To what extent ought the religious person engage with the world and ...

Author: Tradesecret
Politics
Religion
church v state
evangelism

Posts

Total: 44
#31
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 390
1
2
7
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
1
2
7
-->
@Stephen


.
Stephen,

In your very revealing post #26 pertaining to Miss Tradesecrets modus operandi, how totally embarrassing for her to make such statements in even being a pseudo-christian at best.


 Especially disheartening, is when Miss Tradesecret stated the following: "Most atheists I know are impractical andairhead.  Many end up in prison, for theft and sex relatedcrimes, mostly kiddie crime. Many commit suicide and or are on drugsand alcohol. Not too many get married, or if they do - are on totheir 4 or 4th marriage. Many are gay or lesbian. #33"    

What was Miss Tradesecret doing "knowing atheists" in the first place, where Jesus' inspired words state with specificity that she is NOT TO BE AROUND UNBELIEVING ATHEISTS OF CHRISTIANITY to begin with: "Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?" (2 Corintians 6:14).   Once again, Miss Tradesecret slaps Jesus in the face for not following his true words of instruction as shown above.

Once again, Miss Tradesecret shows the membership and visitors in how NOT to be a Christian, and at her embarrassing expense which is  truly sad for her as usual

.  




#32
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,615
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@IlDiavolo
@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
IlDiavolo wrote: There is something that is not clear here, Tradesecret is a she or he? 🤔 😁

I honestly couldn't say.

But seeing that you have asked, I have to go with her first description of herself in her original profile as shown above #29. After all, why would anyone feel the need to lie about their gender in the first place - especially when there is an option to leave it blank?

And we have  to consider the fact that Tradesecret claims to be a Pastor and a Chaplain to his/her countries Armed Forces and claims to have been "chosen by god", would it be right for her to lie intentionally to deceive for no reason? Especially over something as trivial as gender?
 There again she has also changed her nationality since her first profile and now claims to be Australian where as her initial profile clearly shows she is native of New Zealand.
  For me, these petty and unnecessary lies/ contradictions don't seem to fit with someone that also claims to be a true Christian and now a "man" of god that preaches to a congregation of "over 300 worshipers every Sunday".

You can decide for yourself IlDiavolo, it's not his/her petty lies that bother me, it's her fk great whopping lies about herself that should be of concern for those that believe them or have been taken in by them.
Topic's author
#33
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,436
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@IlDiavolo
How is the Christian life boring? 
More or less like Flanders' life, you know, from the simpson. 😁
Again, there might be people that like this life but most of us don't, we find it fucking boring and stupid at times. 

To end with this discussion that is getting boring, I just want to say that you can't consider a belief a truth because they're diametrically opposed, as well as you can't consider a faith not blind because faith is blind by nature. If you understand this simple concepts, you wouldn't be going around trying to convince people that christianity is the truth. The christianity can be a truth for you and for the zealots that attend your church, but not for the others, so that makes you not have the right to fucking bother us with your nonsense, otherwise we have all the right to argue against your nonsense with the only tool available for reasoning: the logic.

Do you know any Christians? Any that live a life like Flanders? 

I have been in many churches in different denominations and I DONT KNOW any Christian who lives like Flanders does.  

Faith is not blind by nature. That is simply wrong. When someone sits on a seat even though they haven't reasonably tested it, it is in faith. Yet, that doesn't mean that they haven't reasoned with their brain to determine whether it is likely to hold their weight or not. It's still faith. 

Mysticism is a different kettle of fish. It says - I believe something because I believe something. It is faith without reason. Or without considered reason. Mormons for instance - pray to God to see if their book is from God or not. And if they receive an experience of peace they know in their mind that this is true. If they don't receive a peace, then they haven't prayed sincerely - so therefore they need to pray again - and again and again until they feel this peace. that's mysticism because they should have realise that praying to God for proof that something is the truth and obtaining a feeling of peace is not reasonable. And if they did believe this - and they didn't receive peace, then perhaps they ought to realise that it was God telling them it was not truth. but to suggest it has to do with sincerity - is blind faith. Like the emperor's new clothes. 

christianity is not like this. and no mormonism is not christianity. There are sadly some elements in the christian church which do rely on blind faith. But not every part and not every person. 

Historically faith has not been at odds with reason.  that is a modern view - put out by people who want to make that line. But it is not historical truth. And not everyone agrees with the modern view. 

