
Problem is, if that didn't work, Earth would be semi-cleared by virtue of being Mafia mislynch target, right? Which forces a more difficult situation for the 2nd person in F4.
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@Mharman
So Moozer is essentially confirmed by the Escape Artist. Earth/Banana looks like a difference check, which would suggest that Whiteflame/Mharman is the same. There is some nuance in that I suppose it's possible Earth/Banana could be v/v if there is indeed a redirector- but it seems like they would have to get particularly lucky to happen to get Banana and happen to do so in a way that implicates Earth. I'm not sure I believe it.
Anyway, I've come out, so Mharman, it's your turn to claim and explain why you're so confident that we need to vote this phase.
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@whiteflame
Going to need a full claim from you to start as well as any night actions you might have taken.
Right. Understandable, because even without Earth's claim, we *are* in MYLO right now, right?
I am Jason Hudson, Muse. If I die, a Town-aligned player has their role disabled entirely. Justification is that Hudson was responsible for coordinating/planning with Mason for a lot of the game, so his death would lead to a loss in effectiveness. I wanted to avoid claiming this for as long as possible, for what I hope are obvious reasons.
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Hello, I'm sorry for the delay, reading through thread right now.
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I don't know if I'm going to be able to set that particular PR play aside, I'll have to think on it a bit more.
I don't think Lunatic simply having a Neighborizer role is reason enough to call him Town without going back and being more thorough. Pockets can happen in neighborhoods. I have played multiple games and written (but never hosted, sadly) a setup with a Mafia aligned Neighborizer.
I'm more willing to believe that Moozer is in fact lynchproof, just because of how risky of a claim it is. As Mafia, you're essentially making yourself the "default" lynch of the Day and hoping that people can come to a conclusion so they don't resort to you. Moozer is not a person who has a strong thread presence, so in that world, he would have some reliance on his partner to make sure another lynch gets pushed through. All of *that* aside, I believe in his reaction to the WyIted kill, unless someone else wants to show me that Moozer is capable of that sort of... "Dumbtell" sounds mean, but something like that, as Mafia.
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@Earth
@Lunatic
Why would town need an ability that prevents them getting lynched lol
A 1x lynchproof wolf is extremely scum sided. It basically means wolves only need 2 mislynches to win, in a game where there are only 9 players.
If Moozer is a wolf, it's because "1x lynchproof" is a lie, not because a Mafia aligned role has that ability, in my opinion.
targeted WF, He was either visited or did a visit.
...Why on Earth would you do that? He claimed an active role with unlimited use on Day 1. What did you hope to get out of it?
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Oh, okay. The way you phrased it, I thought you were saying you were added midway through the Night, which would've made it an "Instant" action. Confusion alleviated.
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@whiteflame
..Hm?
I was recruited to a chat with Luna during the NP as a result of his role, and we confirmed with Pie that WyIted’s role would have taken priority over other night actions.
Just to clarify, you were added midway through the night, but WyIted's role still would have disrupted the ability? That doesn't make sense from a priority perspective- am I misunderstanding you?
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I was going to write a post about how I didn't think he would have used it Night 1 because the benefit wouldn't be great and he strikes me as the type to keep going.
But then I rechecked the EOD and he quite literally said "I feel useless." So maybe he would have used it.
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@Earth
You people are going to force me to be in thread at work or I'll miss a hammer, hm? It keeps happening...
I'll admit Wylted wouldn't be my first pick though.
In that case, who did you expect to be the kill?
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@Bullish
Don't vote me pls
Then give me a good reason not to. You're a tough slot to pin down as Town or Scum, as far as I'm aware.
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@Lunatic
@Mharman
I don't care. I think ideally we are all vanilla and so is mafia. We shouldn't be leaning on roles.
If you're a fan of Mountainous, I have a website to send you to. The Mafia Universe yearns for the Mountainous.
I notice when Wylted is town he usually just says shit to see if he can get a reaction out of people and his page 1 feels no different.
And he doesn't do this as Mafia?
Anyways the chances that scum are exactly the two people that most might consider “nooby” or easily to manipulate (banana and moozer) seems low enough to me that I’m willing to almost confidently bet that scum is likely going to be one of the many vets in this game. I’m not town passing those two completely just speaking from probablility and mod psyche mostly that I feelLike scum is gonna be a deadly pick this time.
