Instigator / Pro
crossed's avatar
9
crossed
1377
rating
62
debates
25.81%
won
Topic
#1268

God measured everything out

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
3
6
Better sources
4
4
Better legibility
1
2
Better conduct
1
2

After 2 votes and with 5 points ahead, the winner is...

oromagi
Tags
Science
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
3
Time for argument
Three days
Max argument characters
4,000
Voting period
One week
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
oromagi's avatar
14
oromagi
1922
rating
117
debates
97.44%
won
Description

No information

Round 1
crossed's avatar
crossed
Pro
#1
My right arm is 30 inches long.


My left arm is exactly the same size at 30 inches.


god measured my arms out so they would be the exact same size



My right leg is 36 inches long



My left leg is exactly 36 inches long




god measured my legs out so they would both be the exact same size


My right foot is 10 inches long


My left foot is 10 inches long


God measured my foot out so they would be exactly the same

My right ear is 3 inches long


My left ear is 3  inches long


My hands are exactly the same size. just put them together. but the exact size is 6 1/2

My middle finger on my right hand is 4 inches my left middle finger is 4 inches



My thumb on right hand is 2 inches my left thumb is 2 inches.

My 4 finger on right hand is 3/1/2 my 4th finger on my left hand is 3/12.

god measured it out this is constant with all fingers

god measured them out


God measured out my ears so they would be the same


My left eye is 1 inch big


My right eye is 1 inch big

God measured my eyes out

My top lips are  3 inches

My bottom lips are 3 inches


God measured this out



My right nose hole is the exact same size as my left nose hole. Because god measured it.

my right ear hole is the exact same size as my left ear hole. This is because god measured it

look in a mirror this is true

my nose is in exact middle of my face. if you measure from my right of my face it takes 2 inches to reach my nose. If you measure from the left side of my face it takes 2 inches to reach my nose

god measured out

My cat named Cheetos first leg is 6 inches long

my cats named Cheetos 2nd leg is 6 inches long

3rd leg is 6 inches

4 leg is 6 inches


Both her eyes are exactly the same size this is because god measured them out.



Both here ears are exactly the same. This is because god measured them out.


god measured Cheeto out


Cheeto and my dog Secret tails are exactly placed between there Butts.


My nose is placed in the middle of my eyes. It makes a triangle. the nose is evenly between each eye

I Don't want to be crude but the butt crack is exactly in the middle. both cheeks are the same size

god measured this stuff out


There noses are both placed on there snouts.


Cheetos right nose hole is the exact size of here left nose holes.


secrets nose holes are exactly the same size.




There ears are the same size.




A deer i saw had antlers the left antler was the exact same size as his right antler. This is because god measured them out.


deer legs were all the same size from viewpoint.




My foot has 5 toes my hands have 5 fingers god counted them out

My right big toe is the same size as my left big toe.




it looks like the eyes sockets on the human skull are exactly the same size. The right one is the same as the left one. That's because god measured them

I can only guess by looking i do not have dead human skulls  around the house


Don't have beavers here. But it seems the right beever tooth is the exact same size as the left one. This is because god measured it


right birds wing seems to be exactly the same size as left bird wing. can not catch one to see


All eight pedals on this flower seems to be exactly the same size. It probably is but do not have any flowers near by. Just looking at flower pictures. I wonder if all the pines on a pine tree are the same.

test it out yourself



omargi put you hands together see that  both your hands are exactly the same size. that's because god measured them out



Omargi measure your arms see how there both the same size. God measured them out

Omargi look in a mirror see how your nose holes both right and left are the same size god measured them out








oromagi's avatar
oromagi
Con
#2
Thanks, crossed.

DEFINITIONS

God is "short for God the Father, the fountainhead and coeternal hypostasis of the Trinity described in the Old Testament." [1]

measure out (past tense measured) is "to measure and remove (something) from a larger amount." [2]

everything is  (literally) "All the things under discussion. "[3]

RESOLUTION: God measured everything out

CON interprets the resolution to mean that God has taken the measurement of anything PRO can think of.  PRO goes on to demonstrate that PRO can think of lots of different things PRO supposes GOD measured.