You didn't have to come onto this page and put your two cents in. It was your choice. You could have turned the channel. But no - you chose to come here and put in your opinion - because you think you are right.  You wanted to make sure you got to impose your views on others - and so you did. You don't like it when people reflect your hypocrisy back into your face. that's ok. but face it. You are as bad as any person you are worried about trying to impose their views on you. you are quite content to do it to everyone else - but the problem is - you have no integrity.  that's it. simple. 
#34
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,074
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Tradesecret
Stupid analogy Trade...You can do better.


Actual seats and hypothetical GODs are two different kettles of fish.

There are various applicable words to describe the chances we take when sitting down and/or praying to a supernatural GOD.

Though a seat is demonstrably real, whereas a hypothetical GOD cannot be proven to exist..

The application of words and language makes no difference.

Faith in GODS is blind.

And a seat is real, but comes with an element of risk.
#35
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,615
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@zedvictor4
On Faith.
Tradesecret wrote: Faith is not blind by nature. That is simply wrong. When someone sits on a seat even though they haven't reasonably tested it, it is in faith. Yet, that doesn't mean that they haven't reasoned with their brain to determine whether it is likely to hold their weight or not. It's still faith. 

zedvictor4 wrote: Stupid analogy Trade [........................]And a seat is real, but comes with an element of risk.

It not ridiculously stupid, it is breath takingly backward and childish from one that alleges himself to be so highly educated in all things theological and biblical.

#36
IlDiavolo
IlDiavolo's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,514
3
2
5
IlDiavolo's avatar
IlDiavolo
3
2
5
-->
@Tradesecret
Do you know any Christians? Any that live a life like Flanders? 
Yes, I do. Some of them are easygoing, but others are unbearable because they turn up as hypocrits and extremely bigots.

If you say you didn't meet any Christian like Flanders, I guess these Christians like to party, for example. I also guess that those Christians don’t mind cursing in their conversations which has nothing wrong, right? What about a threesome, did they have such experience? Or maybe a swinging party, that's pretty wild, aint it? What about a divorce? 😁

Life is experiencing and the way christianity keep you from experiencing the many things life is to offer is just as authoritarian as the people that preach such things. But, hey, you're free to choose. 

Historically faith has not been at odds with reason.  that is a modern view - put out by people who want to make that line. But it is not historical truth. And not everyone agrees with the modern view.
LOL. 
You didn't have to come onto this page and put your two cents in. It was your choice. You could have turned the channel. But no - you chose to come here and put in your opinion - because you think you are right. You wanted to make sure you got to impose your views on others - and so you did. You don't like it when people reflect your hypocrisy back into your face. that's ok. but face it. You are as bad as any person you are worried about trying to impose their views on you. you are quite content to do it to everyone else - but the problem is - you have no integrity. that's it. simple. 
I'm not imposing anything. You might have noticed that I also have beliefs, but I always clarify that they are just beliefs and not an indisputable truth as you Christians shamelessly do.

If I come in here is because you're claiming over and over again that christianity is the truth, so I can't help but argueing against it because as a libertarian I should fight against the enslaving ideoligies such as religions and some political movements (socialism, comunism, leftism). 
#37
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,074
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Stephen
The trouble with being highly educated is that if one is not careful, one can easily loose sight of common sense.

Especially if one is highly educated in subjective non-sense.

My Dad used to accuse me of living in a fantasy World.

Though I think that he was referring to the luxury of youthful exuberance.

Something that he missed out on as a child of the 1920's and 30's.

Which nonetheless made him an excellent teacher in subjects relating to theology, and made me the grounded atheist I am today.

Despite the  best efforts of the C of E.


Topic's author
#38
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,436
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@IlDiavolo
Do you know any Christians? Any that live a life like Flanders? 
Yes, I do. Some of them are easygoing, but others are unbearable because they turn up as hypocrits and extremely bigots.

If you say you didn't meet any Christian like Flanders, I guess these Christians like to party, for example. I also guess that those Christians don’t mind cursing in their conversations which has nothing wrong, right? What about a threesome, did they have such experience? Or maybe a swinging party, that's pretty wild, aint it? What about a divorce? 😁

Life is experiencing and the way christianity keep you from experiencing the many things life is to offer is just as authoritarian as the people that preach such things. But, hey, you're free to choose. 
That's just bollox and you know that.  Life is experience that is true. And Christianity doesn't stop you from enjoying life. It enhances life. It enables you to enjoy it. 

