NO, NO, NO, Pope stay away from the kids! ...........

Author: BrotherD.Thomas

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Pope Francis kisses Ukrainian flag as he denounces 'massacre of Bucha’ as shown in the link below:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/pope-francis-kisses-ukrainian-flag-as-he-denounces-massacre-of-bucha-133224758.html

“He told the audience he had received a Ukrainian flag from the “martyred city” of Bucha the day before. The pope then held up a war-stained flag before folding it and kissing it. BUT WAIT!  A group of "children" who had fled the war in Ukraine joined him on the podium! “These "children" had to flee and come to a strange land,” Francis said. “This is one of the fruits of war. Let’s not forget them, and let’s not forget the Ukrainian people.”

BUT, WHAT WAS NERVE RACKING IS THE FACT THAT THE POPE HAD INNOCENT CHILDREN STANDING WITHIN “TOUCHING DISTANCE” OF HIM AS SHOWN IN THE LINK BELOW:
https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME972AT


As we should all be aware, the Catholic church still is in the press regarding pedophile priests, and the history going back to the late 1960’s where under Bishop RATzinger, they ungodly hid the fact that their priests were buggering innocent childrenand once caught, they were moved to another church and state in the USA in a “hush, hush” manner which is BLASPHEME to Jesus the Christ!

At least this Catholic priest is telling the truth about ungodly pedophilia within the Catholic church:  https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME971QU

Here is the irony of all ironies, as Pope John spills the beans in this link relating to pedophilia in the Catholic church: https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME971FF


QUESTION; who wants to be a hell bound Catholic whose church hid pedophile priests, and spent 6 BILLION DOLLARS of their flocks money from collection plates on Sunday mornings to pay over time the reparations to the parents of the buggered kids by smelly old priests, and the ramification of these poor kids needing psychiatric help in the aftermath, raise your hands!  :(


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As we should all be aware, the Catholic church still is in the press regarding pedophile priests, and the history going back to the late 1960’s where under Bishop RATzinger, they ungodly hid the fact that their priests were buggering innocent children, and once caught, they were moved to another church and state in the USA in a “hush, hush” manner which is BLASPHEME to Jesus the Christ!
Just one question, if these priests were "caught" how were they moved by the church when they were in prison?
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@BrotherD.Thomas
QUESTION;    who wants to be a hell bound Catholic whose church hid pedophile priests, and spent 6 BILLION DOLLARS of their flocks money from collection plates on Sunday mornings to pay over time the reparations to the parents of the buggered kids by smelly old priests, and the ramification of these poor kids needing psychiatric help in the aftermath, raise your hands!  :(

Self confessed sexual deviants and perverts, by all accounts, Brother D.
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@ADreamOfLiberty

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ADreamOfLiberty,

YOUR QUOTE: "Just one question, if these priests were "caught" how were they moved by the church when they were in prison?"

The pedophile priests were NOT in prison because the church took care of them and swept their misdeeds under the rug with their own rules. 

For the most part, pedophile priests were reported by the parents when little Timmy came home and said his butt hurt after the priest took him into the "Rectory" of the church to talk to him about a secret they were to keep in the name of Jesus!  Subsequently, if they had enough complaints regarding the same Pedophile priest, the church would remove him to another parish in the same state, or another state altogether.  In other words, the Catholic church allowed their pedophile priests to continue buggering innocent children, and hide said priests at the same time by moving them around the country!  

Read about one of many Popes like George RATzinger who continued to coverup pedophile priests in protecting church leaders ahead of innocent children and other vulnerable people.  DISGUSTING!

Who wants to be a Catholic by "guilt of association" in the church covering up their pedophile priests,  raise you hands!

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@BrotherD.Thomas
The pedophile priests were NOT in prison because the church took care of them and swept their misdeeds under the rug with their own rules. 
If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt of this, that would be a conspiracy to obstruct justice and is a crime almost everywhere (not always called that). Perhaps you should report it.
I'm afraid that is just a meme.

For the most part, pedophile priests were reported by the parents when little Timmy came home and said his butt hurt after the priest took him into the "Rectory" of the church to talk to him about a secret they were to keep in the name of Jesus!  Subsequently, if they had enough complaints regarding the same Pedophile priest, the church would remove him to another parish in the same state, or another state altogether.  In other words, the Catholic church allowed their pedophile priests to continue buggering innocent children, and hide said priests at the same time by moving them around the country!  
So the theory is that parents of a child suspected their child had received anal penetration from a priest...  the priest told the child to keep it a secret, and these parents did not go to the police, they wrote the church a complaint....

No I'm afraid that doesn't add up. The reaction of 99.95% of parents upon such a suspicion being formed ranges between calling the FBI, local, and state police within a one hour period and buying a gun to kill the suspected person.

