Another falsehood touted by ignorant talking heads is that Obama was a socialist. Of course every Democratic presidential candidate in 2020 was to the left of Obama which is a little funny/sad. But what's interesting to me is what while the fear mongering behind He'S CoMinG tO tAkE yOuR gUnS eventually subsided once realized that was entirely untrue, people still refer to Obama as a socialist to this day. Does anyone here believe that or deny that Obama was relatively moderate according to pre Liberty Caucus standards? After all the Liberty Caucus died the second Ted Cruz and Rand Paul started calling Trump "daddy." So I'm curious - by what metric is Obama a socialist? Unlike claims of him being a race baiter or cop hater, this one I'm seriously willing to entertain. I'm only 2% trolling here. I'd like to know why he is considered the antithesis of American values and capitalism by flag waving MAGA tools. I dunno if any of them can read or think very well but who knows maybe I'll get an interesting response from someone, anyone.
Obama the Socialist
Posts
Total:
98
-->
@Danielle
I dunno if any of them can read or think very well but who knows
Just gonna put this out there, I don't think you'll be changing many minds this way. If you dislike the current state of political affairs, look in the mirror, because saying stuff like this definitely doesn't help.
-->
@MisterChris
But condescension is part of the tradition on the left.
-->
@MisterChris
Just gonna put this out there, I don't think you'll be changing many minds this way.
One can provoke people into trying desperately to prove their point by getting them all riled up, and when they try hard and fail to prove said point, that may be enough for them to change their own mind. That's all we can hope for.
Most people aren't evolved enough to have a legitimate exchange of ideas without being inherently defensive and tribal. I'm capable of it but often defer to ridicule as I've found it a more fruitful (and amusing) endeavor.
For instance you'll see that instead of saying "You're right - I'm not able to justify the claim I made about X" most people will just ignore me and not admit to prior ignorance or misunderstanding. Since most people are not capable of this honest dialog, I often don't extend to them my more friendly and reasonable side because I don't think they deserve it lol.
-->
@Danielle
Well, your posts are counterproductive to what you want then. When you dismiss people, those people dismiss your ideas.
Condescension is a huge foible on the left.
-->
@Greyparrot
But condescension is part of the tradition on the left.
Lmao Dems lost for being too condescending say the Trump supporters who hoot and holler like giddy school girls when Trump says mean things to anyone and everyone who speaks against him. Compared to the words and insults Trump hurled at everyone during the campaign and beyond, I'm not sure how much credence we should give to politicians being "nice" anymore. In fact Trump and his supporters say that being nice is a negative and they prefer people who "tell it like it is." These MAGA morons live and die by the logic "It's not about being nice!!!" when it comes to Trump's indisputably harsh and hostile rhetoric, but when Hillary Clinton calls people deplorable (the horror!) or anyone dare insult them or their way of life, they faint on the floor while clutching their pearls and practically choke to death on their own hypocrisy.
-->
@Greyparrot
Condescension is a huge foible on the left.
The fact that you have the audacity to make this point when Trump's twitter feed exists is honestly hilarious and shows me you are not capable of an honest dialog. You're too biased. When people who are open-minded and fair show themselves to me, I engage them fruitfully and I love it. Some people (like Mikal) and I disagree constantly yet have really interesting and thought provoking conversations all the time. I don't have that opportunity with most people. Sad.
-->
@Danielle
Lol, I predicted you were going to launch into a condescending whataboutism post. It's predictably automatic for leftist sycophants.
It's clear from election results that the left has suffered far more in the past 10 years with their condescending rhetoric than the Repugs have with the few snippets MSM has tried to paint Trumpymanbad with.
I can't think of anyone who was running in the Democratic Primaries that could possibly be more condescending than (#1) Kamala (#snarksmirker) and (#2) Biden (#c'mon man). Maybe Warren could have given Biden a run for being professorially condescending.
On the flip side, I can think of plenty of condescending people on the right that by far outpace Trump's rhetoric, notably Kasich (#1), the Bush dynasty(#2), Romney (#3)...all soundly rejected by the voters.
But that's par for the course for the left. Accuse your opponent of having the exact flaws that you yourself have in order to deflect from your own foibles.
Saul Alinsky's rules for divisive radicals seeking political power in action.
-->
@Danielle
One can provoke people into trying desperately to prove their point by getting them all riled up, and when they try hard and fail to prove said point, that may be enough for them to change their own mind. That's all we can hope for.
We have a pretty different outlook then. Because the way I see it, if someone seems to be genuinely inquiring as to my position on something I am willing to give them an honest opinion. If someone insults me and it's clear they have no intention on keeping the discussion civil, I'll ignore.
