Are Christians bootlickers?

Author: TheUnderdog

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#31
TheUnderdog
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@Lemming
Eh, and if you find your faith again, you'll be a bootlicker again?
If that happens, I'll let future me answer that question.

Myself, I doubt the terms "Bootlicker" and "Mr. Sky Wizard", will get most faithful to question their faith,
More likely it'll just trigger anger and defense, a closed mind.
I'm trying to shift the overton window.  I'm just trying to be honest with my thinking.  I don't like euphemisms.  I care more about substance.  That was the argument Trump supporters used, "His decourm is irrelevent; what matters are his policies".

Myself, I 'prefer, disagreeing without insulting other people, though I 'do fail in my preference, at times.
Trump supporters insult.  Biden supporters insult.  Christains insult.  Atheists insult.  It's freedom of speech.
#32
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@TheUnderdog
Trumps lack of decorum, was one of the aspects I disliked about him.

If the purpose of your thread was to vent, then it makes sense,
But if the purpose was to gain in understanding, or persuade, 'I think it fails it's policy.

I don't think people generally enjoy or continue discussions, where the other party insults and belittles them, their views or beliefs.

For one to say that they think the idea of Hell is unjust, or that it appears to them that some people follow their deity out of fear,
Seems to me direct and clear enough.
#33
Polytheist-Witch
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@Lemming

I don't think people generally enjoy or continue discussions, where the other party insults and belittles them, their views or beliefs

This would normally be true but we're talking about the religion forum.


#34
Discipulus_Didicit
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@Stephen
Seems utterly silly and pointless for you to be distracted by this kind of thing when you have things like nuclear war which you should be focusing on.
#35
Tradesecret
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@Double_R
I suggest to you that sin - is treason against God. It is the most vile and offensive thing.  And we do it knowing the consequences - and still sinning  anyway. 
Treason is held in such high regard in terms of seriousness not because it is vile or immoral, but rather because it threatens the state itself. Nothing can threaten God, so this analogy does not work.
It is not an analogy. It is treason.  And as for whether anything can threaten God misses the point.  God created a world to love and worship Him.  What was threatened was not so much God as the world he created to love and worship Him.   It is the world created by God which if it lived according to the way God intended which has been damaged and continues to be destroyed because of the treason committed against God.  


I reject your assertion that there is no offence that deserves judgment in Hell.  The bible clearly indicates there there is an offence and that all of us have broken it.  You might not like the rules - that is a different matter altogether. How about you go and create your own world and make the rules.
Hell is eternal torture for a finite crime. That makes it infinitely unjust. Logic 101.

If I created your own world I would create far more just rules, which is the point here. If I can see the imbalance here why can’t God?

What makes the offence finite?  That it is committed once or by one person? Or that it is committed within time and not eternity? In other words - you prove too much by that logic which in effect refutes it. See below in relation to love and to mercy. 

I think you miss the point here as well. It is committed against an eternal being.  That is the point.  And one who put people on notice prior to their decision to commit the offence.  

The problem about you making the world is that you didn't.  I also suggest your notions of justice are out of whack with 90% of the world - so silly to even make that point.  

An eternal being loves eternally. Why? For a finite person. An eternal being gives mercy eternally? Why? For a finite act of repentance.  Your logic 101 is flawed since it does not take into account everything to with eternals.  Unless you can explain why eternal mercy is justified for a finite act, you prove to much in your logic 101. 
#36
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@TheUnderdog
My position as many people in the church is that most people in history will end up in Heaven and that only a minority of people will end up being judged in Hell.
What biblical verse proves this?

The Book of Revelation tells us that the number of people in Heaven is number without count.
Where?  What verse?
Revelation 7:9

and it was speaking in general terms to those people in Jesus' time and more or less to a time prior to the incarnation
This interpretation requires evidence.  Jesus did a lot of future predicting.
Yes Jesus did do a lot of prophecy.  But even the verse I provided above is evidence that supports my view that more people go to heaven than to Hell. 


Yes, I have seen the numbers in the West suggesting christians are reducing in number. But have you seen the numbers in Africa, and China, and Asia, and South America? Exponential growth is still occurring.  
How is the popularity of christainity (which I think is decreasing) relevant to the proportion that burn in hell forever?
The relevancy is that since Jesus' time - there were 12 or so people who believed in Jesus. Now there are billions. As a percentage of the world in Jesus time is was less than .000001 of a percent of a much smaller population. Now there are over 1/3 of the world's population who are Christians. And since this number is increasing it stands to reason that the number of people going to Heaven is in the long run be far more than those who don't.  I think Jesus won't return for many many years. I think 1000's really.  


I think you will find that Christians generally say - that EVERYONE - christian or non-christian deserves judgment from God - for all have sinned and fallen short of his requirements. That's why Jesus is significant. Because he is the only one who did not deserve judgment because he alone did not sin.  Since Christians hold to the view that God is good and just - we take the view that since we know the punishment for our sin and do it anyway that - we have no excuse. And we have no defense.  Noone forces us to sin - we choose to do it ourselves - knowing full well it will have consequences. 
Agreeing with God's horrible view of burning in hell forever for a sin is bootlicking.
Nonsense.  Bootlicking is sucking up. That's the intent of it - in order to not get bullied or to get somewhere higher in the ranks of whatever organisation you are in.  In the church - the opposite is true.  In order to be saved we have stop bootlicking - since that is trying to acquire some kind of merit in God's eyes. Agreeing with truth is not bootlicking - it is opening your eyes and being realistic to what is actually happening, whether we like it or not.   If Hell is God's idea by the way - it is just.  