Being content with leaving a note "BTW maybe this priest violated my kid, could you please make sure it doesn't happen again, thanks :)" to the priest's employer/family (because that is the role of the church to a priest) is not a plausible reaction. If that was the reaction of any parent, that parent is not fit to raise their children because it is extremely well known that upon receiving credible information of a crime the only people who can or should do anything about it are the police.
Read about one of many Popes like George RATzinger who continued to coverup pedophile priests in protecting church leaders ahead of innocent children and other vulnerable people.  DISGUSTING!
If it wasn't for ratzinger claiming for the church the role of criminal investigator you wouldn't even have the accusations you have now, yet now you accuse him of being part of the coverup.

A far more likely explanation is that like the confirmation hearings of Clarence Thomas, Brett Kavanaugh, and the so called russian prostitutes of Trump there is no firm or reliable evidence and because there was no firm or reliable evidence no police reports were filed and no legal action taken.

The slander and the libel thrives only in the fertile soil of lesser evidentiary standards like gossip, tabloids, and apparently internal church investigations.

I may not always agree with the decision of a jury, but I will never have anything but the highest suspicion for accusations that were never even reported to police.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I will never have anything but the highest suspicion for accusations that were never even reported to police.

You are coming across no better than those that preferred to turn a blind eye.

If it wasn't for ratzinger claiming for the church the role of criminal investigator you wouldn't even have the accusations you have now, yet now you accuse him of being part of the coverup.

So I will take it that you are pretending to have never heard of John Geoghan the American serial child rapist and Roman Catholic priest assigned to parishes in the Archdiocese of Boston in Massachusetts. He was re-assigned to several parish posts involving interaction with children, even after receiving treatment for pedophilia? Robert Joseph Banks, when an auxiliary bishop in Boston, had recommended in 1989 that Geoghan remain as a parish priest despite receiving an assessment that he would likely continue to act on his pedophilia. Banks was appointed bishop of the Diocese of Green Bay in 1990. He retired in 2003, having reached the church's mandatory retirement age of 75 years. Banks remains Bishop Emeritus of Green Bay.Catholic Archdiocese of Boston sex abuse scandal - Wikipedia

And this Hollywood movie was complete fiction although based on a Pulitzer prized investigation into paedophilia in the RC Church, was it?

The Boston Globe’s Pulitzer Prize-winning investigation of pedophile Roman Catholic priests, deals with just a fraction of sexual predation in the church, its director says.
“These moments where we know people have done things wrong and we don’t, as a society, we don’t stand up to them, it takes years and years and years and the question is why? Why does it take so long?” McCarthy said in an interview on Wednesday.

The Globe’s Spotlight team exposed the attacks over a period of decades by priests in the Boston archdiocese who molested young boys but instead of being reported to the police were given counseling and moved to a different parish. The expose led to the resignation of Boston’s Cardinal Bernard Law in 2002.
The film for the most part focuses on how the Globe’s team tracked down and confronted some of the offending priests.
Team members interviewed victims who were still distraught and disturbed decades later, and established that the Roman Catholic Church had a policy of paying victims to remain silent, and not rock the boat by making their allegations public.

McCarthy said that despite making some concessions to legal authorities by eventually turning over church records, he doubted the Church had fundamentally reformed.
“There are still cases in the church, right? The new pope (Francis) just appointed a tribunal with Cardinal (Sean Patrick) O’Malley out of Boston to oversee these cases but then SNAP (a victims’ group) and all these different organizations are saying it’s not enough, you’ve appointed an in-house tribunal, we are not going to get justice from that,” McCarthy said.
“I still believe in the Catholic Church, I believe in the good they can do but they are an institution that has to sort of take responsibility for the crimes they’ve committed against their parishioners and their constituency and own it — and they are not yet.”
Ruffalo said he hoped the film would help to build pressure on the church to undertake further reforms.
“Many people left the Catholic faith because of a lot of this and it suffered but I feel like maybe now we can have a discussion with the Pope that’s in…and maybe it could start doing some reparations to the credibility of an institution that has meant a lot to people over the centuries.
“I think it’s essential, it must be done.”

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@Stephen
I will never have anything but the highest suspicion for accusations that were never even reported to police.
You are coming across no better than those that preferred to turn a blind eye.
That is likely a result of your biases. The message I'm sending is: Innocent until proven guilty, no matter how angry the crime makes you feel. In fact if you feel very angry you need to be extra careful to be objective.

If it wasn't for ratzinger claiming for the church the role of criminal investigator you wouldn't even have the accusations you have now, yet now you accuse him of being part of the coverup.
So I will take it that you are pretending to have never heard of John Geoghan the American serial child rapist and Roman Catholic priest assigned to parishes in the Archdiocese of Boston in Massachusetts.... etc etc...
No I hadn't heard the name before. Was he charged? If he wasn't charged but the evidence was brought to the police then clearly the police are part of the conspiracy and they are the real problem since they (unlike church officials) are subject to democratic power.

