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@Mopac
You have already admitted that Hey Micky was excommunicated, which by definition made the church he led heretical. What history do you have that refutes that conclusion?
Orthodox Christianity Apologetics Q&A
Posts
Total:
219
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@Mopac
Sounds like a historical anomaly due translational errors.
So does 'ultimate reality'!
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@disgusted
There were 5 churches.
Rome was 1 of them.
Common sense time, who is the schismatic?
You are assuming the supremacy of the Roman Bishop, which was never accepted by the rest of the church. This is the defining characteristic of Roman Catholicism. That all authority is concentrated into the hands of the Bishop of Rome.
The Orthodox Church does not have 1 Bishop over the whole church, in fact, all bishops are considered equals, the main differences being administrative and logistical in nature.
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@keithprosser
That is because you want to believe in anything other than the truth.
Which is what we recognize as our God. You want it to be anything else because you can't reconcile what you see on the surface with what I am saying!
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@Mopac
Common sense time, who is the schismatic?
Who was excommunicated? Not the Catholics, the Orthodox.
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@disgusted
Rome does not represent the entire church. And really, both declared anathema against the other.
Roman Catholicism is a heresy. The Orthodox Church is faithful to Church Tradition.
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@Mopac
I sense dancing . Rome doesn't represent the entireeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee church.
This excommunicated stuff sounds a bit funny. Ya know what i mean ?
Talk us through it.
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@Deb-8-a-bull
As I said, excommunication is a way the church disciplines those who are in the church for being unrepentant in their sin. An example would be living with someone of the opposite sex and having intimate relations with them outside of marriage and refusing to accept that this is wrong. They would be excommunicated until they repent.
What does that mean? It means they are not allowed to take part in the eucharist. That is all that means.
Disgusted doesn't know what he is asking, he is just trying to stir up strife by arguing for something he doesn't even believe in or understand.
But I say Rome doesn't represent the wntire Church because there was a time they were Orthodox, and that is the context of that comment. They did not represent the entire church. Never have. They are no longer Orthodox, and have not been for a while. Since the schism they have only strayed further and further from the faith. As this is the case they don't represent the church at all.
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@Mopac
Well, because you are such a know-it-all, you won't learn anything.Isn't that how it always is?
That makes no sense... no, it's only how it is in this discussion. Something i've considered the other sides arguments many times, but have come to find them lacking. I've given you a chance too... and off of your answers so far, i'm still not convinced Christianity isn't just another fallible man-made religion.
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@Outplayz
You openly admit to placing your perversions as an idol before the truth and that you love your darkness.
You don't reject me, you reject God.
Giving me a chance has nothing to do with it.
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@EtrnlVw
Finally a reasonable assessment of the "JESUS" debacle.......
No DOUBT....100% of these idiotic CHURCH PARASITE VAMPIRE Organizations are out to assimilate weak minded humans into slavery and
servitude of their retarded DOGMA....JESUS is the ultimate TOOL...a SCAPEGOAT used by these parasites as a trigger word for their HYPNOSIS
Church/Bible/Doctrine PSYCHOSIS.....
Never do these Parasite JESUS vomiting Vampires ever discuss and promote health and wellness ....ALWAYS they VOMIT Bible Comic Book
verses and refer back to their brainwashed response of ....let us teach (infest) your brain with our disease and then surrender yourself as a "Born
Sinning Jackass" to serve and seek salvation for even existing ! ...while the Vampires of the Church control your mind and life...in their interest of
course...
You understand clearly the HOAX of this "JESUS" invented "God" idiocy....he was supposedly born through some illiterate VIRGIN JEWISH TRIBE
GIRL (Mary?) who the HELL is his DADDY ? ...regardless, then without any information of this JESUS youth....fast forward to his early 30's where
he is the ultimate scapegoat for the JEWS....as he proclaims himself to be their MESSIAH ! like what is with these idiotic GODS who create everything to not just STOP the WORLD and set the record straight to all of HUMANITY....(they created this crap...what's with this VIRGIN BIRTH
FARCE ?) it's all so absurd...truly the stuff of children's Comic Books...
