Black guy voice, is it different from others?

Author: IlDiavolo
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#31
Sidewalker
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@Lemming
Out of curiosity, do you view races to have different psychological tendencies, than one another?
Yes, I do. Different races have different experiential realities that result in different perspectives and different psychological tendencies.
 
I don't disagree with the conclusion that geographic longstanding groups of people have various tendencies myself.
We are shaped by our experience, culture, environment, and history.  If we are ever going to get along we have to try to understand each other,  and we can't do that by denying differences, we have to value differences.   

But I suppose the question comes to mind, because any differences are often unspoken,
I agree, and I think it's important that we talk about it, as uncomfortable as that is, we can't be unified without understanding each other.

Same reason one disagrees with profiling in police stops I imagine,
Hispanic in Texas 'would be more likely to be an illegal immigrant I'd 'think,
But probability not a decent stop reason, for a reason I forget, (I'm rambling)
Racial profiling is wrong, illegal, and ineffective. It violates our Constitution's foundational premise of equal protection under the law to all and freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures. It's also ineffective. It polarizes communities and alienates law enforcement, hindering policing efforts rather than helping, causing law enforcement to lose credibility and trust among the people they are sworn to protect and serve.
#32
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@Sidewalker
Do you mean biological experiential realities, or social experiential realities?

Do you mean cultures or geographic longstanding ethnicities have to get along?
. . .

Eh, humans have 'some differences, based on geographic location,
We vary so much though, in those locations,
And are so similar to other locations, generally speaking,
Not as though we're different species, competing for living space,
Different 'cultures competing for living space maybe.

I 'think humans mostly intermingle so much,
That for the 'most part, we aren't so different as breeds of dogs, or Gallapigos Island.

Right this moment I think it's more 'culture, than biological.


#33
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@Lemming
Out of curiosity, do you view races to have different psychological tendencies, than one another?
By reason of so-called "race"? No. Psychological tendencies are ultimately a product of individual experience.

I don't disagree with the conclusion that geographic longstanding groups of people have various tendencies myself.
Is a long standing geographic group a "race"? Second, geographic groupings may reflect identical values through, as Sir.Lancelot listed, culture, applied morals and ethics, and religion.

It 'would be difficult to test psychology I'd think,
Well stated. The practicality and validity of any "psychometric" is grossly exaggerated.


#34
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@Sidewalker
Yes, I do. Different races have different experiential realities that result in different perspectives and different psychological tendencies.
This applies to all individuals.



#35
Lemming
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@Athias
I'd call a geographical longstanding group a race,
A group of people, assumably with closer/shared/similar genetics to each other, than some other location.

Health among the Amish is characterized by higher incidences of particular genetic disorders, especially among the Old Order Amish. These disorders include dwarfism,[1] Angelman syndrome,[2] and various metabolic disorders, such as Tay-Sachs disease,[3] as well as an unusual distribution of blood types.[4]

The genetic problems come down to something called the "founder effect" because the nearly 150,000 Amish in America can trace their roots back to a few hundred German-Swiss settlers who brought the Amish and Mennonite faiths to the United States in the 18th century. Over generations of intermarriage, rare genetic flaws have shown up, flaws which most of us carry within our genetic makeup but which don't show up unless we marry someone else with the same rare genetic markers."
. . .

While I 'do think psychology is formed by experience, I also think that nature plays a role.
. . .

The question pops to my mind, I suppose,
Because the more traits one identifies in a group,
The less it becomes skin deep, so to speak.

'Just differences in appearance, I mean.
#36
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@Athias
Yes, I do. Different races have different experiential realities that result in different perspectives and different psychological tendencies.
This applies to all individuals.
That's true, but as it relates to race, being black in America is a very different experience than being white
#37
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@Lemming
A group of people, assumably with closer/shared/similar genetics to each other, than some other location.
Everyone is genetically similar with which to begin--overwhelmingly so. I suppose it can be parsed further into genetic cluster assignments but this will elide that the sample may be taken from an admixed population, which does not exclude longstanding geographic groupings.

