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@Castin
That's clearly a fake noose.
Ironically, I agree with Trump on the Syria move
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@Imabench
It's kind of funny if you pull up some old CNN clips from 2 years ago criticizing Trump for having troops in Syria.
The comments from the TDS crowd 2 years ago are hilarious, demanding that Trump pull the troops out now.
It's just so blatantly obvious that there isn't any morality in the media or any reason for the corporate media to care at all about America.
Why are the - so called - Democrats over there so eager for Donald Trump to start a war ..with anyone?
They have in the past called him a warmonger and then a dove and now a coward and traitor to the Kurds. It appears to many here in England that President Donald Trump can't do right for doing wrong.
It is a pathetic state of affairs when all those bleeding heart liberals who scream and shout about brave but "wasteful" US casualties and protest about taking the country to war illegally or otherwise are now demanding that the President should attack Iran , and continue to support the Kurds in a conflict thousands of miles away from their own shores.
The USA have done their bit and now should leave those people to take care of themselves. The have had some of the best training in the world from the British and Americans. Trump it appears doesn't want to be a President with blood on his hands, what is wrong with that? He seems to have tried his hardest to establish an accord, if not peace, with North Korea for which he has been getting no praise from the so called Democrats or the MSM.
This is all my own opinion from this side of the water but have anti Trump Americans never heard of the phrase - Credit where It is due ?
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@Stephen
It is a pathetic state of affairs when all those bleeding heart liberals.... are now demanding that the President should attack Iran
Ive literally never heard a single Democrat claim that the US should attack Iran. I don't know where you get your information from, but you need to find some new ones because right now you sound stupid as shit
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@Swagnarok
So give "hope" a chance is your foreign policy. I sure "hope" nobody in the middleast gets butchered because USA needs their{?} oil. Theirs till the Shah of Iran was removed.All we can hope for is that Erdogan doesn't butcher too many people.
USA peoples did not want to get involved with Nazis either. I sure hope nobody in Europe gets butchered because USA doesnt not want to get involved in Europe. Then Pearl Harbor occured and USA realizes t that Japan and Hitler were on same page.
So Bosinan war occurs and USA sees people getting butchered, as United Nations walks away from a town and leaves them to be butchered. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in that area. Then USA gives military support.
So twin towers fall and since Bush-2 did not know how to spell Afghanistan, ergo USA went to war in Iraq. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in middle east because of USA's need for oil. So kurds get northern Iraq freed from oppression.
Oh yeah, USA troops are not out of Syria and are in grave danger of being caught between Turkey/Syria/Russia and Kurds as ISIS prioners are making a prison break,--- thanks to Trumpity Dumpity---. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in middleast ---including USA troops---.
1} smart policy that engages to prevent butchering,
2} passive resistance { non-violence } to protest butchering,
3} dumb policy that encourages butchering,
4} give hope a chance policy,
5} USA supports volunteer army that volunteers for where they want to go fight, provided they get enough votes from congress,
6} other options....?
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@ebuc
I sure hope nobody in Europe gets butchered
That's totally up to Europe. They have plenty of money to defend themselves with their own militaries.
I sure hope nobody gets butchered in MiddleEast.
That's going to happen no matter what God you pray to.
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@Greyparrot
That's going to happen no matter what God you pray to.
Our allies the kurds who were the lead in killing off ISIS have a new god since being dumped in the nearest Turkish ditch by Trumpity Dumpity.
Their new god is Russia and and Assad/Syria to battle the Turks. Good going Trumpity Dumpity. Trumpity Dumpity is not going to fight the sanctions ---led by senator Graham-- that will be imposed on Turkey. Too little too late.
Turkey has been turning away from sectarism ---Attorney Barrs kind of rreligous peoples--- to become more Islamic state.
...."Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the founder of the secular Turkish Republic that replaced the Islamic Ottoman Empiredied in 1938,........Ataturk would not have been surprised: He was convinced that Islam in any form would be the ruin of the Turks.".....
