Instigator / Pro
8
1590
rating
91
debates
58.79%
won
Topic
#5677

Women are only attracted to your SMV, not who you are as a person (for Strawbbycake no one else will be accepted unless female)

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
6
Better sources
4
4
Better legibility
2
2
Better conduct
2
2

After 2 votes and with 6 points ahead, the winner is...

Strawbbycake
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
3
Time for argument
Three days
Max argument characters
10,000
Voting period
Two weeks
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
14
1500
rating
9
debates
55.56%
won
Description

No information

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

Adriana Lima (pro):
Good example, a true 11 dating a mere 8... Pro was able to point to how awesome the guy is, and con's reply included Adriana stating "he's very athletic" which seems to be factors on pro's scale.

Never Give Up (con):
So an 8 marrying a 4 (maybe even as low as 3?), that goes much better for con. Pro's defense that the wife thought there was something cute about him, doesn't confirm it was a rare physical attraction or any other part of his scale, and con is able to explain it away as an attraction to his personality (which is the point of the debate right, not that women marry men they aren't attracted to, but if they are capable of romantic attraction).

List of Famous Hunks (pro):
I am not even reading this. There's no way it can help con's case. Maybe they have good personalities in addition to being incredibly hot?

Beyoncé (n/a):
"Any place or thing in the universe can be up to 104% perfect. That's how you got Beyoncé."
-Michael, The Good Place

You can't put her on the scale. Every guy is beneath her by all standards.

...

The big problem for pro was he made the big declaration of NEVER, but let con wholly lead the debate. If redoing this, each side should be limited to a couple examples at the start to contrast, rather than allowing room for Gish Gollops.

Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Better arguments
3 point(s)
Better sources
2 point(s)
Better legibility
1 point(s)
Better conduct
1 point(s)
Reason:

ARGUMENTS

For one, I thought Pro did a good job of defining SMV early in the debate. He intelligently expanded the definition to encompass a man's alpha energy and "game," which might be confused for genuine personality. He intelligently points out that women will even fall in love with serial killers if they are attractive enough.

The real meat of the debate is set up by Pro when he challenges Con to propose one woman who demonstrates a genuine dedication to a man's personality, and not their SMV. Con makes a good effort of meeting Pro's challenge, but only two of her examples carry any weight for me. The other examples were just rich, famous men with sub-par looks, which does not adequately debunk Pro's conception of SMV, which is more dynamic than just physical attractiveness.

The two important examples were Adriana Lima and Never Give Up's (henceforth known as NGU) wife.

For Lima, she fell in love with a man who was high status, being tall, athletic, and famous. However, she stated that she loved him because of his sense of humour and intelligence. Admittedly, it does seem like Lima prefers famous men, but I am not convinced by Pro that it is the only thing she considers. Pro does challenge the sincerity of Lima's statements regarding Jaric, but I don't really see why I should believe she was insincere when Jaric is poorer and (probably) less attractive than Lima. If she only cared about SMV, why would she date a man who seems to be less attractive and wealthy than she is? This really does undermine Pro's claim that Lima was insincere in her interview, which was already a baseless claim to begin with.

NGU was Con's best example. NGU is a self proclaimed ugly guy, but he still found love. NGU's wife only seemed to find him "kinda" attractive, which indicates that some other characteristic (presumably his personality) made him appealing. Pro rightfully points out that the invocation of the word "kinda" indicates that NGU's wife does value attractiveness, but that does not fulfill his burden of proof. Ultimately, I am left with the impression that NGU's wife fell in love with NGU primarily due to his personality. Pro tries to claim that NGU's wife is a narcissist, but he never justifies this assertion. Further, if she fell in love with NGU because he was easy to manipulate, I fail to see how this fits into Pro's SMV paradigm.

Basically, most of Con's examples of women who fell in love with men due to reasons other than SMV fell short, but the two she elaborated upon were great! Con adequately proved that Lima cared a lot about characteristics other than SMV, even if her love of Jaric may have been informed by his height and fame. Further, I also believe that Con proved NGU's wife fell in love with NGU because of NGU's personality. Did NGU's wife consider NGU's SMV? Maybe, but the fact that she considered factors other than SMV fulfills Con's burden of proof.

Pro really bit off more than he could chew with this resolution. He had a really tough case and Con made him pay for it.

SOURCES

Sourcing was bad on both sides, though Con did better. The disparity is not great enough to justify assigning the point.