Trump the dummy has been indicted. The indictment has been unsealed

Author: IwantRooseveltagain

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FLRW
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@TWS1405_2

There's going to be a witness at Trump's trial saying that Trump took pictures of the top-secret records and sold them to Russia.
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@FLRW
Good, let the Russians testify against fellow Russians.
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@FLRW
Lies. 

Unless the ISP/URL/phonr number can be concretely established l….all lies. Political weaponization for nefarious purposes. The country is broken. Democracy is broken. 

“Broken Arrow”!!!!!
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@Greyparrot

Why do you think Trump took all those records? Trump doesn't do anything he can't make money on.
IwantRooseveltagain
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weaponization
Hey you got the spelling right this time! You’re welcome 

The country is broken. Democracy is broken.
Because of idiots like you

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@FLRW
It's a Russian thing, you wouldn't understand.
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@FLRW
Listen to Ben Shapiro much? It’s not about money but about “attitude” and “knowledge!”
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Whatever you say, you are never wrong about anything. I was just repeating words by people who work in the legal profession.
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@FLRW
There's going to be a witness at Trump's trial saying that Trump took pictures of the top-secret records and sold them to Russia.
Yeah, sounds like a reliable witness. I wonder how he managed to follow Trump all the way to Russia.
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@FLRW
As much as I agree that Former President Trump is an: asshat, bigot, and all together criminal - I don't agree with the idea that we should "lock him up" at least not in the way most people are advocating.

Staunchly I'm prison abolitionist, the much better punishment in my opinion is to permanently strip him of any means of building power and enforce rehabilitation. Imagine if Trump ever renounced his old ways? Imagine how many people's minds that would change? Certainly it wouldn't end maga cults or do more than make some people change figureheads- but there are certainly a LOT of people who would be convinced by such a thing. 

Teach him empathy, and employ him to make a better world.
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@TWS1405_2
Sorry, this was to you...
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@Double_R
He didn't present one single argument in his entire rant. The closest he came was by calling it a "documents case" completely lying about the fact that the bulk of these charges are for obstructing the investigation and overtly lying to federal investigators. This was pretty much 9 minutes of whataboutism.

This, btw is why I don't watch videos by people who are too intellectually lazy to write their own arguments. Is there one snippet of this rant that you think was insightful here? Don't know. I could sit here tearing it apart piece by piece and all you do is go "well that's not the part I was highlighting".

So feel free to enlighten us with your own words; what about this silly rant do you think destroys anyone's argument?

Your accusation of the "whataboutism" = "whataboutism is a fallacy most closely related to the ad hominem fallacy, wherein a person responds to an accusation by attacking the person making it." It demonstrates that you cannot handle the fact-based information (i.e., the truth) being conveyed. It's a lazy denialist retort. 

What argument is to be made when I agree with every fact-based statement he made. Statements. Not arguments. Statements. 

Every statement made in the OP were destroyed by the litany of fact-based statements Levin recounted. A man 100x more intelligent than you and beyond IwantRooseveltAgain imagination of having any measure of intelligence, even at the tip of his little pinky. 

  • Democrats want to take control of the United States
  • Democrats want one party rule
  • Democrats have weaponized the DOJ and FBI against their political opposition
  • Presidential Records Act =/= a criminal statute
  • Espionage Act: Woodrow Wilson weaponized it against his opponents and jailed over 2,000 of them
  • DOJ and Jack Reed (via Eric Garland) are weaponizing the Espionage Act against Trump to trap him in a corner
  • The allegations of obstruction are all false, there has been no obstruction at any time by Trump
  • This is a documents case (civil law)
  • Biden asserts he never told the DOJ and/or FBI what to do - LIE!
  • Biden had to sign off on the weaponization of the DOJ & FBI against Trump, moving the matter from the National Archives over to the DOJ
  • Double standards / 2 tiers of justice: Biden has in fact had documents from the days he was a fledgling Senator to VP strewn across the Eastern seaboard since the 1970s, all in insecure locations with no oversight; Hilary actually obstructed the government and should have been charged with 10,000 obstruction charges for each email bleachbit'd and 5 for destroying the 5 phones (government property)
  • Did Trump sell any documents to the enemy? NO! Did he burn the documents to hide them? NO!! The government has all the documents back in their possession, so there is no violation of the Presidential Records Act.  
  • DOJ has forced under duress, Trump's attorneys to violate their attorney client privilege during interrogations - Trump has been denied due process
  • DOJ indicts Trump in Miami but not DC, why? Venue issues Reed and Garland know they would lose the case thereon. 
  • Reed has an 8-0 loss ratio with SCOTUS precisely because he takes statutes and expands them into areas they do not cover. Reed is doing the same here against Trump - directly interfering with a Presidential Election
  • Under the special counsel statutes, Biden should be investigated not Trump - a political rival - as a documents case doesn't warrant it nor falls under said statute.
  • Biden should be under investigation for the clear-cut case of corruption with the pay to play bribery scheme that is actionable, but the DOJ criminalizes a documents case to hinder Trump's ability to campaign
ALL STATEMENTS OF VERIFIABLE FACT!

