Abortion

No, you do not get to kill people. 

You didn’t ACTUALLY read a damn word I wrote. 

Not a damn word. 

And I’ve already given, more than once, the legal (constitutional) argument how abortion, like the right to travel, marry interracially, etc. falls under “personal Liberty” rights/laws.

Ffs, go back and read my replies AGAIN. Slower. Try to let the words sink in, and perhaps you will comprehend the fact based truth of it all.

You’re lazy. You  can access my profile and look for my posts directed to/at you. I’m not going to repost them for you. 

Slapping someone has nothing to do with personal Liberty. 🤦‍♂️ It’s already covered by statute, you know, the one titled “assault.”

Now go read what I’ve already written to you and try again.

A pregnancy ≠ [a] person.

Now go read what I’ve already written to you and try again.

You seem very angry.  You should calm down.

That’s not a rebuttal argument. It’s childish. Try again.

Again, go to my profile, click on forum posts and sort by thread and scroll in reverse date/time order. Even do a control F for key words to make it easier. It’s your responsibility, not mine. 

I’ve proven conclusively that a pregnancy ≠ [a] person.

Fiction sure is fun in your world of idiocracy.

No, letting the government decide would mean that we the people wouldn't get to vote on it. 

I think you mean is murder capital punishment

What about a man in a coma? 

You think of this as women just being quiet, and the men are doing all of the decision making, but you don't point out all of the women who are pro-life.

The consequences of women engaging in sex, is that there is a possibility that she might get pregnant, which might be a good or a bad thing for that specific woman. So, women should be vigilant when having sex, because of that possibility.  

I'm not saying that women should know better, I am saying that women should be smart when having sex, because sex is a bigger deal than most people make it out to be. 

Well, the excuse that they would have been exactly the statement you brought up. 

"What if they don't know about the consequences of having sex?"

That is not an excuse.

It would be the same as murdering someone based just off of convenience. If you don't like someone in your life and you murder them to get rid of them, that is wrong. Like let's say you have a roommate. You hate them so much and it inconveniences you. They haven't done anything necessarily wrong; you just don't like them. 

In this situation you have no right to kill them, for your own convenience. 

For many reasons:

1.) If you're not ready for a child then you won't be prepared to raise your own child in the best way possible, and given you want the best for them, that won't help you at all if you don't at least have some sort of a plan for what you are doing. 

2.) Finacial reasons, because babies' cost a lot of money, and if you're not financially ready for a baby, then that is going to negatively impact you, your husband (if you have one) and the baby. 

3.) Mental reasons, because taking care of a baby takes a lot of time and effort, and again given you want what's best for your child, you want to be able to provide for them, care for them, love on them, in order to raise them in the best way possible, and if you're not ready to do that, well that's not going to turn out well for you or your child. 

At the moment in some states yes, she is not obligated. What I am arguing or rather stating is that she should be obligated to do so, unless some other factor like rape or incest, because to do otherwise would be murder, which might not hold on to legal standards, but it does by moral ones. 

I am not arguing what the law says, I am arguing what the law should say, and why by moral standards it should say that, and even further enforce it. 

Yes, and part of being an adult is putting your own interests aside in order to grow in society, family or not. 

If you are asking why a mother owes her child anything, then what the hell are you talking about?

A mother owes almost everything to that child. She brought them into this world, the baby did not force itself into this world. It was by a decision she made, that another life was conceived, and that child deserves the right to life.

That is not how abortions work at all. Abortions work by first making a slice through the back of the fetus's head and sucking out all of the brains.

Well, why on earth would you abort it rather than give it up for adoption? It's the least you can do as a biological mother, when you first brought the child into the world. Why wouldn't you at the least give it a chance to live. Giving it up for adoption, or at least leaving it alive, is giving it more of a chance, than literally killing the thing. People who don't give human life a chance to live are the ones who don't care for human life and are the selfish ones. 

Legally she has the right to do that. Morally she has no right to do anything of the sort. How on earth are you going to deny entry to a child the use of your body, when you are the one who put them there in the first place?

So, when you get into your car, you are consenting the possibility that you might get into a crash.

So, if you don't want to crash, and assure that you never get into a crash, then don't drive. Otherwise, be prepared.

Again: WATCH: Women See The Horrific Reality Of Abortion In These Stunning Videos | The Daily Wire

If you kill yourself, (for whatever reason it may be) you are being selfish in that act, because you are putting your pain and suffering before others, and that is wrong.

She consented to herself. She told and agreed with herself to make that decision. Also, to whatever man she had intercourse with. 

1.) Of course, the mother's womb belongs to her. I never said it didn't. What I said was that she gave over her womb when consenting to sex to the possibility of a pregnancy. So, it is her womb, but she gave access to another life. 

And B, (I am not quoting from your analogy, I am claiming what the actual situation would have to look like in order for your analogy to hold ground) I did not knock on the door for you to let me in. You put me in that house. I had no intention of going to the house, nor did I ever say I wanted to go into the house. Also, I was never in a blizzard before I entered your house, I was never in a dire situation before going into your house. 

And according to how abortions actually work, you wouldn't of just pushed me out of the house, you would have shot me or killed my yourself. 

You put me in that house without my permission then proceeded to kill me for whatever reason. 

That is how the analogy would work if lined up right. 

Your home is your home, but you put me in your home without my consent and then shot me. That is an analogy for the logic of abortions. 

Ok, well in that case, I could argue that the beneficiary the husband who might not want the abortion to happen. 

Listen, your argument is solid, but what you are saying without saying it is that the mother didn't choose for the fetus to exist, the mother didn't give consent whilst having sex to the possibility of getting pregnant, and that abortions are simply just letting a baby survive on its own. These claims are all incorrect and give your argument a disadvantage. 