If Hellfire is the punishment - why is it so severe and harsh? In normal legal systems - the more severe and heavy the punishment - the greater the value of what is being protected.
In our legal system, even the worst of the worst of murderers (if your country/state has the death penalty) is a relatively painless death and torture violates the 8th amendment.  If we don't burn murderers at the stake for murder (when they die after a few hours), then it is even more horrible to burn someone forever for not keeping the sabbath day holy.
God never signed the UN HR charter.   There is a difference between spiritual and non-spiritual offences. The fact that you don't see sin against God as a particularly severe thing is emblematic of what you think about sin.  On the other hand - God's view of sin is such that only Jesus' death on the cross was able to resolve it.  This is death of the messiah.  Hardly a small thing. Personally I think your understanding of sin - is shallow. 


We value life as a rule so someone who takes away someone else's life is given a punishment appropriate to that - which is mitigated only by circumstances and intent. We value the sanctity of the marriage which is why rape, and adultery and other forms of sexual offences are given heavy sentences (at least historically).  Incidentally, one way to show marriage is not valued anymore in the west is the fact we don't in many countries have punishment for adultery. 
Rape and adultery should not be punished with an eternity in hell.  Rapists and murderers deserve to be shot, but this is less severe than an eternity in hell.  Adultery committers should be whipped 30x in the presence of their spouse, but not burn in hell forever.
God does not punish people in Hell for rape or murder. Rape and murder are fruits of a much worse situation. Rebellion against God.  


And the answer is interestingly, even on most legal books the most serious offence- treason. Go and have a look at the various legal systems around the world. One of the few offences which still carries the death penalty in most cases is treason. 
Our justice system doesn't burn people alive who commit treason.  However, God burns people forever for even trivial sins if they are unrepentant.
So what? Each legal system has its own rules and laws and methods of punishment. It stands to reason that an eternally perfect and just God has his own standards which are going to be very different from ours.  So different in fact - that our very flawed and imperfect methods will think his perfect and just systems are severe and evil. Your position is one of a flawed human being - not of a perfect one. 

In Thailand - treason is expressed simply saying something negative about the king. 
Do you really want the justice system to emulate anti first amendment Thailand?
My point was that in our world - there is a legal system which does do that.  Is it good or bad? That is another question. 

I suggest to you that sin - is treason against God.
God is as thin skinned as the monarch of Thailand; not someone to be emulated.
You have no conception about sin. That you suggest it is not worth such severe punishment missed the point that God sent Jesus to die for such a matter. 

Nope. It is not bootlicking.  God can do anything he chooses to do.
Letting God burn your relatives in hell forever once they die is bootlicking.  Otherwise, what is bootlicking?
Bootlicking is about trying to win the superior person's gratitude. Christianity is EXACTLY the opposite. We can't win his approval.  That is why Jesus had to die. Because it is impossible for us to win God's approval. Hence there is NO POINT to boot licking. To suggest so - simply demonstrates a misunderstanding about God's grace. 
How about you go and create your own world and make the rules.
It is impossible for a human to create a world.  But if God is going to create us just to torture the majority of our species, then that's an evil god.

I also noticed that you contradicted yourself.  First you said that most people aren't burning in hell forever.  Then you claimed that burning in hell was justified if Mr. Sky Wizard deems that you should burn in hell forever.

No  I did not contradict myself.  I said most people wont burn in Hell.  To contradict this - would mean that I would say that most people will burn in Hell.  I did not say that.  To claim that Hell is justified by God does not contradict that most people go to Heaven.   Do you understand logic?   




Topic's author
#37
TheUnderdog
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@Tradesecret
Revelation 7:9
This indicates how many people go to heaven.  It does not state how many go to hell.

Nonsense.  Bootlicking is sucking up.
Like sucking up to God.

 If Hell is God's idea by the way - it is just. 
Just because someone comes up with an idea does not make it just.  Satan is also one of God's ideas.  I'm assuming you don't call Satan just.  If God does something I like, I praise him for it.  He does this with abortion, immigration, and sex and I praise him for it.  But if he does something I don't like, "like burn ANYONE in hell forever", then I'm going to criticize him for it.

There is a difference between spiritual and non-spiritual offences. The fact that you don't see sin against God as a particularly severe thing is emblematic of what you think about sin.
The only offenses that should exist are those that cause a victim.  Anything victimless ought to be legal in a free society.  Many sins are victimless (like not going to church on Sundays and using God's name in vain).

God does not punish people in Hell for rape or murder. Rape and murder are fruits of a much worse situation. Rebellion against God.  
God punishes in hell for rape and murder.  How does not going to church on Sundays lead to rape and murder 100% of the time?

 It stands to reason that an eternally perfect and just God has his own standards which are going to be very different from ours.
It's not justice to burn someone in hell forever under any circumstances.  Punishments must be proportional.  

But any offense against an infinitely powerful entity is worthy of infinite punishment.
This is false.  Biden and Trump have a lot of power.  Insulting either one of these figures should be unpunished, even if you say it to their face. Insulting God should also be unpunishable.

Bootlicking is about trying to win the superior person's gratitude.
Bootlicking is letting entities in power get away with whatever they want.

No  I did not contradict myself.  I said most people wont burn in Hell.  To contradict this - would mean that I would say that most people will burn in Hell.  I did not say that.  To claim that Hell is justified by God does not contradict that most people go to Heaven.   Do you understand logic?  
Maybe I misunderstood your argument here.
#38
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@TheUnderdog
Personally, I dislike the pop culture ideas of Satan, and Hell.