Maybe that psychology doesn't work with all people, but do you really think starting flame wars really changes people's opinions? Maybe you should aim for quality over quantity, as I have never witnessed a flame war end positively for anyone involved.
You have to moderate your conduct if your aspirations include running for president. That doesn't make one's ideological motive "moderate".
I'd be interested to see what sympathies you think he might have with socialism.
-->
@MisterChris
Trump's entire campaign schtick is to mock and parody condescending politicians.
It's the reason why he is known as being a populist instead of a wise professor.
-->
@Danielle
The fact that you have the audacity to make this point when Trump's twitter feed exists is honestly hilarious and shows me you are not capable of an honest dialog.
The fact that you are willing to equivocate Law Professor Obama's level of condescension with populist Trumpy shows me you are not capable of an honest critique. I can't imagine someone as well-read as you blaming, say, "the Russians" for Trump being president today instead of Obama. Call me wrong.
-->
@Danielle
Obama 2008 was probably on average where Trump is right now.
The modern Democratic Party is extremely to the left. Joe Biden can deny it all he wants but the old Dems are falling like flies to Progressives
-->
@Conway
Don’t know if anyone has said this but...
Welcome to the Site!!
-->
@Greyparrot
Kasich (#1), the Bush dynasty(#2), Romney (#3)...all soundly rejected by the voters.
RINOS hate Trump but are adored by people who support Joe Biden and the radical left
-->
@ILikePie5
Are you familiar with Saul Alinsky's rules for radicals?
It's one of the most divisive of the Chicago-machine era clusterfuck strategies embraced by the left to gain power.
Obama had cited him as a prominent influence in his first book, Dreams from My Father. Hillary also praised the man while she was in college.
Alinsky's rules are designed to essentially utterly destroy your opponent Sun Tzu scorched earth style.
That kind of bullshit is what paves the way for an intolerant totalitarian government. It's my hope that the right does not use the same weapons that the left used to get as far as they did with their Marxist agenda.
-->
@Greyparrot
Are you familiar with Saul Alinsky's rules for radicals?
Of course. The tactics are near verbatim
-->
@ILikePie5
Of course, leftist diehards like Danielle are going to say the ends justifies the means in their neverending whataboutery quest to justify the bullshit.
-->
@Greyparrot
Of course, leftist diehards like Danielle are going to say the ends justifies the means in their neverending whataboutery quest to justify the bullshit.
She’s a RINO who’s willing to betray everything she stood for because Orangeman bad.
-->
@ILikePie5
RINOS are leftists. What do you think NEO in NEOCON stands for?
-->
@Greyparrot
RINOS are leftists. What do you think NEO in NEOCON stands for?
Yup. They’ve shown their true colors.
-->
@Danielle
Another falsehood touted by ignorant talking heads is that Obama was a socialist. Of course every Democratic presidential candidate in 2020 was to the left of Obama which is a little funny/sad. But what's interesting to me is what while the fear mongering behind He'S CoMinG tO tAkE yOuR gUnS eventually subsided once realized that was entirely untrue, people still refer to Obama as a socialist to this day. Does anyone here believe that or deny that Obama was relatively moderate according to pre Liberty Caucus standards? After all the Liberty Caucus died the second Ted Cruz and Rand Paul started calling Trump "daddy." So I'm curious - by what metric is Obama a socialist? Unlike claims of him being a race baiter or cop hater, this one I'm seriously willing to entertain. I'm only 2% trolling here. I'd like to know why he is considered the antithesis of American values and capitalism by flag waving MAGA tools. I dunno if any of them can read or think very well but who knows maybe I'll get an interesting response from someone, anyone.
Time is an illusion. All presidents, especially post World War II have been serving an agenda of creating a communist state in which, for the most part, they've succeeded. You want an example? The minimum wage; social security; public health insurance; the MTA. It isn't that people bear a misunderstanding of socialism; it's that people bear a misunderstanding of capitalism. Capitalism is a system in which the means of production and their dissemination are controlled by private parties. The government by definition is NOT private. Whenever the government imposes a price control (e.g. minimum wage, rent-control, subsidizing pharmaceutical R&D, etc.) it is controlling the dissemination of production. Whenever the government charges a tax, it is controlling the means of production. The government's participation in the economic system necessarily characterizes that economy as "socialist."
"Moderate" is merely a rhetorical device to perpetuate cognitive dissonance. The U.S. political system in effect is a binary. "Moderate" has no practical application.
