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Author: rbelivb

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#121
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@3RU7AL
(IFF) you believe it is UNFAIR for an employer to fire someone for NON-WORK-RELATED activities (THEN) either join or form a labor union
No more than a girlfriend would join a group of pasts ex-girlfriends or current "side-pieces" because she was unfairly dumped by a boyfriend for non-sexual reasons.

"freedom of speech" does not mean "freedom from social consequences"
Well stated.
#122
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@3RU7AL
many older (and or taller and or overweight and or muscular) women (who are born as women and also identify as women) can be routinely mistaken for men and face repeated harassment in public restrooms
Give us your source.

Also I am curious of something since you cowered out of replying to my quoted solid retorts to your 'self determination' BS, why is it when I self-identify as INTP you get triggered and need to force me to 'admit' to being ESTJ or whatever it is you think I am?
#123
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“The brain and the body can go in different directions,” Dr. Murat Altinay says. “Gender is not only in our genitalia; there’s something in the brain that determines gender.”
#124
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Also I am curious of something since you cowered out of replying to my quoted solid retorts to your 'self determination' BS, why is it when I self-identify as INTP you get triggered and need to force me to 'admit' to being ESTJ or whatever it is you think I am?
I'm actually quite certain I mentioned how pleased I am that you self-identify as INTP.

I merely pointed out that (from my perspective) your writing has the earmarks of ESTJ (and even this most recent comment of yours exemplifies this).

This would be like me telling someone they appear to have beliefs that are similar to Taoist teachings (even if they don't choose to self-identify as a Taoist).

MBTI is fundamentally distinct from other "self-identification" labels, such as "male" or "female" (which are beyond our epistemological limits, because that information is specifically hidden underneath your clothes and skin).

MBTI is fundamentally distinct from other "self-identification" labels, such as "christian" or "muslim" or "deist" or "gnostic" (which are also beyond our epistemological limits, because sincerity cannot be quantified).
#125
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@3RU7AL
This would be like me telling someone they appear to have beliefs that are similar to Taoist teachings (even if they don't choose to self-identify as a Taoist).
Yeah and what is wrong with that? Are you a fan of silencing people because of the easily offended?
#126
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@3RU7AL
MBTI is fundamentally distinct from other "self-identification" labels, such as "male" or "female" (which are beyond our epistemological limits, because that information is specifically hidden underneath your clothes and skin).

MBTI is fundamentally distinct from other "self-identification" labels, such as "christian" or "muslim" or "deist" or "gnostic" (which are also beyond our epistemological limits, because sincerity cannot be quantified).
Sure, it's distinct but it's also in the category of self-identifiable aspects that others can say 'no you're not' but if anything MBTI is even more difficult to justify defying the self-identification of as it is psychology and not overt biology, better luck next time though.
#127
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@RationalMadman
many older (and or taller and or overweight and or muscular) women (who are born as women and also identify as women) can be routinely mistaken for men and face repeated harassment in public restrooms
Give us your source.



#128
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@RationalMadman
Sure, it's distinct but it's also in the category of self-identifiable aspects that others can say 'no you're not' but if anything MBTI is even more difficult to justify defying the self-identification of as it is psychology and not overt biology, better luck next time though.
MBTI is detectable in the words you use.

Good luck identifying anyone's "biology" over the intarwebz.
#129
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@3RU7AL
How do any of those sources know that she was mistaken for a man? What if she changed her mind half way walking into the bathroom or on her way out? Or 'his' way or 'their' way?

I am asking seriously how we are determining it being mistaken or not. I know this can sound transphobic but this is actually about law/policy and enforcing protections of both cisgender and transgender people if we are to do so since you are giving a cisgender person misgendered, how do we know for sure that the people telling her to get out were mistakenly calling her a him/he?

I ask you sincerely to specify to me how we know a mistake was made, should we look perhaps to social media beforehand, ask relatives which gender pronouns this individual went by beforehand or what?

I'd say in this case a solid basis for it being mistaken is that it is a genuine female adult who happens to appear masculine. Would you agree that is the case? Would you also agree that if nobody who was male-sex entered a female bathroom/washroom that the hostility and caution the cis females had around her wouldn't have taken place nearly as likely as they'd have given the benefit of the doubt since people don't do that?

I am also curious if you support the solution of unisex bathrooms in most places, the issue of 'protecting women from men' is kind of negated due to transgendered people existing so the 'safe space' from adult males is kind of becoming moot, I also think unisex bathrooms/washrooms would be a huge step in evading the clash altogether with respects to that.
#130
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@3RU7AL
MBTI is detectable in the words you use.