Let's note that PRO never connects the list of measurements to God in any purposeful way.  Essentially the whole of PRO's claim is that an invisible, supernatural being has performed every measurement we can think of because his supernatural powers allows us to assume infinite time and interest in the measurement of things.  PRO offers no information about the tools or process or documentation of God's measurements, these are all mysteries that must be taken as granted.

Of course, even a superficial scan of PRO's extensive list of examples makes manifest the falsehood of PRO's claims.

  • God would never measure in British Imperial units which were historically inexact and variable.  Our present standard inch was arrived at almost at random.  The inch was traditionally defined as the width of an average man's thumb but how the average man was determined or measured is seldom explained.  Of course, the average man's measurements are variables that change over time as human sizes change through the ages. [4]  Since any God worth the supposing would be imagined as rather more invariable that fickle thickness of man's thumb, let us assume that God would measure in metric meters, derived from the measure of the invariable speed of light. 
Further, PRO's claims are pretty obviously invented:

  • PRO's measurements are rounded inches, a rather absurd scale for measuring a human face.  If PRO offered these private measurement in round feet, we would obviously call foul since PRO would necessarily eliminate the small differences in measuring the left and right nostril, say, and then claim a perfect match.  Well,  perhaps a bit less obviously, rounding inches is likewise so large a scale that even fairly obvious differences in ear lobe length or left eyebrow vs right eyebrow would be rounded to totally unsurprisingly identical numbers. 
  • If PRO measured in micrometers and maybe kept the first few decimal places- many interesting and important asymmetries could be accurately recorded.  Asymmetries, we should note, already apparent to the human eye without measurement- our human brains are particularly well adapted to noticing minor assymetries in human faces as an essential component of human communication.
  • Nobody is perfectly symmetrical [ https://www.self.com/story/one-boob-bigger-than-the-other] and very few people are even as symmetrical as PRO's personal claims.
  • PRO has only offered a long list of data based on PRO's personal features and some pet features.  CON asks voters to invalidate as evidence each and every one of these highly suspect claims entirely untestable and unfalsifiable by CON. 
  • CON asks that voters to invalidate the entire listed data in full awareness that this eliminates 100% of PRO's R1 argument.  CON recommends that PRO submit an entirely new argument or forfeit, whichever CON prefers.
  • Put another way, once we toss out  the long list of unfalsifiable data and requests that CON generate some unfalsifiable data,  PRO's argument is a blank.
Return to PRO for resubmission of argument using data that can be falsified.


Round 2
crossed's avatar
crossed
Pro
#3
In the beginning God created a man named Adam. God created Adams right hand to be 6 inches long. He then created Adams left hand to be 6 inches long. God Then went on and created Adams arm span to be 5 foot 10 inches long and then he created him to be 5 foot and 10 inches tall. God also had both arms be exactly the same size. and was still able to measure it out so his arm span was equals his height. God then went on and created Adams legs. God created Adams right leg to be the same size as his left. God saw that Adam was lonely so he went on to create eve. He created eves right hand hands exactly the same size. God created her arm span to be 4 foot 11 he then created her to be 4 foot and 11 inches long. God created both her arms to be both the same size and created her arm span to equal her height God created Both her legs to be exactly the same size.

Not real numbers just needed to tell the story.



Years past and Adam and eve have Million of children. Adam past these measurements Down to his children via his DNA. But out of the million children 1000 of them are slightly off. Billy one of Adams decedent was a runt in a litter of 12 brothers. All his brothers except him were perfectly proportioned his oldest brother was
6 foot 2 and his arm span was 6 foot and 2 inches and all his limbs were exactly the same. Same with his 2nd oldest brother who was 5 foot and 11 inches tall and his arm span was 5 foot and 11 inches long. and all his limbs were exactly the same. But Billy had a mutation  he was 4 foot 9 and his arm span was 4 foot 8. This was because the information in His DNA in which god put the measurements in was damaged. Luckily all his limbs were exactly the same size. And The mutation was not big enough to effect any of his offspring. Thousands of years past and it is the year 2019 These measurements have Mostly stayed the same with most people being exactly proportioned. For example Bob. Bob is 5 foot and 7 inches long His Arm span is also 5 foot and 7 inches tall. His arms are also exactly the same along with both his legs. His ears are both 4 inches Long. But Bob eats the American diet. The American diet has chemicals that damage his DNA. So Bobs son Jimmy Is slightly off Jimmy's right arm is 29 inches long While his left arm is 30 inches long.Luckily all his other limbs were exactly the same. He saw the flaw of his fathers bad diet and Jimmy ate right. By not eating crud he grew out of it by the age of 19 his right arm was 35 inches and his left arm was 35 inches. fixing the mutation he had when he was younger.



