34 Felony Counts Guilty

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Swagnarok
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Meaningful steps have been taken to combat racial biases on modern juries. For example, black people serve as jurors and any one of them can veto an obviously unjust conviction driven by racial animosity and prejudice. Furthermore your average black man is nowhere remotely near as hated as Donald Trump.

Few steps were taken to ensure the jury which tried Trump would be balanced, which is the closest we can get to unbiased.
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@Swagnarok
Few steps were taken to ensure the jury which tried Trump would be balanced, which is the closest we can get to unbiased.
Trump gets blamed for everything he does! The jury system is completely unreliable. Except when it comes to impeachment and the jury is made up of elected Senators who have a pledged allegiance to their party over the country or the law and their own political survival is predicated on supporting the leader of the party. So when Trump was not convicted by Congress in his two impeachments , that was totally balanced and unbiased, right?

Double_R
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@Swagnarok
To call him an extremely polarizing figure would be underselling it; people who wouldn't vote for him often have such viscerally negative feelings about the man that they'll readily believe any story accusing him of misconduct.
That is why we have a jury selection process to weed out those people.

Besides, that argument cuts both ways. Just as there are people who would disregard any rational argument to convict him, there are those who would do the same to acquit him. So even if there was not a fair juror on the bench, the statistical odds were still in Trump’s favor.

But seriously, you really need to set that aside. You focus on a jury whom you know absolutely nothing about because you have no argument defending his conduct. If the fault here lies on anyone that’s not Trump it would be his attorneys. They gave the jury absolutely nothing to work with. The only question is why. I say it’s because they themselves had nothing to work with, reality is a bitch. But if the facts were on Trumps side you really need to wrestle with why they were so incompetent to point it out.
IwantRooseveltagain
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@Double_R
Well reality has a well known liberal bias
ADreamOfLiberty
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It's funny to see people trying to debate double R when he has spent months losing every attempt to debate every case involving Trump. You think now that his fake jury and his fake fascist judge have given him a stamp he's going to suddenly see the light?
Double_R
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@sadolite
Trump will gain more power, support  and popularity from this.
Yeah, we know. Because you know, party of law and order right?
ILikePie5
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@ADreamOfLiberty
It's funny to see people trying to debate double R when he has spent months losing every attempt to debate every case involving Trump. You think now that his fake jury and his fake fascist judge have given him a stamp he's going to suddenly see the light?
Lol challenge him to a debate. Easiest win of my life
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@Double_R
Trump will gain more power, support  and popularity from this.
Yeah, we know. Because you know, party of law and order right?
Almost, because Americans like law and order. Prepare your surprised pikachu face.
TheUnderdog
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@Double_R
Yeah, we know. Because you know, party of law and order right?
The GOP is not consistently the party of law and order.  When republicans say, "Law and Order", they are bandwagoning.
Double_R
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@ADreamOfLiberty
It's funny to see people trying to debate double R when he has spent months losing every attempt to debate every case involving Trump.
Says the guy who thinks Biden discovering that he had classified documents and then returning them without being asked is the same thing as Trump being asked for the documents back, lying about not having them, ordering them moved to stop the FBI from finding them, then ordering the evidence of there whereabouts destroyed.

You don’t get a say on who “lost” the debate.
Greyparrot
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Did you see "campaign finance" in any of the charges?
Best.Korea
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@ADreamOfLiberty
his fake jury and his fake fascist judge
Yeah, everything is fake except Trump.

Who wears the diaper that cannot be seen?
Donald Trump! Donald Trump!
To grab by the pussy, who feels the need?
Donald Trump! Donald Trump!
Who can never be found guilty of any deed?
Donald Trump! Donald Trump!
Who fucked Stormy and spilled his seed?
Donald Trump! Donald Trump!
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Double_R
You don’t get a say on who “lost” the debate.
Your endless, repeated, and never corrected fallacies are an objective fact whether or not I point them out or not. I have pointed them out, that is my say; and I have nothing to retract on that front.
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Greyparrot
Did you see "campaign finance" in any of the charges?
No, and after the 10th layer of absurdity it's not even that interesting to pick it apart. I've already given more than enough attention on this site to these incoherent fantasies before this point.

You ever tried to argue with a flat earther? It gets boring very quickly.
Best.Korea
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"Not only is Trump the first former president to be found guilty of a felony, he’s also the first major-party presidential nominee to be convicted of a crime in the midst of a campaign for the White House. And if he defeats President Joe Biden in November, he will be the first sitting president in history to be a convicted felon."

Lol
Greyparrot
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@Best.Korea
Plot twist: Biden pardons Trump and easily wins reelection.
Swagnarok
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That is why we have a jury selection process to weed out those people.
That's impossible when your average person consumes media which encourages them to think this way.

Besides, that argument cuts both ways. Just as there are people who would disregard any rational argument to convict him, there are those who would do the same to acquit him.
I'll admit that this is true.