It'd amazing that HUMANS are so easily HYPNOTIZED and DUMBED DOWN to accept this idiotic knockoff story that many other human cultures
have also......like GILGAMESH ...long before this Jesus FARCE shows up....
JESUS is like JIM BAKKER and BENNY HINN without the GREED ! he was some preacher of good will...and ended up nailed to a cross by ROME !
Then ROME took the lead in converting this jewish boy into some kind of God garbage along with a new Comic Book Testament ! over time many
who saw the Roman Church for what it IS (a concentration camp for power)...fabricated new Church spins...it's like early Rock and Roll music
initially rejected then accepted and evolved to its own category....
JESUS...the boy toy GOD invention of the Roman Catholic Concentration Camp Church is a TOOL for assimilation...this ORTHO DIARRHEA TRIBE
offered by MOPAC only validates the HYPNOSIS PSYCHOSIS...brainwashed to the point of a zombie...everything revolves around this CHURCH
DOGMA CRAP stuffed between his/her ears....sad...a former open minded human converted into a mindless ORTHO ROBO CHURCH clown....
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@WisdomofAges
Once again, I must ask you... do you ever say anything that isn't just mindless rhetoric?
Better yet, do you have a question about Orthodoxy?
Of course you don't. The entire purpose of you being here is to be a lousy rhetorist.
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@Mopac
THE TRUTH MATTERS...and the TRUTH is that all these Parasite vampire Christian Churches are out to HYPNOTIZE and enslave weak minded humans into their idiotic CULTS....
No HUMAN ever needs some Church/Bible/Dogma VOMIT flowing between their ears to live well and THRIVE.....
There is no doubt that if this "JESUS" boy toy God invention of ROME ever showed up again ? HE WOULD SPIT ON the VATICAN and reduce
it to ashes for the CRIMES and ATROCITIES these Parasite Vampires cloaked in Halloween Glory Gowns have commited in his name against humanity...then he would do the same to all these fake CHRISTIAN PARASITES who invented so many other Church versions in his name he
would lose count and just reduce them to ashes as well along with all the phony CHRISTIANS that abuse him and his name for self gain....= 100%
Then he would most likely pay the JEWS a visit...to remind them he is the MESSIAH .....of course they will deny it and want him crucified again !
Once the JEWS realize their "GOD" is also a HOAX they will do the MASADA thing and commit suicide ! then this Jesus ? will pay a visit to the
other "GOD" invented hoax...ALLAH..the Arab version of him or his DADDY (who is JESUS DADDY ?) no matter JESUS will see these Muslim
ISLAM parasite VAMPIRES as nothing more than some idiotic stagecraft by more GOD playing clowns in Halloween Glory Gowns....and reduce all
of the Muslims to ASHES !
NOW the TRUTH ! as JESUS has rid EARTH of the 4 billion Parasite JEW-JESUS-ALLAH Vampires...he will inform the remainder of HUMANITY
that he is part of a HIGHLY ADVANCED space faring species that visited EARTH to tap natural resources...and that the modern HUMAN LIFE FORM
was part of a GENETIC MODIFICATION PROJECT...to use humans for mining and energy producing structures i.e PYRAMIDS.....and stargates for
transport....he took the form of a human that was totally simplified....to clam the humans down...only select humans were given higher cognitive
abilities....to rule....the human genetic engineers knew there would be a rift among the humans...with few controlling many....and using force to do so
This could only lead to EXTERMINATION of the species....as EARTH is still a valuable biosphere for experimentation...the humans have gotten out
of hand...as technology improves more of them are becoming hopelessly OBSOLETE...unable to catch up or matriculate into the new frontier of
Artificial Intelligence...most of humanity must be exterminated...there are not enough resources to sustain 10 billion ++ most of which are MENTALLY
INCOMPETENT....the point of these RELIGIONS and GODS was for CONTROL....now that the youth are waking up to the HOAX the older generations are OBSOLETE and a drain on resources.....G O D = Genius Of Deception...with the deception revealed CHAOS will break out and WAR
will leave EARTH devastated...JESUS or a like ENTITY of an advanced species will facilitate the extermination of 2/3 of humanity ++......