While I 'do think psychology is formed by experience, I also think that nature plays a role.
How so?
#38
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@Sidewalker
but as it relates to race, being black in America is a very different experience than being white
Not necessarily. "Black" and "White" aren't so-called, "races." They're government/corporate designations. Most of what Americans consider the "Black" or "White" experience is dictated by narrative.
#39
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@Athias
Oh I'd agree,
Humans are pretty genetically similar, (I think)

Though, even dogs are genetically similar, different breeds, can breed,
Yet there is large difference between breeds, in behavior, intelligence, genetics,

Not that I'm saying human races are like dog breeds,
Dogs are 'way too intentionally bred to compare to human races (I think).
. . .

Well, take dogs and wolves,
(Again, I'm not comparing human races to dog breeds, this is just an argument on nature)
Wolves don't domesticate too well I hear, unless they've been bred a bit for it.
An example of nature having a large role in action, 'despite an attempt at nurture.

Take some humans with mental disabilities (Not a race)
Nurture can do quite a bit, but that nature is always there.
#40
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@Lemming
Not that I'm saying human races are like dog breeds,
Dogs are 'way too intentionally bred to compare to human races (I think).
Well, arranged marriages and the concept of blood purity (especially in the 15th century) would suggest intentional breeding.

Take some humans with mental disabilities (Not a race)
Nurture can do quite a bit, but that nature is always there.
Isn't that the only way the argument can be made--i.e. with respect to a mental disability, as opposed to so-called race?
#41
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@Athias
Yeah,
One get's dogs with bad hips, or other problems,
Humans with Hemophilia, or other problems,
Good stuff as well, I'm sure, but 'man, did some royals interbreed.
. . .

Well,
If one can identify various physical aspects with race, skin color, voice quality,
Then I'd 'think one could identify certain psychological tendencies as well,

We're able to examine people's genetics more and more, (I think)
. . .

As for race, well, if one can claim skin, voice quality,
Then one could claim amount of testosterone,
(I'm not saying any race has more or less, or is effected more or less, just an example)

But even 'with nurture, if an entire race had higher testosterone, even with nurture,
There would be, expected social outcomes of their behavior,
Not 'certainties, but tendencies.
#42
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@Athias
but as it relates to race, being black in America is a very different experience than being white
Not necessarily. "Black" and "White" aren't so-called, "races." They're government/corporate designations. Most of what Americans consider the "Black" or "White" experience is dictated by narrative.
Oh pulease,  this country is polarized between black and white culturally,  and definitions and semantics don't change the reality of the situation,and  if we are going to get along, we need to recognize, understand, and accept that reality.  
#43
sadolite
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You could not differentiate a black man a white man a Chinese man or any man that speaks proper English with proper diction.
#44
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@Lemming
If one can identify various physical aspects with race, skin color, voice quality,
Do, for example, Chinese people all have the same skin color? Does that make skin color a reliable indicator of so-called race? What about so-called Hispanics? Do they bear a uniform skin color?

Then I'd 'think one could identify certain psychological tendencies as well,
The issue I take with this inference is the incapacity to control for this on the basis of race. How does one, for lack of a better term, maintain the attitudes and behaviors of one's so-called "race"? If other so-called races also engage these psychological tendencies, does that not undermine the attempt to exclude such tendencies to a particular so-called "race."

But even 'with nurture, if an entire race had higher testosterone, even with nurture,
There would be, expected social outcomes of their behavior,
Not 'certainties, but tendencies.
Can this be controlled on the basis of so-called race?
#45
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@Sidewalker
Oh pulease,  this country is polarized between black and white culturally, 
I don't dispute the influence of the narrative(s.) But "White" and "Black" are neither so-called "races," nor "cultures." They're narratives.

and definitions and semantics don't change the reality of the situation,
All arguments are semantic.

and  if we are going to get along, we need to recognize, understand, and accept that reality.  
We need only respect each other's discretion to behave ourselves as we see fit.