It's like a game for example.  You can play the game according to the rules of the game or you can play just making up your own rules.  Some people think the latter is the best way to enjoy life and for them - perhaps there is an element of truth to that.  But try playing a game of chess, without sticking to the rules. Or try playing footy without sticking to the rules.  Or trying playing a game of poker where someone says - let's do whatever we can. People don't like cheats. Cheats spoil the game for others. There are rules in this life. And some people make their own rules. They typically end up dead, at a young age, spend lots of time in prison, are so drugged out - that they don't even know what they are missing. Or catch some venereal disease. 

Many people live as you suggest and become bored with it. Many wish that they had never wasted their life doing all these so-called fun things. Yeah, there are some who enjoy it, but not the vast majority.  why is that so many people spend their time watching tv shows or drinking? or on drugs? TO forget about life. To escape. They hate life - 

Christianity is a religion of rules anyway.  Yeah some individuals make it a whole lot of rules. But that's not what it is about. It is liberating. It is freeing. It is being connected to the most information - possible. 


Historically faith has not been at odds with reason.  that is a modern view - put out by people who want to make that line. But it is not historical truth. And not everyone agrees with the modern view.
LOL. 
You didn't have to come onto this page and put your two cents in. It was your choice. You could have turned the channel. But no - you chose to come here and put in your opinion - because you think you are right. You wanted to make sure you got to impose your views on others - and so you did. You don't like it when people reflect your hypocrisy back into your face. that's ok. but face it. You are as bad as any person you are worried about trying to impose their views on you. you are quite content to do it to everyone else - but the problem is - you have no integrity. that's it. simple. 
I'm not imposing anything. You might have noticed that I also have beliefs, but I always clarify that they are just beliefs and not an indisputable truth as you Christians shamelessly do.

If I come in here is because you're claiming over and over again that christianity is the truth, so I can't help but argueing against it because as a libertarian I should fight against the enslaving ideoligies such as religions and some political movements (socialism, comunism, leftism). 
Of course you have beliefs.  You are entitled to that - as are Christians.  You think you have the truth - otherwise you'd think something else. In fact I would suggest that you are militant in your beliefs - you are the fundamentalist. Yet without the integrity to realise what you are doing. you shove your views down people's throats and then get all upset when someone challenges you. Christians do think they have the truth - and they are not ashamed of it. And there is no reason why they ought to be ashamed of it.  Yet, what you seem to fail to realise is that tied up in this truth they hold is a very inescapable fact.  they know they can't change someone else's views. They can't manipulate to follow Christianity - and more than that - they don't want to. The end is not their justification. And since you fail to grasp this concept - you fail to understand where they are coming from - and hence why you think it is about rules.  I doubt that you will understand this - but there you go. 
#39
IlDiavolo
IlDiavolo's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,514
3
2
5
IlDiavolo's avatar
IlDiavolo
3
2
5
-->
@Tradesecret
That's just bollox and you know that.  Life is experience that is true. And Christianity doesn't stop you from enjoying life. It enhances blah, blah, blah...
you didn't address any of the experiences I mentioned. Do christians admit divorce? Remember that you said you are a libertarian, you know what libertarians think about marriage and divorce, I guess. You weren't clear either about swinger clubs or other safe forms of sex entertainment, do christians admit this kind of sexual experiences which is far from being unsafe as you put it? what about jerking off, how do christians of your church take on it? Do you think it's unsafe too? I met some christians that don't allow their wifes to work, how is it in your church? Are homosexuals admitted as christians? Man, so many questions to ask, but as far as I'm concerced christianity is dogmatic and dogmatism doesn't admit freedom to be yourself, so please just admit it and I will avoid to waste my precious time.

Of course you have beliefs.  You are entitled to that - as are Christians.  You think you have the truth - otherwise you'd think something else. In fact I would suggest that you are militant in your beliefs - you are the fundamentalist. Yet without the integrity to realise what you are doing. you shove your views down people's throats and then get all upset when someone challenges you. Christians do think they have the truth - and they are not ashamed of it. And there is no reason why they ought to be ashamed of it.  Yet, what you seem to fail to realise is that tied up in this truth they hold is a very inescapable fact.  they know they can't change someone else's views. They can't manipulate to follow Christianity - and more than that - they don't want to. The end is not their justification. And since you fail to grasp this concept - you fail to understand where they are coming from - and hence why you think it is about rules.  I doubt that you will understand this - but there you go.
Lol. I don't think I have the truth, but you sure do. That's why I ask for the evidence of your bold assertions, unless you claim right now that yours are just religious beliefs.
#40
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 390
1
2
7
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
1
2
7
-->
@Stephen