First to go are all the Religious parasites....they are hypnotized and useless going forward...they are expendable...
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@WisdomofAges
Another atheist who thinks that theists are too stupid to think for themselves. And a threat.
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@Polytheist-Witch
Not ATHEIST...no such HUMAN exists...the word was invented by religious PSYCHOPATHS to dehumanize and degrade open minded free thinkers
who easily see through the Parasite Vampire Church/Temple/ psychopath agenda for power and control of the masses....
No human is a LABEL...those who attach Christian-Jew-Muslim +++ are HYPNOTIZED and BRAINWASHED to do so....hey have been programmed
to respond this way from the 24/7 Bible/Koran Church/Mosque/Temple Bible/Koran VOMIT flowing in their supersaturated neural network...these
former humans are nothing more than HYPNOTIZED ZOMBIE slave drones of the Religious CULT they are attached to....
The greatest threat to these parasite Vampire Cults and their Zombie sheeple drone slaves is the open minded FREE THINKING HUMAN....who easily recognizes the HYPNOSIS "GOD" PSYCHOSIS ...........the BRAINWASHED FOOLS can only argue and create CONFLICT toward all who do NOT fall
for their stagecraft
The "ATHEIST" label allows the Parasite Vampires to pass blame and condemnation to all who do not accept their UTTER...... BS.......
Only the Christian and Muslim Parasites use this word as an excuse...yet it is they who have deliberately caused more DEATH and DESTRUCTION
using their "JESUS" and "ALLAH" invented GOD garbage to ravage humanity...including WAR-RAPE-CHILD MOLESTATION-BURNINGS-HANGING-
TORTURE-MENTAL PSYCHOSIS...and most of all SLAVERY to serve these VAMPIRE CULTS....
The Ancient Philosophers of Sumeria-Egypt-Greek-Rome-Persian +++ knew well the POWER PLAY behind the "GOD" hoax inventions....there are no CHURCHES-TEMPLES-MOSQUES built for these wise intellectuals...only for totally idiotic simpleton psychopath "GODS" what a JOKE....
Go now Christian-Jew-Muslim to your GOD ! each of you have MURDERED and DESTROYED in their names...YOU are all GUILTY of MURDER and ATROCITIES against humanity....and EARTH...get off this planet....there are billions-trillions of other worlds...go to your GOD....
Humans will easily THRIVE without YOUR GOD/Bible/Koran/Church/Mosque/Temple GARBAGE....get off this amazing planet...and rot with your GODS
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@WisdomofAges
If you have a question about Orthodoxy, I will happily answer to the best of my ability.
Please, one question at a time.
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@WisdomofAges
Who are you talking to moron
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@Mopac
It's sad you believe in something where it teaches not to love yourself. Yet another man-made element of your faith. The powerful teaching the weak they need them. Yea... okay. Stay on your knees for all i care.You openly admit to placing your perversions as an idol before the truth and that you love your darkness.
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@Outplayz
You believe you are something you are not. Your false identity reduces you to the level of a dog. I am telling you that this isn't who you really are, and you are better than that.
Instead of being curious, you dismiss it and double down on your false sense of identity. Well, funny how I tell you that you are better than what you think and you are, and you take that as not loving yourself.
No, you don't really understand. And you won't, because younare dismissive.
Yet, here I am, ready to answer questions. It would be easier if you didn't presume to know anything.
And I will answer to the best of my ability.
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@Mopac
Yet, here I am, ready to answer questions. It would be easier if you didn't presume to know anything.
I have no other questions other some additional that i'm sure you can't answer the same as the other questions. Beyond that i don't care, i really don't have questions. I mean, there is a lot i probably agree with. There is morals and stories that teach you about life. I have no problem there, so i have no questions. But, to take Christianity serious as a belief that can explain my afterlife, i don't buy it one bit. It isn't necessary, nor is it the final answer. To learn from it, to read it's history, etc. i have no problem there... so i have no questions there. I asked you my questions, and you can't answer them. Those are the questions that will qualify Christianity as a necessary belief for me.