#39
Tradesecret
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@TheUnderdog
Revelation 7:9
This indicates how many people go to heaven.  It does not state how many go to hell.
That's correct. It indicates that so many people go to heaven that their number can't be counted.  It never says anything like this for the people who end up judged.  So at least I have a figure. You are just pulling an idea out of their air.  
Nonsense.  Bootlicking is sucking up.
Like sucking up to God.
Why is there a need to suck up to a God? The bible tells us that God has no favorites. This means it would be pointless sucking up to God. 

 If Hell is God's idea by the way - it is just. 
Just because someone comes up with an idea does not make it just.  Satan is also one of God's ideas.  I'm assuming you don't call Satan just.  If God does something I like, I praise him for it.  He does this with abortion, immigration, and sex and I praise him for it.  But if he does something I don't like, "like burn ANYONE in hell forever", then I'm going to criticize him for it.
That is mixing apples with pears.  If God judges someone as a perfect judge then it is perfectly fair and just. God made Satan too. Making Satan was just and fair. Yet Satan is not just an idea. He is someone who his responsible for his own actions.  I praise God for whatever he does. He ALWAYS does things worthy of praise. 
There is a difference between spiritual and non-spiritual offences. The fact that you don't see sin against God as a particularly severe thing is emblematic of what you think about sin.
The only offenses that should exist are those that cause a victim.  Anything victimless ought to be legal in a free society.  Many sins are victimless (like not going to church on Sundays and using God's name in vain).
Says you. Why should your view of what sin is and how it should be judged - be one that God must adhere too?  I have a view about reducing taxes which seems ultimately fair and just to me - however that doesn't change the facts of the powers that exist and how they exercise them. In other words, just cos I have a subjective view about taxes - won't stop the taxman coming after me if I don't comply.  In a similar way - God determines what sin is and why it ought to be punished and with what it ought to be punished. We can all whine about it - it doesn't change the facts. 

God does not punish people in Hell for rape or murder. Rape and murder are fruits of a much worse situation. Rebellion against God.  
God punishes in hell for rape and murder.  How does not going to church on Sundays lead to rape and murder 100% of the time?
Sorry, the God of the Bible sends people to Hell for treason and rebellion. Rape and murder are fruits of such rebellion. Going to church or not going to church is irrelevant to punishment. Going to church is about deepening your faith in Christ, learning to love others better and becoming more like Jesus.  It stands to reason that if one is not doing these thing, then they will become more and more like Satan in his rebelliousness. 

 It stands to reason that an eternally perfect and just God has his own standards which are going to be very different from ours.
It's not justice to burn someone in hell forever under any circumstances.  Punishments must be proportional.  
Yes, proportionality is important.  If people reject God as King, their judgment is proportional.  Rejecting the eternal authority of God has eternal consequences. 

But any offense against an infinitely powerful entity is worthy of infinite punishment.
This is false.  Biden and Trump have a lot of power.  Insulting either one of these figures should be unpunished, even if you say it to their face. Insulting God should also be unpunishable.
Neither Biden or Trump are eternal.  Nor are the perfect. Insulting God - the one who gives you life - is punishable and will be punished.  Treason and Rebellion is more than just a slight. 

Bootlicking is about trying to win the superior person's gratitude.
Bootlicking is letting entities in power get away with whatever they want.
So how do you propose to bring the almighty God of the universe to account? Which court will hold him to account?  You seem to have a very small and puny image of god in your mind.  The God of the Bible is the one who determines what is right and wrong. There is no law above him. He is above the law - in the sense that he is the law. His law reflects his holy character. 

No  I did not contradict myself.  I said most people wont burn in Hell.  To contradict this - would mean that I would say that most people will burn in Hell.  I did not say that.  To claim that Hell is justified by God does not contradict that most people go to Heaven.   Do you understand logic?  
Maybe I misunderstood your argument here.
Yes. 





#40
Double_R
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@Tradesecret
It is not an analogy. It is treason.  And as for whether anything can threaten God misses the point.  God created a world to love and worship Him.  What was threatened was not so much God as the world he created to love and worship Him.
You used the legal notion of treason and the way our justice system treats such offenses as a point of comparison to what God is doing with regards to hell. That is what we call an analogy.

And no, it doesn’t miss the point. You can’t point to the harsh sentences our system imposes to try and make your point without talking about why our system imposes them.

And I’m so sorry for god that he doesn’t get to have this world where everyone worships him. I have a difficult time understanding how that justifies in your mind the punishment of hell. When any man punished others for not worshiping him we call that vile.

Your logic 101 is flawed since it does not take into account everything to with eternals.  Unless you can explain why eternal mercy is justified for a finite act, you prove to much in your logic 101. 
Not worshiping a god within a finite lifetime is by definition a finite crime.

An eternal punishment is by definition… eternal.

This isn’t rocket science. The fact that God himself is (if he exists) an eternal being is utterly irrelevant. We’re talking about the individual committing the “crime”. That individual could easily repent while in hell at which point they would spend the rest of eternity suffering for something they once did back when they were living their mortal life. To call that just is absurd.
#41
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  God created a world to love and worship Him.  
Yes, but when he went on MASTERGOD and showed his work, he was voted off. That is when we stopped hearing from Him.
#42
Stephen
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@Tradesecret
@BrotherD.Thomas
Tradesecret wrote: The bible tells us that God has no favourites.#39

Does it? 

Deuteronomy 7:6 King James Version
For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

Deuteronomy 14:2 King James Version
 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God, and the Lord hath chosen thee to be a peculiar (special) people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.

Deuteronomy 26:19 King James Version
 And to make thee high above all nations which he hath made, in praise, and in name, and in honour; and that thou mayest be an holy people unto the Lord thy God, as he hath spoken


Psalm 135:4 King James Version
For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar(special) treasure.