“These moments where we know people have done things wrong and we don’t, as a society, we don’t stand up to them, it takes years and years and years and the question is why? Why does it take so long?”
That is a very good question. Even in 1989 dialing the police non-emergency number, explaining the evidence and setting up a meeting with a detective would take less than half an hour. The only plausible reason I can imagine this not happening is that there existed at the time, no compelling evidence.

The Globe’s Spotlight team exposed the attacks over a period of decades by priests in the Boston archdiocese who molested young boys but instead of being reported to the police were given counseling and moved to a different parish.
"Instead of being reported to the police", yea who made that decision? Not someone who had reliable evidence of sexual abuse I will continue to infer.

Team members interviewed victims who were still distraught and disturbed decades later, and established that the Roman Catholic Church had a policy of paying victims to remain silent, and not rock the boat by making their allegations public.
If that could be proven, that's child prostitution, pull the bank records. If nobody reported this at the time, not the church, not the victims, not the victim's parents then the 'victims' were in on the coverup weren't they? Even money did change hands that is far from placing the blame squarely on some secret church policy, clearly the 'victims' wanted money more than they wanted justice.

Suppose the people who arranged this alleged payment in the church honestly believed the accusation was a lie and it was purely a matter of blackmail?

So this theory of the crime can essentially be described as sexual abuse which may or may not have occurred, followed by the parents essentially pimping out their own child by demanding money instead of going to the police. If there was no money on the table (and the parents knew that) then why would they not immediately go to the police? So who is more to blame some cardinals in Rome who probably had no idea about this alleged payout or the parents of the child who were supposed to protect that child caring more about money?

McCarthy said that despite making some concessions to legal authorities by eventually turning over church records
The police do not need to ask for records, if there is probable cause they can get a subpoena.


“Many people left the Catholic faith because of a lot of this and it suffered but I feel like maybe now we can have a discussion with the Pope that’s in…and maybe it could start doing some reparations to the credibility of an institution that has meant a lot to people over the centuries.
“I think it’s essential, it must be done.”
That pope would be Ratzinger, the one Brother.D said was covering for pedophiles? Seems like a witch hunt when all roads lead to the stake.
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@BrotherDThomas
So, curious to ask, what faction are you within Christianity?

You seem to tolerate God killing people back in the stories of the Bible, but this offends you. Just what are you?
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I will never have anything but the highest suspicion for accusations that were never even reported to police.
You are coming across no better than those that preferred to turn a blind eye.
That is likely a result of your biases.
What do you believe has caused my "biases". Do you think that I got out of bed one day and simply decided that the Roman Catholic Church was rife with paedophilia? 



The message I'm sending is: Innocent until proven guilty, no matter how angry the crime makes you feel. In fact if you feel very angry you need to be extra careful to be objective.
I agree, anger, like faith, can blind one to the truth of the matter.



If it wasn't for ratzinger claiming for the church the role of criminal investigator you wouldn't even have the accusations you have now, yet now you accuse him of being part of the coverup.
So I will take it that you are pretending to have never heard of John Geoghan the American serial child rapist and Roman Catholic priest assigned to parishes in the Archdiocese of Boston in Massachusetts.... etc etc  Catholic Archdiocese of Boston sex abuse scandal - Wikipedia
No I hadn't heard the name before. Was he charged?

So you didn't bother reading the link.





“These moments where we know people have done things wrong and we don’t, as a society, we don’t stand up to them, it takes years and years and years and the question is why? Why does it take so long?”
That is a very good question. Even in 1989 dialing the police non-emergency number, explaining the evidence and setting up a meeting with a detective would take less than half an hour. The only plausible reason I can imagine this not happening is that there existed at the time, no compelling evidence.

It is a good question. Did you research why this is the case?

The FBI did;

Church officials followed a “playbook for concealing the truth,” the reports states. The patterns were similar enough that FBI analyses of the church’s responses yielded seven rules, basically, an institutional guide to covering up abuse. Here are seven principles the jurors note:
  1. Make sure to use euphemisms rather than real words to describe the sexual assaults in diocese documents. Never say”rape”; say “inappropriate contact” or “boundary issues.”
  2. Don’t conduct genuine investigations with properly trained personnel. Instead, assign fellow clergy members to ask inadequate questions and then make credibility determinations about the colleagues with whom they live and work.
  3. For an appearance of integrity, send priests for “evaluation” at church-run psychiatric treatment centers. Allow these experts to “diagnose” whether the priest was a pedophile, based largely on the priest’s “self-reports” and regardless of whether the priest had actually engaged in sexual contact with a child.
  4. When a priest does have to be removed, don’t say why. Tell his parishioners that he is on “sick leave,” or suffering from”nervous exhaustion.” Or say nothing at all.
  5. Even if a priest is raping children, keep providing him housing and living expenses, although he may be using these resources to facilitate more sexual assaults.
  6. If a predator’s conduct becomes known to the community, don’t remove him from the priesthood to ensure that no more children will be victimized. Instead, transfer him to a new location where no one will know he is a child abuser.
  7. Finally, and above all, don’t tell the police. Child sexual abuse, even short of actual penetration, is and has for all relevant times been a crime. But don’t treat it that way; handle it like a personnel matter, “in house.”
In response to the report, Pennsylvania’s Catholic bishops issued a statement (paywall) calling for prayers for victims and the church. They promise more openness and said steps have been taken to make churches safer.The Catholic Church's seven-point system for covering up abuse — Quartz (qz.com)

