God exists, and I Can Prove It.

Author: YouFound_Lxam

Posts

Total: 531
#61
K_Michael
K_Michael's avatar
Debates: 38
Posts: 749
4
5
10
K_Michael's avatar
K_Michael
4
5
10
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Here's the thing about scripture. If the Bible had called, thousands of years in advance of science, stuff that no other religion claimed,  it would be HUGE. Like if Genesis said, 'Hey, there are 8 planets. Two are closer to the sun than Earth is, and two of them are so far away you can't even see them yet.' And then when telescopes were invented we were able to look and be like, 'yep, there they are.' You would have to believe that the Bible was either the word of God, aliens, or some advanced human civilization lost to time, like Atlantis.
That's what science does, except it has to show it's work.
#62
TWS1405
TWS1405's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,048
3
4
7
TWS1405's avatar
TWS1405
3
4
7
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
HA HA HA!!!!


You are 0 for 0 on two threads you started here: this one and the abortion one. 

Best quite while you are behind, very behind. 
Topic's author
#63
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
So the 7 day creation story is not to be taken literally but the  1 day = 1,000 years is to be taken literally?
How do you know?
And have you recanted on your belief that you can prove god exists and that there are many ways that you can to prove it?

Here's the thing about scripture. If the Bible had called, thousands of years in advance of science, stuff that no other religion claimed,  it would be HUGE. Like if Genesis said, 'Hey, there are 8 planets. Two are closer to the sun than Earth is, and two of them are so far away you can't even see them yet.' And then when telescopes were invented we were able to look and be like, 'yep, there they are.' You would have to believe that the Bible was either the word of God, aliens, or some advanced human civilization lost to time, like Atlantis.
That's what science does, except it has to show it's work.
Here is the thing about the scripture. The scripture doesn't always mean something literally happened, and it doesn't mean something metaphorically happened.

For instance, "So the 7-day creation story is not to be taken literally but the 1 day = 1,000 years is to be taken literally?"

Yes maybe. But maybe by the scripture saying that, it could be representing that God lives outside of time, therefore it was portrayed differently.

But then again it could have meant a literal 7 days, or 7 thousand years. Thats the fascinating thing about the bible.


Topic's author
#64
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
You are 0 for 0 on two threads you started here: this one and the abortion one. 
Best quite while you are behind, very behind.
Only because you just don't want to believe what I'm saying is true. 
You all argue that I am only proving that there is a higher force or being and not the Christan, God exists. And you are right. But I am proving that there is a higher being, which is a start. I'm still doing research on the rest. 
Topic's author
#65
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
Here's the thing about scripture. If the Bible had called, thousands of years in advance of science, stuff that no other religion claimed,  it would be HUGE. Like if Genesis said, 'Hey, there are 8 planets. Two are closer to the sun than Earth is, and two of them are so far away you can't even see them yet.' And then when telescopes were invented we were able to look and be like, 'yep, there they are.' You would have to believe that the Bible was either the word of God, aliens, or some advanced human civilization lost to time, like Atlantis.
That's what science does, except it has to show it's work.
Yes, it would be huge.... your point?
Topic's author
#66
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
That's what science does, except it has to show it's work.
But even science sometimes can't show its work or prove things.
#67
K_Michael
K_Michael's avatar
Debates: 38
Posts: 749
4
5
10
K_Michael's avatar
K_Michael
4
5
10
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Yes, it would be huge.... your point?
If God wants people to worship Him so bad, it would be trivial to include this information. The fact that the Bible is so often wrong on both historical and scientific claims is very strong evidence that it's NOT the word of God.

But even science sometimes can't show its work or prove things.
Science gets stuff wrong. It's called trial and error. But when Einstein's theory of relativity replaced Newtonian physics as the consensus held theory, it was because Newton's work was fruitless or bad, just incomplete. You plug in a relative speed of zero into Einstein's equations and you get Newton's. But there's a difference between, 'hey, Newton's formulas aren't super accurate 100% of the time like we thought,' and, 'flying insects have 4 legs.'
Even worse, because it's in the Bible, the holy Word of God, you aren't allowed to question it when your religion says the earth is only six thousand years old. Science on the other hand, is always striving for better answers, updating with new information. There's no loyalty to Newton, or Einstein. A three year old could write a new theory and if the math checked out and answered more questions than Einstein's, they would replace it. A line in my bio says, 'Be faithless to your cause and betray it to a stronger enemy.' This is the same stance I try to take in all of my debates. I want to hold true beliefs more than I want to win arguments.