So summary God measured out Adam and eve perfectly. Adam and eve had children. Adam and Eve past down there DNA to there children. The perfect  measurements were coded into  There DNA. Even though the majority of people Still have the perfect measurements. some people Had there DNA damage So the information/measurements in there DNA were mutated. So maybe there arms is off by a couple cm or something.



Our arm span is equal to our height for the typical human. Only god could have done this because Arm length has nothing to do with height.



For most people, their arm span is about equal to their height. Mathematicians say the arm span to height ratio is one to one:

Apparently i am not the first to come  up with this. Virtuvius a roman architect. says god measured ever limb


Rebuttal
I did not round i just did not feel like spending the time to put the decimals. i can in the next round if you want. You can do it yourself to see. What i say is true. It says the boobs are slightly off because of genetics. Like i said The measurement/information in our DNA can get mutated. I urge the voter to measure there own Body's and not leave it to word say.


The boob site said.
A lot of it has to do with genetics






oromagi's avatar
oromagi
Con
#4
Thanks, crossed.

DEFINITIONS

PRO did not object to any definitions.  CON's definitions stand.

RESOLUTION: God measured everything out

PRO did not object to PRO's interpretation

BURDEN of PROOF

Wikipedia offers:

"When two parties are in a discussion and one makes a claim that the other disputes, the one who makes the claim typically has a burden of proof to justify or substantiate that claim especially when it challenges a perceived status quo. This is also stated in Hitchens's razor. Carl Sagan proposed a related criterion, the Sagan standard, "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence". [1]

As a proclaimer of the extraordinary, the Burden of Proof is clearly PRO's.

DROPPED ARGUMENTS

  • PRO has not yet offered any evidence that can be tested or falsified.  
  • CON declared PRO's R1 100% invalid and PRO has not objected or countered.
  • PRO still never connects the list of measurements to God in any purposeful way. 
  • PRO ignored metric vs. imperial standard argument:  any hypothesized  creator would be more likely to  measure in units that reflect universal constants such as the speed of light (metric) rather than the King of England's thumb width (imperial).
  • PRO ignores CON's complaint that PRO is using the wrong scale to measure human features.
  • PRO admits that his personal measurements of various bits and bobs are inexact.
PRO continues to make extraordinary assertions without offering any framework or evidence or reason.  PRO extends the primary contention: no debatable point has yet been offered for CON to counter.

Back to PRO for one last chance.  What evidence show that God measured out everything?

Round 3
crossed's avatar
crossed
Pro
#5
I measured feet big toe and hands out. there exactly the same. I suspect that if most of you do the same experiment you would most likely come to the same conclusion. God measured us out.or to be more exact he measured Adam and eve out and we inherited the numbers from Adam .now the numbers can be screwed a bit when being  passed down but via the DNA.But that does not change  that he measured.


This takes longer then I suspected. So I was not able to measure everything. but it comes down to the same thing. I got some measurements from 2 siblings but they did not like doing it. so it is mostly me. 



Our hands are measured if my right hand is exactly the sane as left. I suspect you will most likely find the same if you tried. 


Foot measurement's.

big toe sizes

Hand sizes


I will get more it takes time and I need someone to hold the camera which Is hard to find someone to do.



precise hormone clocks


espanol deer hormone clocks release hormone  between October through January. this is called deer mating season. these clock's have been precisely dialed they release hormones during October every year.

the precise thing is that they release hormones at the same time each year. same time  being October through January each year.

this is espanol deer other deer can be different.