I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say here. That the team isn't exactly Banana/Moozer? Based solely on mod psyche/probability? I agree that you're probably correct, but it's a lot of words to say something so simple.
I wanna pressure whiteflame I think.VTL whiteflame
This is a mindmeld, I was feeling a little uneasy about WF for uncertain reasons. Something about the soft claiming felt off in a way I can't describe, which is unfair to WF, I know. That being said, the gut is right sometimes... I think I'll shelve that for now, though. See how WF proceeds.
(I know you said you though it was balanced Luna but it was NOT lmao).
My own slot, degrading one of my two wins on this website... how depressing. Woe is me.
Maybe I start here for now- VTL Bullish. See how this feels.
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What if we just dont do any discussion and just lynch somebody
This. Is null from Bullish. Isn't it.
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Moozer is the top Villager read from Page 1. Don't think WF/Lunatic is paired based on their interaction about softing.
I'm going to ping some of our low posters in particular here - what do you think about my question in #55?Do you think scum would be more likely to push for or against softclaims in this case?
Is it weird to answer a question that my own "slot" asked? It's tough to say for sure, but I think scum would want more softclaims rather than less. Considering that there don't seem to be a lot of "important" characters, the space that scum has for fake claiming might be pretty tight, so getting a gist of what everyone else has would be fairly important for them.
There are probably ways of doing it that are tougher for wolves to fake their way through, though. I might take a closer look and see if there's a good way to soft without giving too much away after I finish catching up.
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Seems my break was short-lived. Ah well, I did sign up for being a substitute.
I'll be taking a read through everything right now. Haven't played these games, so I'm afraid I won't be much help with theme analysis.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
For what it's worth, ADOL, Lunatic and I both thought we would have you marked as Obvious Town on D3 if we were Town, but it was pro scum wincon to contribute to bulldozing you.
Not a whole lot I have to say, Lunatic did most of the heavy lifting. We didn't have any Town abilities we really wanted to block, so I spent my N2 Jailkeep on Vader for credibility.
This is why you never concede.
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@Savant
Just saw the schedule- seems Savant is in the game starting this coming Monday. Good luck!
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You can slot me as a substitute if you'd like, but probably not joining from the start.
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Small chance you’d aim for me just to prevent the dual win or in case you thought I was hiding another TP role.
Fair enough.
Had a lot of paranoid induced rants in the scum chat. Casey is probably sick of me lol
I can indeed confirm that a certain someone decided this game was a scum win after ADOL was chopped. Which was true, apparently, but it was also amusing to watch.
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@whiteflame
Why did you hide on that last Night? A Survivor claim like that was never going to be targeted for a NK when Vader existed (and me if you thought I was Town.)
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Oh, thank God I didn't actually have to keep going there, I had absolutely no plan.
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...Hm, okay, well, there's the cross.
Sorry for the delay, thank you for waiting. (Mostly.)
For starters, I think I'll take the truth of WF's claim for granted. The balance of the game feels like it would be a bit off with exactly 9 Town and 2 Mafia, so a 3P makes sense.
If we take that as true, it splits the rest into two pairs- Me and Pie, Lunatic and Banana, each presumably containing one scum. The caveat there is whether or not scum!Lunatic would put scum!Banana in his Dreamer result. In a 3 Mafia game, I would say yes, the soft bus is worth it, but in a 2 Mafia game, putting a teammate who's apparently a bit lynch-prone in something like that is risky. The only reason Banana's not gotten much scrutiny, I think, is because That2 and ADOL both crashed out, and I don't... believe scum!Lunatic would have been able to predict that?
If I take both of these points to be true, it puts me in a position where Pie is essentially forced to be evil. Which would be great, except for the cross that just happened. So I do have to pick between the other two.
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@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
I'm baffled, what was the point of lying about "Asceticizer"? Doesn't seem to be worth a lie, especially on Day 3 when both charges might have been used and you're literally on the chopping block.
But c'est la vie, we're here regardless.
Honestly trying to decide on that front. Pretty sure I know who scum is already.
Ya it’s pretty obvious tbh
Care to share with the class? I need to take a bit to mull.
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