BTW I'm not blocking you, so you'll get faster responses if you tag me back.
#68
Sidewalker
Sidewalker's avatar
Debates: 8
Posts: 2,628
3
2
5
Sidewalker's avatar
Sidewalker
3
2
5
-->
@K_Michael
Here's the thing about scripture. If the Bible had called, thousands of years in advance of science, stuff that no other religion claimed,  it would be HUGE. Like if Genesis said, 'Hey, there are 8 planets. Two are closer to the sun than Earth is, and two of them are so far away you can't even see them yet.' And then when telescopes were invented we were able to look and be like, 'yep, there they are.' You would have to believe that the Bible was either the word of God, aliens, or some advanced human civilization lost to time, like Atlantis.
That's what science does, except it has to show it's work.
OK, so that's what it would take to make you think the Bible is an accurate book about science, but what is the basis of your belief that the Bible is a science book, is that a principle of your faith perhaps?
#69
K_Michael
K_Michael's avatar
Debates: 38
Posts: 749
4
5
10
K_Michael's avatar
K_Michael
4
5
10
-->
@Sidewalker
what is the basis of your belief that the Bible is a science book
If by 'science book' you mean a book that makes claims about reality, with specific subfields such as astronomy, biology, etc., then the Bible is unequivocally a science book. If you mean a book that makes claims about reality based upon scientific inquiry, then not so much, though 1 Kings 18:18-39 does qualify as a type of empirical experiment (Elijah ruins the controlled variables by pouring water on his sacrifice though).

The term 'science book' is yours though, I'm just saying that the Bible gets some pretty basic stuff wrong. I could literally check the flying insect claim with five minutes and a fly swatter. More importantly though, the Bible should be able to get stuff that isn't easily checkable right. God  should know that the earth orbits the sun, for instance. Yet it reads
He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.  Psalms 104:5 NIV


is that a principle of your faith perhaps?
I don't have a faith.
Topic's author
#70
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
-->
@K_Michael
If God wants people to worship Him so bad, it would be trivial to include this information. The fact that the Bible is so often wrong on both historical and scientific claims is very strong evidence that it's NOT the word of God.
Well actually there is your fatal flaw. God doesn't want us to worship him. He only wants us to love him. He doesn't send people to hell, because he's bad, but he tries to save them. If God really wanted us just to worship him, then he wouldn't have given us free will.  Every actual legit Christian you ask will give you the same answer. That is the Christan belief.

Also, the bible is actually very accurate when it comes to historical happenings and given that you read the bible in a metaphorical since, and in a physical stance, then it is very accurate when it comes to scientific claims as well.

Even worse, because it's in the Bible, the holy Word of God, you aren't allowed to question it when your religion says the earth is only six thousand years old.
This is an old claim that is actually very untrue, and there have been many other ways of showing the timescale of the universe parallel to the scriptures.

'Be faithless to your cause and betray it to a stronger enemy.
And did you know that it takes more faith to believe in sciences claims about the universe, than it is to believe in God. 
Don't just take my word for it though:
That is a documentary, that has a lot of compelling arguments.

I personally have the idea, that science is a tool that God has given us, to explore and work out his creations, he has created us curious for a reason, and gave us science in order to understand his creation even more, but we will never understand the true extent of his creation, which is why science is unable to prove certain things to be true.




Topic's author
#71
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
-->
@K_Michael
He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.
Again, this can be seen as metaphorical. Don't take everything in the bible literally.
#72
K_Michael
K_Michael's avatar
Debates: 38
Posts: 749
4
5
10
K_Michael's avatar
K_Michael
4
5
10
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Well actually there is your fatal flaw. God doesn't want us to worship him.
hmmm

Exodus 20
And God spoke all these words:
2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.
Matthew 4:10
Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’”
Deuteronomy 6
13 Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14 Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15 for the Lord your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16 Do not put the Lord your God to the test as you did at Massah. 17 Be sure to keep the commands of the Lord your God and the stipulations and decrees he has given you. 18 Do what is right and good in the Lord’s sight, so that it may go well with you and you may go in and take over the good land the Lord promised on oath to your ancestors, 19 thrusting out all your enemies before you, as the Lord said.
Those are the words of someone who only wants love?