-->
@Athias
Capitalism in America has, at its core, the principle that Americans should have the right to own private property through life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness. America relies on the Constitution to protect them from a government that could take that right away to varying degrees.
The major difference between the USA and South America despite having the exact same conditions at the formation of the various nations, including slavery, is that South America did NOT evolve onto a society where property rights were viewed as a benefit for society. Today, most of South America is far behind the developed world in regards to property rights.
Obamacare flopped primarily on the one point about limiting private insurance, which is something people want a right to own.
Bruh I wish
-->
@ILikePie5
Check out this latest tweet from Queen Rodham.
"I was born for that. I mean, that's why I knew I'd be a good president. I was ready for crises and emergencies, and I would have done what you see these women leaders doing. You listen to the science. You bring in people in an open, inclusive way. You communicate constantly, you make the case by explaining why what you're doing is in the long-term interests, not only of health, but also, of the economy. Yeah, I have no doubt in my mind at all that I would have stepped up to that crisis."
The chutzpah of the left to think they do not have a problem with the perception of being professorially condescending is phenomenal in scope.
It aint the Russians babe.
What sane person would actually say they were "born to be president?" This nation isn't led by monarchal dynasties.
You don't just deserve to be president for simply having the correct DNA. Talk about condescending and delusional.
-->
@Danielle
List of things to be sold to the highest bidder in conservative utopia:
- All public schools
- All public roads
- All fire departments
- The post office
- County hospitals
- Municipal utilities
- What else?
-->
@Greyparrot
I have no idea why you bothered to comment here. Of course you didn't make a single point in response to the OP. We all know you can't prove this claim you've made so you don't have the audacity to even try. Good! I'm glad you know better. Stick to your strategy of not responding to me directly because that's the only way to limit the shame I guess.
What I don't get is why you made a useless quip to MisterChris about how the Dems lost because they were too condescending lol. (Aww. Too condescending.) Who gives a shit and how is that relevant to the OP at all? I don't care that Hillary Clinton hurt your fee fees. I don't care that you require a safe space to be protected from Democrat's snark. Leave it to Trump supporters to be the biggest cry baby snowflakes on the planet. These anti-PC folks were so offended per your article that they decided to vote against Dems and you think I... care... about that... for some... reason?
I'm not a Democrat lol. I couldn't care less if the Democrats were the rudest, most snarky, most scumbag politicians on planet Earth because their advocacy does not align with mine. I don't care if they win or lose. In fact my life will probably be better if Trump wins because I do well enough that I don't rely on government food stamps, government healthcare, government social security and all the other programs his uneducated and low-income supporters depend on but vote against. That's their problem. I'ma be fine no matter what.
I just like to mock people for not being able to back up their nonsense. You repeatedly spew the most asinine, falsifiable bullshit. It's a shame you don't have the decency or integrity to acknowledge it every time (or any time) I prove you wrong. I just wish you wouldn't waste my time by replying at all if you have nothing relevant or useful to add. All you do is whine incessantly about the left. I'm the one who said in response to Michelle Obama that my personal M.O. is when they go low, I go lower so I don't know why you think I care about the strategy of being nice to win hearts and minds. I don't, Trump doesn't, and you're only pretending to so you can complain about Democrats some more. That's all you do. Unfortunately that's not good enough to back your incessant falsehoods up which is why I have to correct you all the time.
-->
@Greyparrot
Of course, leftist diehards like Danielle are going to say the ends justifies the means in their neverending whataboutery quest to justify the bullshit.
Lol @ leftist diehard. Yep, you know me! I don't even know what you're talking about here and I don't think you do either.
But anyway, um, yeah it is insanely hypocritical to say Democrats are not being "kind" enough for people, so they are forced to choose Trump instead. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You don't have a response or justification for that stupidity so all you can say is that it's "whataboutism" for me to point out that Trump is more rude than any Democrat. How observant of you! It absolutely is whataboutism. It also happens to be true which is why you have nothing else to say about it lol. Derp.
-->
@Athias
All presidents, especially post World War II have been serving an agenda of creating a communist state in which, for the most part, they've succeeded.
We're not communist lol. Things like the minimum wage and MTA do not prove we are socialist either. But what does any of this have to do with Obama? Are you saying his support for publicly funded endeavors makes him a socialist? You seem to be arguing that the very fact we have a government at all means capitalism is not possible. In that case every politician is a socialist. Republicans support ALL of the things you mentioned (public transportation, social security, social safety nets, etc.) so by that logic they're socialists too.
-->
@Danielle
Being rude to some people and some sketchy fringe groups =/= condescending professor to entire groups of voters.
Enjoy the election results! I am sure you were born to snark.