Aight here’s a simple plan. We make peace deals with the terrorists that we will stop all operations on them. All they have to do is not attack us. We leave them to do what they want. If the UN comes knocking we give them the middle finger and cancel funding. Middle East has been a war zone since the beginning of time. Better we get out then get caught in the cross fire. Oh ya btw, Turkey is a more valuable ally than the Kurds. But the Kurds may become the next Taliban, in which case we have the Turks to beat em up. Ez dub.
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@ILikePie5
Yep, today's freedom fighters are tomorrow's cockroaches.
That's what the Middle East does to you. It's time to snuff out the tiki torch and leave the island. The USA does not need to play that reality game.
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@bmdrocks21
Bit late for that. That message has been heard loud and clear around for the last several decades; that's why Iran and North Korea see nuclear weapons as the only effective deterrent against us. We funded the mujaheddin to fight the Soviets, then abandoned them. We propped up Saddam as a foil to Iran, then abandoned him. We promised not to attempt regime change in Libya, then our SoS laughed about their leader being sodomized to death with a bayonet. Any government that isn't retarded knows that our supposed loyalty is secured by bribes to our congressman, lobbyists, and permanent beauriacracy, not any sort of real principle.I just don't want this to be a message to any future groups that are thinking about helping the US: that we will use them to help with our goals, and then immediately leave them to die.
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@ResurgetExFavilla
You're not wrong. I'm very disappointed in how we have conducted foreign policy for the past few decades. I'm angry that we are continuing this cycle of backing and then screwing people over.
Not sure about the Mujaheddin point, though. We helped them drive the Soviets out.
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@Imabench
I'm glad you agree that Arabs are sub-human insects whose affairs we should avoid interfering with.
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@ILikePie5
The entire existence of these terrorist groups though is to wage jihad against 'enemies of Islam' though, and the groups that carry out the most attacks in the name of Islam are usually the ones that convince the most recruits to join them since that group appears to the one actually fighting the jihad the most. if we were to pull out of the Middle east we would be doing so acknowledging that these groups are going to continue to be massive dicks, and that we will have to play defense against them. I believe though that is what we should do since constant intervention into every conflict that bubbles up is just as fruitless, but approx 5 times as costly.We make peace deals with the terrorists that we will stop all operations on them. All they have to do is not attack us
But the Kurds may become the next Taliban
I think thats a bit of a stretch. The Kurds have their own ethnic identity and are interested in maintaining that culture despite being spread out across numerous countries. Spreading religious beliefs to foreign areas by force isnt really one of their priorities, especially in comparison to some of the other groups fighting in Syria against Assad at the moment.
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@Imabench
The entire existence of these terrorist groups though is to wage jihad against 'enemies of Islam' though, and the groups that carry out the most attacks in the name of Islam are usually the ones that convince the most recruits to join them since that group appears to the one actually fighting the jihad the most. if we were to pull out of the Middle east we would be doing so acknowledging that these groups are going to continue to be massive dicks, and that we will have to play defense against them. I believe though that is what we should do since constant intervention into every conflict that bubbles up is just as fruitless, but approx 5 times as costly.
You’re right. However, if we do show restraint it sends a message that we are tired of this. Y’all can deal with your bs, just leave us alone. Russians can have Syria considering we get Israel and Turkey and the end to terrorist campaigns. Constant intervention has to end. It just means more lives and more radicalization. We are done with what we aimed to do - Kill OBL. The Middle East has never lived under a democracy, it’s futile to assert that democracy is what they want.
I think thats a bit of a stretch. The Kurds have their own ethnic identity and are interested in maintaining that culture despite being spread out across numerous countries. Spreading religious beliefs to foreign areas by force isnt really one of their priorities, especially in comparison to some of the other groups fighting in Syria against Assad at the moment.
Taliban is mainly active in Afghanistan if I’m not mistaken. But again, even if they do become the Taliban, their fight is with Turkey and Syria - the former has the power to do whatever they want and the latter is supported by Russia, which means Kurds will attack Russians instead of us. It’s a win win situation for us either way. Only problem I see in this entire conflict is the damned human rights people just as always lmao. War is war.
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@ILikePie5
Turkey is definitely the stronger ally to support in that conflict of allies.
Sorry Kurds, but Bye Felicia!