#46
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@sadolite
You could not differentiate a black man a white man a Chinese man or any man that speaks proper English with proper diction.
Nope, I can still do it.
#47
Sidewalker
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@sadolite
You could not differentiate a black man a white man a Chinese man or any man that speaks proper English with proper diction.
Wrong again, been doing it for decades.
#48
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@Athias
Oh pulease,  this country is polarized between black and white culturally, 
I don't dispute the influence of the narrative(s.) But "White" and "Black" are neither so-called "races," nor "cultures." They're narratives.
"Race", "culture" and "narratives" are only social constructs, as are all words, and as such, they have meaning.
and definitions and semantics don't change the reality of the situation,
All arguments are semantic.
Arguments tend to involve opposing views.

and  if we are going to get along, we need to recognize, understand, and accept that reality.  
We need only respect each other's discretion to behave ourselves as we see fit.
Just look past the socially constructed categories and recognize that everyone is an individual.
#49
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@Sidewalker
Been doing what, speaking proper English or differentiating voices by skin color ?
#50
Melcharaz
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i wanna share a video where a comedian tells the difference between latino voices. Hopefully this will either contribute to the conversation, or cause a smile.

the voices is in first 1 minute 45 seconds. rest is other stuff.
#51
Lemming
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@Athias
The lines of race seem a bit blurry to me,
Though I suppose people who breed dogs, have some methodology,
Though humans aren't dogs,
Still, we define various species by differences, at certain points.

I suppose al black lab, is more like a golden retriever, than a black Chikwawa.
. .

I don't think all X people look exactly the same, but they tend to have similarities, I imagine.
. . .

Some people claim gayness is genetic,
Just because other races can be gay, wouldn't mean this or that race isn't more or less predisposed to gayness.

Not that I'm saying gayness is or isn't genetic,
Just an example.
. . .

Well, 'might be when human populations were smaller, and more varied, yes,
Neanderthals and Humans for example,
Not that I'm saying the current human ethnicities are as different as humans and Neanderthals, just an extreme example,
. . .
Humanity 'is pretty spread out nowadays,

Still, if a race can all share 'roughly the same color and voice, as three people argued,
I don't see why they couldn't share psychological tendencies as well.
#52
Athias
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@Sidewalker
"Race", "culture" and "narratives" are only social constructs, as are all words, and as such, they have meaning.
My contention is not that they don't have "meaning"; my contention is that government designations such as "Black" or "White" are neither descriptions nor indicators of one's so-called race. They are merely devices to create political narratives.

Arguments tend to involve opposing views.
Opposing views over semantics.

Just look past the socially constructed categories and recognize that everyone is an individual.
For the most part, I agree.

#53
Athias
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@Lemming
Still, if a race can all share 'roughly the same color and voice, as three people argued,
I don't see why they couldn't share psychological tendencies as well.
Can it be said that they share psychological tendencies by virtue of one's so-called race if it hasn't been controlled? Case in point: if a Jamaican couple adopts a Chinese baby and raises that baby in Jamaica, what sort of psychological tendencies do you expect to be expressed that reflects his/her so-called race and the exclusion of his/her environment?
#54
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@Athias
Of psychological tendencies and race, I don't know any myself,
Though I think culture is strong.

6 Black Men vs 1 Secret White Guy,
Though I 'think the white guy sounds a bit white to me, may be because I 'watched the video.
In the video he talks of how he was adopted and where he grew up.
. . .

Human 'do mostly seem alike to me,
And I think one would see psychological tendencies in a geographical group, more than a color,
'But, if physical tendencies occur, so would psychological one's is my view.