Levin details (expands) on his fact-based statements in the cited video where he was on Hannity, HERE, with more facts affirming his statements said on Hannity. Namely general warrants have been used again, obviously, by the DOJ and FBI in violation of the 4th and 5th Amendments.

Grand juries were meant to protect individuals against rogue prosecutors, but it is now being used against individuals and the GJ are going along with the rogue prosecutor. The fact is what they are doing is election interference, and with each false attack and accusations against Trump only affirms that fact. Biden admitted he got the anti-corruption prosecutor in Ukraine fired, it's on video. He and Hunter received $5M each for it. This is a war on Trump, the Republican party and the Republic itself. The left and legacy media is running point for the Biden crime syndicate to cover for him and deflect with overstating and exaggerating the fictional charges against Trump across the Eastern coast with one democratic prosecutor/AG after another conspiring to take Trump down in favor of the Biden crime family.

The facts are out there and being reported daily on the news sources that matter, and other trusted sources like Levin and more importantly our own representatives in committees investigating the corruption of the Biden family along with the DOJ and the FBI. 

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If Trump is truly guilty of all these crimes, then hang him.  BUT I want all others to be judged by the same standard.  The fact that Trump has been constantly bombarded with impeachments, trials, investigations, etc, really shows a bias to the outside contender. If you are not part of the club, then you are going to be torn up.

The government is corrupt and we all know but since some people don't like Trump and would rather have a drooling, bumbling, hair sniffing fool in office, and they gladly accept the double standard.  If it weren't for double standards, the left wouldn't have any standard at all.

Really, we need to get rid of the whole clown show that is congress and start over, but that would mean we don't know who would be coming in next.  I guess it's better to dance with the devil you know than the devil you don't know.

They made an example of the Jan 6'ers by crushing them with the hardest crime they could.  They are making an example of Trump too.  The message is "Don't fight against the machine."

America is in a steady decline and it's sad to watch it.
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@TWS1405_2
  • Your conspiracy theory is not a fact or an argument
  • No evidence the Dems want one party rule
  • No evidence the Dems weaponized the government. Let me guess, Durham report?
  • It doesn't need to be a criminal statue. One of his many violations is withholding documents that don't belong to him. That's theft. The Presidential Records Act dictates who owns the documents in question. 
  • What Woodrow Wilson did or did not do is irrelevant
  • Your conspiracy theories are not an argument
  • Your opinion of what happened is not an argument
  • Complete BS, in addition to the willful retention of classified documents he is also being charged with obstruction and lying to federal investigators
  • Biden's statements to the FBI are irrelevant to the charges against Trump
  • Biden signed off on the fact that the documents do in fact belong to the American people - because they do. Reality is not an argument against the indictment.
  • Whataboutism is not an argument against the indictment
  • The indictment does not charge Trump with selling these documents and Trump did not give them back, they were seized during the search warrant
  • The DOJ did not interrogate Trump's attorneys, they testified. You should know the difference. Attorney/Client privilege does not apply when it is used to commit a crime
  • Why are you even asking this question? 95% of the residents of DC voted against Trump, so if they were just out to get him they would have tried him there. My guess is they are trying him in Florida because that's where he committed his crimes, which would make sense.
  • Reed's record with SCOTUS is not an argument against the indictment
  • Your opinion is not an argument against the indictment
  • Whataboutism is not an argument against the indictment
This is a war on Trump, the Republican party and the Republic itself.
No, this is what holding a criminal to account looks like. It's unbelievably sad and pathetic that even something so simple as this indictment, complete with Trump insiders as witnesses, pictures, and recordings of Trump literally committing his crimes, the cult still remains unwaivered.

