Was humanity created flawed?

Author: Tradesecret

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#31
Stephen
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@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
where instead of Miss Tradesecret making a complete Bible Fool of herself within this forum, she is to to do the following: “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation." (Mark 16:15)

Yes, well. I have the bible dunce Tradesecret on record telling me that the Great Commission   Matthew 28:16-20 was not  intended for him. And that it was "not his job".
I know, you could make it up. 

Jesus commanded them:  "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,  and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
#32
IlDiavolo
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If you read the bible with the correct translation and no useless interpretation at all, you wouldn't make such stupid claims.

#33
Stephen
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@IlDiavolo
If you read the bible with the correct translation and no useless interpretation at all, you wouldn't make such stupid claims.


I have always maintained that the word god is a relatively new word in the scheme of things. I haven't watched the video yet but I did read all the opening synopsis.

I notice in your link Mauro Biglino (who I hadn't heard of until now) speaks of the Mesopotamian as an  " ancient alien civilization called Elohim?"  When we read anything pertaining to the  Mesopotamia epics they only ever use the word - lord - for the Annunnaki hierarchy:  Lord Enki, Lord Enlil etc. Annunnaki are referred to in the OT. They were no doubt superior beings as far as I and many authors understand..

Ancient alien civilization theory is not new by any means. I remember my first reading of  Chariots of the Gods Erich Von Daniken in the 70's . I have read all his work since. Then there is The Genius of The Few-The Story of Those Who Founded the Garden in Eden & The shining Ones by Christian And Barbara Joy OBrien both excellent and well research books. And of course Zecharia Sitchin and his massive work on the Earth Chronicles which I have found to be absolute fascinating reading . Yet it has to be recognised that all these authors make clear refences to the OT as pointers that certainly do appear to support their theories. For instance one question posed in the synopsis is:

Where Adam and Eve really created by the Elohim or just put in the Garden of Eden from outside the world?

I believe the bible answers this question . When the bible is read closely it  states quite clearly:  god/Annunnaki created them and only then did they  place them in the garden. Clearly indicating that they were created somewhere else before being placed in the garden.


I do like this theory . At least it does paint a more believable account of creation of humans that the one  Christianity  has been ramming down our throats since childhood. But in all fairness to the early Christians they didn't have the research, archaeology, or technology that is available to us today ie the Sumerian cuneiform tablets of which there are hundreds of thousands, the Rosetta Stone translation, the dead sea scrolls and many more ancient writing from around the world.
 Lets no ever forget, when one civilisation met another and they asked one another where they got "the idea",  they all without exception point skyward.

You should start your thread on the subject. It will more interesting and entertaining than the shite the Pastors and Priests are still pumping out and  force feeding our children, to this day.



#34
IlDiavolo
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@Stephen
I notice in your link Mauro Biglino (who I hadn't heard of until now) speaks of the Mesopotamian as an " ancient alien civilization called Elohim?" When we read anything pertaining to the Mesopotamia epics they only ever use the word - lord - for the Annunnaki hierarchy: Lord Enki, Lord Enlil etc. Annunnaki are referred to in the OT. They were no doubt superior beings as far as I and many authors understand..

Biglino says that in the bible, using the correct translation, the other "gods" were referred as Elohim too, it's just the name in hebrew. So, at that time each civilization had their own "elohim", meaning that there were several "gods".
Where Adam and Eve really created by the Elohim or just put in the Garden of Eden from outside the world?
You have to listen to Biglino, it's fascinating what he understands from the bible if it's read with the correct translation and without interpretations. He has his own YouTube channel.

Adam and Eve are hybrids of apes and those aliens. This story of Eve created by God taking a rib from Adam is a reference of the DNA manipulation. Also, from an evolutionary point of view, the human being is not a species adapted to any environment in the earth, so this clearly indicates that the human being was domesticated.

You should start your thread on the subject. It will more interesting and entertaining than the shite the Pastors and Priests are still pumping out and force feeding our children, to this day.
I sure will. There is a lot of controversy, though, so I don't know if people here will like it.