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@Outplayz
Every story in the bible is allegorical.
But it would be wrong of me to say they don't also account real events. It is impossible to answer that question, and it isn't really even that important.
And I am telling you truthfully that nitpicking the bible is the wrong path of questioning to take, because there is an innate presumption about the bible in these questionings.
That is why I told you it is better to ask instead what the bible is used for.
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@Mopac
I'm okay with that way of looking at it. But that isn't how most Christian's believe. Noah's ark happened. That's what i am use to hearing. But if Orthodoxy believes these stories are allegorical and not literal... i can respect that. But then, we fall back to my other questions. And, additional stuff like the POE, how a creator guy is illogical over a pantheistic god, etc. Or, if i am sticking to the Bible... that i "have to believe in Christianity" to be saved. Actually, i'll ask that question... Do i have to say i'm Christian in order to be saved? Basically, will agnostics not be saved?Every story in the bible is allegorical.
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@Mopac
The bible is just a collection of lies, I agree
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@Outplayz
I didn't say just allegorical.
I am saying there is an allegorical meaning to every story.
And every book of the bible is different. Some books are accounts of history.
What can I say?
The Church has never believed that the books of the bible were dictated by God. They are written by people who were inspired by God. There is a difference. And what makes these writings scripture is that we use them.
The Old Testament we use is what was in the septuigate. We use that because it was the scripture that the earliest Christians use. The New Testament was compiled over 300 years after Jesus. The writings were there, but because of certain heresies trying to pass off writings as being written by the church that really weren't, a canon of scripture had to be recognized. The church agreed that what is in the New Testament is legit.
However, the church has never stopped writing, and we have plenty of writings from monastics and saints that make up our Church Tradition. And so we honor Church Tradition while these others you call Christians do not. Protestants do not remember anything, they are churches with amnesia. The Roman Catholics are united by submission to The Pope, who has greater authority yhan Church Tradition.
And what can be learned from Church Tradition?
The faith is fundamentally Truth worship, and the Christian discipline has to do with purifying the heart so that one can be more sincere in their love of The Truth and Charitable in their interactions toward their fellow man.
The religion is Sincere faith and charity. And this is true religion.
You ask "Do I have to say that I am a Christian in order to be saved?"
My answer is, saying you are a Christian will not get you saved.
But I will also say this, if you are anti-Christian, you are warring against The Truth, and this is how the foolishness of God is greater than the wisdom of men. Those who stand against Christianity don't know what it is they are really condemning. This is because they don't have charity. They get stuck in the external things and never actually get to what the faith is about. For that reason, a lack of charity, they make fools of themselves by mocking what they don't understand.
And that is why it is an easy thing for me to be so bold and sure of what I proclaim, with utmost confidence. I know my God. The enemies of God do not know my God. They can't, and the reasons why are prophesied of in scripture.
And the surest proof of this is that compared to most, I speak very plainly about the mysteries, and people still fight God. This validates why it is Christianity teaches through allegory and parable. Why it takes the form that it does, and why it looks so strange to outsiders.
And The Orthodox Church is the true church. We know what we believe, we hold the mysteries in reverence, and The Spirit of Truth is with our church. It is the very church founded by Jesus and the apostles, and the gates of hell will not overcome it.
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@Mopac
I didn't say just allegorical
Well, at that point... i just don't believe the impossible stories happened. I just don't.
But I will also say this, if you are anti-Christian, you are warring against The Truth
I would say most are warring against Christian"s" and less so Christianity. When it comes to the religion itself, i don't hate it or love it. I just don't think it's a valid belief to have. But there is no ill will towards it per se... it's more towards humans that have twisted it for their own gains. Those are the people i hate/warring against. I can read the entire Bible by myself and find very little to no reason to dislike it. So, in my interpretation of the Bible i have no ill will towards it and actually respect it... I personally think that is enough. Once a god demands for more... i find said god to be a petty god not worth any respect... but then again, under my interpretation, that isn't how god is... that god is a man-made god that needs people to kneel.