AND here are two more good questions.

Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 





The Globe’s Spotlight team exposed the attacks over a period of decades by priests in the Boston archdiocese who molested young boys but instead of being reported to the police were given counseling and moved to a different parish.
"Instead of being reported to the police", yea who made that decision? Not someone who had reliable evidence of sexual abuse I will continue to infer.

So it will be the fault of children, their parents, the police and the local authorities, and not the RC Church according to your own biases.




Team members interviewed victims who were still distraught and disturbed decades later, and established that the Roman Catholic Church had a policy of paying victims to remain silent, and not rock the boat by making their allegations public.
If that could be proven, that's child prostitution, pull the bank records. If nobody reported this at the time, not the church, not the victims, not the victim's parents then the 'victims' were in on the coverup weren't they? Even money did change hands that is far from placing the blame squarely on some secret church policy, clearly the 'victims' wanted money more than they wanted justice.
This says more about your own biases than it ever will my own.



So this theory of the crime can essentially be described as sexual abuse which may or may not have occurred, followed by the parents essentially pimping out their own child by demanding money instead of going to the police. If there was no money on the table (and the parents knew that) then why would they not immediately go to the police? So who is more to blame some cardinals in Rome who probably had no idea about this alleged payout or the parents of the child who were supposed to protect that child caring more about money?

This too says more about your own biases than they ever will my own.



McCarthy said that despite making some concessions to legal authorities by eventually turning over church records
The police do not need to ask for records, if there is probable cause they can get a subpoena.

You don't seem to understand how this works do you?  You also underestimate the power of the RC Church and you obviously haven't ever heard of penitent privilege.





“Many people left the Catholic faith because of a lot of this and it suffered but I feel like maybe now we can have a discussion with the Pope that’s in…and maybe it could start doing some reparations to the credibility of an institution that has meant a lot to people over the centuries.
“I think it’s essential, it must be done.”
Seems like a witch hunt when all roads lead to the stake.
I suppose it would seem that way... if  you were a Roman Catholic.
 Tell me, do you believe a persons testimony should be taken as truth and at face value?

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He's an atheist that uses a "Christian" persona to get away with trolling.
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@the Witch.

-->@Intelligence_06
He's an atheist that uses a "Christian" persona to get away with trolling.

And you are not trolling?  Your comment has nothing to do with the theme of the thread or topic in hand.
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@Stephen

Yes,  a Church-commissioned report in 2004 said more than 4,000 US Roman Catholic priests had faced sexual abuse allegations in the last 50 years.
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@Stephen

So you didn't bother reading the link.

It is a good question. Did you research why this is the case?
I'm confident in the dichotomies I established, therefore I won't be accepting homework. Links are there to backup raw evidence not substitute for answers. If he was charged and found guilty then somebody managed to contact the right authority. If the assaults happened but people only negotiated with the church that's their fault. If there was no assault and there was a payout that is just blackmail.

Under no circumstances is the church the appropriate entity to be sending criminal complaints to, and therefore under no circumstances is the church responsible for anything. This is not particular to The Church, Amazon isn't responsible for stopping the crimes of its employees, nor is Disney, nor any other organization not empowered by law to seek subpoenas, arrests, etc... they should not respond to complaints in any way except: Send it to the police, we will always consider our employees innocent until proven guilty.

"Innocent" does not mean "kinda guilty" and so we fire them. Fuzzy logic and justice don't mix.

The FBI did;

Church officials followed a “playbook for concealing the truth,” the reports states. The patterns were similar enough that FBI analyses of the church’s responses yielded seven rules, basically, an institutional guide to covering up abuse. Here are seven principles the jurors note:
Jurors? What jurors?