"As somebody wrote in a very very powerful article today, they [the Kurds] didn't help us in the Second World War, they didn't help us with Normandy..." -- Trump
*headdesk*
*headdesk*
*headdesk*
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@Castin
Why do you hate Turkey so much? Thanksgiving blues?
Will someone please get this man a history book? He needs help, people. He doesn't know why the Civil War happened, he thinks it was the nation of Canada that burned down the Whitehouse in the War of 1812, and apparently it escapes his notice that the Kurds had no country or military in WWII, so this makes about as much sense as blaming Native Americans for not committing their Native American military armies to the Battle of Normandy.
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@Castin
That's still no reason to pillory poor Turkey. They just wanna gobble gobble the Kurds.
Ugh, why didn't he just stick to his other reasons for the withdrawal? They were contendable. This was such a stupid thing to say. His attitude should be "I sympathize but this was necessary," not "who cares, you're people of low character anyway." Especially when those people have just done us a solid.
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@Castin
Will someone please get this man a history book?
Post #37----Turkey has been turning away from sectarism ---Attorney Barrs kind of rreligous peoples--- to become more Islamic state.
...."Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the founder of the secular Turkish Republic that replaced the Islamic Ottoman Empire died in 1938,........Ataturk would not have been surprised: He was convinced that Islam in any form would be the ruin of the Turks.".....
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@Greyparrot
If he didn’t get troops out, he loses Turkey. If he does he loses the Kurds. Guarantee you that’s what the call between Erdogan and Trump was about. What would you do in this situation if you were Trump? Lose Turkey and lose American lives, or withdraw?
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@Swagnarok
All we are saying, is give Hope a chance, all we are saying, is give hope a chance...sung to John Lennon song.
We live in a one-world-island, ergo taking the .....'tiki torch and leave the island'... was never ever an optiion in history, and especially in the year 2019.
1} So give "hope" a chance is your foreign policy. I sure "hope" nobody in the middleast gets butchered because USA needs their{?} oil. Theirs till the Shah of Iran was removed.
2} USA peoples did not want to get involved with Nazis either. I sure hope nobody in Europe gets butchered because USA does not want to get involved in Europe. Then Pearl Harbor occured and USA realizes that Japan and Hitler were on same page.
3} So Bosinan war occurs and USA sees people getting butchered, as United Nations walks away from a town and leaves them to be butchered. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in that area. Then USA gives military support.
4} So twin towers fall and since Bush-2 did not know how to spell Afghanistan, ergo USA went to war in Iraq. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in middle east because of USA's need for oil. So kurds get northern Iraq freed from oppression.
5] Oh yeah, USA troops are not out of Syria and are in grave danger of being caught between Turkey/Syria/Russia and Kurds as ISIS prioners are making a prison break,--- thanks to Trumpity Dumpity---. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in middleast ---including USA troops---.
1} smart policy that engages to prevent butchering,
2} passive resistance { non-violence } to protest butchering,
3} dumb policy that encourages butchering,
4} give hope a chance policy,
5} USA supports volunteer army that volunteers for where they want to go fight, provided they get enough votes from congress,
6} other options....?
So Putin and Assad are now running the show in Syria even more than before. Wouldnt surprise me if Putin is running the Trumpity Dumpity show on this issue also.
Where is good ole Moscow Mitch when we need him. Or yeah, he has hi lack-of-integrity Senator nose in Putins and Trumps pants and now apparrently the Erodgans also.
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@ILikePie5
If he didn’t get troops out, he loses Turkey. If he does he loses the Kurds. Guarantee you that’s what the call between Erdogan and Trump was about. What would you do in this situation if you were Trump? Lose Turkey and lose American lives, or withdraw?
Absolutely the wrong move is to go to war with Turkey. I suspect these sanctions are a screen and Trump has already had a secret meeting with Erdogan to take over the ISIS prisoners since the EU gave him the middle finger. The sanctions are likely a paper tiger. Nobody is going to be saying a damn thing in 2 months about this.
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@Castin
Ugh, why didn't he just stick to his other reasons for the withdrawal? They were contendable. This was such a stupid thing to say. His attitude should be "I sympathize but this was necessary," not "who cares, you're people of low character anyway." Especially when those people have just done us a solid.
