&quot;Religious Freedom&quot; = Discrimination = Hate

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@Mopac

s sexual orientation evena protected class to begin with? In the context of a business being allowed to refuse service?
Not where I live. Not to my knowledge.

Well, if it isn't I think it should be as long as we have the civil rights act. It is not protected under the Civil Rights Act at the federal level as of this time.

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05.10.2019 10:33PM

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@Mopac

I asked whether you think a business should have the right to refuse service to blacks and/or the disabled because of the business owners' religious beliefs.

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05.10.2019 10:39PM

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@Snoopy

I think comparing sexual orientation to race is kind of asinine, but I am all for loving everyone.

I am concerned about churches being forced by law to bow to the lbgt agenda, because as I said earlier, the type of things that are being proposed at city hall where I live would demand churches to do things we definitely won't do.

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05.10.2019 10:43PM

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@3RU7AL

If you offer one set of services to one customer, you must offer those same or equivalent services to all paying customers.

He was, he was offering heterosexual wedding cakes to anyone who wanted to buy one.

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05.10.2019 10:47PM

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@Stronn

I thought it was obvious I said yes, and there would still be consequences.

But it is against the law anyway, so it doesn't matter. I'm not calling to change the law.

I wiuld be effected if a business were to discriminate on these things, and I think that is worth mentioning.

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05.10.2019 11:20PM

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@TheDredPriateRoberts

He was, he was offering heterosexual wedding cakes to anyone who wanted to buy one.

Heterosexuality is not an attribute that cakes possess.

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05.10.2019 11:28PM

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05.10.2019 11:28PM

I'm still trying to picture, A Christian bakery.

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05.10.2019 11:36PM

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@secularmerlin

I'm sure he meant heterosexual-themed.

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05.10.2019 11:49PM

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@3RU7AL

@Alec

Jesus would never encourage conversion therapy...that's horrendous @Alec

Our country is in such a sad place right now, @3RU7AL

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05.10.2019 11:53PM

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@Speedrace

The bible says that men who practice homosexuality will go to hell. Our country is in a scary place because communist leftists run our schools and much of the mainstream media. Facebook banned Paul Joseph Watson.

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05.10.2019 11:54PM

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@Alec

The Bible also says that those who complain will go to hell, along with liars, murderers, thieves, and people who spread strife

I fit more than one of those categories (not murderer tho lol) but I'm still going to heaven

You go to hell for unbelief, not sin

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05.11.2019 12:02AM

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@Speedrace

You go to hell for a lot of things. The bible says most of us will go to hell. It's why I'm not religious. I think God is a tyrant.

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05.11.2019 12:05AM

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@Alec

You go to hell for one thing: unbelief, not sin

And the Bible doesn't say most of us will go to hell, I believe it's actually a pretty large majority that will go to heaven (2/3+), but I'm not sure where it says that

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@Speedrace

Matthew 7:13-14 states, “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."(https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%207:13-14&version=NIV)

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disgusted

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05.11.2019 07:05AM

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@Snoopy

No just read

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05.11.2019 12:07PM

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@secularmerlin

lol they can identify any way they want, fine, wedding cakes for heterosexual weddings. :)

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05.11.2019 12:24PM

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@TheDredPriateRoberts

How does a cake for a heterosexual wedding differ from a cake for a homosexual wedding?

Ingredients?

Time in the oven?

Color of icing?

It seems like the two projects are similar enough that you could just make a cake for a heterosexual wedding and then sell it to someone having a homosexual wedding.

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05.11.2019 12:29PM

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@Speedrace

You go to hell for unbelief, not sin

How have you determined that this is the case?

And the Bible doesn't say most of us will go to hell, I believe it's actually a pretty large majority that will go to heaven (2/3+), but I'm not sure where it says that

If the bible gives any figures on this I'm unaware of it but even if it did how have you determined that the bible is an accurate source for determining it?

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05.11.2019 12:46PM

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@secularmerlin

intent and purpose.

It seems like the two projects are similar enough that you could just make a cake for a heterosexual wedding and then sell it to someone having a homosexual wedding.

they have the option to purchase one from the case, so yeah that's true in a way.

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@secularmerlin

How have you determined that this is the case?

I should clarify; everyone sins, and Jesus is here to basically stand in for you when you refuse him you basically say that you'll take the punishment that you deserve for sinning

If the bible gives any figures on this I'm unaware of it but even if it did how have you determined that the bible is an accurate source for determining it?

Because we're talking about Christianity...

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05.11.2019 01:07PM

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@TheDredPriateRoberts

If the cakes in the case are significantly different in complexity then it is also untrue in a more fundamental way. But let's assume that it is true for a moment. In that case and if the cakes in the case are what he is offering homosexuals then he has ALREADY baked several gay wedding cakes and I am unclear what difference one more or less would make moralistically or theologically. It rather invalidates the religious objection if that us true.

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05.11.2019 01:13PM

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@Speedrace

I should clarify; everyone sins, and Jesus is here to basically stand in for you when you refuse him you basically say that you'll take the punishment that you deserve for sinning

This is your claim. Do you have evidence for this claim?

Because we're talking about Christianity...

The bible is not in my experience a good source for determining any given christians beliefs and even if it was the mere fact that one specific person or even many people believe something is not evidence of the truth of the propisition.

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@secularmerlin

This is your claim. Do you have evidence for this claim?

John 3:18

The bible is not in my experience a good source for determining any given christians beliefs

That's your claim. Where's your proof for that claim?

the mere fact that one specific person or even many people believe something is not evidence of the truth of the propisition.

I never said it was

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@secularmerlin

You should not say they don't have the option to buy a custom cake, or that they are barred from purchasing complex cakes since that has never been proven.

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@Speedrace

This is your claim. Do you have evidence for this claim?
John 3:18

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

Ok you have replaced your claim with the bible's claim. Now what? Do you have any evidence for the bible's claims or even just this one biblical claim?

The bible is not in my experience a good source for determining any given christians beliefs
That's your claim. Where's your proof for that

Only that christians interpret the bible differently not just from denomination to denomination but from individual to individual. As an example am Amish person has very different ideas about what is acceptable in the eyes of the Yahweh (which is I believe one reason you see so few of them on the boards).

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@secularmerlin

Ok you have replaced yoir claim with the bible claim. Now what? Do you have any evidence for the bible claims or even just this one biblical claim?

That scripture is the evidence...

Only that christians interpret the bible differently not just from denomination to denomination but from individual to individual. As an example am Amish person has very different ideas about what is acceptable in the eyes of the Yahweh (which is I believe one reason you see so few of them on the boards).

But we're not talking about what Christians believe, we're talking about what the Bible says

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@Snoopy

You should not say they don't have the option to buy a custom cake, or that they are barred from purchasing complex cakes since that has never been proven.

When discussing the efficacy of legislation one must consider the worst case scenario.

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