What exists? (No seriously.)

Author: Math_Enthusiast
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#91
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@sadolite
did succinctly answer your enquiry." 

Actually no it doesn't "Unless programmed to give a fuck" is the answer which in that case one doesn't actually believe time space and matter don't exist but only argue it for the sake of argument. Which I find completely inane.
Time and space is not dependent on your belief system. It is a fact of nature.
#92
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@Shila
"Time and space is not dependent on your belief system. It is a fact of nature." You are preaching to the choir
#93
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@sadolite
"Time and space is not dependent on your belief system. It is a fact of nature." You are preaching to the choir
So we are in agreement. Good!!
#94
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@sadolite
So.

What is it within your physiological make up, that causes you to give a fuck?

Is it nothing to do with genetic inheritance and brain function?

Functionality as I referred to it.

Do you think that it is a sort of energy that seeps in from the outside?


Discussion for the sake of discussion is variant on the theme of overthink...That's all.

It makes a change.
#95
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@Shila
No energy, no matter.

But.

Time and space are constant intangible potentials.

So,

"Nothing would be happening".

Therefore as you clearly indicated, nothing has a duration, that requires time and space.
#96
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@zedvictor4
The original question was:  If  one believes time space and matter don't exist, then why would one  live as though it does.  It is inane to argue time space and matter don't exist while at the same time living by every  law of time space and matter.  Its argument for the sake of argument. One doesn't believe their own words.
#97
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@sadolite
You don't get it?

It's a philosophical discussion in a philosophical forum.

And nothing to do with a personal "belief" in anything.

Makes a change from discussing the weather.

Nah...I'm sure you get it really.
#98
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@sadolite
The original question was:  If  one believes time space and matter don't exist, then why would one  live as though it does.  It is inane to argue time space and matter don't exist while at the same time living by every  law of time space and matter.  It’s argument for the sake of argument. One doesn't believe their own words.
You don’t belong in this world if you don’t believe time, space and matter don’t exist.
#99
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@Shila
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess no one in this thread  believes time space and matter don't exist. 
#100
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@sadolite
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess no one in this thread  believes time space and matter don't exist. 
So we are all subjected to time, space and matter. Case closed.
#101
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@sadolite

Tru-dat!
#102
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@Shila
So we are all subjected to time, space and matter. Case closed.

Cult of MAFA and King Trumpet can spin-out falsehoods about anything no matter how obvious the truth is. And rarely if ever do narcissists apologize for the bad behavior.  Aka psychotic behavior.
#103
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@ebuc
 And rarely if ever do narcissists apologize for the bad behavior.  Aka psychotic behavior.
Everyone is narcissist in a way. It's healthy. I will have AI explain it.

A degree of narcissism, or self-focused behavior, is present in all surviving species as an evolutionary necessity. At its core, this trait enhances individual survival and ensures reproductive success, making it a persistent feature across the tree of life.

Self-preservation drives organisms to prioritize their own safety, seek nourishment, and avoid risks that could endanger their lives. This innate self-interest ensures they are in the best condition to reproduce and pass on their genes. In social species, this manifests as behaviors that secure status or access to resources, ensuring better chances for offspring to thrive. Even in solitary creatures, this focus on self-maintenance and resource control is a direct expression of evolutionary narcissism.
These traits are not anomalies or psychotic traits, but foundational strategies for survival, demonstrating that some degree of self-prioritization is a universal characteristic in all life that has managed to persist through natural selection.

A low-T male on the verge of being excluded from the evolutionary pool may lack these traits and perceive those who possess them as adversaries.

#104
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@ebuc
Cult of MAFA and King Trumpet can spin-out falsehoods about anything no matter how obvious the truth is. And rarely if ever do narcissists apologize for the bad behavior.  Aka psychotic behavior.
That is the time and space Trump and MAGA occupy in American politics.

#105
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@Greyparrot
Everyone is narcissist in a way.

King Trumpet = psychotic narcissist. Old news to logical, common sense critical thinking people.

Cult of MAFA over rides logic when it comes their agenda, that, more times than not, with unnecessary, violent tendencies with illogical lack common sense critical thinking.

Some perecentage of MAFA is stuck in 1865 days of insurrection, and a gun on ever persons hip, or hand bag. 

I'm all for better paid policing as long as there exists good programs to weed out the irrational, racist, bigoted people, before they become police officer and act out uncalled for irrationally towards the general public.
#106
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@ebuc
King Trumpet = psychotic narcissist. Old news to logical, common sense critical thinking people.

Cult of MAFA over rides logic when it comes their agenda, that, more times than not, with unnecessary, violent tendencies with illogical lack common sense critical thinking.

Some perecentage of MAFA is stuck in 1865 days of insurrection, and a gun on ever persons hip, or hand bag. 

I'm all for better paid policing as long as there exists good programs to weed out the irrational, racist, bigoted people, before they become police officer and act out uncalled for irrationally towards the general public.
Trump’s campaign promise to Make America Great Again was well received by the American people. The Trump phenomenon is likened to a cult.
#107
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@sadolite
Nah, you do get it.

I can see you grinning.
#108
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@zedvictor4
I can see you grinning

Does the Cheshire cat exist? 