Because the people stupid enough to not know a damn thing about Turkey and the Kurds need an explanation like that. Those people are easy to talk to.
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@Greyparrot
Are you watching the debate? Donald Trump has to laughing his pants off with this circus
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@ILikePie5
Eh, I already knew who is going to be the nominee since July.
Warren 2020!
1} So give "hope" a chance is your foreign policy. I sure "hope" nobody in the middleast gets butchered because USA needs their{?} oil. Theirs till the Shah of Iran was removed.
Since you have such beef with our "oil wars" I'm sure that means you use very little of such, or otherwise find a specialized "oil made in USA only" dealer who sells it to you for higher prices. (Hint: Even if somehow that were true those oil prices on USA oil would certainly be much higher if everyone in America was only using USA oil, and so you would still be benefiting from a lower price made possible by Middle Eastern oil.) You're using the internet on a device powered by electricity, which in all likelihood is supplied to your home by a power plant that uses oil, possibly Middle Eastern oil.
So don't act like you're superior when you reap the same rewards as everyone else in America does from such.
Even if you're not American, you still probably live in a society powered by Middle Eastern oil, made possible by, you guessed it, USA wars designed to keep the supply flowing.
2} USA peoples did not want to get involved with Nazis either. I sure hope nobody in Europe gets butchered because USA does not want to get involved in Europe. Then Pearl Harbor occured and USA realizes that Japan and Hitler were on same page.
However bad the suffering and slaughter of peoples overseas, FDR had no right to force Americans to fight and die against their will to rectify the situation. If he wanted to help so badly he could've grabbed a rifle, hopped a plane, and wheeled himself to the Russian front lines. In that sense American involvement in WWII was only justified so far as an Axis victory would've been very bad for us in the long term.
Now, today we have a volunteer force. But even then there's a general consensus nowadays that our troops are not 100% expendable and should only be endangered when the good of the nation counts on it.
5] Oh yeah, USA troops are not out of Syria and are in grave danger of being caught between Turkey/Syria/Russia and Kurds as ISIS prioners are making a prison break,--- thanks to Trumpity Dumpity---. I sure hope nobody gets butchered in middleast ---including USA troops---.
Trump is withdrawing those forces now so I fail to see your point. Virtually everyone, myself included, does naturally sympathize with the Kurds. But their statehood is ultimately unsustainable anyways, and it would definitely not be in our best interests to go to war with Turkey, a crucial NATO ally, over the statehood of a regional minority group. Especially not a group whose state would be dominated by a communist party.
Now, I will admit that Trump has made one serious blunder here. After announcing he wouldn't stand in the Turks's way he STILL went and supported sanctions against the anatolian state. And yet, if the Turks end up leaving us anyway over that then it'll have been for nothing. We've made our bed with the Turks already so let's lie on it.
So Putin and Assad are now running the show in Syria even more than before. Wouldnt surprise me if Putin is running the Trumpity Dumpity show on this issue also.
And? The only way to prevent this was to have toppled Assad back in 2011, or in any year since then, by outright invading Syria. Trump wasn't willing to do this, and neither was Obama.
(Also, you want to talk about butchering innocent people? The Obama administration helped inspire the Arab Spring, and then sat on its hands for six years as hundreds of thousands of Syrians died in a war that Assad's going to win anyway. In September 2015 Russia entered the war. At this point Obama had more than one year to get America directly involved and reverse the situation, as at this point an Assad victory would've otherwise been guaranteed. But he did nothing, save arm and train the rebels just enough that they still wouldn't be able to win the war but at least it'd be prolonged, leading to countless more deaths. This program was not halted until Trump came along. Obama has 300,000+ Syrian deaths on his conscience, far more than anything Trump could even dream of.)
Alright, scratch one thing I said above.
Because our's is a volunteer force it may be used for moralistic purposes that do not directly benefit the United States...so long as whatever cause we threw their lives away for is able to prevail and so long as that cause is sufficiently worthy.
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@Greyparrot
Warren 2020!
Amen