Tradesecret wrote: " I have memorised the bible from a very young age, I know it backwards and in many languages.", my arse!😂

O, and he was talking about Israelites/Jews. Not Christians


#43
Tradesecret
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@Stephen
Firstly, I HAVE NEVER said I have memorized the ENTIRE BIBLE.  You can go back and check your notes. I have never said it. Yes, I have memorized lots of different scriptures. And yes I have read the bible many times. I told you that I make a habit of reading the NT twice every year and the OT at least once.  I use that method due to the inspiration from a very famous English / Welsh preacher - the Dr Martyn Lloyd-Jones.  

So stop with the lies.  

Secondly, I said God does not show favorites.  I would rely upon verses such as Deuteronomy 10:17;  Romans 2:11; and Colossians 3:25 amongst others.   My meaning and intent was directed towards the notion of God being impartial because of his character not based on some whimsical position of his people. 

Yet I also stand corrected for you are also correct.  Although I would not use the term favorite  in the verses you quote (even as the translation does not use the term) but accept some translations do use the term. I think peculiar is a better term. And special does not necessarily mean favorite. Nevertheless, I will rephrase my usage of language and state that God does not judge impartially - but rather does so according to his character which is just.  


#44
Stephen
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@Tradesecret
Firstly, I HAVE NEVER said I have memorized the ENTIRE BIBLE.So stop with the lies.  

There you go again, giving me cause to remind you. 

 This is what you have claimed, you bible dunce:
[A]
Tradesecret wrote:"I have been taught to memorise the bible from very young. I have read the bible numerous times. I try and read the OT once every year and the NT twice a year. "#52

 So your attempts to play on words doesn't work.

You then  pressed home YOUR point of  YOUR amazing memory of the bible by adding this:

[B]
While further adding:

[C]
Tradesecret wrote: I  know the bible backwards - and frontwards - in Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic 


  You can go back and check your notes.

I did. See[A],  [B] &  [C]



Secondly, I said God does not show favorites.

Nope. This is what you wrote:

Tradesecret wrote: The bible tells us that God has no favourites.#39

Well we can clearly see that god certainly did have is favourites, You absolute bible dunce. Or did your amazing memory of biblical passages let you down.. AGAIN?

Deuteronomy 7:6 King James Version
For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

Deuteronomy 14:2 King James Version
 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God, and the Lord hath chosen thee to be a peculiar (special) people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.

Deuteronomy 26:19 King James Version
 And to make thee high above all nations which he hath made, in praise, and in name, and in honour; and that thou mayest be an holy people unto the Lord thy God, as he hath spoken


Psalm 135:4 King James Version
For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar(special) treasure.


  I would rely upon verses such as Deuteronomy 10:17;

Would you now?  Well lets look at what god say just before your chosen verse:

Deuteronomy 10:15-17 King James Version
15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day.
16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:





  Romans 2:11;

Yes this is simply saying anyone that commits evil will punished as would anyone else; MORE SO the Jews. 

Romans 2:9-11 King James Version
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

See that. He singled out the Jews because they should know better.  Why should they know better? Because they were HIS chosen people ABOVE ALL OTHERS and he was their God.


and Colossians 3:25
Nothing here about "favourites". Reverend Munchausen. No these are are simple instructions to  Jewish families. No matter if it was the Father, Mother or the child.

Colossians 3:20-25 King James Version

20 Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord.
21 Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.
22 Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as men pleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God;
23 And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;
24 Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ.
25 But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.


 My meaning and intent was directed towards the notion of God being impartial because of his character not based on some whimsical position of his people. 

But god isn't impartial is he. He has a "special, " treasured" "chosen"  people, above other ALL people, doesn't he, you bible dunce? 
Now if you had said god has no favourites when it comes to the Israelite, you may have had a case, but then as shown above, he does single out Jacob as being somewhat favourite and wants him all to himself:

Psalm 135:4 King James Version
For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar(special) treasure. AMING OTHERS!!!!


Yet I also stand corrected for you are also correct. 

 I know I am. I also know that you were not correct and  it was just another one of your many  throwaway claims about what "the bible says" and for all of your self proclaimed theological education "tutored by orthodox priests, church fathers and theological academics"....... and your "Hebrew teacher", you were totally wrong... AGAIN!


Although I would not use the term favorite  in the verses you quote (even as the translation does not use the term) but accept some translations do use the term. I think peculiar is a better term.


Do you actually know what god/the bible means when it uses the term "peculiar"?  It means:  God’s special possession.


And special does not necessarily mean favorite.


Well it did in gods case and his affections towards one chose people. 

favourite:


  1. preferred to all others of the same kind.

    best-loved<<<<<

    favoured<<<<<

    treasured<<<<<

    special<<<<<

    chosen<<<<
  2. The opposite being least liked.





#45
BrotherD.Thomas
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@Stephen
@Tradesecret


.
Miss Tradesecret, as a woman shown herewith: https://ibb.co/NFcsLgy that goes directly against Jesus’ words in 1 Timothy 2:12, whereas she is not to teach and in being SILENT towards men!

ONE OF YOUR MOST BIBLE STUPID QUOTES ONCE AGAIN IS SHOWN IN YOUR POST #39:  "Why is there a need to suck up to a God? The bible tells us that God has no favorites. This means it would be pointless sucking up to God."

Can you tell the membership in when your Bible ignorance and stupidity will ever stop?  Seriously, I and many others are getting tired of always having to easily correct you of being outright BIBLE DUMBFOUNDED!!! ENOUGH!


To Bible Slap you Silly®️ once again at your embarrassing expense, I refer you to the following Jesus inspired passages below that state with specificity that our serial killing Jesus, as the Hebrew only Yahweh God incarnate, DID CHOOSE FAVORITES! Understood, Miss Tradesecret the #1 Bible fool of DEBATEART Religion forum?


