Instigator / Pro
6
1266
rating
119
debates
15.97%
won
Topic
#103

Binary code cannot account for the physical properties of our reality

Status
Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
6
Better sources
4
4
Better legibility
2
2
Better conduct
0
2

After 2 votes and with 8 points ahead, the winner is...

RationalMadman
Parameters
Publication date
Last updated date
Type
Standard
Number of rounds
3
Time for argument
Two days
Max argument characters
30,000
Voting period
One week
Point system
Multiple criterions
Voting system
Open
Contender / Con
14
1702
rating
574
debates
67.86%
won
Description

No information

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@Ehyeh

I do not care.

If you want to be convinced, make it a forum topic, if you want to be a sophist for the win, expect the same from me.

I do not debate honestly in the arena unless honesty benefits my win condition.

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@RationalMadman

I wouldn't even have to appeal to Occam's razor to beat your simulated universe theory. We know physicalism has checked all its ontological commitments and is possible. We don't know if consciousness can even exist in non bio life (machines). Even if physicalism possessed more ontological commitments than a simulated universe theory (it doesnt). It still has less unknowns.

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@Ehyeh

Occam's Razor is what keeps a hillbilly as a poor farmer. If you always approach things entirely minimalistically, you never innovate or pursue deeper, hidden truths.

I don't remember supporting occam's razor but I will happily play the role of atheist irl and back that as it's a very politically-correct way to say 'I think most religions are full of shit' without getting tangled into discussions that can be used against you.

One thing is public tact, the other is private real thoughts. Occam's Razor is a scapegoat used to gaslight people who think more complex, the solution is only the 'simplest' solution when it comes to mathematics. In science and more complex real-world matters, optimal/correct solutions are only the simplest solution a minority of times.

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@RationalMadman

I wonder how you can overcome the issue of information. If you claim we're all in a simulation, i cant imagine what type of machine they're using to simulate all our brains and experiences. 1 single brain stores 2.5 petabytes of information. That is simply just ones memory which is far weaker than our processing speed. Which can do within 1 second what takes a computer 40 minutes to do. Now on top of this add all the trillions of neurons and cells of every living being being simulated at once. Then also add in simulations within simulations. I honestly have no idea how the machine doesn't simply blow up. How much storage capacity do they have. If they have this storage capacity it cannot be limitless can it? so when we make a new universe inside a universe where is the more storage coming from? it should all be on one hardrive and anything on its own hardrive is an illusion.
https://neurotray.com/how-many-calculations-per-second-can-the-human-brain-do/

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@RationalMadman

I would wager physicalism is certainly more likely than a simulation. We can open up that debate sometime in the future then.

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@RationalMadman

All the simulation theory does is regress the problem. If we're not base reality, we could be made within a simulation. This problem keeps going on and on to the point where you have so many ontological commitments its probably going to be the least likely metaphysical reality from an Occam's razors perspective - simply because of this.
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At a certain point some reality must be real, no?

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@Ehyeh

It is not, it is far more difficult to justify consciousness in a physicalist's reality.

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@Ehyeh

No, I would want a clearer resolution that won't end up with you making me need to prove the code and computation behind the simulation are 'real' and just sit behind the 'he hasn't proven where the code is'.

I want the debate to be that you are a pure physicalist and I am arguing fundamentally a simulation alternative to typical dualism.

I think its hard to reconcile the conscious experience of certain dimensions with simulations. You also possess a lot of ontological commitments i would probably wager are unnecessary to a more simpler explanation.

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@RationalMadman

I see, i never took note of the high character number. Potentially you would indulge me in this debate sometime in the future?

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@Ehyeh

Don't set 30k char Rounds if you aren't ready for volume-heavy attacks.

I get the sense anyone would struggle to rebut RM in this debate, not because his argument is particularly strong - but Simply through his overwhelming volume which makes it impossible to respond to everything he is saying.

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@Barney

I meant only ever not never in my number 2.

Just to be clear to everyone reading I noticed this error just now.

Under my proposed refinement to S&G, RM would have won that point as well. A block of text vs the work he put in...