People are so confident in this that they say that  it will happen each year in October.


let say I precisely dial my alarm clock to go off at 7.30.but the power goes out and my alarm does not go off at 7.30. did I still precisely dial my alarm clock. I absolutely did. The fact that the power went off and  my precise dialing was screwed up. Does not change the fact that I precisely dialed it.


lets say god precisely dialed the deer's hormone clocks to go off in October. But let say a bunch of environment toxins effect the clock and its clock gets messed up. Did god not precisely dialed the clock. no he did precisely dialed it but the toxins screwed it up.




"Deer have a fairly long mating season that covers from October through January. This period of time is called the rut"
Same with the measurements above. God measured stuff out. But through chemicals filled diet. These measurements can be slightly off. Now the perfect ratio between measured out stuff can be different. Hands and feet are almost always exactly the same. I would say a good 99 percent of the time. while maybe circle are less likely to be as exact as something like sticks. Something like female breast are a little less then 50 percent like you mentioned. but still almost half of them are  exactly the same.  about one out of two and  half people



God counted stuff out. these are precise numbers


Humans have 2 eyes 2 ears

dogs have 2 eyes 2 ears


cats have 2 eyes 2 ears


horses have 2 eyes 2 ears


cows have 2 eyes 2 ears

weasels have 2 eyes 2 ears

goes on for about 90 percent of all animals

same with 4 legs and 2 legs and 2 arms

These precise measurements that have been passed down from Adam and eve can be corrupted. like a mutation in the DNA can cause 3 arms. but that does not change the fact that it is preset to give you 2 arms. he counted them out and set the number to be two. that set number can be corrupted. that does not change the fact that the number was set that way





Con said god did not use man measuring systems. if something is exactly the same size its been measured out. symmetry numbers.
pls don't b###### me because of the title. because I said everything. lets say about everything. I can not go out and measure everything. but I can observe and see that things have been measured out.



The earth is round. the moon is round. the sun is round.. this is because god measured them out.










oromagi's avatar
oromagi
Con
#6
Thanks, crossed.

DEFINITIONS

PRO did not object to any definitions.  CON's definitions stand.

RESOLUTION: God measured everything out

PRO did not object to PRO's interpretation

BURDEN of PROOF

PRO did not object to full BOP on PRO

DROPPED ARGUMENTS

  • PRO has not yet offered any evidence that can be tested or falsified.  
  • CON declared PRO's R1 100% invalid and PRO has not objected or countered.
  • PRO still never connects the list of measurements to God in any purposeful way. 
  • PRO ignores CON's complaint that PRO is using the wrong scale to measure human features.
  • PRO admits that his personal measurements of various bits and bobs are inexact.
PRO briefly addressed the imperial vs. metric argument by arguing if something is exactly the same size its been measured out.  We have established that PRO is deliberately using a large units of measurements and rounding to the nearest or half.  So if my right nostril is 14 mm in diameter and my left nostril is 18mm, PRO's methodology would report back that I have two nostrils that are identically 1 inch in diameter.  PRO then uses that identicalness (created by methodology only) as proof of GOD.  PRO's methodology distorts the evidence.  Nor has PRO gotten around to explaining why identical nostrils must prove GOD.

PRO continues to make extraordinary assertions without offering any framework or evidence or reason. 

  • deer release hormones between Oct & Jan is evidence of precision....[Biology tells us that any large multi cellular organism is going to be secreting hormones more or less constantly.  We need no experiments to say with confidence that deer also release hormones in Sept and February- that's just basic biology].  PRO's evidence is manifestly false.
  • PRO talks about how many creatures have even numbered features without discussing natural symmetry in cell division.  PRO falsely claims that 90% of all animals have 2 eyes and 2 ears. In fact, the arthropod phylum contains about 80% of the known animals species and none of these have ears.

In conclusion, PRO has listed many things that are measurable without offering a methodology for falsifying PRO's data.  PRO's case relies exclusively on the precision of these measurements and by what standard but PRO measure small things with large units (facial features measure in inches, for example) and then rounds to nearest whole numbers to create an illusion of exactitude.

PRO never makes the theoretical connection between the (deceptively generated) identical numbers and the necessity of God to account for those identical numbers.

If VOTERS agree that PRO has failed to prove that any of these measurements are meaningful or that God did the measuring then VOTERS should award arguments to CON.

Thanks in advance to the VOTERS for their kind consideration.