He doesn't send people to hell
sure.

2 Peter 2:4
God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell
Luke 12
4 And I say unto you my friends, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do.
5 But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.


The Bible is very against the idea of free will in places.

Exodus 9:12
And the Lord hardened the heart of Pharaoh, and he hearkened not unto them
Ecclesiastes 7:13
Consider the work of God: for who can make that straight, which he hath made crooked?
Ephesians 1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Acts 13:48
 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
Romans 9
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
2 Timothy 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
2 Thessalonians 2
11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
Revelations 13:8
All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life, the Lamb who was slain from the creation of the world.

#73
K_Michael
K_Michael's avatar
Debates: 38
Posts: 749
4
5
10
K_Michael's avatar
K_Michael
4
5
10
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Don't take everything in the bible literally.
Then why should I take any of it literally?
Topic's author
#74
YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
Debates: 32
Posts: 2,182
3
4
7
YouFound_Lxam's avatar
YouFound_Lxam
3
4
7
And God spoke all these words:
2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.
Well, if were going out of the realm of physical facts, then I can give you a bible lesson.

God doesn't want people to worship him. In these scriptures he is specifically talking about what is right and what is wrong. though the scriptures say he is commanding his people to do these things, he is not commanding them in a way to force them but commanding them as to lead them on the right path righteousness.

Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14 Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15 for the Lord your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16 Do not put the Lord your God to the test as you did at Massah. 17 Be sure to keep the commands of the Lord your God and the stipulations and decrees he has given you. 18 Do what is right and good in the Lord’s sight, so that it may go well with you and you may go in and take over the good land the Lord promised on oath to your ancestors, 19 thrusting out all your enemies before you, as the Lord said.
Those are the words of someone who only wants love?
 When Christians talk about fearing the Lord, we don't talk about fear in a sense of fear, like people normally portray fear, rather we fear him, as to respect him.
Christians believe that God is perfect, and the type of anger and jealousy that he portrays, is not the bad kind. He only is angered, because he created us, and we look to other material things to worship, even though his soul purpose of creating us, was to love and to have fellowship with us. 

Now when it says that gods anger will burn against you, it doesn't mean that he will put his anger out on us, no he loves us too much to do that. Instead, this scripture represents, that God will not use his power, or take your free will away, just to make you love him. Instead, he will let you go down the path of destruction and face the eternity that you have chosen, because true love is not true, unless that person choses to love and is not forced to love.

God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell
This instance where God cast the angels to hell, was not him physically forcing them to be there, rather, the angels had sinned, as well as lucifer, who Jesus loved dearly, and they could no longer be in the presence of God with sin in their hearts.

 hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.
Rather, he has the power, and the will, to not save you from eternal doom.

And the Lord hardened the heart of Pharaoh, and he hearkened not unto them
You are looking at the wording wrong. The lord himself did not harden his heart, instead this scripture means the idea of the lord, or another god, hardened the heart of pharaoh.

Consider the work of God: for who can make that straight, which he hath made crooked?
This scripture represents, that no one can change the will of God, and no one can change sin into a good thing. For instance:
No one can make lies right, if God himself has proclaimed them to be evil.

Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
This scripture means, he has made us loving and caring, not forcing us to do so.

 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
Living an eternal life, is not something that he has forced us to do, rather, it is a gift he has given us. Now how to spend that eternal life is up to us.

 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
So, God isn't allowed to have free will? He never said I will kill who I will hate etc. 

 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Yes, God shows mercy, because if he really wanted to, then he could not show mercy, but that would be against his own scripture and laws. He won't so he will show mercy.

Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
This scripture demonstrates that God is not looking for us to do good deed to enter into his kingdom, rather, he is looking for people that follow his laws on purpose and grace, which was given to us by him. If anything, this scripture proves free will rather than argues against it.

And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Well, if you looked earlier at the scripture, you would see that is says this:

"The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with how Satan works. He will use all sorts of displays of power through signs and wonders that serve the lie, 10 and all the way that wickedness deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11 For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12 and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness."

God only send them those delusions through earthly things, because sin has to exist in a world full of sinful people, therefore God is playing into the sinner's desires, to show them the path of destruction.

 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
Yes, he chose us, and gave us free will to choose salvation or not.