You said these ancient "lords" were superior. They indeed are, and it's not just in technology but also in mental abilities. If you check on the testimonies of contactees, there is a lot of psychic experiences like telepathy and precognition, which are coincidentally present in the biblical stories. I dont know if the people here are ready for that kind of discussion, they are so fucking scheptical. Lol. 
#35
Stephen
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@IlDiavolo
You should start your thread on the subject. It will more interesting and entertaining than the shite the Pastors and Priests are still pumping out and force feeding our children, to this day.
I sure will. There is a lot of controversy, though, so I don't know if people here will like it.

It matters not what other "other people think". This is a religion forum and not a religious forum; as much as many here seem to believe it is and want to use it as a pulpit and go challenged.
These boards are  open to anyone with an alternative opinion, idea or theory concerning creation/ the scriptures.  You obviously have to be prepared for push back and understand your subject yourself. 
You are on a reasonably good footing as it stands because all Christians have is faith, which they believe trumps every piece  of science man has come to know. Arrogant haughty pricks does cover it.


You said these ancient "lords" were superior.

Yes, as far as I understand the few of the many authors I mention above. For which they do submit some very believable & convincing evidence. 

I wouldn't go with the "apes" theory. And have never heard of it to be honest apart from Darwin. Indeed Darwin was a Christian but himself admitted there was a "missing link" that he couldn't explain.
It was more likely Neanderthal / Cro-Magnon.

I have said many times on this forum that if we were to super impose many of todays sciences over some of the events in the bible that we may well come to a clearer understand of what those ancients were trying to convey.    The creation of Eve is a good example of 21st century genetic engineering.
Read the episode yourself but now with your 21st century mind :
Genesis 2:21-23
So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, [anesthetised] and he slept; then He took one of his ribs [dna/life essence] and closed up the flesh [stitched him up] at that place. The Lord God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man.




They indeed are, and it's not just in technology but also in mental abilities.
Well it has to be admitted that it is still theory as convincing and believable as it is,  as in all the pieces appear to fit -  and certainly makes more sense than that  of Christians that believe three day old dead rotten stinking corpses  came back to life - for which there is absolutely no evidence at all.


I dont know if the people here are ready for that kind of discussion, they are so fucking scheptical. Lol. 

Don't  make the mistake of underestimating the members on these boards/people you have never met. That is a grave mistake that many haughty Christians always make only to fall flat on their face, or put on their arses with facts..... and start crying every time you embarrass them by exposing the empty skull bones they have.

There are also  some very clever people on this forum that actually do have open minds that can think for themselves.

You start your thread, IlDiavolo and don't concern yourself with what others may think or throw at you. Just be advised to take not of what I have boldened and underlined above.

This subject needs a thread of its own imo. You cannot do the subject any justice by posting information scattered over many threads in drips.



#36
zedvictor4
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@IlDiavolo
The problem I have with special ancient people, is where are they?

Now, I can certainly posit my own answers to this question.

But it still seems illogical that they are not here.
#37
Stephen
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@zedvictor4
The problem I have with special ancient people, is where are they?

They left "like migrating birds",  after a major catastrophe. According to the ancients. Vic.
#38
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@Stephen
According to which ancients?

It seems illogical not to stay and colonise and dominate.

I base this upon Zed's Law of Universal sameness.

Though based upon Zed's Law of Universal sameness,

They wouldn't have turned up in the first place.
#39
Stephen
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@IlDiavolo
@zedvictor4
According to which ancients?

 The Mesopotamian Babylonians.

But I would rather wait for IlDiavolo's thread and his opinions and theories on the subject, as I explained to him above:


This subject needs a thread of its own imo. You cannot do the subject any justice by posting information scattered over many threads in drips. #35



#40
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@Stephen
I await IlDiavolo.

I imagine that they are preparing a thesis, as we speak.
#41
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@zedvictor4
I imagine that they are preparing a thesis, as we speak.

Would be nice to think so.

What's the weather doing in Wales , Vic? 

Its freezing, cloudy & damp , here my mate.

#42
IlDiavolo
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@zedvictor4
I imagine that they are preparing a thesis, as we speak.
This is also a problem, a long thread is not appealing in my opinion.

I didn't even read all the OP of this thread. Lol. 

#43
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@IlDiavolo
Yep, I tend to agree with you.