1. JESUS STATED: “He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel.” (Matthew 15:24)

Jesus was ONLY interested in people of his Jewish heritage, and NOT of other peoples of the world! Get it Bible fool?


2. JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATE:  ““Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband unto them,” saith the Lord. But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord, I will put My law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and will be their god, and they shall be my people. (Jeremiah 31:31-33)

This is self-explanatory even to your Bible inept mind, or do you need further explanation from me, in the fact that our brutal serial killer God Yahweh/Jesus/Ghost is for the Hebrews ONLY and no other peoples, period!


3. JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATE:  “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.”  (1 Peter 2:9).

The chosen race is the HEBREWS and the nation is ISRAEL in Jesus choosing His favorites! Get it Bible fool?


4.  JESUS STATED: "And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel." (Matthew 19:28)

Jesus is the God of the Hebrews ONLY when He will judge the twelve tribes of Israel, understood Miss Tradesecret Bible idiot!


Miss Tradesecret, again, isn't it time for you to take a needed break from you being so Bible stupid here at this Religion Forum?  Remember the last time you disappeared in total embarrassment where what you thought you knew about the scriptures, YOU DIDN'T?! What is totally disturbing, is the fact that you have a congregation that you teach the Bible too, of which is essentially the "Blind leading the Blind!" LOL!


NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN WOMAN AS DUMBFOUNDED OF THE JUDEO-CHRISTIAN BIBLE AS MISS TRADESECRET, WILL BE ...?


.

#46
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@Stephen
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Stephen,

I am sure you will agree that it is tiresome in the fact that we have to easily CORRECT the #1 Bible fool Miss Tradesecret all the time, along with many other members!  With your revealing and Bible truths shown in your post #44, and mine in post #45, shows exactly how Bible stupid Miss Tradesecret actually is at her expense!  It is like before she arrives upon this esteemed forum where she DOES NOT belong in the first place, she has to take her "Bible Stupid Pills" to keep her prized position of being so Bible dumbfounded!  

As if her explanation of finally admitting that SHE IS A WOMAN wasn't embarrassing enough when she continually said she wasn't as shown in this link; (https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/7337/post-links/319428), she has to continue to show this forum that what she thinks she knows about the scriptures, SHE EMBARRASSINGLY DOESN'T!!!

.


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@BrotherD.Thomas

Tradesecret wrote: The bible tells us that God has no favourites.#39


BrotherD.Thomas, wrote: To Bible Slap you Silly®️ once again at your embarrassing expense, I refer you to the following Jesus inspired passages below that state with specificity that our serial killing Jesus, as the Hebrew only Yahweh God incarnate, DID CHOOSE FAVORITES! Understood, Miss Tradesecret the #1 Bible fool of DEBATEART Religion forum?
🗸


BrotherD.Thomas, wrote: 1. JESUS STATED: “He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel.” (Matthew 15:24)


🗸

BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  Jesus was ONLY interested in people of his Jewish heritage, and NOT of other peoples of the world! Get it Bible fool?

 🗸

BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  Jesus2. JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATE:  ““Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband unto them,” saith the Lord. But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord, I will put My law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and will be their god, and they shall be my people. (Jeremiah 31:31-33)
🗸

BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  JesusThis is self-explanatory even to your Bible inept mind, or do you need further explanation from me, in the fact that our brutal serial killer God Yahweh/Jesus/Ghost is for the Hebrews ONLY and no other peoples, period!
🗸



BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  Jesus3. JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS STATE:  “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.”  (1 Peter 2:9).
🗸


BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  JesusThe chosen race is the HEBREWS and the nation is ISRAEL in Jesus choosing His favorites! Get it Bible fool?

🗸


BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  Jesus4.  JESUS STATED: "And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel." (Matthew 19:28)

🗸


BrotherD.Thomas, wrote:  JesusJesus is the God of the Hebrews ONLY when He will judge the twelve tribes of Israel, understood Miss Tradesecret Bible idiot!

🗸

Well I make that 9/9, Brother D. In any language. And well worth the thumbs up!
#48
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@Stephen
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Stephen,

If I can be frank, and you can still be Stephen, our #1 Bible fool Miss Tradesecret has overrun her time upon this most prestigious Religion forum. How can she even think about returning to this forum subsequent to the membership of late showing her total ineptness to the scriptures?  At what point does she take into consideration that her Bible skills are as empty as a keg of beer at a Redneck summer picnic?

Just think, like you have expertly done, in showing her past hypocritical statements relative to the Bible, and where she tries at times to use her brand of Satanic apologetics to spin doctor them away, but to no avail!  I also have a "plethora" of her past posts just waiting for her to step in the proverbial poo again, of which will be brought forth at her ever so embarrassing expense again, and again, and again!

If Miss Tradesecret returns, which seems that she is licking her wounds of late in staying away for good reason, Jesus and I have a surprise for her relative to her finally coming out as a woman as she did herewith; https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/7337/post-links/319428

What is the most disturbing fact about Miss Tradesecret, other than her outright Bible stupidity,  is that she has a congregation that she preaches too, but as a woman, and of which I have said ad infinitum, she goes directly against Jesus' direct words in 1 Timothy 2:12!!!   Furthermore, this said congregation is as dumbfounded of the JUDEO-Christian Bible as Miss Tradesecret is, therefore they are NOT getting the true facts of Jesus' words!



#49
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@BrotherD.Thomas
 How can she even think about returning to this forum subsequent to the membership of late showing her total ineptness to the scriptures?  

Compulsive lying narcissist have no conscience and care not if the lie is believed or not, Brother D.

