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@b9_ntt
Lol, I wouldn't bet on that. Especially with the things the FBI has done the last decade.
Mt Favourite Antifa Movie.
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@Greyparrot
Well, if you really believe that, what are you doing to protect yourself from it?
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@b9_ntt
Try to stay anonymous and try not to get in the crossfire.
Make no mistake, the 100k field agents of all the combined alphabet agencies have a much larger potential for not only mayhem, but also have no incentive to disobey lawful orders, regardless of what those orders may be.
The closest thing in comparison would be a suicide bomber. Unreasonable. Unstoppable.
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@Greyparrot
I'm glad I don't feel that way. Life is hard enough without having to worry that government agents are out to get me.
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@b9_ntt
I guess. I'm too old to lead the blissful life, sadly.
My reaction to Alphabet Agency enforcers is the same as the reaction of the 1940's Warsaw Jews or the modern Chinese. Do not get noticed. Do not resist. Do not engage. Avoid and pray.
If and when examples need to be made, it will most certainly come from the pool of the unconcerned and defiant first.
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@Greyparrot
If and when examples need to be made, it will most certainly come from the pool of the unconcerned and defiant first.Yeah, if and when.
Have you heard the expression, "When you have always been privileged, equality feels like oppression"?
I think that's the situation now among a certain number of white males. They like to break things when they don't get their way.
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@b9_ntt
Government privilege trumps any skin privileges.
Have you heard the expression, "When you have always been privileged, equality feels like oppression"?
I would say the corollary to that would be:
"When you have always been told you were oppressed, having privileges over others feels like equality."
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@b9_ntt
Wikipedia:The name is derived from the song "Proud of Your Boy" originally created for Disney's 1992 film Aladdin but left out following story changes in production, and later featured in the 2011 musical adaptation. In the song, the character Aladdin apologizes to his mother for being a bad son and promises to make her proud. McInnes interprets it as Aladdin apologizing for being a boy. He first heard it while attending his daughter's school music recital. The song's "fake, humble, and self-serving" lyrics became a running theme on his podcast. McInnes said it was the most annoying song in the world but that he could not get enough of it.
FFS!
So Aladdin, a character from a animated children's Disney movie says sorry to his mom and promises her to make her proud?
Are you fkn serious!
So how does this go anywhere in describing "proud boys" in the USA and what they are proud of?
You simply cannot answer can you?
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@Stephen
You didn't get it. The quote shows that the Proud Boys are proud to be boys. I think it's fair to say that some men feel that they are being discriminated against these days. These guys are standing up and saying, "We are proud to be boys."
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@b9_ntt
You didn't get it.
No I didn't and still don't.
The quote shows that the Proud Boys are proud to be boys. I think it's fair to say that some men feel that they are being discriminated against these days. These guys are standing up and saying, "We are proud to be boys."
The quote is from and about a Disney character. So these real life men fighting with Antifa scum are likened to a fabled Disney character. And that is what they are "proud" of is it?
I wonder if they made their mothers proud like Aladdin?
The quote shows that the Proud Boys are proud to be boys
And is it wrong of them to be proud of being boys?
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@Stephen
Apparently, Aladdin is racist now. And Disney is a white supremacist Corp.
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@Stephen
The quote is from and about a Disney character. So these real life men fighting with Antifa scum are likened to a fabled Disney character. And that is what they are "proud" of is it?
What are you talking about? I clearly said I think it means they are proud to be boys, and I said nothing about that being right or wrong. In fact, there is nothing wrong with being proud to be a boy. I think the PBs are acting out a version of feeling discriminated against and put down by Antifa and others.
Why should anyone be against anti-fascism? Fascism is a terrible ideology. Antifa has its share of thugs just like PB, but I think the alt-right extremists and their Republican fellow travelers are a far worse threat to our republic and way of life than the leftists are.
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@b9_ntt
I clearly said I think it means they are proud to be boys, and I said nothing about that being right or wrong. In fact, there is nothing wrong with being proud to be a boy. I think the PBs are acting out a version of feeling discriminated against and put down by Antifa and others.