Indicting a former president and presidential candidate is definitely a problem, but the issue here is not the DOJ, the problem here is that we elected a man who so brazenly thinks he is above the law and would burn the country down before ever admitting to anything he did. Even Nixon had enough respect for democracy and the rule of law to resign. This is on you and every moron who put our nation's secrets in this man's hands.



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@DavidAZ
The fact that Trump has been constantly bombarded with impeachments, trials, investigations, etc, really shows a bias to the outside contender.
Or it means Trump has broken a lot of rules and laws, including the constitution 

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@DavidAZ
If it weren't for double standards, the left wouldn't have any standard at all.
Did you hear that one on one of your right wing wack job talk radio shows?

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@DavidAZ
Really, we need to get rid of the whole clown show that is congress and start over, 
Every one of those clowns was voted in by the people. The people get the government they deserve.

Lauren Boebert is a divorced high school dropout who got pregnant in high school. She’s a dummy and she has been elected twice in rural Colorado 

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@DavidAZ
They made an example of the Jan 6'ers by crushing them with the hardest crime they could.  They are making an example of Trump too.  The message is "Don't fight against the machine."
The message is if you break the law as a subversive, you will go to jail

IwantRooseveltagain
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@DavidAZ
America is in a steady decline and it's sad to watch it.
It is because of morons like you and the Republican Party

DavidAZ
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Woah! A multi-post run.  Tired now Rooskie?  Why don't you have some more kool-aide?

Or it means Trump has broken a lot of rules and laws, including the constitution 
Maybe, but again, let's keep the standard the same.  Let's indite Hillary for her emails, Joe Biden for his business deals, etc.  You know this happens.  Don't deny it or will  you just run to your dixie cup with your happy juice?

Did you hear that one on one of your right wing wack job talk radio shows?
So wise!  I did hear it from there and that made so much sense that I decided to adopt it.

Every one of those clowns was voted in by the people. The people get the government they deserve.

Lauren Boebert is a divorced high school dropout who got pregnant in high school. She’s a dummy and she has been elected twice in rural Colorado
I don't think there is anything we have ever agreed on, but this is an exception.  

The message is if you break the law as a subversive, you will go to jail
No, the message is that if you push back against the establishment, then expect them to ruin your life.  Don't think, just be sheeple.

It is because of morons like you and the Republican Party
Ha! I actually contribute to society, but it's the democratic base that really sucks up the money from the government.  How does it feel to be part of a party that literally buys their votes?
TWS1405_2
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@Double_R
  • Your conspiracy theory is not a fact or an argument
It's not a conspiracy theory and claiming it is just doesn't make it so. 

  • No evidence the Dems want one party rule
The evidence is being thrown in front of American's faces since 2020 to present, and ongoing. 
Ignoring the evidence is your fault and your fault alone.

  • No evidence the Dems weaponized the government. Let me guess, Durham report?
Ignoring the evidence is your fault and your fault alone.

  • It doesn't need to be a criminal statue. One of his many violations is withholding documents that don't belong to him. That's theft. The Presidential Records Act dictates who owns the documents in question. 
And yet a federal judge disagrees with you as she did a conservative's legal group trying to get recordings from Clinton.

"The Court has seriously [sic] doubts about whether the former President’s retention of the audiotapes as personal is a matter that is subject to judicial review. But the Court need not decide this question because whether judicial review is available or not, the relief that plaintiff seeks – that the Archivist assume 'custody and control' of the audiotapes – is not available under the PRA," Jackson wrote in her decision (posted here)."

  • What Woodrow Wilson did or did not do is irrelevant
No, it's not, as it set a precedent that is being used again present day with the current indictment of Trump over a documents case turned criminal under the Espionage Act. 

  • Your conspiracy theories are not an argument
Nothing I've stated were conspiracy theories, and claiming they are dies not make it so. 

  • Your opinion of what happened is not an argument
It's not an opinion, its objective fact.