I have said many times: To People with narcissistic personality problems the believability of the fantasy seems to be of no consequence. All that seems to count with the narcissist is whether his tall tales about himself helps him rebuild the façade of his greatness while struggling to be relevant. #186


#50
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@Stephen

Compulsive lying narcissist have no conscience and care not if the lie is believed or not, Brother D.

I have said many times: To People with narcissistic personality problems the believability of the fantasy seems to be of no consequence. All that seems to count with the narcissist is whether his tall tales about himself helps him rebuild the façade of his greatness while struggling to be relevant. #186
Talking about yourself Stephen.   I don't lie.  You still have not shown any evidence that suggests I memorized the entire bible.  I never said that. I said I started memorizing the bible when I was younger.  Saying I have memorized the bible is not the same as saying I have memorized the entire bible. Yes, probably I could have said - parts of the bible, but I didn't think anyone would consider what I said - to be ALL of the Bible. I didn't think people were that dense. Seems I was wrong.  You are that dense. 

DO I know the bible inside and out? Yes. Does that mean I know everything about it? Nope.  But at least I read it and attempt to read it properly and not putting my magic and secret rituals into it. At least the manner in which I read it is in accord with how most people would read it.  

I explained what I meant about favoritism above - and even conceded that perhaps there was perhaps another way of looking at it.  But surprise, surprise, rather than you manning up - you acted like a coward.  And invited your Brother to join in.  Well that speaks volumes. 

I can honestly say I have never lied on this site. Yes, I have made mistakes. I have said things I regret now. But not once have I ever lied.  You on the other hand, are a serial liar. And a creepy stalker.  And you don't have a care how people perceive you.  

I find it ironic you call me a narcissist. Nevertheless, life goes on. And I will continue to remain on this site - exposing your lies and your bad theology. 

Unlike you, I don't crying to someone everytime someone says something nasty about me.  I wonder how many times you have reported me. I suspect every opportunity you get, you do.   That is what I mean by coward.  Stevie Blunder the creepy stalker from GB. 

#51
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@Tradesecret
Compulsive lying narcissist have no conscience and care not if the lie is believed or not, Brother D.

I have said many times: To People with narcissistic personality problems the believability of the fantasy seems to be of no consequence. All that seems to count with the narcissist is whether his tall tales about himself helps him rebuild the façade of his greatness while struggling to be relevant. #186
 I don't lie. 
You have done nothing but lie about your god, the bible and yourself in particular since the day you came here Reverend Munchausen.

Firstly, I HAVE NEVER said I have memorized the ENTIRE BIBLE.So stop with the lies.  

There you go again, giving me cause to remind you. 

 This is what you have claimed, you bible dunce:
[A]
Tradesecret wrote:"I have been taught to memorise the bible from very young. I have read the bible numerous times. I try and read the OT once every year and the NT twice a year. "#52

 So your attempts to play on words doesn't work.

You then  pressed home YOUR point of  YOUR amazing memory of the bible by adding this:

[B]
While further adding:

[C]
Tradesecret wrote: I  know the bible backwards - and frontwards - in Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic 


  You can go back and check your notes.

I did. See[A],  [B] &  [C]



Secondly, I said God does not show favorites.

Nope. This is what you wrote:

Tradesecret wrote: The bible tells us that God has no favourites.#39

Well we can clearly see that god certainly did have is favourites, You absolute bible dunce. Or did your amazing memory of biblical passages let you down.. AGAIN?

Deuteronomy 7:6 King James Version
For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

Deuteronomy 14:2 King James Version
 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God, and the Lord hath chosen thee to be a peculiar (special) people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.

Deuteronomy 26:19 King James Version
 And to make thee high above all nations which he hath made, in praise, and in name, and in honour; and that thou mayest be an holy people unto the Lord thy God, as he hath spoken


Psalm 135:4 King James Version
For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar(special) treasure.


  I would rely upon verses such as Deuteronomy 10:17;

Would you now?  Well lets look at what god say just before your chosen verse:

Deuteronomy 10:15-17 King James Version
15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day.
16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:





  Romans 2:11;

Yes this is simply saying anyone that commits evil will punished as would anyone else; MORE SO the Jews. 

Romans 2:9-11 King James Version
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

See that. He singled out the Jews because they should know better.  Why should they know better? Because they were HIS chosen people ABOVE ALL OTHERS and he was their God.


and Colossians 3:25
Nothing here about "favourites". Reverend Munchausen. No these are are simple instructions to  Jewish families. No matter if it was the Father, Mother or the child.

Colossians 3:20-25 King James Version

20 Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord.
21 Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.
22 Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as men pleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God;
23 And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;
24 Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ.
25 But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.


 My meaning and intent was directed towards the notion of God being impartial because of his character not based on some whimsical position of his people. 

But god isn't impartial is he. He has a "special, " treasured" "chosen"  people, above other ALL people, doesn't he, you bible dunce? 
Now if you had said god has no favourites when it comes to the Israelite, you may have had a case, but then as shown above, he does single out Jacob as being somewhat favourite and wants him all to himself:

Psalm 135:4 King James Version
For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar(special) treasure. AMING OTHERS!!!!


Yet I also stand corrected for you are also correct. 

 I know I am. I also know that you were not correct and  it was just another one of your many  throwaway claims about what "the bible says" and for all of your self proclaimed theological education "tutored by orthodox priests, church fathers and theological academics"....... and your "Hebrew teacher", you were totally wrong... AGAIN!


Although I would not use the term favorite  in the verses you quote (even as the translation does not use the term) but accept some translations do use the term. I think peculiar is a better term.


Do you actually know what god/the bible means when it uses the term "peculiar"?  It means:  God’s special possession.