Make sure to use euphemisms rather than real words to describe the sexual assaults in diocese documents. Never say”rape”; say “inappropriate contact” or “boundary issues.”
...Maybe that is what they (church staff) believed the issue was.
Don’t conduct genuine investigations with properly trained personnel. Instead, assign fellow clergy members to ask inadequate questions and then make credibility determinations about the colleagues with whom they live and work.
  • For an appearance of integrity, send priests for “evaluation” at church-run psychiatric treatment centers. Allow these experts to “diagnose” whether the priest was a pedophile, based largely on the priest’s “self-reports” and regardless of whether the priest had actually engaged in sexual contact with a child.
  • When a priest does have to be removed, don’t say why. Tell his parishioners that he is on “sick leave,” or suffering from”nervous exhaustion.” Or say nothing at all.
  • That is definitely a mistake, just like social media fact-checking they advance themselves in a role they do not belong in and therefore get blamed for being less than perfect. The most the superiors of a clergyman should ever do is inform the man/woman in question that there have been complaints and they should change their behavior.

    That is assuming "boundary issues" not child sexual assault. If someone goes to a church official with accusations of sexual assault they should be told to contact the police. If they don't contact the police and continue to talk with the church the only explanation is that they want money. The church can't lock people up. ALL they can do is pay blackmail and move priests around.

    Even if a priest is raping children, keep providing him housing and living expenses, although he may be using these resources to facilitate more sexual assaults.
    That beggars belief.

    If a predator’s conduct becomes known to the community, don’t remove him from the priesthood to ensure that no more children will be victimized. Instead, transfer him to a new location where no one will know he is a child abuser.
    ... because only priests can go after children? if they defrock him without a trial he's still out there. They move the priest because in their view vicious and unfounded rumors have rendered his service in that diocese useless.

    Finally, and above all, don’t tell the police. Child sexual abuse, even short of actual penetration, is and has for all relevant times been a crime. But don’t treat it that way; handle it like a personnel matter, “in house.”
    It's not their job to tell the police, it's the job of the witnesses. If I was raped in a Disney parking lot and I reported it only to Disney no one should take my story seriously. Especially if I asked Disney for 5 million USD to keep quiet.

    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics . Another might be the fact that the Church knows they have bad PR and don't want to stoke the flames.

    So it will be the fault of children, their parents, the police and the local authorities, and not the RC Church according to your own biases.
    According to a sane interpretation of responsibility, not my biases. Employers are not responsible for conducting criminal investigations. The police are not to blame if no one ever informs them. If parents want money more than arrests they are to blame for the lack of arrests. They may not have planned to pimp out their child but the end result is the same.

    McCarthy said that despite making some concessions to legal authorities by eventually turning over church records
    The police do not need to ask for records, if there is probable cause they can get a subpoena.
    You don't seem to understand how this works do you?  You also underestimate the power of the RC Church and you obviously haven't ever heard of penitent privilege.
    I think I do understand.

    Your quote implied there were records (documents) that were relevant in establishing a crime. That's got nothing to do with penitent privilege. If you're referring to the seal of confessional written records are not made of those conversations. If the seal was broken there would be no confessions, any confessions made in regards to child sexual assault would not make their way up church hierarchy because that would break the seal.

    As for this abstract "power", they have money. Just like Amazon has money. The only power there is pay people to keep quiet and that is exactly what your links imply happened.

    I suppose it would seem that way... if  you were a Roman Catholic.
    Or if you're an objective observer. Ratzinger goes along with all the accusations, agrees (against reason) that the church is substantially responsible for policing its clergy, and people still say he's no good? What exactly does a pope need to do? Throw themselves off St Peter's? Or perhaps produce the secret list of pedophiles the conspiracy theorists are so sure exists?

    Tell me, do you believe a persons testimony should be taken as truth and at face value?
    Depends on the history and context. A random stranger's claim should neither be dismissed nor considered infallible.
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    @ADreamOfLiberty
    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .

    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?


    Another might be the fact that the Church knows they have bad PR and don't want to stoke the flames.

    And another could be they didn't want to risk the chance of more revelations that would put the "Spotlight" on them  highlighting the child sex abuse scandal revealing more child sex abuse in the RC Church  and would rather play it down to protect the priesthood. 


    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?


    "Ex-Bishop of Albany admits he didn't report child sex allegations made against ELEVEN priests to police or fire them because he wanted to avoid another Catholic church 'scandal'.  

    Meanwhile, Hubbard testified he didn't report the allegations to law enforcement because he didn't feel he was required by law to do so, and instead kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret 
    When asked why he didn't report the allegations to police, Hubbard said: 'Because I was not a mandated reporter. I don't think the law then or even now requires me to do it. Would I do it now? Yes. But did I do it then? No.'"



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    @FLRW

    Yes,  a Church-commissioned report in 2004 said more than 4,000 US Roman Catholic priests had faced sexual abuse allegations in the last 50 years.

    Indeed, and the Roman Catholic church paid off many its child sex abuse victims, running to  over a $billion world wide.  One would think it more  worthier, honourable  and noble to challenge the accusations made against these men chosen and called by god.   Not to mention a damn site cheaper. They must have realised that Prayer alone wouldn't work.

    Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” Matthew 19:14

    What tf it must be like for children in the kingdom of heaven only god knows.



    Stephen
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    It all goes back before even I  was born.

    Letters: Catholic bishops warned in '50s of abusive priests

     FAITH & REASON
    By Rachel Zoll, Associated Press

    The founder of a religious order that treats Roman Catholic priests who molest children concluded in the 1950s that offenders were unlikely to change and should not be returned to ministry, according to his letters, which were obtained by plaintiffs' lawyers.
    The Rev. Gerald Fitzgerald, founder of the Servants of the Paraclete, was so sure of the priests' inability to control themselves that he tried to buy an island to isolate them.
    Fitzgerald discussed the issue with Pope Paul VI and in correspondence with several bishops, according to the National Catholic Reporter, an independent newspaper that reported the full content of the letters Monday.
    The documents challenge recent statements by U.S. bishops that before the clergy sex abuse scandal erupted in the 1980s and again in 2002, they were unaware of the risks of moving predators among parishes.
    "I myself would be inclined to favor laicization for any priest, upon objective evidence, for tampering with the virtue of the young, my argument being, from this point onward the charity to the Mystical Body should take precedence over charity to the individual," Fitzgerald wrote in a 1952 letter to Bishop Robert Dwyer of Reno.

    "Moreover, in practice, real conversions will be found to be extremely rare," he continued. "Hence, leaving them on duty or wandering from diocese to diocese is contributing to scandal or at least to the approximate danger of scandal."
    The Los Angeles law firm Kiesel, Boucher & Larson, which has brought many abuse cases against California dioceses, persuaded a judge in New Mexico to unseal the letters in 2007, according to Helen Zukin, an attorney at the firm.
    The attorneys then verified that the documents were authentic during depositions with Fitzgerald's successor as the Paracletes servant general, the Rev. Joseph McNamara, Zukin said.
    Leaders of the Servants of the Paraclete could not be reached for comment Monday.
    Fitzgerald set up the Paraclete treatment center in the late 1940s in Jemez Springs, N.M., mainly to help clergy struggling with alcoholism and emotional troubles. Soon, bishops began sending him priests who had molested young people or could not keep their celibacy vows.
    In a 1957 letter to Bishop Matthew Brady of Manchester, N.H., Fitzgerald wrote that abusive priests only pretended to repent and change "to be again in a position where they can continue their wonted activity." He said eventually the church would have to establish "a uniform code of discipline and of penalties" to protect the priesthood.
    More than four decades later, the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops did just that. It created a national discipline and child protection policy after news reports and court files unsealed in 2002 showed that many bishops had moved guilty priests from assignment to assignment without notifying parents or police.
    Under the new plan, offenders are barred from church work or ousted from the priesthood altogether.

    American dioceses have paid more than $2.6 billion in abuse-related costs since 1950, according studies commissioned by the U.S. bishops.
    By the 1960s, Fitzgerald was losing control over the direction of the religious order, and medical and psychological professionals began working at the center — a change he had resisted. Those experts said some abusers could return to ministry.
    The New Mexico treatment center closed in the 1990s in the face of lawsuits over priests who had molested children while staying at the Jemez Springs site or after being treated there.




















    ADreamOfLiberty
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    @Stephen
    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .
    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?
    Your question is complex (the fallacy) because it hides the truth in the details:

    What does it mean to "go up against" the church? PR? Civil suits? Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.

    That is not the real issue. The real issue is that this is an extremely criminal matter perpetrated not by "the church" but by specific persons.

    The pertinent question is: How possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to report sexual assault by a specific person to the police?

    I think that's very possible, and I don't believe the most catholic police force in the most catholic country would refuse to investigate such an accusation. If they did they would be the problem, not the suspect's employer.

    Why is it that all of these actions against the church only seem to occur well after the statute of limitations expire (there shouldn't be such a thing in such serious cases)? Or after the accused is dead? Because in civil cases the burden of proof is lighter and you only need a simple majority to win. If they brought the complaint when criminal charges could still be applied the obvious defense would be that the person is innocent.

    Another might be the fact that the Church knows they have bad PR and don't want to stoke the flames.
    And another could be they didn't want to risk the chance of more revelations that would put the "Spotlight" on them  highlighting the child sex abuse scandal revealing more child sex abuse in the RC Church  and would rather play it down to protect the priesthood. 
    That is repeating what I said with a spin.
    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).

    "Ex-Bishop of Albany admits he didn't report child sex allegations made against ELEVEN priests to police or fire them because he wanted to avoid another Catholic church 'scandal'.  
    Made by people who must have chosen to report only to him and not to the police their belief that crimes had occurred.