All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life, the Lamb who was slain from the creation of the world.
The Lamb's book of life, is described as a book, in which God keeps all of his followers in. This scripture takes place in the last book of the bible, explaining the end times. So yes, at the end, when he comes back, he will have that book, to show all of the sinners' sins, and the righteous good doings, and vice versa.

Then why should I take any of it literally?
You should, and you shouldn't. That is one of the jobs of people who study the bible. They look at the bible and using context clues determine which scriptures have literal value. And which scriptures have metaphorical value. But all scriptures have both in some quantity.
#75
Sidewalker
Sidewalker's avatar
Debates: 8
Posts: 2,628
3
2
5
Sidewalker's avatar
Sidewalker
3
2
5
-->
@K_Michael
what is the basis of your belief that the Bible is a science book
If by 'science book' you mean a book that makes claims about reality, with specific subfields such as astronomy, biology, etc., then the Bible is unequivocally a science book. If you mean a book that makes claims about reality based upon scientific inquiry, then not so much, though 1 Kings 18:18-39 does qualify as a type of empirical experiment (Elijah ruins the controlled variables by pouring water on his sacrifice though).

The term 'science book' is yours though, I'm just saying that the Bible gets some pretty basic stuff wrong. I could literally check the flying insect claim with five minutes and a fly swatter. More importantly though, the Bible should be able to get stuff that isn't easily checkable right. God  should know that the earth orbits the sun, for instance. Yet it reads
He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.  Psalms 104:5 NIV

It is strictly a matter of your faith that you think that a factual error in a text written three thousand years ago invalidates religious belief, science believed that the sun orbited the earth until the Copernican revolution less than 500 years ago, does that invalidate science also?  Of course it doesn’t, you are applying a middle school understanding of science to a grade school understanding of religion, and it’s contrived by your ideological agenda and your religiously held belief that science and faith are at odds. 

You are contending that God wrote the Bible and got the science wrong, that is a preposterous contention based solely on your own faith.  When you challenge belief in God you are talking about metaphysics, particularly ontology, your commitment to materialism is a form of metaphysics and your second implied assertion, that the scientific method is the only reliable path to knowledge is a matter of epistemology. Ontology and epistemology are branches of metaphysics, you aren’t talking about science, you are making faith based metaphysical assertions, which is fine, but don’t try to pass them off as science or scientific conclusions, that isn’t what they are.

is that a principle of your faith perhaps?
I don't have a faith.
Sure you do, it’s a faith based belief in scientism, and it is deeply religious in nature. All fundamentalists say they don’t have faith, they are just talking about the way things are, they are presenting facts. Your religious beliefs are no different than any other fundamentalist religious beliefs, they are characterized by rigid adherence to strictly faith-based principles with a pretense of being the sole source of objective truth, and opposition to those who hold other beliefs.

#76
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,427
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@BrotherD.Thomas
No disappearing here fake man. 

I just can't be bothered conversing with an ignorant bum.  

When you learn to engage - we may converse.  I am not going to hold my breath. 
#77
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,427
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
There are many ways to prove gods' existence, and the ones who try to disprove I can use their arguments against them.
proving god's existence is easy. using a philosophical logical argument can do that. For instance -  there are absolutely no such thing as an absolute. This is a self contradictory statement which proves absolutes exist.  The question is - what is the absolute? 

Or we could use a similar argument in respect of the typical agnostic statement. "there is no way of knowing whether God exists or not".  Of course this too is a self contradictory statement. How can we know this about God - unless we know something about God?  It proves the existence of God. And if that is the end game then we have achieved it. 

Proving that a particular god exists is another whole step though isn't it? 

If God exists - he she or it either wants us to know about it or not? I suppose they could be indifferent too. If he doesn't want us to know - we would not know. If he does, then the question is how would he she or it think is the best way of letting us become aware? If it is indifferent - then whether we know or not becomes immaterial to God - and he she or it will simply do things - when and if they so choose to. Given that this last notion would mean that god does things randomly and with forethought since it is indifferent - then the conclusion must be one of the first two. Either he doesn't want us to know - which is fundamentally dumb given all of the religious positions found in the world. or he does want us to know. 

How would God choose to reveal himself? What a great question.  But I suppose I will let you respond to my first part of analysis and then we may go further. 


#78
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,006
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Those facts are wrong.

Yes, that is correct, those aren't actually facts.

In fact, no scriptural narrative is factual.

So, we might be able to pin down locations.

