Economy Without Money - Communism in 5 steps

Author: Best.Korea

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AleutianTexan
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@oromagi
Before I waste my time answering everything you said, are we just playing a game of semantics? Like, it seems the question of "what is communism" is more about trying to see how far we can stretch a label as opposed to meaningful theoretical conversation, no?

oromagi
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@AleutianTexan
-->@oromagi
Before I waste my time answering everything you said, are we just playing a game of semantics? Like, it seems the question of "what is communism" is more about trying to see how far we can stretch a label as opposed to meaningful theoretical conversation, no?
I don't think I need any answering.  My only point was to note some historical inaccuracies:
    • Communism is an authoritarian state
    • Marx created communism under the idea of a "dictatorship of the proletariat"
    • Lenin created the Bolsheviks to protect a democratic system
    • Communism is  a nationalist description for how to structure society
    • Communism hopes to turn individual nation states into one world government

100 days later

Tradesecret
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@Best.Korea
Step 4 suggests that if people don't do the desired work, they won't get paid. 

Paid what? There is no money remember. Serious flaw. 

Money is inescapable. It is impossible to have any system without money. 

Money doesn't have to be printed dollar bills.  Money is just a bartering tool. That is all it has ever been and all it ever will be. 

Money has been rocks, gold, silver, toilet paper, smokes, etc. 


Best.Korea
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@Tradesecret
Who doesnt work, doesnt eat 😁
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@Best.Korea
If you get paid for your work, then you are using a form of money.
sadolite
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@Tradesecret
"If you get paid for your work, then you are using a form of money." That's not true. If you cant decide what you can spend your money on then you are working for the privilige to be alive. A true communist govt dictates everything a person needs to  have to survive, not live. You don't work, they kill you with starvation.
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@sadolite
"If you get paid for your work, then you are using a form of money." That's not true.
Yes, it is.   Money is inescapable. 

If you can't decide what you can spend your money on then you are working for the privilege to be alive.
I am not sure what you are saying.  "If you can't decide what to spend your money on". Do you believe in money or not? Many people in this world work for the privilege of staying alive. Staying alive is a form of payment. It is therefore ipso facto money. 

A true communist govt dictates everything a person needs to  have to survive, not live. You don't work, they kill you with starvation.
That's right.  Your life is your bargaining tool.   It is money. 
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Best.Korea
Step 2:
Government decides what to produce. Government observes what is necessary to produce desired product.
The quantification of the relative value of products and services normalized by the resources required is 'money'.

You can set prices but that just means you're probably wrong about the price.

You can forbid trading, but that doesn't escape rivalry in consumption and production.
Best.Korea
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@ADreamOfLiberty
This is a very old forum topic. I actually explored how would a completely controlled economy work and concluded that:

1) If people are made to work hard, we will have more stuff.

2) If people are equally limited in how much they take, products will be more equally distributed.

For example, one person cannot take more than 1 bread per day. One person cannot own more than 1 house. One person cannot own more than 10 acres of land.
Best.Korea
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@Tradesecret
If you get paid for your work, then you are using a form of money.
Money that buys anything =/= money that can buy just food.

The meaning of money today is that money buys plenty of stuff. 

19 days later

charlescanderson10
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@Best.Korea
The discussion on the concept of an economy without money and the steps towards achieving communism intriguing. While it's an ambitious vision, it's important to consider the practical aspects of transitioning to such a system.
One key aspect to ponder is the role of business plans in this context. Even in a moneyless economy, the need for effective planning and organization remains crucial. For the Help With Business Plan outline goals, strategies, and resource allocation, ensuring the efficient functioning of various sectors within the economy.
As we discuss the path to communism, it's worth exploring how business plans can aid in the implementation of economic policies, resource distribution, and the allocation of labor. By using business planning principles, we can help ensure that the transition to communism is smooth and sustainable, taking into account factors such as production, distribution, and innovation.
I believe that discussing the role of business plans in this context can shed light on the practical aspects of implementing alternative economic systems. It would be interesting to explore how business planning concepts can be adapted and integrated into a moneyless economy, fostering cooperation, and equitable resource allocation.
What are your thoughts on the role of business plans in a moneyless economy? How can we leverage business planning principles to help shape and guide the path towards communism? I look forward to hearing your perspectives and engaging in this thought-provoking discussion.
zedvictor4
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@charlescanderson10
Money is a symbolic representation of social hierarchy.

And social hierarchy will occur irrespective of a nominal system.

Communism in name only, but unachievable in reality.

Carrot or big stick?

Donkeys probably prefer carrots.

13 days later

FLRW
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@zedvictor4

Oh, and Elephants prefer big sticks?
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@FLRW
I will have to think about that.
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You guys talk bad about communism but you are now spending your life savings to heat your house in the winter

7 days later

hey-yo
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@oromagi
The greater missing piece is how every communist govt. since conception in Russia has used currency. Even north korea uses money because money is a better bartering system than goods & skills/services. 


hey-yo
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@FLRW
Elephants prefer big sturdy trees because they use it to scratch their behind. 
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@hey-yo
All so called "communist" states are just versions of hierarchical dictatorships.

As are all democracies.

Though some states are more brutal and oppressive than others.

Communism was a fanciful idea of the bourgeoisie.....Which is a contradiction in itself.