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@Outplayz
The God we believe in is The Truth.
And so you don't really know our God, because you treat it as a created thing. We are not pagans. Pagans worship created things.
And the point of all the exterior manifestations of our religion is to point people to The Truth and to have true love towards it.
The letter kills, but the spirit brings life. You see the letter, but don't see the spirit.
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@Outplayz
@Tradesecret
From The Confession of Dositheus, which was a synod of the Church called together as a response to the reformation in the west, particularly Calvinism.
I would like to point out that while this doctrine refers to The Church as being "The Catholic Church", this is not refering to Roman Catholicism, which is a heresy, but The Orthodox Church.
The proper name of the church is really The Orthodox Catholic Church. Because of Rome and its influence in the west, refering to the church as The Catholic Church becomes confusing. As should be evident from this topic, many here can not tell the difference.
"We believe the Divine and Sacred Scriptures to be God-taught; and, therefore, we ought to believe the same without doubting; yet not otherwise than as the Catholic Church has interpreted and delivered the same. For every foul heresy accepts the Divine Scriptures, but perversely interprets the same, using metaphors, and homonymies, and sophistries of man’s wisdom, confounding what ought to be distinguished, and trifling with what ought not to be trifled with. For if [we were to accept Scriptures] otherwise, each man holding every day a different sense concerning them, the Catholic Church would not by the grace of Christ continue to be the Church until this day, holding the same doctrine of faith, and always identically and steadfastly believing. But rather she would be torn into innumerable parties, and subject to heresies. Neither would the Church be holy, the pillar and ground of the truth, {1 Timothy 3:15} without spot or wrinkle; {Ephesians 5:27} but would be the Church of the malignant {Psalm 25:5} as it is obvious the church of the heretics undoubtedly is, and especially that of Calvin, who are not ashamed to learn from the Church, and then to wickedly repudiate her.
Wherefore, the witness also of the Catholic Church is, we believe, not of inferior authority to that of the Divine Scriptures. For one and the same Holy Spirit being the author of both, it is quite the same to be taught by the Scriptures and by the Catholic Church. Moreover, when any man speaks from himself he is liable to err, and to deceive, and be deceived; but the Catholic Church, as never having spoken, or speaking from herself, but from the Spirit of God — who being her teacher, she is ever unfailingly rich — it is impossible for her to in any wise err, or to at all deceive, or be deceived; but like the Divine Scriptures, is infallible, and has perpetual authority."
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@Mopac
And so you don't really know our God, because you treat it as a created thing. We are not pagans. Pagans worship created things.
Metaphysically... i favor a pantheistic type of platform. I've told you that. That's not a created platform. I believe everything is what you call "God." An infinite consciousness. At least spiritually... i think that platform is most logical. Your platform is not the only one there is. I just don't see why it's more logical than what i've searched and found to be more probable.
Edit: I should add... all the questions i've asked you that you have had trouble with answering... this platform answers.
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@Outplayz
Orthodox Spirituality has a great deal more to do with ridding oneselves of vices than believing particular things. The problem with vices is that they make us blind to what would normally be obvious. They have a real profound effect on discernment. Besides that, as the word "vice" implies, they hold us down. We become slaves to our vices, and even come to not see them as vices but part of who we are.
If you build an entire tree of logic off of faulty premises, what you are going to come up with are in fact logical conclusions. They are all, however, wrong, being built off of faulty premises.
Likewise, it is inportant to take into account the tool you are using to measure. Are you going to measure with a smudged up lense?
So Orthodox Spirituality is an alctive thing. It isn't a clever philosophy that seems satisfying to the intellect but wholly useless in other respects.
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@Mopac
I'm sorry but all this sounds like don't question, don't think, just blindly follow. That's not an attractive platform and very cult like. A sign of cult like behavior is domination and monopoly of truth.So Orthodox Spirituality is an alctive thing. It isn't a clever philosophy that seems satisfying to the intellect but wholly useless in other respects.