But as for what people may have uttered.

We have no way of substantiating anything that might have been said.

And what might have been said, certainly wasn't uttered in English.
#79
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,595
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
Stephen wrote: So the 7 day creation story is not to be taken literally but the  1 day = 1,000 years is to be taken literally?
How do you know?


YouFound_Lxam Wrote: Here is the thing about the scripture. The scripture doesn't always mean something literally happened, and it doesn't mean something metaphorically happened.
All very ambiguous then.
So how do you know when to take something literal or metaphorical? Did the  illiterate  superstitious Jews and early Christians understand metaphor and idioms? 
From what I have read even the disciples of Jesus didn't understand what he was talking about most of the time, so how can you claim that you understand what is meant by something spoken 2000 years ago, when the local goatherd and fisherman couldn't?

Stephen wrote: "So the 7-day creation story is not to be taken literally but the 1 day = 1,000 years is to be taken literally?"

YouFound_Lxam wrote: Yes maybe. But maybe by the scripture saying that, it could be representing that God lives outside of time, therefore it was portrayed differently.

But then again it could have meant a literal 7 days, or 7 thousand years. Thats the fascinating thing about the bible.
"maybe it is"?    "could have meant"?

That's called make it up as you go along where I come from.  And opens the door for you take  literary licence and apply any excuse as long as it suites.



YouFound_Lxam wrote, That's the fascinating thing about the bible.



And it is fascinating to me that Christians have had 2000 years to iron out these ambiguous half stories that make up the NT and  with every new excuse for these biblical ambiguities comes new dilemmas and questions To put that in English, you Christians have  continually  been putting patches on a burst innertube for over 2000 years and it has left you holding nothing but patches..


You should actually take note of what your Christ had to say on such matters.

Matthew 9:16-17 New International Version
“No one sews a patch of unshrunk cloth on an old garment, for the patch will pull away from the garment, making the tear worse. Neither do people pour new wine into old wineskins. If they do, the skins will burst; the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. No, they pour new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved.”




#80
Elliott
Elliott's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 407
2
2
6
Elliott's avatar
Elliott
2
2
6
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
So, evolution, can create emotions and morality?
Basically yes, although evolution operates through selection rather than creation, it simply selects those traits that are beneficial for survival.
#81
ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,839
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@YouFound_Lxam
1: The Singularity
Aka null geodesics i.e. where math of general relativity leads to in black hole scenarios and proved by Roger Penrose in 1965 paper, for which he received nobel prize in 2018 or so.

Penrose does not think a singularity is begining of our finite, occupied space Universe. Penrose believes our Universe is eternally existent in various phases and transformative cycles he calls aeons.

A big bang is just a name for events of which no one really knows what occured.  We do know there exist cosmic laws that state, energy cannot be created nor destroyed ergo, energy as an occupied space cannot be created nor destroyed only transformed between various phase states of existence.

2: Design Has to Have a Designer
There is no design or designer.  Humans have purpose and create designs.
Universe has not purpose and does not design.

where does design originate?
There is no origin since energy cannot be created nor destroyed it eternally exists in various phase-states  of fermionic matter, bosonic forces, Gravity and Dark Energy.

3. What Created Life?
1} w dont know that biologic life was created,

2} if it was created from where before there was none, it is called random chance of simple to complex evolution of non-life substance to living substance.

Just because humans have not created life, does not mean it has no arisen on its own.

5. Human Reasoning

Something you need more of and I call logical common sense.

Humans have unique ability to  access Meta-space mind/intellect/concepts and conceptualize a finite Universe, and conceptually place themselves outside of the the conceptual Universe, as if they are this conceptual God, looking back in on the Universe, holding it in its conceptual hands.

.....space(> * <) i  (> * <)space.....

space = truly non-occupied and occupied

>< = dipolar invaginations from ultra-high nummber of space-time tori, that, result in sine-wave pattern /\/\/ aka physical reality

* * = bilateral consciousness found in reality with woman being the most complex entity of Universe, barring  two or more women or man and woman or a black hole with encoding for biologic life embedded within

(  ) = postive shaped geodesic Gravity aka Spirit-3 { Meta-physical }

)(  = negative shaped geodesic Dark Energy aka Spirit-4 { Meta-physical }

i = ego identification as Meta-space concept










#82
Novice_II
Novice_II's avatar
Debates: 98
Posts: 174
2
6
6
Novice_II's avatar
Novice_II
2
6
6
.....space(> * <) i  (> * <)space.....