    Meanwhile, Hubbard testified he didn't report the allegations to law enforcement because he didn't feel he was required by law to do so
    That is no doubt correct. The duty, in those cases where it exists is on the witness.

    and instead kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret 
    He and every single person who made an allegation. You think that is a coincidence?

    On the other hand this Hubbard was himself accused of sexual abuse. Was he obligated to report to the police that someone was accusing him of a crime when the accuser did not?

    I can easily see why he might find accusations suspicious if he himself was falsely accused. If you want to assume he's guilty too why in the world would he keep records?

    The article says:
    [DailyMail] One, David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behavior alleged.
    When? What behavior?

    If Hubbard heard a confession (not official confession just general confession) and there was an investigation that would be an exception to the hearsay rule and he could be compelled in court to testify. It sounds like a simple police investigation would have stopped Bentley.

    [DailyMail] In arguing for the release of the deposition transcript, attorneys for some of the alleged victims had argued that the risk of pre-trial prejudice was no longer valid after Hubbard published an opinion piece in the Albany Times-Union last year in which he defended the diocese's handling of abuse complaints.
    So we don't actually have the transcript, this story is based on what the plaintiff's attorneys told the DailyMail.
    BrotherD.Thomas
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    @ADreamOfLiberty





    .
    ADreamOfLiberty,

    In your post #5 to me, you seem to be coming to the defense of Catholicism relating to their buggering pedophile priests.  So, the obvious question has to be asked, are you a Hell bound Cathylick?  SCARED to answer this question?


    YOUR QUOTE OF DESPAIR: “If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt of this, that would be a conspiracy to obstruct justice and is a crime almost everywhere (not always called that). Perhaps you should report it.”

    Duh!  The RCC is like its own nation with its own rules, furthermore, do you deny that Catholic priests were buggering innocent children? Yes or no? As for me reporting it is laughable because I am just the messenger. Conversely, and in the same vein, why aren’t you reporting it? GET IT?”


    YOUR VAIN ATTEMPT TO RUN FROM THE TRUTH REGARDING AN IMAGE:  "https://www.imagebam.com/view/ME971QU   I'm afraid that is just a meme."

    NO, you're afraid that what was shown in the image is the TRUTH!  You can call it whatever you want, but the FACT remains that Cathylick priests screwed innocent little children, and said church hid this fact for years, period!  Understood?!



    YOUR QUOTE OF GRASPING FOR STRAWS: “So the theory is that parents of a child suspected their child had received anal penetration from a priest...  the priest told the child to keep it a secret, and these parents did not go to the police, they wrote the church a complaint.... No I'm afraid that doesn't add up. The reaction of 99.95% of parents upon such a suspicion being formed ranges between calling the FBI, local, and state police within a one hour period and buying a gun to kill the suspected person."

    Listen up, Google about how survivors and experts who work in the field of child sex abuse will tell you there are many reasons why it’s difficult for some to report Cathylick priest sex abuse. Denial, fear and shame, AND jeopardizing your church association, are just a few of the reasons. Remember, the mind set of Hell bound Cathylicks is that the priest is always right, he was sent by Jesus to herd the flock in believing whatever the priest says is correct.

    “A Cathylick priest has a unique position in society in general, where they enjoy an exalted position where they were trusted more than anyone if you are a Cathylick. The flock were taught if you say anything bad about a priest it’s a sin, and God will punish you and so priests were held in high esteem.”

    The parents, often times, if the kid said something to them about a priest regarding sexual contact, the parents would not believe them! “Father would never do that, you must have misunderstood in what He did to you.” Or Jesus forbid, the parents would punish their children for saying what they did about the priest which was even worse and that was common as well. The innocent buggered kids at times subsequently to an abuse wouldn’t say anything because they were intimidated by the priest and family!

    Buggered by priest kids in younger years were totally confused and stunned by what was happening to them because they knew nothing about sex. They knew that whatever was happening was being done by a priest and so they were totally confused because priests don’t sin! And it is said a great number of victims who were sexually violated didn’t report it to anyone!

    Now, for your homework to not embarrass yourself any further upon this topic, GOOGLE what is said above with child abuse organizations of sex abuse within the Catholic Church, and you will be weeks and months in understanding that the above actions are true at your expense in seemingly defending a totally despicable Cathylick church!



    YOUR FAULTY CLAIM QUOTE OF NOT DOING YOUR HOMEWORK FOR THE FUTURE BURNING IN HELL RATZINGER!!!!:  “If it wasn't for ratzinger claiming for the church the role of criminal investigator you wouldn't even have the accusations you have now, yet now you accuse him of being part of the coverup.”