Stephen,

MISS TRADESECRET'S EMBARRASSING QUOTE IN THE 21ST CENTURY: "Christianity is a religion of rules anyway.  Yeah some individuals make it a whole lot of rules. But that's not what it is about. It is liberating. It is freeing. It is being connected to the most information - possible. "

DAMN IT, I hate it when Miss Tradesecret brings forth statements that put Christianity into a drastic situation in the 21st century, therefore, Christianity does have rules as shown below, but it is embarrassing to bring these particular "rules" to the forefront as explicitly shown below to address Miss Tradesecret's statement above.


RULE #1  is truly "liberating" to my offspring over the years by me godly having to BEAT THEM WITH A ROD:. "Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou BEATEST him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt BEAT HIM with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell." (Proverbs.23:13-14)!  


RULE #2  was truly "freeing"  since I was told by Jesus, as God, to be fruitful and multiply (Genesis 1:28), where we sometimes had to many daughters with the many wives that I have had over the years, 9 to this point, therefore we had to sell off some of our daughters into slavery!  “When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.” (Exodus 21:7)


Rule #3,  "In being connected to the most information," which is obviously the Bible, it taught me personally  that I had to HATE my father and mother, and my current wife, and even my children, and thank Jesus that I didn't have any brothers or sisters that I didn't need to hate as well, but ,I still had to hate my life that I thought was going just fine, but as the passage below so states, I had to perform these terrible acts above to be a disciple of Jesus, praise!

If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)


Stephen, do you think that Miss Tradesecret follows these three godly rules above, or does she still become a pseudo-christian and doesn't  perform them in front of Jesus (Hebrews 4:13), more so, do you think that she preaches these 3 godly edicts to her congregation?  *cough*


Poor Miss Tradesecret is such a mess in her own thread as shown.  :(

.
#41
ponikshiy
ponikshiy's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 604
3
3
6
ponikshiy's avatar
ponikshiy
3
3
6
-->
@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
I am virgin woman and you are preacher. I have seen many Christian preachers make hundreds of millions of dollars. If you are wealthy from exploiting your congregation, could you consider taking a beautiful 19 year old Russian virgin as bride. I have practiced blow job's on cucumbers, do do not think my lack of sexual experience means a lack of blowjob skills
#42
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 390
1
2
7
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
1
2
7
-->
@ponikshiy



.
ponikshiy,

YOUR UNGODLY QUOTE: " I have practiced blow job's on cucumbers, do do not think my lack of sexual experience means a lack of blowjob skills"

When you are able to give BJ's to watermelons, then and only then ,  will I think about your proposal.

"This is the way of an adulteress: she eats and wipes her mouth and says, “I have done no wrong.” (Proverbs 30:20)

.



#43
ponikshiy
ponikshiy's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 604
3
3
6
ponikshiy's avatar
ponikshiy
3
3
6
-->
@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
I can maybe do that, but I cannot do that without using my teeth which would scrape against watermelon a bit. Is teeth scraping during BJs something American man like?
#44
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,615
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@IlDiavolo
@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
Stephen, do you think that Miss Tradesecret follows these three godly rules above,#40

Well of course not., Brother D.  The Reverend Tradesecret is a contradictory clown at the best of times if not all the time. Not to mention his/her double standards when it suites.

I can never forget this eyewatering contradiction and use of double standards spewing from the Reverend.

I once asked the Reverend Tradesecret what he would consider a credible expert? 

Here>
Tradesecret wrote: Do you have any support for this from credible experts 
Stephen wrote: What would you consider to be a "credible expert"?  #39

Tradesecret wrote: Someone who has studied and been peer reviewed by his field. Not wikapedia.... #40
Now on the face of that you wouldn't expect any different from such a highly educated Wo/man that the Reverend Tradesecret claims to be. BUT!

 In another argument concerning the issue and use of "peer review" material, the the Reverend Clown had this to say:


Tradesecret wrote: Peer review is a bollox. Consensus is not proof.#135


And although the Reverend Tradesecret mentions that "Wikipedia" is not to be considered a "credible authority and is in no way "expert" , I have lost count of the times s/he has referenced and submitted into evidence material taken directly from Wikipedia his/her self!