Good luck identifying anyone's "biology" over the intarwebz.
Oh you meant over the Internet when you were arguing with all the people so far who said they can spot a man from a woman fairly easily IRL? That is a fascinating way to go about things.

I am also curious which pronouns you use to somebody if you have any kind of IRL job, whether it be a colleague or a client/customer, unless they are particularyl androgynous in both physique, dress and name would you not dare to presume a gender and say sir/ma'am or how do you approach asking each and every person you meet what they identify as? I can imagine a huge amount of cisgendered and even transgendered (who blatantly appear as their chosen gender) would get offended by your approach of asking. :)
#131
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@RationalMadman
how do we know for sure that the people telling her to get out were mistakenly calling her a him/he?
Read at least one of the articles.

Ask a specific question.
#132
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@RationalMadman
they can spot a man from a woman fairly easily IRL?
Sample.

Bias.
#133
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@3RU7AL
If by sample bias you mean a necessary social skill level required for you not to offend the fuck out of someone who isn't particularly androgynous in appearance and/or fashion then sure.

I can tell that your stances are written from somebody who barely can get by socially, that's why you think you're superior to others. The reason I am going as far as to overtly ad hominem here is that I gave you a full-scale open chance to justify to me how you get by in daily life dealing with men and women that you refuse to presume the gender of.

You could not so either you're being a hypocrite here or you don't really interact enough to understand.

Also, if you were interested, I am actually capable of spotting feminine and masculine personalities over text like you say you can spot MBTI Jung personality types.

The difference is I'm already baseline 25/50 likely to be right and work my way up. Your baseline is 3.125/50 likelihood to be right. I have actually made threads even on here showing my reads on people in the past, which shocked them (not the whiteflame impersonation thread, that's just entertainment). If you want me to tell you what I think of you ask some questions to me on PM, if you were curious I assess you to be an ISTP but I don't put massive amounts of weight on myers-briggs as it ignores severity of each and how significanty that can impact a personality, I also feel it's misunderstood P/J because they aren't opposites but I'll debate that later.
#134
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@3RU7AL
how do we know for sure that the people telling her to get out were mistakenly calling her a him/he?
Read at least one of the articles.

Ask a specific question.
I did :)

The instinctive answer is because she is a female who has always been so. As for your answer, that's just lazy.

the problem with that is it doesn't defend trans people.

Alternatively, we could say that on texts, IRL interactions etc she's always wanted to be a she/her.

Why didn't you reply to the rest of what I wrote, are you okay with your reading comprehension?
#135
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@RationalMadman
Why didn't you reply to the rest of what I wrote, are you okay with your reading comprehension?
I'm still trying to figure out exactly what you're trying to argue here.

Are you suggesting that these women, who were born women (according to their birth-certificate and drivers license), and have always identified as women, that these women were NOT mistaken for men and harassed for being in a women's public bathroom ?

Do you see the problem here?

Self-described CONSERVATIVES are the ones who are more likely to "MISGENDER" someone.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES don't care about "real-reality" like they keep insisting.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES are consistently OVERCONFIDENT in their personal opinions regarding their perceptions of the world around them.

Classic "S" (ESFJ)
#136
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@RationalMadman
the problem with that is it doesn't defend trans people.
Please be slightly more specific.
#137
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@3RU7AL
Are you suggesting that these women, who were born women (according to their birth-certificate and drivers license), and have always identified as women, that these women were NOT mistaken for men and harassed for being in a women's public bathroom ?

Do you see the problem here?
Actually, let's say I am since you want to force it to be a claim.

Let's say I am indeed claiming that these cisgendered women are entitled to be mistaken for men. How can you say I am wrong if you do not refer to the fact that they are female or what precise way did you determine that they have always gone by female because a birth-certificate mentions sex, not gender, even though it uses the term 'gender' it is clearly based on the genitalia alone.
#138
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@3RU7AL
The instinctive answer is because she is a female who has always been so. As for your answer, that's just lazy.

the problem with that is it doesn't defend trans people.
How is this not 'specific'?

I'm asking where you draw the idea that she was mistaken as a woman without harming the trans agenda.

You then mention birth certificate.
#139
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@3RU7AL
Do you see the problem here?

Self-described CONSERVATIVES are the ones who are more likely to "MISGENDER" someone.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES don't care about "real-reality" like they keep insisting.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES are consistently OVERCONFIDENT in their personal opinions regarding their perceptions of the world around them.

