Inheritance Cycle Mafia DP1

Author: ILikePie5

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AustinL0926
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@Cerulean
Evening, all. I haven't read this series, but I'll take some time to look it up in more detail later. It would definitely be worthwhile to see if we can at least speculate on what Mafia might have access to, role-wise.
Can you clarify what you mean by this? Because pretty much any discussion of mechanics is inevitably going to give mafia information that I don't think we should give. For example, if I say "[X] means that [A, B, or C] might be in the game for mafia", I'm basically spewing myself as not having any of A, B, or C as my role. Also, the potential pool of mafia roles is so large that any discussion isn't really going to bring any tangible benefit mechanically speaking - and by tangible I mean helping to better coordinate night actions, or discussion of results, etc.

Disclaimer that my philosophy (as stated in a fair few of my games) is that mafia not knowing town PRs is one of the few forms of mitigating the informational advantage that they already start with, so I'm generally opposed to mechanical discussion outside of strict results. 
AustinL0926
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Posts 16 and 17 are sharply towny by Casey. They had similar thoughts to me in regards to discussing roles and checking back Pie's past games to see how he might formulate a potential themesplit is pretty clearly indicative of genuine thought. First townlean.
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@Cerulean
Not sure what to make of Cerulean's speculation of scum potentially not having full info. It's an interesting idea and I'd be inclined to townread the depth of thought - it's a pretty complex connection to check a potential mafia character, check the character's info, and then extrapolate that to a complex mechanic. The thing that makes me hesitate is that it could be potentially a result of Cerulean actually being mafia and knowing about this mechanic, i.e. having more information than he should. I don't recall ever seeing this mechanic on DART, nor elsewhere. Cerulean, have you seen this mechanic before? What made you consider it in the first place?
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@Casey_Risk
Interesting theory; I'll keep that in mind. A question for the veterans here -- when was the last game that had no private mafia chat, if you can remember?
Haven't seen any in the past year or so I've been playing, nor do I remember any from archived games.

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@Cerulean
It might be worthwhile to say if our characters are on the "Important Characters" list here. I ask specifically because mine isn't. This might narrow some things down.
Sure, that seems like a good place to start. My character is on that list.

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@Cerulean

Actually, on second thought, considering this line from the OP:

As always, Mafia will be given the opportunity to ask if any two roles and if any two characters are in the game at any point in time, to which I will truthfully answer.
...I highly doubt that there's no scum chat. -CASEY

Oh, I did forget about that. Seems fairly conclusive unless we want to make assumptions about how that would be run with independent Mafia, then. - CERULEAN

Hypothetically, what would stop an independent mafia from simply asking Pie, and being informed if their partner had already used questions? It's an interesting point by Casey but I'm curious why it made you drop the idea in particular.
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@Earth
I like Casey so far. I'll echo Cerulean and my role and character fairly connect well. 
For mine, I can see the connection but it's also not quite my initial expectations for my character.

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Town read:

Casey (see above)

Town lean:

Cerulean (dependent on responses to questions, but I think I still like the depth of thought)
Luna (mainly for the willingness to put together a character list, it's a level of commitment that does not feel intuitive to do for scum)

Slight town:

Earth (like the energy)
WF (vibes, realistically it's hard to articulate a reason for even a slight town lean but I just feel that way on gut)

Null/0-posting:

Mharman 
ADOL
Wylted

Casey_Risk
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@AustinL0926
For mine, I can see the connection but it's also not quite my initial expectations for my character.
I'd say that the justification for my role makes a fair amount of sense based on the biography of my character that Pie provided. I'm not sure how useful this sort of discussion is, though. I think we've established that justifications don't seem to be very loose for this game, so what else is there to say? 
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Right, I have to go for a bit now. Hope to see some more activity when I come back later, it's been a long time since I've seen a D1 hit scum and hopefully this game breaks the streak.
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@AustinL0926
Hope to see some more activity when I come back later, it's been a long time since I've seen a D1 hit scum and hopefully this game breaks the streak.
That happened in Bo Burnham mafia, only a few games ago. Though I don't think you were part of that one. 
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@Casey_Risk
I'd say that the justification for my role makes a fair amount of sense based on the biography of my character that Pie provided. I'm not sure how useful this sort of discussion is, though. I think we've established that justifications don't seem to be very loose for this game, so what else is there to say? 
I like this form of breadcrumbing - the reason why is that it doesn't leak any information about one's role unnecessarily, but it also limits potential claims. Town players have no reason to be scared about needed to claim their true role (which has a good justification), but scum players, who might need to fakeclaim depending on the scumminess of their role, now have to either commit to a good fakeclaim (if they claimed they had a good justification) or endure some pressure for having a poor justification (which, as we've established, is slightly outside the norm of the game so far).