space = truly non-occupied and occupied

>< = dipolar invaginations from ultra-high nummber of space-time tori, that, result in sine-wave pattern /\/\/ aka physical reality

* * = bilateral consciousness found in reality with woman being the most complex entity of Universe, barring  two or more women or man and woman or a black hole with encoding for biologic life embedded within

(  ) = postive shaped geodesic Gravity aka Spirit-3 { Meta-physical }

)(  = negative shaped geodesic Dark Energy aka Spirit-4 { Meta-physical }

i = ego identification as Meta-space concept
This is literally just pure nonsense.
#83
Best.Korea
Best.Korea's avatar
Debates: 352
Posts: 10,367
4
6
10
Best.Korea's avatar
Best.Korea
4
6
10
-->
@Novice_II
"This is literally just pure nonsense."

Ummm

Its an argument that claims how human logic and human life is a product of gravitational movement in eternal space.

Or, to put it simply, he claims that world is divided into smallest parts which are eternal, while the form they make together is not eternal.

Its just a complicated way of saying: Things werent created. They always existed, they just change form.

Its an alternative explanation that doesnt require God.
#84
Tarik
Tarik's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 2,481
3
3
5
Tarik's avatar
Tarik
3
3
5
-->
@Elliott
which in terms of survival is about as good as it gets.
But the value of survival can only be objectively proven through God, there’s no other logical justification.
#85
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Tradesecret

. 
MISS TRADESECRET, whose gender went from a “MAN TO A WOMAN,” and then to “OTHER,” then went to her being 53 years old, then 12 years old, then changed to being 14 years old, Debate Runaway on Jesus' true MO,  Bible denier of Jesus being God in the OT, the runaway to what division of Christianity she follows, the pseudo-christian that has committed the Unpardonable Sin, the number 1 Bible ignorant fool regarding the Noah's Ark narrative, SHE SAYS THAT OFFSPRING THAT CURSE THEIR PARENTS SHOULD BE KILLED, states there is FICTION within the scriptures, and is guilty of Revelation 22:18-19, 2 Timothy 4:3, and 1 Timothy 2:12. She obviously had ungodly Gender Reassignment Surgery, Satanic Bible Rewriter, she goes against Jesus in not helping the poor, teaches Christianity at Universities in a “blind leading the blind” scenario, and is a False Prophet, says that Jesus is rational when He commits abortions and makes His creation eat their children, and that Jesus is rational when He allows innocent babies to be smashed upon the rocks, will not debate me on the Trinity Doctrine or the Virgin Birth, has a myriad of EXCUSES not to answer your questions, and says that the Bible contradicts itself, and she is "AN ADMITTED SEXUAL DEVIANT!!!!!”


Addressing ANOTHER runaway post of yours #76 in this thread,

YOUR RUNAWAY EXCUSE TO A POSTS OF MINE BECAUSE YOU CANNOT ADDRESS THEM: "I just can't be bothered conversing with an ignorant bum.  When you learn to engage - we may converse.  I am not going to hold my breath."

Miss Tradesecret, the last time that I did engage you regarding your complete BIBLE STUPIDITY, is shown in the links below that you ran away from with your lame excuse shown above:


I can understand in why you had to RUN AWAY from them, because again, what you thought you knew about the Bible, you didn't! LOL!


Seriously, at what point will you not put up with being made the continuous Bible fool, and either leave this esteemed forum that you are giving a bad name to, or to save face, change your moniker and rejoin this Religion Forum?


NEXT PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN WOMAN LIKE "MISS TRADESECRET" THAT HAS TO USE LAME LITTLE GIRLY EXCUSES TO RUN AWAY FROM POSTS TO HER THAT SHE CANNOT REPOND TOO BECAUSE OF HER BIBLE STUPIDITY, WILL BE ...?

.


#86
Elliott
Elliott's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 407
2
2
6
Elliott's avatar
Elliott
2
2
6
-->
@Tarik
which in terms of survival is about as good as it gets.
But the value of survival can only be objectively proven through God, there’s no other logical justification.
You have taken that quote out of context, it related to evolution and that being at the top of the food chain maximises our chance for survival.
 
However, to address your point, the value of survival it is an end in itself as the alternative is non existence, which has no value.
 
