not voting for biden is effectively letting trump win

Author: n8nrgmi

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@n8nrgmi
Here is a better article that proves conservatives are smarter than your average liberal who makes 1st order solutions. "Derp rent too expensive let's do rent control" while conservatives actually look at the impacts of policies https://www.speakfreely.today/2019/09/28/intelligence-negatively-related-socialist-beliefs-data-shows/
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@n8nrgmi
So essentially you re willing to blindly vote for someone like Biden (over a third party member, or in a worst case scenario, trump himself) simply because of what......?
People are sometimes so stuck up in their affiliation to a political party that they forget to ask themselves whether that party is still affiliated to them.
So where does Biden stand on the political spectrum?
He is evidently pro war, he is evidently pro China, he is clearly for the reduction of tax for the super wealthy, he is evidently anti healthcare at the point of delivery, and the list goes on and on. 
How could an ex Sander.s voter even consider voting for someone like Biden over any other candidate, as someone who represents the exact opposite they stand for. 
And I will go further, if the option of voting for a third party or not voting at all wasn’t available to them, I’m convinced ex sander’s voters would be more at home with Trump than someone like Biden.
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@n8nrgmi
Provide the sources
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@n8nrgmi
only stupid people vote for Trump
Would you like to cite those "studies," or are we supposed to take your word for it? How about that on lystupid people make non-cited claims?
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@fauxlaw
I'd be very interested to know the name of the most recent book he has read.
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@Greyparrot
Trump, or n8?
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@fauxlaw
Anyone really.
n8nrgmi
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trump supporters and intelligence

low information trump supporters 
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@n8nrgmi
I'd be very interested to know the name of the most recent book you have read.
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@Greyparrot
the last novel i read front to back was called 'siddartha'. i also regularly read and study excerpts from 'evidence of the afterlife' and 'God and the afterlife'. i have subscriptions to discover magazine, and fortune. i regularly read 'the atlantic', the new york times, time, the economist, and stuff like that. i spend the large majority of my days reading stuff. 

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@n8nrgmi
Your cited studies are very revealing...
in their inadequacy to represent the likely voters in our society. Digging into the weeds of your cited studies, which you should have done yourself, but statistical studies can be so boring; why bother doing it? Well, I asked because I do. I am a Certified Six Sigma Black Belt. Look it up. In this regard, I am a professional of significant capability. Where many will accept a survey's results as credible, I am a huge skeptic with reason. Most polls, in particular, virtually all political polls, come fully biased. First is the nature of those polled as a sub-group "representing American voters" in general. The reason why the election results were so different from what political polls were telling us in 2016, was that polls, as do those in your cited studies, asked the wrong kind of people: registered voters. You more accurate sub-group will always be likely voters, a significantly different population. You polls end up citing "most Americans" and you accept as fact that it represents America. Nope. Not even close.

Have a care to know what is meant by "most Americans." Who is polled to arrive at such conclusions? Hint: it's usually registered voters. That, alone, is a faulty beginning because the target ought to be likely voters. The two terms are not synonymous. In 2016, there were 250M registered voters. Only 127M of them actually voted, 51.1%, divided between Trump and Hillary. 123M, 49,9%, did not vote, and had no opinion, yet, they are included in a poll such as you reference. If they didn't care to vote, how valid is their opinion? And there, my friend, is your true majority; people with no opinion, because they refuse to back it by voting for either candidate. Now, shall we discuss what "margin of error" means? It's another reason why 2016, and virtually all political polls, are flawed, and inaccurate.

Margin of error is the calculation of how many percentage points your results will differ from the real population value, expressed as a plus/minus percentage. For example: coupled with a standard 95% confidence interval with a ±3 percent margin of error means that your statistic will be within 6 percentage points of the real population value 95% of the time. Great, except that your "studies," extensive though they were, omitted reveal a margin of error. A margin of error of greater than ±3 percent is to great for general accuracy. 

Number of questions: A valid poll will keep the questionnaire to a minimum number of questions to avoid the huge risk of a polling subject's loss of interest, which messes with your margin of error. Your studies had 98 pages of of multiple questions per page. The acceptable poll is limited to about 10 questions, total. Oops.

An equivalent number of poll subjects considering a particular demographic gives the most accurate results. For example, one should have a relatively even number of men and women, Democrats and Republicans, ages groups, racial demographics, education demos, [we'll key on that one aa an example], and likelihood to vote.