Women and men, are pretty different they say,
Course a man of any race is a man, I'd figure,
Just another point on nature vs nurture,
I don't feel like sourcing anything, so just a claim on my part, men and women being different by nature,
Though certainly nurture closes many gaps.
#55
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Yes, it is called an accent. Being a former student in NYC, I am pretty sure that I sound different than for example a HS kid in Glascow or Melbourne.
#56
Athias
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6 Black Men vs 1 Secret White Guy,
Though I 'think the white guy sounds a bit white to me, may be because I 'watched the video.
In the video he talks of how he was adopted and where he grew up.
Before I played the video, I closed my eyes so I could make an assumption as to the voice belonging to the so-called "white guy." I played it back, and I was correct (by process of elimination.)

'But, if physical tendencies occur, so would psychological one's is my view.
Can particular psychological tendencies be attributed to particular physical tendencies? If so, what was the control?

Women and men, are pretty different they say,
Because human beings are sexually dimorphic. But even with sex, are there tendencies that are strictly male or female?


#57
Lemming
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@Athias
Video
Yeah, video seems more in agreement with voice matching race,
But still I thought it interesting,
Of course voice 'would tend in race (I think),
But black and white seem pretty 'wide, for all the different people's that would fall into either category, Lot of room for variation. Similar to what you say in #52 about narrative.
Which isn't me disagreeing on the voice claim,
I just like talking, asking, sometimes.

Physical Cause
Of physical tendencies, I'd 'think, but don't know,
That metabolism or something related to food, for example, can be inherited,
My Dad would often get in a mood, if he hadn't eaten,
My eldest brother's much the same way, though he's less a grump about it,
And more it's an irritation/bother, harder to think function.
,
Course hunger hits a lot of people that way, but some more than others.

Psychology often looks a soft science in a number of areas to me (Currently), but,

  • "Openness: creative, open to trying new things, happy to think about abstract concepts
  • Conscientiousness: high levels of thoughtfulness, good impulse control, and goal-directed behaviors
  • Extroversion: sociability, talkativeness, assertiveness, and excitability
  • Agreeableness: trust, altruism, kindness, affection, and other prosocial behaviors
  • Neuroticism: sadness, moodiness, emotional instability, worries about many different things

Most of the characteristics you might use to describe your own personality fall under one of these broad headings. Personality traits such as shy, outgoing, friendly, and sociable are aspects of extroversion, while traits such as kind, thoughtful, organized, and ambitious would be part of the conscientiousness spectrum.

Research indicates that heritability explains around 40% to 60% of the variance in big five personality traits."

Link doesn't say anything about race though, I think.

Men and Women
Well, not 'strictly maybe,
One can nurture over nature here and there,
Nature sometimes has outliers,
Men and women both 'human.

Bot like a human compared to a fish or bird, with their forced migration and memory of where to go,
Tendency for that I've never heard in a human,
(Humans who migrate don't count I argue, as  something very different is happening with the bird and fish 'compelling and 'method of migrating)
#58
Athias
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@Lemming
Psychology often looks a soft science in a number of areas to me (Currently), but,
It very much is. Hence, I am hypercritical when it's conflated with hard sciences and/or used in conjunction with hard sciences, e.g. genetics and genomics.

#59
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@Athias
For sure.

Psychology relies upon the unverifiable psychological integrity of the psychologist.

And do we know what normal is actually meant to be like?

11 days later

#60
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Somewhat related to this topic. Once during a visit to a black person's house, I found myself remembering out of nowhere the house of my black aunt. Later I realized it was the smell. I don't know why but it seems different races have a different smell and you can clearly notice it in their houses if they don't pollute it with artificial odors.

After some research about it, most people said this different smell was due to different diets or other cultural habits, but that didn't make much sense to me. Those people have the same diet I do, live in the same area, so it doesn't add up. So I came by someone claiming to be from the US Army who said they had this habit of playing a game of blindfolding a guy and asking him to tell the races from other people by their smell. And they usually did very well on this game. Considering they slept in the same place, did the same things and ate the same food, it's an evidence that race really impacts on one's smell. But you probably won't find much research on this topic because racism.