Classic "S" (ESFJ)
So all people who call themselves conservatives are ESFJ and have weak perception of reality? Literally all?
#140
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@3RU7AL
I made an error before that I edited to be 3.25/50 but to be clear:

25/50 baseline gender correct guessing.

(25/8)/50 baseline MBTI correct guessing.

The odds become more in your favor the more genders that there are and more prominent that the non-binary ones are. 

I am curious if you are pushing for they/them pronouns or transition to she/her and he/him pronouns.
#141
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@RationalMadman
I'm asking where you draw the idea that she was mistaken as a woman without harming the trans agenda.
I honestly have no idea what you think the "trans agenda" is.

AND,

I also honestly have no idea how you think anything in this conversation "harms" the "trans agenda".

What "harm" is this causing, specifically ?
#142
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@RationalMadman
So all people who call themselves conservatives are ESFJ and have weak perception of reality? Literally all?
I never said "all".

And an "S" type actually has a very strong perception of reality.

The perception is not "the problem".

The OVERCONFIDENCE is "the problem".

It is important to maintain a constant awareness of and vigilant respect of our epistemological limits.
#143
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@RationalMadman
I am curious if you are pushing for they/them pronouns or transition to she/her and he/him pronouns.
I couldn't give less of a shit what pronouns anyone chooses.

It's exactly like people who choose to "go by" their middle name instead of their first name.

There's no way for you to know until they tell you.

A pronoun is a placeholder for someone's name.

People get to choose what they "go by".
#144
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@RationalMadman
Let's say I am indeed claiming that these cisgendered women are entitled to be mistaken for men.
Entitled to be harassed and have the cops called on them for NOT committing any crime at all ?

Please explain.

How can you say I am wrong if you do not refer to the fact that they are female or what precise way did you determine that they have always gone by female because a birth-certificate mentions sex, not gender, even though it uses the term 'gender' it is clearly based on the genitalia alone.
I read the report.

They call themselves "female" and a judge agreed with them.
#145
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@3RU7AL
I can now tell you are arguing in completely bad faith when you reply to my 'lets say I am' as literal and sidetrack the entire thing, while ignoring the important part.

I have replied in depth to you and you replied to one fucking line from it a few posts ago.

You are just being toxic and petty here, regardless of whatever your actual stance is (because at this point I think you are just trying some mental gymnastics for the hell of it).

You haven't replied to over 90% of what I wrote to you in the past few posts, you just quote snippets and barely reply to the words in them, instead you misconstrue and contort.

I am not interested in this exchange, you are completely bad faith or straight up stupid. Whichever it is, I am out. When you want to actually reply to the stuff you ignored, let me know by replying to it. There are several questions you didn't answer and several lines you didn't show you took in even indirectly by your replying.
#146
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@RationalMadman
Self-described CONSERVATIVES are the ones who are more likely to "MISGENDER" someone.
Are you honestly suggesting that LIBERALS are the ones who are more likely to call the cops on someone in a public bathroom for "wearing the wrong clothes" ?
#147
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@3RU7AL
I never said "all".

And an "S" type actually has a very strong perception of reality.


Self-described CONSERVATIVES are the ones who are more likely to "MISGENDER" someone.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES don't care about "real-reality" like they keep insisting.

Self-described CONSERVATIVES are consistently OVERCONFIDENT in their personal opinions regarding their perceptions of the world around them.

Classic "S" (ESFJ)
Something does not add up here. Where is it you elaborate on what your point even is?

Is your point just that you are limited or something? You just said S has the opposite to what you said is 'classic S' ...
#148
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@RationalMadman
You haven't replied to over 90% of what I wrote to you in the past few posts,
I skipped over the ad hominem attacks.
#149
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@3RU7AL
Self-described CONSERVATIVES are the ones who are more likely to "MISGENDER" someone.
Are you honestly suggesting that LIBERALS are the ones who are more likely to call the cops on someone in a public bathroom for "wearing the wrong clothes" ?
I never remotely suggested it at all, I think you are becoming lost in your bad faith arguments to the point that you're quoting yourself in order to misconstrue what I said.
#150
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@RationalMadman
Is your point just that you are limited or something? You just said S has the opposite to what you said is 'classic S' ...
Yes, 

and this seems typical of our miscommunications.

Even the best perceptions have limits.

Failure to recognize (your own) perceptual limits results in OVERCONFIDENCE.

These limits are commonly referred to as "epistemological limits".