Your "studies" had 4x women to men, for example, and the real cogent key: education: less than 10% of the total sub-group population bothered to register that they had completed high school or college. TEN PERCENT! Your "studies" results in this demographic, the absolute purpose of the "studies," turns on this very point. 10% of your "most Americans," half of whom DID NOT VOTE, were the basis of the claim that Trump supporters are less educated than Hillaryous Balloon Girl supporters. Sorry, I do not accept your cited "studies." I'll wager you knew none of the foregoing, or you would have been ashamed to cite it. Know your sources. Having a fair idea about who you're talking to helps, too.
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@n8nrgmi
How do you feel about the merits of Buddhism?
Danielle
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Agree with the OP. Any progressive who doesn't vote for Biden out of "principle" is, most likely, an idiot. 


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@Danielle
Agree with the OP. Any progressive who doesn't vote for Biden out of "principle" is, most likely, an idiot. 
any progressive who does support biden isn't very progressive. They are willing to continue to reward the corruption and incompetence of the democratic party. As long as the democrats can win running as corrupt corportists, america will never be able to get any significant positive change. The only way that change will happen is when the democrats learn that if they continue running corrupt corportists they will lose. 

The democrats have ignored the left for decades and been able to succeed. They need to learn those days are over. 

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@HistoryBuff
A Trump win will ensure that no progressive legislation gets pushed through for the next 4+ years, and that the Supreme Court will lean conservative for decades to come. You can kiss goodbye any fantasy about nationalized industries (healthcare) or government mandates, and you can watch civil liberties disappear in conservative states especially.

Deluding yourself into thinking that you can somehow change "the DNC" by allowing Trump to win is just silly. It is not remotely progressive (and in fact, it is ANTI progressive) to commit to all progressive legislation being dead on arrival under another Trump term.

Sitting out the election or letting Trump win = Republican Congress. Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders would have the same Congress... ya know, the body of government that actually passes laws.

It literally makes no sense for Bernie Bros to take some self-righteous moral high ground approach. Unless you can't bring yourself to vote for a rapist (and you believe the allegations against Biden) a progressive has no logical reason not to support Biden - especially since Biden hinted at only wanting to run for one term. If he picks Warren as VP, I will definitely vote for Biden. If he doesn't I'll be undecided, but that's because I'm not progressive. 
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@Danielle
A Trump win will ensure that no progressive legislation gets pushed through for the next 4+ years
that will happen either way. Biden has a record of pushing the republicans to the right on some issues. 

and that the Supreme Court will lean conservative for decades to come
fair enough. But again, it's not like Biden would appoint any progressive judges anyway. 

You can kiss goodbye any fantasy about nationalized industries (healthcare) or government mandates
Biden has sworn to veto medicare for all. So there is absolutely no difference on that point. 

and you can watch civil liberties disappear in conservative states especially.
again, i really see no difference at all between trump or biden on this point. 

Deluding yourself into thinking that you can somehow change "the DNC" by allowing Trump to win is just silly.
Of course we can change the DNC. If the high ranking members of the DNC lose elections, then they won't be high ranking members of the DNC. The thing they love most is power. If being right wing hacks guarantees they won't ever get power again, we will see how quickly they see the light. 

It is not remotely progressive (and in fact, it is ANTI progressive) to commit to all progressive legislation being dead on arrival under another Trump term.
it would be just as dead under biden. Biden is also a corrupt, right wing candidate who hates progressives. I fail to see how it is progressive to vote for a candidate who has sworn to fight against progressive ideas. 

It literally makes no sense for Bernie Bros to take some self-righteous moral high ground approach. Unless you can't bring yourself to vote for a rapist (and you believe the allegations against Biden) a progressive has no logical reason not to support Biden - especially since Biden hinted at only wanting to run for one term.
you aren't making alot of sense. You are saying that it is logical to vote for a corrupt, right wing, candidate because he is slightly less evil than a different corrupt right wing candidate. That kind of thinking guarantees that change will never happen. As long as corrupt candidates continue to win in the democratic party, then corrupt candidates are the only ones who will gain power. 

If he picks Warren as VP, I will definitely vote for Biden. If he doesn't I'll be undecided, but that's because I'm not progressive. 
I seriously doubt he would pick warren. He hates warren. She spent years making his life miserable while he was "the senator from mbna". He is too corrupt and hard headed for that. And even if he did go so far as to pick a progressive as a VP, it wouldn't change anything. VPs have absolutely no power in the government. And since Biden has a long history of spitting on progressives, picking a token progressive to trot out at events while he fills his cabinet with corrupt, neo-liberals and goldman sachs executives won't mean a thing. 
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@n8nrgmi
Your response is based on your TDS You cant prove anything you say. Where as I can prove Biden is in the beginning stages of dementia. And Show overwhelming evidence of corruption and bribe taking from China. Why would it be stupid to Vote for Trump? Give 3 examples.
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@HistoryBuff
and you can watch civil liberties disappear in conservative states especially. - Danielle
again, i really see no difference at all between trump or biden on this point. 
Really? Show me in what manner Trump has curtailed your constitutional civil liberties. One example will do.
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@sadolite
here are five reasons it's stupid to vote for trump....