But you have also said this
I think they are white supremacist fascists. Maybe that's what they are proud of. Sounds twisted to me.#18
I think they are simply patriotic and proud of their country and proud to be American and do not want to see their country turned to shite by left wing cretins that make up Antifa.
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@b9_ntt
Why should anyone be against anti-fascism?
Because the media falsely labels all sorts of organizations as "fascist," giving moral justification to oppress all sorts of unaffiliated people.
It's straight out of Joseph Goebbels's playbook. Mislabel your opposition to justify the violence.
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@Stephen
Ok, so we disagree about what they are proud of.
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@Greyparrot
Because the media falsely labels all sorts of organizations as "fascist," giving moral justification to oppress all sorts of unaffiliated people.
No, "media" do not. The word fascist was avoided by the MSM until after Jan. 6, 2021. After that date, the term has been justified in many instances, I think.
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@Greyparrot
@Stephen
From The Anatomy of Fascism (2004) by Robert O. Paxton
mobilizing passions (pp. 219-20):
⦁ a sense of overwhelming crisis beyond the reach of any traditional solutions
"Our convention occurs at a moment of crisis for our nation.”1
“We're gathered together in the heart of our nation's capital for one very, very basic and simple reason: To save our democracy. ... We want to go back and we want to get this right because we're going to have somebody in there that should not be in there and our country will be destroyed and we're not going to stand for that. ... This is not just a matter of domestic politics — this is a matter of national security.”2
‘But it’s not a natural disaster that [Stewart]Rhodes thinks will catapult the country into chaos. In his email announcing the launch of the plan, Rhodes lays out the course of action he predicts “the enemy”—the government—is preparing to follow, including “intentionally triggering a catastrophic economic collapse” as a means of creating disorder that they will then use as an excuse to impose martial law, destroy the constitution and use the billions of dollars in ammunition, armored vehicles and weapons he claims the Department of Homeland Security and local police have been stockpiling “to control and contain us.” “We’re headed for a Weimar Republic-style collapse,” he said. “And Americans are foolish to ignore it.”’4
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⦁ the primacy of the group, toward which one has duties superior to every right, whether individual or universal, and the subordination of the individual to it
‘In deciding to attend the December 12 rally, Greene testified that he and other members, including Pezzola, were “ready and willing” to be a part of whatever might happen. ‘3
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⦁ the belief that one’s group is a victim, a sentiment that justifies any action, without legal or moral limits, against its enemies, both internal and external
‘[Trump’s] delivery was not presidential, rather it was harsh and indignant. It resonated with resentful Trump supporters who feel they are the victims of an America that has left them behind.‘1
“But it almost seems that they're all going out of their way to hurt all of us and to hurt our country.”2
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⦁ dread of the group’s decline under the corrosive effects of individualistic liberalism, class conflict, and alien influences
‘... Chapman was kicked out three years ago, he attempted to gain control of the group in the fall of 2020 and steer the Proud Boys toward more open extremism, announcing, “We will no longer cuck to the left by appointing token negroes as our leaders. We will no longer allow homosexuals or other ‘undesirables’ into our ranks. We will confront the Zionist criminals who wish to destroy our civilization. We recognize that the West was built by the White Race alone and we owe nothing to any other race.”’5
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⦁ the need for closer integration of a purer community, by consent if possible, or by exclusionary violence if necessary
“The Proud Boys vocally promoted themselves as violent actors, even in their initiation process,” says one former FBI agent. “It’s unusual for any kind of organization to publicly state its intent to break the law.”5
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⦁ the need for authority by natural chiefs (always male), culminating in a national chieftain who alone is capable of incarnating the group’s historical destiny
"I am your voice," Republican nominee Donald J. Trump told convention delegates in Cleveland as he accepted his party's nomination in a speech filled with anger but lacking soaring rhetoric. Trump railed against a rigged system. "No one knows the system better than me," he said pausing to smile, "which is why I alone can fix it." 1
‘When asked to denounce the Proud Boys, Trump first said he didn’t know who they were, then said, “Proud Boys, stand back and stand by.” ‘5
‘Bertino said interest and membership requests for the Proud Boys surged after then-President Donald Trump addressed the group by name during a 2020 presidential debate.’6
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⦁ the superiority of the leader’s instincts over abstract and universal reason
“The attacks on our police, and terrorism in our cities, threaten our way of life." He promised, "the crime and violence that today afflicts our nation will soon, very soon, come to an end. Beginning on January 20 (Inauguration Day), safety will be restored." He continued, "We will make America strong again. We will make America proud again. We will make America Safe again. We will make America great again!"2
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⦁ the beauty of violence and the efficacy of will, when they are devoted to the group’s success
‘[Matthew]Greene said that he and Pezzola had talked about how “the typical things that had been going on to redress our grievances [with government] were ineffective and were not working.”