And special does not necessarily mean favorite.


Well it did in gods case and his affections towards one chose people. 

favourite:


  1. preferred to all others of the same kind.

    best-loved<<<<<

    favoured<<<<<

    treasured<<<<<

    special<<<<<

    chosen<<<<
  2. The opposite being least liked.

#52
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I don't tell lies. 

And your spin is nothing to those who value the truth. 
Topic's author
#53
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@Tradesecret
That's correct. It indicates that so many people go to heaven that their number can't be counted.  It never says anything like this for the people who end up judged.  So at least I have a figure. You are just pulling an idea out of their air.  
After reading that, good point.

If God freed the people that he burned in hell once Jesus died on the cross, I wouldn't mind worshiping him.
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@TheUnderdog


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.
Miss Tradesecret, as a woman shown herewith: https://ibb.co/NFcsLgy that goes directly against Jesus’ words in 1 Timothy 2:12, whereas she is not to teach and in being SILENT towards men!

YOUR LYING QUOTE IN YOUR POST #39 TO UNDERDOG: "That's correct. It indicates that so many people go to heaven that their number can't be counted. It never says anything like this for the people who end up judged. So at least I have a figure. You are just pulling an idea out of their air."

WRONG AGAIN Miss Tradesecret, what's new, NOTHING! There are NOT so many people going to heaven like you stated, especially where they cannot be counted, and where you have a figure, which you do not! LOL!  You're funny. :)

Jesus stated: "Many are called, but few are chosen.” (Matthew 22:14)

Jesus stated: "Someone asked Jesus Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?” And he said to them, “strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able." (Luke 13:23 )

Jesus stated:  “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few." (Matthew 7:13-14)


Miss Tradesecret, as you stated before that I am allegedly stalking you, this is not true because of the simple fact that you are so biblically ignorant and stupid, that I have to continually correct you as Jesus would want me to do in His name, whereas this to you is stalking! NOT!

The only way that you will not be continually corrected by me and the membership in allegedly stalking you, is for you to not be so Bible dumbfounded as I have shown you to be above, and elsewhere within this Religion forum, get it?!  Since that is absolutely impossible for you to do, then expect further corrections to your outright in being the #1 Bible stupid and ignorant fool in this forum!


NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN WOMAN LIKE MISS TRADESECRET THAT IS DUMBFOUNDED OF THE BIBLE, WILL BE ...?


.
#55
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@BrotherD.Thomas
Miss Tradesecret, as a woman shown herewith: https://ibb.co/NFcsLgy that goes directly against Jesus’ words in 1 Timothy 2:12, whereas she is not to teach and in being SILENT towards men!

YOUR LYING QUOTE IN YOUR POST #39 TO UNDERDOG: "That's correct. It indicates that so many people go to heaven that their number can't be counted. It never says anything like this for the people who end up judged. So at least I have a figure. You are just pulling an idea out of their air."

WRONG AGAIN Miss Tradesecret, what's new, NOTHING! There are NOT so many people going to heaven like you stated, especially where they cannot be counted, and where you have a figure, which you do not! LOL!  You're funny. :)

Jesus stated: "Many are called, but few are chosen.” (Matthew 22:14)

Jesus stated: "Someone asked Jesus Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?” And he said to them, “strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able." (Luke 13:23 )

Jesus stated:  “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few." (Matthew 7:13-14)


Miss Tradesecret, as you stated before that I am allegedly stalking you, this is not true because of the simple fact that you are so biblically ignorant and stupid, that I have to continually correct you as Jesus would want me to do in His name, whereas this to you is stalking! NOT!

The only way that you will not be continually corrected by me and the membership in allegedly stalking you, is for you to not be so Bible dumbfounded as I have shown you to be above, and elsewhere within this Religion forum, get it?!  Since that is absolutely impossible for you to do, then expect further corrections to your outright in being the #1 Bible stupid and ignorant fool in this forum!


NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN WOMAN LIKE MISS TRADESECRET THAT IS DUMBFOUNDED OF THE BIBLE, WILL BE ...?
Thanks Brother. 

good verses to focus on. Question though. Who is Jesus talking to? And in what time is he talking about? And is it true to say that this relates to the entirety of history or perhaps just to a fixed time in Jesus' own life? Perhaps he was talking only to the Jews - because as Stephen rightly tells us - Jesus came to the Jews. And if this is the case - then there is nothing to suggest he is not talking about a greater number of Gentiles - as Revelation clearly points out - a great congregation - such that their number could not be counted.  

As for stalking - you are the creepy white stalker - and your co - stalker Stephen.  The only way for the forum to know you have stopped stalking is if you actually start asking and answering REAL theological and religious Questions - and not asking personal ones.  Of course we all know that you can't help yourself. It is in your nature. 
#56
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@Tradesecret
and not asking personal ones [questions].

 I think the only single personal question I have asked you is whether or not you spoke Russian too?  Unless you can show different

Any of your own personal information has been given to this forum on the www of your own free will.   Your most recent offering concerned your "mentor in Moscow". #311


 The only way for the forum to know you have stopped stalking is if you actually start asking and answering REAL theological and religious Questions 

 Just recently I asked you a theological question based on what you told us your "mentor in Moscow" had disclosed to you;

Tradesecret wrote:  I have seen many people attempt to locate it [the Garden Of Eden] and honesty none have been very convincing. 

So what evidence did your "Eastern Orthodox Academic in Moscow mentor" tell you that caused you to believe his account? What was the material he provided that convinced you he was correct as to the location of The Eden and all other scholars and arachnologist were wrong?
This was your response;

That is for me Stephen. You are not my student.
So why do you not " actually start and answering REAL theological and religious Questions"   you hypocrite?
#57
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@Stephen
and not asking personal ones [questions].