  • Complete BS, in addition to the willful retention of classified documents he is also being charged with obstruction and lying to federal investigators
He was the POTUS and had broad authority where those records were concerned. 

"“[t]he PRA incorporates an assumption made by Congress (in 1978) that subsequent Presidents and Vice Presidents would comply with the Act in good faith, and therefore Congress limited the scope of judicial review and provided little oversight authority for the President and Vice President’s document preservation decisions.” CREW v. Cheney, 593 F. Supp. 2d 194, 198 (D.D.C. 2009)."

There was no "willful" retention, he complied with all parameters of security advised to do so. It's not like they were carelessly placed in a garage next to Trump's POV or a Chinese owned building at a university with no security whatsoever!

  • Biden's statements to the FBI are irrelevant to the charges against Trump
Wrong! Biden has to sign off on all of it and he lies claiming he doesn't have any involvement. 

  • Biden signed off on the fact that the documents do in fact belong to the American people - because they do. Reality is not an argument against the indictment.
Wrong! The National Archives had the jurisdiction here, not the FBI let alone Joe Biden. By signing off to move it to the DOJ and have him charged criminally, it was a politically motivated move during a presidential election; otherwise, all this would have been done in 2020.

  • Whataboutism is not an argument against the indictment
Whataboutism = logical fallacy, one of your greatest hits ... as IWRA would say. 

  • The indictment does not charge Trump with selling these documents and Trump did not give them back, they were seized during the search warrant
Never said he gave them back, I said they were back in the government's possession, ergo no violation of the PRA. Strawman fallacy on your part. And the warrant was a general warrant not used since the days of the monarchy. Pure and direct violation of the 4th and 5th Amendments.

  • The DOJ did not interrogate Trump's attorneys, they testified. You should know the difference. Attorney/Client privilege does not apply when it is used to commit a crime
Yes, they did interrogate them, and under duress using the statute forcing them to violate their client attorney privilege, something sacred to the practice of law...but Biden's DOJ and FBI don't give a shit about the rule OR practice of law. 

  • Why are you even asking this question? 95% of the residents of DC voted against Trump, so if they were just out to get him they would have tried him there. My guess is they are trying him in Florida because that's where he committed his crimes, which would make sense.
Reading comprehension problems? It was a VENUE issue that forced the DOJ to try him in Florida! 

  • Reed's record with SCOTUS is not an argument against the indictment
Sure it is, you just conveniently ignored why.

  • Your opinion is not an argument against the indictment
It's not my opinion, it's fact. 

  • Whataboutism is not an argument against the indictment
Whataboutism = logical fallacy, one of your "greatest hits" asinine rebuttals 

This is a war on Trump, the Republican party and the Republic itself.
No, this is what holding a criminal to account looks like. It's unbelievably sad and pathetic that even something so simple as this indictment, complete with Trump insiders as witnesses, pictures, and recordings of Trump literally committing his crimes, the cult still remains unwaivered. (sic)
But he is not a criminal. Biden is. Hunter is. Hillary is. Bill Clinton is. Obama is. James Comey is. And so many more...are all criminals. 

Indicting a former president and presidential candidate is definitely a problem,
Well no shit sherlock!!!

...but the issue here is not the DOJ, the problem here is that we elected a man who so brazenly thinks he is above the law and would burn the country down before ever admitting to anything he did. Even Nixon had enough respect for democracy and the rule of law to resign. This is on you and every moron who put our nation's secrets in this man's hands.
Your subjective opinion is not evidence of an argument. 

TWS1405_2
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@DavidAZ
The fact that Trump has been constantly bombarded with impeachments, trials, investigations, etc, really shows a bias to the outside contender.
Or it means Trump has broken a lot of rules and laws, including the constitution 

Name ONE measure of the Constitution that Trump violated, and with evidence. 
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@DavidAZ
The fact that Trump has been constantly bombarded with impeachments, trials, investigations, etc, really shows a bias to the outside contender.
This is like claiming that your school is terrible and the evidence of that is that your report card shows all F's.

Trump has been impeached and investigated over and over again because he's easily the most brazenly corrupt individual we've ever seen in US politics. This should have been obvious from the very beginning by his very public infatuation with his mentor Roy Cohn. If not his fake university, fake charity, and droves of unpaid contractors should have given people the hint. Yet here we are, despite all of the evidence against him,  right wing cultists still blame everyone else for the crime of investigating him.
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@DavidAZ
Let's indite Hillary for her emails, Joe Biden for his business deals
These are speculation advanced by known liars on FOX NEWS.