Sorry it was so long I had to put it into two posts lol. 

YOU LITERALLY.....................you know what.............................never mind I will just let you look stupid. 

Skin cells still have human DNA.  I fail to see the relevance of the DNA being unique or not.  If there was a human with my exact DNA, they are a seperate human being. 

If a new cell is created in my right arm with unique human DNA, that’s not a human being.

Life is not created at conception. You can call it reproduction. Life existed before conception. That's why this term procreation is really just about  confusion. Then there's needless controversy over where or when "life starts".

Nope. Rapists should be castrated and killed.

YOU LITERALLY.....................you know what.............................never mind I will just let you look stupid. 

It's alright. No need for either of us to assume the burden of his lack of decorum. His behavior has already received more attention than it deserves.

Life is not created at conception. You can call it reproduction. Life existed before conception. That's why this term procreation is really just about  confusion. Then there's needless controversy over where or when "life starts".

Cell specialization; zygotes, embryos, and cancer cells all have human DNA but aren’t specialized, so they aren’t human.  A fetus does have its cells mostly specialized, so they are human.

If you have the ability to save someone’s life and you don’t, you’re letting them die.  I have the ability to send all my money to Africa to help children and to prevent them from dying of starvation.  But I don’t.

I just strongly disagree with that; I would kill one person to save 4 if I valued all people equally.  90% of the population agrees with me.

Mr. Beast did this poll where he asked people, “Would you press a button that killed someone and you got $1 million for it?”  45% of the population said they would.  Now my position is, “I would do it for $1 billion, but then use some of the money to save more people from more painful deaths, leading to more lives saved than killed and I still have a lot of money.”  Nothing that lasts a finite amount of time has infinite value, including the human life.

You can make the living conditions as horrible as you want in prison, if 1/6 people are in jail, it’s going to be extremely expensive to take care of them all.

I don’t believe I said that.  I believe that we should kill the very bad prisoners (murderers, rapists, kidnappers, people that bring fetanyl in the country), and impose alternative sentences for lesser crimes (so if your crime is a DUI for example, you get lashings).

They put themselves in that situation because of men like you having sex with them.  If you don’t want a pregnancy, don’t have sex.

We don't get to vote on it. The politicians in government, which is what the government is, are passing these laws restricting abortion. That's called... The government deciding.

There is hardly a single state anywhere in the country where a referendum would result in abortion being banned. Even Kentucky supported a women's right to choose overwhelmingly.

No, I meant what I said. Is capitol punishment, as in execution by the state... according to your definition... murder? It's a very simple question.

If no, why not?

If the prognosis on the man is that he will never wake up, then he is regarded as a vegetable and his life can be legally ended at any time.

A man in a coma has all of the qualities I listed. The difference is that those qualities are laying dormant, it's no different than when we're asleep.

And let's not forget the biggest difference here...  the man in a coma is not relying on anyone else's body to remain alive.

Because women are overwhelmingly pro choice. The only reason there is any serious discussion in this country over whether abortion should be legal is because of men.

No, you're making it out to be a big deal, because you are imposing on others that they must carry an unwanted pregnancy to term.

There is nothing else about sex that is a big deal in any way that is not entirely subjective, hence why this whole conversation about responsibility is circular.

Why would that be an excuse? One presumes that one makes excuses to escape accountability. But a female is not accountable to anyone when deciding to have sex. You're arguing that she is. And I'm asking you to justify that, without presuming that she already is.

This isn't apropos. Murder is wrong because one is initiating and acting out in aggression, infracting on another's right to oneself. When a pregnant woman carries out an abortion, she merely maintains the right to herself--her unborn child's surviving or not notwithstanding. It's not the same at all.

All of this can be mitigated with a legal abortion.

Since you're arguing that she should be obligated, you have to justify the obligation--especially since it excludes her interests over her body.

 You may argue the unborn child is an innocent human life, and I won't dispute that, but why should that matter to her, much less justify the coercive submission of her body?

 Explain the reason her knowing the consequences eliminates her authority over the use of her body.

Why does her being raped or a participant in incest allows for her autonomy, but her consenting to a non-incestuous relationship disallows it?

No, it most certainly is not. Being an adult does not mean putting your own interests aside. I don't intend to get in argument over the abstractness of "adulthood" given that individuals can choose to express themselves however they see fit at whatever age. But nothing during one's period necessitates to "put one's own interests aside."

Exactly. So why does the mother OWE the child? 

she in part is responsible for the creation of its life.

She provides the labor that goes into birthing it.

 If anything, the child owes her.

 The womb does not belong to the child; the mother gifts it, not submits it because she's indebted.

You stated: "A fetus does have its cells mostly specialized, so they are human."

At what specific point does one become a human?

If you spend all your money giving to the poor, now your poor, and if the whole world keeps this cycle going, then there will always be poor and wealthy people.

If you decided to pull that lever, then you are purposefully involving yourself in a situation where you didn't have any obligation to be involved with in the first place. Also, with this side, you are arguing with most villains in certain genres.

45% of the population is still less than half. 

There should be a place where if you commit a crime, you should be imprisoned. Not all crimes should be punishable by death, they should be punished by imprisonment which is a tactic that has worked for centuries. The living conditions don't have to be good, just enough for the inmates to live long enough to survive prison. 

All lashing will do is leave a scar on you, not enough to kill or torture you for long. Lashings also will heal. 

They put themselves in that situation because of men like you having sex with them.  If you don’t want a pregnancy, don’t have sex.

My point exactly. If a female doesn't want a pregnancy and they want a 100% guarantee of that, then the only way to do that is to not have sex.