#87
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Tradesecret
@YouFound_Lxam


.
YouFound_Lxam,

YOUR BIBLE STUPID QUOTE AGAIN!: “God doesn't want people to worship him.”

HELLO?” Are you trying to be more Bible dumbfounded than Miss Tradesecret? Huh?  The JUDEO-Christian bible that you absolutely no NOTHING about says Jesus as God wants to be worshiped, you Bible fool as the passages shown below so state:

“But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” (John 23:23-24)

“Then Jesus said to him, “Be gone, Satan! For it is written, “‘You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve.” (Matthew 4:10)

“Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.” (John 4:21)
 All scripture is given by inspiration of God." (2 Timothy 3:16)

 Obviously you have forgotten this important passage:  "All scripture is given by inspiration of God." (2 Timothy 3:16). GET IT BIBLE FOOL?


NEXT DUMBFOUNDED OF THE BIBLE LIKE "YOUFOUND_LXAM" THAT DOESN'T KNOW HIS ASS FROM A WILD GRAPE WILL BE ...?


.
#88
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@YouFound_Lxam


.
YouFound_Lxam,

YOUR QUOTE IN SHOWING US THAT YOUR BIBLE STUPIDITY HAS NO BOUNDS! LOL!: “Yes, he chose us, and gave us free will to choose salvation or not.”

Did Satan send you to this forum to make a Bible fool of yourself and to give Christianity a bad name?  Listen up you Bible inept pseudo-christian, Jesus, as God, controls everything and therefore WE DO NOT HAVE FREE WILL like you so stupidly state, and as the following passages so state:

“In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,” (Ephesians 1:11).  Key word: PREDESTINED where Jesus’ creation have absolutely no free will, period!

“The lot is cast into the lap, but it's every decision is from the LORD” (Proverbs 16:33).  

"Many are the plans in the mind of a man, but it is the purpose of the Lord that will stand (Proverbs 19:21).

"The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps" (Proverbs 16:9).

JESUS SAID: "For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord, plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope (Jeremiah 29:11).

Can your child like reading comprehension understand the above passages where with biblical axioms as shown, WE DO NOT HAVE FREE WILL!?



Further passages proving that we TRUE Christians DO NOT HAVE FREE WILL, and where Jesus controls our every action!

“If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.” (1 John 3:20)

“Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground outside your Father’s care. And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered.” (Matthew 10:29-30)

“Remember the former things, those of long ago; I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me. I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come.” (Isaiah 46:9-10)

“Oh Lord, You have searched me and known me. You know when I sit down and when I rise up; You understand my thought from afar. You scrutinize my path and my lying down, And are intimately acquainted with ALL my ways.” (Psalm 139:1-3)

“Before a word is on my tongue you, Lord, know it completely.” (Psalm 139:4)

“Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written.  The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them.” (Psalm 139:16)


To the membership, as we can blatantly see, the new Bible fool YouFound_Lxam is vying to be more Bible stupid than Miss Tradesecret with all of his missteps regarding the JUDEO-Christian Bible! LOL!

.





#89
Tarik
Tarik's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 2,481
3
3
5
Tarik's avatar
Tarik
3
3
5
-->
@Elliott
However, to address your point, the value of survival it is an end in itself as the alternative is non existence, which has no value.
By that logic everything that exists is valuable which contradicts with the things you don’t care about, mentioning the alternative is a deviation from the actual narrative.
#90
BrotherD.Thomas
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,145
3
3
7
BrotherD.Thomas's avatar
BrotherD.Thomas
3
3
7
-->
@Tradesecret
@YouFound_Lxam

.
YouFound_Lxam,

THIS IS THE "THIRD TIME" YOU'VE RUN AWAY SCARED FROM MY POST #36 TO YOU IN THE LINK BELOW WHERE YOU HAVE YET TO ANSWER IT FULLY, UNDERSTOOD? 

Are you that NERVOUS and AFRAID of the biblical axioms and truths that I have shown you in the link below, therefore you have to RUN AWAY from ALL of them?  


Address ALL of my post above to you!  BEGIN:


NEXT BIBLE FOOL LIKE "YOUFOUND_LXAM" THAT WENT TO TRADESECRET'S SCHOOL OF HOW TO RUN AWAY FROM POSTS THAT YOU CANNOT ANSWER, WILL BE ...?


.