1} yes, as a Meta-space mind/intellect/concept,

--------conceptual line-of-demarcation--------------

2} yes as animated pixels or screen, and pencil lead/ink on paper, etc ergo occupied space electrons, atoms etc

The cult of MAFA{ Make America Fat Again } and via their King-of-falsehoods, the Trumpet, may try and spin falsehood about time and space one way today, and another way tomorrow. 

MAFA is irreverent to science and reverent to disinformation.

1} absolute cosmic  truths

2} relative truths ---ex the sky is blue---

3} falsehoods i.e. a lies mixed in with relative and absolute truths

AI.." The Cheshire Cat from Alice's Adventures in Wonderland is a mischievous character who enjoys misdirecting Alice. However, there's no information about whether or not the Cheshire Cat lies "...
#109
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@ebuc
The Cheshire Cat from Alice's Adventures in Wonderland is a mischievous character who enjoys misdirecting Alice. However, there's no information about whether or not the Cheshire Cat lies "...
Why don’t you find out before posting more lies?
#110
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@ebuc
My wife is an Alice in Wonderland fan.

We have a grinning Cheshire cat effigy in the garden.

And all sorts of other associated paraphernalia.

Charles Dodgson was an unmarried clergyman with a penchant for little girls.

But hey?


#111
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@zedvictor4
We have a grinning Cheshire cat effigy in the garden.

AI.." The Cheshire Cat from Alice's Adventures in Wonderland is a mischievous character who enjoys misdirecting Alice. However, there's no information about whether or not the Cheshire Cat lies "...

Mischievous or malicous, or mal-intent, or msidirection, or misinformation, or falshoods etc all exist primarily as Meta-space attributes of humans via their access to Meta-space mind/intellect/concepts and ego.

Animals graze plants or eat other animals.

Rare Earth " Ma" { " this is a story about the lady who rasied me " } https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsnpaHf5IIs

Rare Earth " Feeling Alright { going get down tonight }..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdSQSRm5uKI

Rare Earth " Keeping Me Out of The Storm " https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiYsLHDmSSw

Rare Earth { ecology } " Im Losing You " 1970 on the Ed Sullivan show

#112
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@ebuc
Rare Earth " Ma" { " this is a story about the lady who rasied me " } https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsnpaHf5IIs

Rare Earth " Feeling Alright { going get down tonight }..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdSQSRm5uKI

Rare Earth " Keeping Me Out of The Storm " https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiYsLHDmSSw

Rare Earth { ecology } " Im Losing You " 1970 on the Ed Sullivan show 
Not the best pick out of a Seventies group.

8 days later

#113
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@Math_Enthusiast
A few questions to ponder and discuss:
Does the past exist?

Yes, as a set of occupied space  and abstract relationships the present

Does the future exist?

Yes, however only  based on best understanding the nature of occupied space's eternal existence, flow of time --Observed -reality- Time { OT } via our experiences of the latter

Do abstractions exist?

Yes. Ex unicorns exist as occupied space drawings pixels on a screen etc, that were conceived via human experience, and that humans access to Meta-space mind/intellect/conceptual abstractions.
Do thoughts exist?

I think about an occupied space experience ergo I exist as an occupied experience with access to Meta-space mind/intellect/concepts and ego.

If something will never be observed, does it exist?

Does not exist for humans, until we have quantised it. I remains speculative until quantization occurs

If you have heard that something has been observed, but never observe it yourself, does it exist?

It exists as Meta-space mind/intellect/concept via an occupied space humans experience and passed on to another human via communication in whatever method of occupied space transfer of information.

There exists three, primary kinds of cosmic existence, with the  #2 being a moot point of existence:

1} eternally existent, Meta-space mind/intellect/concepts aka abstractions,

---------------conceptual line of demarcation------------------------

2} eternally existent, macro-infinite and truly non-occupied space, that surrounds/embraces the following,

3} eternally existent, finite, occupied space Universe.

It does not get any simpler than this Cosmic Trinary Set, however, there exist subsets of Meta-space truth, and greater number of subsets of occupied space  Universe, if we discount all of the complementary Meta-space aspects of those differrentiated subsets of occupied space Universe.
#114
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@zedvictor4
Therefore as you clearly indicated, nothing has a duration, that requires time and space.
Everything requires time and space.
So we are all subjected to time, space and matter. Case closed.
#115
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According to current scientific understanding, 3D space was created during the Big Bang, where all of space, time, matter, and energy were generated in a single moment, causing a rapid expansion that resulted in the three dimensions of length, width, and depth we observe in our universe today; essentially, the universe inflated and "stretched" into its 3D form as it cooled down from the initial explosion.
#116
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@FLRW
According to current scientific understanding, 3D space was created during the Big Bang, where all of space, time, matter, and energy were generated in a single moment, causing a rapid expansion that resulted in the three dimensions of length, width, and depth we observe in our universe today; essentially, the universe inflated and "stretched" into its 3D form as it cooled down from the initial explosion.
That only confirms, Everything requires time and space.
So we are all subjected to time, space and matter. Case closed.

#117
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@Shila
"We" are, for sure.

But I thought that we were referring to nothing.

I thought the case was closed.

But you reopened it.
#118
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@zedvictor4
But I thought that we were referring to nothing.
We are all subjected to time, space and matter. We are everything.