I much prefer more of a conversational forum.


When presented well, a lot can be said in a few words.
#44
zedvictor4
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@Stephen
Just cold, cloudy and damp here.

Can induce gloominess.

Just watched Bill Bailey in sunny Western Australia, thinking that it would heighten my mood. But for some reason it had the opposite effect.

Perhaps I'll try some vitamin D.

Or get one of those lamps.
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#45
Tradesecret
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@IlDiavolo
I imagine that they are preparing a thesis, as we speak.
This is also a problem, a long thread is not appealing in my opinion. 

I didn't even read all the OP of this thread. Lol. 

I guess you missed out then.  

Ok. 
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#46
Tradesecret
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@zedvictor4
Yep, I tend to agree with you.

I much prefer more of a conversational forum.


When presented well, a lot can be said in a few words.

True, but just because some present a few words, doesn't mean that it is said well.  


#47
Stephen
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@IlDiavolo
I imagine that they are preparing a thesis, as we speak.
This is also a problem, a long thread is not appealing in my opinion.


 That is a shame. It would have been nice for you to show just how many Old Testament stories actually originated in the Mesopotamian region and that were written down thousands of years before the bible was even thought of. 

#48
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@Tradesecret
That is a truism.
#49
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
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@Stephen



Stephen,

OMG, Jesus in prayer last night told me that I forgot the following quote by Miss Tradesecret that He wants me to address at her embarrassing expense AGAIN!

MISS TRADESECRET QUOTE OF OPENING UP A CAN OF WORMS AGAIN!:  "In summary, humanity was not made flawed but rather was made "very good" without any flaws. Yet he was made morally and legally responsible for his actions."

Uh,  humanity as a whole today IS NOT made "very good without any flaws" today because of the following godly passages, H-E-L-L-O?!:

"Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me." (Psalms 51:5).
"The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray from birth, speaking lies." (Psalm 58:3)

Yes, therefore man is morally and legally responsible for his SINFUL actions because of EVE transgressed first against Jesus, as God (1 Timothy 2:14), whereas Miss Tradesecret ignorantly blames Adam in her initial post, tsk, tsk, tsk.      Therefore, the ONLY TIME that Miss Tradesecrets erroneous statement shown above is true, is where man was NOT FLAWED, was before EVE transgressed first and originated the "original sin!"  2+2=4!


MISS TRADESECRETS LACK OF MEMORY QUOTE RELATIVE TO THIS TOPIC IN HER INITIAL POST:  "I have discussed this at some length on this site with another member. I can't recall where that discussion took place. And I cannot be bothered looking for it. "

Uh, as I think I remember, it was ME, Mr. Brother D. Thomas, that Bible Slapped Silly®️ Miss Tradesecret in this discussion a while back!  Furthermore, it is no wonder why she can't be bothered in looking for this embarrassing FACT!  


Stephen, and Miss Tradesecret teaches her flock of about 300 about Christianity and the Bible? Surely she jests!   LOL!
.
#50
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@Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
MISS TRADESECRET QUOTE OF OPENING UP A CAN OF WORMS AGAIN!:  "In summary, humanity was not made flawed but rather was made "very good" without any flaws. Yet he was made morally and legally responsible for his actions."

 Indeed Brother D.  I picked up on this absolute contradiction by the Reverends as early as post  #4
When I wrote:


Take a long look at this absolute contradictory bullshite:

Tradesecret wrote:  humanity was not made flawed but rather was made "very good" without any flaws

Tradesecret wrote: I have suggested that the Bible expresses that God made humanity "very good".  Indeed without flaw.

The clown[Tradescret]  has just defined the word - perfect:  while using the idiom "very good".



#51
Mr.BrotherD.Thomas
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@Stephen



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Stephen,

Remember me asking you if you want to split the costs of getting a secretary to peruse this Religion Forum for us in getting together all of Miss Tradesecret's posts where she blatantly goes directly against Jesus' words within the scriptures, where we have to correct her once again in front of the membership?  This would save time for us to discus  with other members that have more of an intellect relative to Christianity than Miss Tradesecret does.

At least think about it, okay?  Thanks.

“ It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop, than with a brawling woman in a wide house.” (Proverbs 21:9)