1. he wants to kick millions off their health insurance, and he has no plans to replace it. he's talked about getting people healthcare but is a stooge to the republicans so he won't do it

2. he wants to allow companies to pollute mercury into the environment, which is a serious neurotoxin. among all the other pollutants he's cool with

3. his center piece for legislation that he could actually get through congress, is a give away to the wealthy and tax cuts are stupid to do during good economic times. how is it wise to borrow against your kids to fund the government? 

4. he wants enact no gun control, despite the fact that gun control works according to the best science out there, according to the scientific consensus. he talks like he wants more background checks, but is a stooge to the NRA

5. he has no plan to transition us to alternative energy, and got us out of the Paris accord to reduce air pollution. if carbon dioxide is the highest it's been in millions of years, and twice what it's been for hundreds of thousands of years, and it causes global warming according to the scientific consensus, maybe we shouldn't be putting so much in the air? just a thought. i'm mostly worried about droughts due to global warming. 
Vader
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Let the Bernie Bros sit out of the election. I endorse this. 
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@n8nrgmi

1. he wants to kick millions off their health insurance, and he has no plans to replace it. he's talked about getting people healthcare but is a stooge to the republicans so he won't do it
It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to purchase healthcare on the pain of punishment.

2. he wants to allow companies to pollute mercury into the environment, which is a serious neurotoxin. among all the other pollutants he's cool with
It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to ascribe to arbitrary levels of mercury set by flawed men in government on the pain of punishment.

3. his center piece for legislation that he could actually get through congress, is a give away to the wealthy and tax cuts are stupid to do during good economic times. how is it wise to borrow against your kids to fund the government? 
It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to confiscate your wealth if you have a good idea that can improve the lives of millions and create millions of jobs as if the economy was a zero-sum game.

4. he wants enact no gun control, despite the fact that gun control works according to the best science out there, according to the scientific consensus. he talks like he wants more background checks, but is a stooge to the NRA
It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to give up their 2nd amendment rights for arbitrary reasons from flawed people in government.

5. he has no plan to transition us to alternative energy, and got us out of the Paris accord to reduce air pollution. if carbon dioxide is the highest it's been in millions of years, and twice what it's been for hundreds of thousands of years, and it causes global warming according to the scientific consensus, maybe we shouldn't be putting so much in the air? just a thought. i'm mostly worried about droughts due to global warming. 
It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to purchase the kinds of green energy they do not want with arbitrary expenditures from flawed people in government purchasing failed ventures like Solyndra. 

It requires an authoritarian government to mandate the public to purchase any of the things on the shopping list of the green new deal.

Even if I were to agree with all 5 of those points, it's not worth having the authoritarian government required to implement them. I would rather die free than live a long life in shackles.
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@Greyparrot
there's also an authoritarian government from another perspective contrary to yours, you just side with evil. the government lets people not have enough resources by force of law to afford healthcare, the government lets polluters kill people instead of letting me take a flame thrower to their business given they are killing people. all your examples have the government taking someone's side at the expense of innocent people. you simply choose to side with evil. that's on you. 
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@Greyparrot
do you have any idea how stupid you sound? the government can't stop companies from killing people, because the government is inherently a bad actor at anything it does. yeah, makes a lot of sense. 
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@n8nrgmi
Why would you purchase a product from someone who kills people? You sound really dumb here.
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@Vader
Antitrumpers seem to act like a newly separated wife who hates her ex so much that she doesn’t care what happens to the kids as long as it hurts her ex.
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@n8nrgmi
there's also an authoritarian government from another perspective contrary to yours, you just side with evil. 

There is no such thing as a benevolent government.

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@Greyparrot
I think this is the truest statement yet
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@Vader
I've been using my quarantine time to watch every episode of Milton Friedman's series from the 80's.

Free to Choose.
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@n8nrgmi
Kick people off their health insurance? Who's policies are being canceled? My health insurance was canceled under Obama then my new policy was 3 times more expensive. 

He wants to pump mercury into the environment. Does he really? What regulations has he changed or added that allows mercury to be pumped into the environment

Tax cuts for the rich. . The wealthy lobby congress, congress makes all fiscal decisions, not the president.

Gun control. There are currently over 10,000 laws both federal and state. What new laws do you want added that are not already in place?

Alternative energy. There is no reliable cost effective alternative energy source to transition too that can 100% replace oil. Crude oil will always be used even if it isn't used for fuel. 80% of everything you own is made from crude oil. over 4000 different substances are made from crude oil. Crude oil is the most efficient multi use substance on earth.

Basically you have policy disagreements from what I can tell. So anyone who disagrees with you politically is stupid is what you are saying.
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@sadolite
well, u said anyone who votes biden is irrational, so i guess we are even