 I think the only single personal question I have asked you is whether or not you spoke Russian too?  Unless you can show different

Any of your own personal information has been given to this forum on the www of your own free will.   Your most recent offering concerned your "mentor in Moscow". #311


 The only way for the forum to know you have stopped stalking is if you actually start asking and answering REAL theological and religious Questions 

 Just recently I asked you a theological question based on what you told us your "mentor in Moscow" had disclosed to you;

Tradesecret wrote:  I have seen many people attempt to locate it [the Garden Of Eden] and honesty none have been very convincing. 

So what evidence did your "Eastern Orthodox Academic in Moscow mentor" tell you that caused you to believe his account? What was the material he provided that convinced you he was correct as to the location of The Eden and all other scholars and arachnologist were wrong?
This was your response;

That is for me Stephen. You are not my student.
So why do you not " actually start and answering REAL theological and religious Questions"   you hypocrite?

Stephen, you have been asking personal questions of me for years.  But in any event, my comments above were for the Brother - not you in particular.  Unless of course he is another one of your fake personas.  You do seem to answer for him in a lot of cases. 

Also - you did not ask a theological question. You asked me what this Moscow person has told me that had changed my mind. That is not a theological question. It was simply a personal one - designed as always to find more information to use in your stalking. 
#58
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@Tradesecret
and not asking personal ones [questions].

 I think the only single personal question I have asked you is whether or not you spoke Russian too?  Unless you can show different

Any of your own personal information has been given to this forum on the www of your own free will.   Your most recent offering concerned your "mentor in Moscow". #311


 The only way for the forum to know you have stopped stalking is if you actually start asking and answering REAL theological and religious Questions 

 Just recently I asked you a theological question based on what you told us your "mentor in Moscow" had disclosed to you;

Tradesecret wrote:  I have seen many people attempt to locate it [the Garden Of Eden] and honesty none have been very convincing. 

So what evidence did your "Eastern Orthodox Academic in Moscow mentor" tell you that caused you to believe his account? What was the material he provided that convinced you he was correct as to the location of The Eden and all other scholars and arachnologist were wrong?
This was your response;

That is for me Stephen. You are not my student.
So why do you not " actually start and answering REAL theological and religious Questions"   you hypocrite?

Stephen, you have been asking personal questions of me for years. 
Nope. Let's see em.  


. You asked me what this Moscow person has told me that had changed my mind.

Nope. And this wasn't just any "person" was he?   You tell was one of  your " mentors".

HERE>>
Tradesecret wrote:   #311  MY best bet for the location of the Garden of Eden is the Ukraine - around the Black Sea.  I have seen many people attempt to locate it and honesty none have been very convincing. Nevertheless, there was an Eastern Orthodox Academic in Moscow - (one of my mentors) who provided me a reasonably good basis for his view which is that it was in the Ukraine.



I asked you ;


Stephen wrote; So what evidence did your "Eastern Orthodox Academic in Moscow mentor" tell you that caused you to believe his account [as to the location of the Garden of Eden?]#313

The garden of Eden and its location is most certainly a theological question. You just can't answer it and probably because it was simply more of your bullshite invented on the hoof.



That is not a theological question. It was simply a personal one - designed as always to find more information to use in your stalking. 

Your paranoia is showing Reverend Munchausen.

Stop crying that no one askes you "theological questions"   when you have no fkn intention of answering them. ESPECIALY when the questions are raised by your own statements and comments and or wild claims.

#59
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@Tradesecret


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Miss Tradesecret, as a woman shown herewith: https://ibb.co/NFcsLgy that goes directly against Jesus’ words in 1 Timothy 2:12, whereas she is not to teach and in being SILENT towards men!

I am following Jesus’ inspired words in CORRECTING YOUR BIBLE STUPIDITY once again:  ”As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear.” (Timothy 5:20)


YOUR QUOTE IN POST #55 THAT YOU DIDN'T EVEN KNOW ABOUT THE VERSES THAT I HAD SHOWN, LOL: "good verses to focus on. Question though. Who is Jesus talking to? And in what time is he talking about?"

Well, let's address your Bible stupidity again, Jesus was only talking to His creation, the JEWS, since He ONLY came for the Jews (Matthew 15:24), get it Bible fool?  In what time He was talking about had  to be when He started teaching which was about 30 years old (Luke 3:23), therefore, since Jesus was approximately born in 4BC, that would make Him 30 years old which was the time He stated the passages shown above that you had no idea existed in the first place, otherwise you wouldn't have said what you ignorantly did in your Bible ignorant post #55! H-E-L-L-O? LOL!

It matters not for the rest of your Bible ignorant post #55, because the FACT remains, ONLY A FEW OUT OF MANY of Jesus' Jewish creation will see heaven as I proposed at your expense. Furthermore, since you are a 2nd class WOMAN, you will never see heaven because there will be no women in heaven to begin with, PERIOD!   


Miss Tradesecret, furthermore, QUIT STALKING ME whenever I easily correct your outright Bible stupidity, where you in return STALK ME in your vain attempt to "try" and get out of you being Bible Slapped Silly®️ by me regarding your Bible ignorance and stupidity as shown in this post, and in this thread alone!  DO YOU UNDERSTAND?!


NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN WOMAN LIKE MISS TRADESECRET THAT OUTRIGHT "LIES" IN SAYING COUNTLESS NUMBERS OF PEOPLE WILL BE HEAVEN BOUND IN "CONTRADICTING" JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS WHICH SAY ONLY A "FEW" WILL ATTAIN HEAVEN, WILL BE ...?

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TheUnderdog
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@Tradesecret
I changed my position on this.