Everyone should have an abortion

Author: Best.Korea

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Intelligence_06
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@Best.Korea
I often forget that men exist 😅
No, I get what you mean. You mean to convey a pro-choice position, but this is a debating website, and it is much more within my character to critique in ways that nitpick your topics. So that is what I did, since I have no problem with the general pro-choice position although "everyone" is a bit extreme including mothers who want children and mothers who don't want children abstaining. Obviously, I anticipated said to be said, so I picked a way of introducing myself to the thread in a way no one has as of yet.

And yes, men do exist. My father is one.

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@Best.Korea
Yep. Certainly no need for late term abortion.
Best.Korea
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@Intelligence_06
although "everyone" is a bit extreme including mothers who want children
No. The extreme would be to let mothers torture their children. No sane person would give birth to a child, or support such a horrible thing.

it is much more within my character to critique in ways that nitpick your topics.
Thats actually quite irrelevant, since my subjective opinion allows me to change definitions at any time. Therefore, I can even 200 posts later change the definition of "everyone", therefore negating your critique and forcing you to think of new.

And yes, men do exist. My father is one.
My father is a man too. My mother is a woman.
Best.Korea
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@zedvictor4
Yep. Certainly no need for late term abortion.
I agree. There is no need to wait 9 months when baby can be aborted at 6 weeks or sooner.

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@Best.Korea
No. The extreme would be to let mothers torture their children. No sane person would give birth to a child, or support such a horrible thing.
Ah, a poor sequence of words. I meant to say since most people are sane, using the term "everyone" is extreme.

My father is a man too. My mother is a woman.
OMG Same!!

Best.Korea
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@Intelligence_06
I meant to say since most people are sane,
I wouldnt say that most people are sane. Most people are psychopaths who torture others for pleasure.

Sidewalker
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@Intelligence_06
I'm a dude. I can't have an abortion even if I want one. Also, I don't want one.
I'm a Dudeist Priest, our position on Abortion is "everything is just, like, your opinion, man”

If you are interested I can get you ordained.

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@Best.Korea
while your syllogism is flawed, your conclusion about net negatives is quite a good point.
n8nrgim
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i imagine Oprah Winfrey when i see this thread... "everyone gets an abortion! you get an abortion! and you get an abortion! and you get an abortion! abortions for everyone!"  
SkepticalOne
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@Best.Korea
I see no good reason to abort because of the potential for pain in general. If you could make a case that there would be significantly more pain than happiness, then maybe I could be persuaded. 
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@SkepticalOne
 If you could make a case that there would be significantly more pain than happiness, then maybe I could be persuaded.
That depends on what you mean by "significantly more pain".

If you mean that the happiness of eating a cheeseburger or having sex outweights pain of being crushed by a car, raped or whatever, then there is really nothing to argue there.

I simply hold position that not having happiness and not having pain is better than having happiness and having lots of pain.

As long as you hold an assumption that happiness outweights pain in the world, you will end up justifying child birth if you take that for your moral value.

However, the truth is that your position is utterly immoral. 

My position: "Everyone should abort", means that I am not causing more pain than I am removing. My position is universal. It would literally prevent suffering of not just humans, but also animals. It also means that I am not causing more pain, therefore not having moral guilt.

Your position could, at best, argue that average happiness outweights average pain. However, even if that was true, it would still be immoral because there are individuals with pain that far outweights their happiness. Therefore, your position would be forced to argue that causing extreme pain to someone is good if it makes someone else happy. So not a very universal position, or even a morally sound one.
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@n8nrgim
i imagine Oprah Winfrey when i see this thread... "everyone gets an abortion! you get an abortion! and you get an abortion! and you get an abortion! abortions for everyone!"
Well, abortions, castrations, condoms and what not.
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@Barney
while your syllogism is flawed, your conclusion about net negatives is quite a good point.
Pain net negatives are just one of the problems with child birth. The other problem is personal responsibility for causing pain in the world. One more problem is money. Children are expensive and demanding. Kindergarten costs 3000$ a month.
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@Best.Korea
My position: "Everyone should abort", means that I am not causing more pain than I am removing
No, that is not what your syllogism is stating in the OP. It states everyone should abort because... pain. I'm not convinced life is pain.

As for not causing more pain than removing - How we can know a potential life is going to be more about pain than joy? Perhaps a given abortion is removing more happiness than pain.

Ultimately, if someone is an antinatalist, they should look into birth control. I mean, shouldn't the strength of their convictions keep them from potentially bringing new life into a 'world of misery'?!
zedvictor4
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@SkepticalOne
Well stated.

58 days later

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@Best.Korea
Ok bud I think that abortion is completely wrong because by definition bringing someone into the world however cruel it may be is indefinitely more cruel than smiting that poor being before it has a chance to live
FLRW
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"The power of population is so superior to the power of the Earth to produce subsistence for man, that premature death must in some shape or other visit the human race."
The late-18th century philosopher Thomas Malthus wrote these ominous words in an essay on what he saw as the dire future of humanity. Humans' unquenchable urge to reproduce, Malthus argued, would ultimately lead us to overpopulate the planet, eat up all its resources and die in a mass famine.
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@FLRW
If Malthus were alive today what on earth would he make of things.
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@zedvictor4

He would see an 800 percent increase in Earth's population.
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@FLRW
Would he view LGBTQetc as a positive development.

I'm guessing that a lot his angst was a result of late 18th century sexual angst.

And far less to do with global food production.
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@zedvictor4

See: The Reformulation of Sexual Knowledge in Eighteenth-Century England

sadolite
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Upon retrospect and given what the world is like today after 60 years of living, I wish I had been aborted.
FLRW
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@sadolite

Remember that J. Howard Marshall found his soul mate in a strip club at age 89!
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@FLRW
Good for him, doesn't change shit, the world is still what it is.
ponikshiy
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How am I supposed to trap wealthy man I to ridiculous child support payments if I abort the bastard child I have with him?
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@sadolite
Upon retrospect and given what the world is like today after 60 years of living, I wish I had been aborted.

Given your advanced age, and desire to die. I have one question for you, before I decide you are worth giving my virginity to. 

What is your net worth?
sadolite
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@ponikshiy
Well lets see, my house, summer house in Sweden, business condo and liquid cash and toys I'd say $800,000. But with that said shit is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it and your desperation to sell it. Could be more could be less. You should sell your virginity, you could get 40 or 50 grand for it. Ain't worth nothing to me, sex is way over rated. Been there did that done that like a billion times. I'd rather have tools and car parts.

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@sadolite
I could use a summer house. Maybe I could negotiate to be mistress once I find man who will be main victim. They must have 10 million net worth and be on deaths door.
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@ponikshiy
I think you are way over valuating your market place value among men.