So even if there was not a fair juror on the bench, the statistical odds were still in Trump’s favor.
I doubt this. Biden won NYC with 76% of the vote in 2020, compared to 79% for Hillary Clinton in 2016. This would suggest Trump could get 3 favorable (starting out with some degree of pro-Trump bias) jurors if selected at random, assuming that he simply didn't, as small samples deviate from strict statistical likelihoods more readily.

However, this doesn't tell the whole story. Juries strive for diversity. Not political diversity, but diversity of physical characteristics and perhaps religion. This matters; almost 90% of black voters, 65% of Latino voters, 61% of "Asian" voters, and almost 60% of female voters voted for Biden in 2020. As did 69% of "other" religious affiliation and 65% of "no religious affiliation" voters. If, on the jury, diversity required white jurors, they could be white women. Or if diversity required male jurors, they could be black men. And this is assuming there was no push for, say, queer jurors in Trump's trial.
In any case it's easy to see how diversity targets can overpower the result you'd get from sheer random sampling. And of course, while Trump's attorneys could object to a juror with anti-Trump social media posts, they wouldn't dare object to a jury being too diverse. The optics would be unacceptable, even though someone with the most rudimentary knowledge of statistics could tell you this is in fact relevant to establishing the biases of the final jury tasked with conducting an inescapably political trial of an inescapably political figure.

Finally, if you had, say, one or two pro-Trump jurors but they weren't confident about their decision, they could be pressured by the remaining 10 or 11 to not go against the group and throw a wrench in the trial.

But seriously, you really need to set that aside. You focus on a jury whom you know absolutely nothing about because you have no argument defending his conduct. 
Fair, I suppose. Typing in "Trump jury" gave me nothing on who those people are. But that lack of info empowers me to question its reliability just as much as it does you to assume its reliability. Any speculation is fair speculation in a zero-information game, especially when there were such incredibly powerful incentives to fix the trial to whatever extent possible.

the fault here lies on anyone that’s not Trump it would be his attorneys. They gave the jury absolutely nothing to work with.

This article suggests you may be right.
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Best.Korea

Now go hunt slugs for your chickens, it would be more productive.
Best.Korea
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Nothing new
Yeah, we already knew Trump was corrupt.

Now go hunt slugs for your chickens, it would be more productive.
Well, I am pretty, sure that your brain somehow thinks that thats a good response to what I wrote.
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Swagnarok
the fault here lies on anyone that’s not Trump it would be his attorneys. They gave the jury absolutely nothing to work with.

This article suggests you may be right.
rofl, and if Chamberlain had been a bit more convincing Hitler wouldn't have attacked Poland!

Any person who is willing to say "legal expenses" is a substantially false description of a payment to a lawyer to execute a legal agreement is so far outside the bounds of reason as to be surely unreachable by any argument.
Swagnarok
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Now I'm starting to feel like I've had this entire conversation before. Not an unfamiliar feeling, but still.
IwantRooseveltagain
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@sadolite
Trump will gain more power, support  and popularity from this.  New  York is going to suffer untold financial loss in the business sector at every level. It will be epic. This isn't about Trump, this is about anyone who dares challenge the uniparty status quo. I'm gonna sit back make some popcorn
That’s just what Marjorie Taylor Green would say. 

Greyparrot
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Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto, who planned the attack on Pearl Harbor would reportedly write in his diary, “I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve.”
sadolite
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Ya, and about 150 million other people that live in the country.
sadolite
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@Double_R
There is only one party, the uniparty. 
Double_R
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@Swagnarok
Typing in "Trump jury" gave me nothing on who those people are. But that lack of info empowers me to question its reliability 
No, it doesn’t. The reason we know nothing of these jurors is because the judge went to great lengths to protect their identities. This was necessary because the defendant has demonstrated at every opportunity he’s ever had that he will publicly attack anyone he perceives as being against him and will do absolutely nothing to dissuade those he inspires from threatening the lives of everyone involved.

There’s nothing to glean from that, so all we do have is the credibility of the process itself which has been revered around the world for centuries. This is why Trump and his minions are working so hard to tell you the system itself has gone to hell - because they have no arguments so instead of accepting the results they would rather burn the country down. This is what makes Trump so dangerous.

Any speculation is fair speculation in a zero-information game
But you’re doing more than speculation. You’re arguing that the jury was unfair to Trump for political reasons. That requires evidence, not speculation.
Double_R
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@ILikePie5
Lol challenge him to a debate. Easiest win of my life
If I was such an easy opponent that you thought you could beat again you wouldn’t be here 3 years later still bragging about it.
Double_R
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Any person who is willing to say "legal expenses" is a substantially false description of a payment to a lawyer to execute a legal agreement is so far outside the bounds of reason as to be surely unreachable by any argument.
130k to a porn star to keep her quiet is not a legal expense. Everyone knows that.
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Double_R
Any person who is willing to say "legal expenses" is a substantially false description of a payment to a lawyer to execute a legal agreement is so far outside the bounds of reason as to be surely unreachable by any argument.
130k to a porn star to keep her quiet is not a legal expense. Everyone knows that.


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@ADreamOfLiberty

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