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@Casey_Risk
That happened in Bo Burnham mafia, only a few games ago. Though I don't think you were part of that one. 
Ah, got it. The last one I remember was Joebob getting CC'd by me in Presidential Elections because I showed up late to the game, but that hardly counts. I think the last time I remember scum getting caught behaviorally was Savant in Mahabharata? But yeah, in general D1s on this site don't seem to hit at a rate much above random chance.

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@AustinL0926
Town players have no reason to be scared about needed to claim their true role (which has a good justification), but scum players, who might need to fakeclaim depending on the scumminess of their role, now have to either commit to a good fakeclaim (if they claimed they had a good justification) or endure some pressure for having a poor justification (which, as we've established, is slightly outside the norm of the game so far).
Fair enough I suppose. 
Cerulean
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@AustinL0926
Hypothetically, what would stop an independent mafia from simply asking Pie, and being informed if their partner had already used questions? It's an interesting point by Casey but I'm curious why it made you drop the idea in particular.
It means you can't really coordinate on what roles/characters to ask about. Coming up with a fake claim very often tends to be a collaborative experience for the whole Mafia team, so giving them a guess & check mechanic like that while they're split up seems like a weird choice, design-wise. Not 100% totally out of the question, but I feel that it makes the scenario significantly less likely.

Cerulean
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@ADreamOfLiberty
@WyIted
Vaguely irritated at the existence of 2 0-posters almost a full Day in... Where are you two?

WyIted
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@Cerulean
I am here now. I honestly thought we would start Jan 2
WyIted
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@whiteflame

How have the holidays been for you? Also, what do you know of this series? I haven't even seen Eragon, that 2007 movie, so I barely have any familiarity with the series.
Know nothing of the series. Thought about getting some audiobooks to listen to while at work before it started but decided not to.
Mharman
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Reading and thinking
whiteflame
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@WyIted
Know nothing of the series. Thought about getting some audiobooks to listen to while at work before it started but decided not to.
Alright then, welcome to the game.

Unvote
whiteflame
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@Casey_Risk
That happened in Bo Burnham mafia, only a few games ago. Though I don't think you were part of that one. 
Yeah… not my best moment.
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Official Vote Count:

Earth (1/5) - Cerulean

Mharman
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Lunatic null. Cerulean feels off and I’m going to look into him more when I get the chance (I absolutely hate how his role speculation idea). Casey slight town (mostly for pointing out what Cerulean may have been doing). I like Whiteflame’s vibes, although I do note what he said to Casey earlier and I can see a connection between him and Cerulean.

I haven’t thought much about Austin and Wylted yet and I look them later before I look at Cerulean again.

I am making my way through an airport rn since my father, uncle, and I are going to New Orleans for the Sugar Bowl.

Mharman
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I like Whiteflame’s idea of asking if everyone has an important character. Mine is on the wiki list

I don’t notice Earth showed up. Null.

That’s all for now.
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*didn’t notice
whiteflame
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@Mharman
I like Whiteflame’s idea of asking if everyone has an important character. Mine is on the wiki list
That was Cerulean’s idea, not mine. 
Cerulean
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@Mharman
I absolutely hate how his role speculation idea
Why's that? If our roles are closely tied to our characters, then it stands to reason that the evil players also have roles that are closely tied to their characters. So if we can peg some likely characters, we might get a good idea of what sort of evil roles there are to deal with.

Is that what makes me feel "off" to you, or something else?

WyIted
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My role has a negative utility we might want to discuss a bit so I can be directed. 

I of course offer this so we can hopefully get some real conversation going
whiteflame
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@WyIted
My role has a negative utility we might want to discuss a bit so I can be directed. 
Alright, would you consider it an SOP claim? Saying it's negative utility and saying that you want to "be directed" gives me a general idea of what's going on, but it doesn't tell me whether you have a strong reason to claim now. If not, then I don't know what kind of direction you're looking for.

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@whiteflame
Alright, would you consider it an SOP claim?
No

Saying it's negative utility and saying that you want to "be directed" gives me a general idea of what's going on, but it doesn't tell me whether you have a strong reason to claim now. If not, then I don't know what kind of direction you're looking for.
I don't have a good reason to claim at all just wanted to see if we can get some discussion.