I did hear it from there and that made so much sense that I decided to adopt it.
You see, this establishes you as a dummy if you listen to that garbage.
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Name ONE measure of the Constitution that Trump violated, and with evidence. 
He tried to pressure Mike Pence to reject the electoral college votes against the procedures laid out by the Constitution and instigated an insurrection 

He made money while in office by using his position as President in violation of the emoluments clause

He attempted to bribe and blackmail the President of Ukraine to help win reelection. Seeking help from foreigners in a Presidential election is against the constitution.





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@TWS1405_2
And yet a federal judge disagrees with you as she did a conservative's legal group trying to get recordings from Clinton.

"The Court has seriously [sic] doubts about whether the former President’s retention of the audiotapes as personal is a matter that is subject to judicial review. But the Court need not decide this question because whether judicial review is available or not, the relief that plaintiff seeks – that the Archivist assume 'custody and control' of the audiotapes – is not available under the PRA," Jackson wrote in her decision (posted here)."
You clearly didn't read her decision.

The reason why it wasn't available under the PRA is because the PRA doesn't require NARA to assume custody of presidential records, therefore she had no judicial jurisdiction to order NARA to do so.

This is yet either typical example of right wingers searching for anything under the sun they can to equivocate completely different things in their never ending whataboutisms.

He was the POTUS and had broad authority where those records were concerned.
Having broad authority under a law does not mean one can rewrite the law entirely or simply deem it irrelevant. The PRA defines what qualifies as presidential records, there is no universe where the documents Trump took, especially classified documents containing the US's nuclear secrets fall under "personal documents". That's obscenely offensively stupid.

There was no "willful" retention, he complied with all parameters of security advised to do so.
We have the photos and the text messages. Trump literally ordered boxes of documents moved from one room to another to stop federal investigation from finding them.

Read the indictment.

Never said he gave them back, I said they were back in the government's possession, ergo no violation of the PRA. 
This is like claiming a shop lifter cannot be charged because the police tackled the guy outside the store and took the merchandise back.

There is no way you are being serious. This is the level of absurdity one must lower themselves to in order to defend Donald Trump.
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@TWS1405_2
BTW, I'm curious as to what your take is on Bill Barr, the latest left wing lib tard saying pretty much all of the same things I would about this indictment...
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@Double_R
This is like claiming that your school is terrible and the evidence of that is that your report card shows all F's.
LOL! Great analogy!  In that case, my school was terrible. :)

Trump has been impeached and investigated over and over again because he's easily the most brazenly corrupt individual we've ever seen in US politics. This should have been obvious from the very beginning by his very public infatuation with his mentor Roy Cohn. If not his fake university, fake charity, and droves of unpaid contractors should have given people the hint. Yet here we are, despite all of the evidence against him,  right wing cultists still blame everyone else for the crime of investigating him.
I will still claim that with whatever standard they are prosecuting Trump with, make it the same across the board.  If Trump is truly guilty, then hit him with the book, BUT it seems that the liberals here still think that their political heroes are little angels.  This is actually pretty funny.  Both sides pointing out the folly of the other's leaders but won't hold a standard to anything.  We just seem to say that our devil is a less evil devil.


IwantRooseveltagain
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@Double_R
This is the level of absurdity one must lower themselves to in order to defend Donald Trump.
That’s his “logic”. He’s a dummy

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If HR 1 is enacted, they won’t need any such excuse in 2022 because the states will have no choice but to implement policies such as legalized ballot harvesting, early voting, and universal mail-in voting, as well as repeal of voter ID laws, signature-matching laws, and other ballot security measures. 
This opinion piece is garbage. It basically says if everyone is allowed to vote (even black people) and Democrats make it easy to vote (for poor people) and Republicans aren’t allowed to cheat, then we will have singled Party rule because the Republicans can’t possibly win without cheating and making an effort to exclude some voters.

Under the rules outlined in HR 1, election observers wouldn’t even be able to challenge the legitimacy of ballots without written documentation, making it virtually impossible to document or detect election irregularities.
Such as when a black person tries to vote