“Based on the events that I had seen over the summer and over the past few years, violence seemed to be getting a response,” Greene said. when people acted in violence people did not back down, did not say you were going too far,” Greene said of Proud Boys leadership. “If anything, it was celebrated.” ’3
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⦁ the right of the chosen people to dominate others without restraint from any kind of human or divine law, right being decided by the sole criterion of the group’s prowess within a Darwinian struggle
“Because you'll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong. We have come to demand that Congress do the right thing and only count the electors who have been lawfully slated, lawfully slated.” “We will not be intimidated into accepting the hoaxes and the lies that we've been forced to believe. ... The radical left knows exactly what they're doing. They're ruthless and it's time that somebody did something about it. ... The Constitution doesn't allow me to send them back to the States. Well, I say, yes it does, because the Constitution says you have to protect our country and you have to protect our Constitution, and you can't vote on fraud. And fraud breaks up everything, doesn't it? When you catch somebody in a fraud, you're allowed to go by very different rules.”2
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1 Huffpost, 07/22/2016, on the Republican national convention
2 Donald Trump, 01/06/2021
3 Hannah Rabinowitz and Holmes Lybrand, ”Proud Boys member testifies about group’s culture....”, CNN, Jan. 24, 2023
4 ”Oath Keepers: Bring on the Collapse!,” Caitlin Dickson, Daily Beast, July 11, 2017
5 EJ Dickson, ”The Rise and Fall of the Proud Boys,” Rolling Stone, Jun 15, 2021
6 Quin Owen, “Proud Boys saw surge in membership after Trump's debate message...”, ABC News, Feb. 21, 2023
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@b9_ntt
the term has been justified in many instances, I think.
What about the times they clearly were not? You just throw your hands up and say "oops?"
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@Greyparrot
I'm not always sure what someone means by "fascist." My post above is accepted by many people as the best definition to date. But pop media are known for using terms indiscriminately. Have to go case by case.
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@b9_ntt
Yeah, but don't expect Antifa to be anywhere near as careful as you are (or seem to be)
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@Greyparrot
Try to stay anonymous and try not to get in the crossfire.
This is you trying to be anonymous?
Egads man, I'd hate to see what your on line presence would be if you were trying to get noticed.
Just what you already typed here should get you your picture hanging in the post office.
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@b9_ntt
Yeah, if and when.Have you heard the expression, "When you have always been privileged, equality feels like oppression"?
Never heard that one before but damn, that is spot on, it explains a lot.
I think that's the situation now among a certain number of white males. They like to break things when they don't get their way.
There is a lot of aggression masquerading as victimhood.
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@Sidewalker
Officially, the state thinks I am an African American. I am covered.
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@Greyparrot
Officially, the state thinks I am an African American. I am covered.
I'm sure you're on the list of people that aren't allowed to buy fertilizer and kerosine at Home Depot
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@Sidewalker
Maybe 20 years ago, but nobody is gonna care if a black man has an unusually large garden in 2023.
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@Sidewalker
There is a lot of aggression masquerading as victimhood.
I agree.
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@b9_ntt
No they are not the good guys. They perform the same acts as any fascist regime or group. There are many reports of them swarming people like a cowardice mob to use weapons, piss, spit, and anything else to attack people who didnt do anything but have a different opinion.