    LIAR!!!  Your total ignorance upon RATzinger not being a major part of the RCC coverup is without bounds!  Your complete ignorance upon this topic is duly noted by the membership, thank you!    If you are an attorney, you are LOUSY at your job in not reading about the hell bound RATzinger upon this topic FIRST, before you remove one foot to insert the other at your embarrassing expense!  Priceless stupidity on your part! LOL!

    The following links are but a FEW of MANY in showing RATzinger hiding sexual abuse by Cathylick priests!

    RATzinger failed to act over pedophile priests screwing little kids:

    RATzinger asks for forgiveness in not handling child sex abuse properly:

    RATzinger ADMITS in giving false claims to sexual abuse of children that were BUGGERED by priests!:

    RATzinger faulted over child buggering sex claims

    RATzinger begs forgiveness from child victims of being buggered by priests:

    RATzinger accused of inaction in sexual abuse cases more so than not:

    RATzinger didn’t think it was a priority to come down on priests that screwed innocent children:

    ADreamOfLiberty, now wipe the proverbial egg from your face in now knowing “what you think you knew, YOU DIDN’T!”  If you continue in this vein, Jesus and I will Bible Slap you Silly®️ in front of the membership, do you understand ignorant of the FACTS fool?  Yes? Maybe?


    “John Paul, NO, not here, we’ll bring him to your room later tonight!”


    .

    BrotherD.Thomas
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    @Intelligence_06


    .
    Intelligence_06,

    YOUR QUOTE IN POST #8 TO MY CHRISTIAN POSITION: "So, curious to ask, what faction are you within Christianity? You seem to tolerate God killing people back in the stories of the Bible, but this offends you. Just what are you?"

    I am a non-division of Christianity, because there're just too many DIVISIONS of the faith to begin with, and who determines which one is correct?!  I read the JUDEO-Christian Bible in its literal and parable form, and if you have an IQ above a gnat, you can understand the Bible's writings without any Satanic apologetic  spin doctoring, crystal balls, or a quija board!

    Cathylick priests screwing innocent young children is despicable to say the least, notwithstanding the coverups of same by the RCC church.  Therefore, I can differentiate Jesus brutally killing His creation, but not His creation in priests brutally killing the young children’s minds in their future and the ramifications thereof subsequent to them being SCREWED by smelly old men priests!


    I have to tolerate Jesus in being a brutal serial killer, an abortionist, killer of innocent zygotes, fetus' and babies in His Great Flood, promoting in having children smashed upon the rocks, having women raped, etc., etc., simply because the JUDEO-Christian Bible states that there will be NO WOMEN in heaven, praise! Therefore, this is enough for me to put up with Jesus' killings, where the caveat of me being a man is going to heaven, where women are not.  

    In only men going to heaven, we get a reprieve from the 2nd class Sisters of Eve woman that we had to put with while upon earth, praise! "A quarrelsome wife is as annoying as constant dripping on a rainy day. Stopping her complaints is like trying to stop the wind or trying to hold something with greased hands." (Proverbs 27:15-16)


    .

    Stephen
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    @ADreamOfLiberty
    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .
    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?
    Your question is complex (the fallacy) because it hides the truth in the details:

     No it isn't.  You have offered possible reasons for the RC  church not taking out lawsuits against film makers and investigative journalist. One being the "almost impossibility" of winning.  I asked you in response  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  

    What does it mean to "go up against" the church? PR? Civil suits?
    Stop being so ignorant and disingenuous. Go up against as in -  sue a  powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman Church?  


    Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.

    So do you believe the thousands of accusations against the RC Church are all a conspiracy? 


    That is not the real issue. The real issue is that this is an extremely criminal matter perpetrated not by "the church" but by specific persons.

    They represent the church and god. 


    The pertinent question is: How possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to report sexual assault by a specific person to the police?

    No, my question was clear. You are simply trying wave it it away and attempting to absolve the RC Church. 



    Why is it that all of these actions against the church only seem to occur well after the statute of limitations expire (there shouldn't be such a thing in such serious cases)?

    You haven't researched this at all have you. The obvious reason appears to be in most cases the CHILDREN don't say a word about their sexual abuse at the hands of these powerful and influential priests until they have grown into adults. 




    Another might be the fact that the Church knows they have bad PR and don't want to stoke the flames.
    And another could be they didn't want to risk the chance of more revelations that would put the "Spotlight" on them  highlighting the child sex abuse scandal revealing more child sex abuse in the RC Church  and would rather play it down to protect the priesthood. 
    That is repeating what I said with a spin.
    That is adding to what you disingenuously failed to say.




    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).

    That doesn't answer the question. 




    "Ex-Bishop of Albany admits he didn't report child sex allegations made against ELEVEN priests to police or fire them because he wanted to avoid another Catholic church 'scandal'.  
    Made by people who must have chosen to report only to him and not to the police their belief that crimes had occurred.

    Your apologetics are breath-taking.


    Meanwhile, Hubbard testified he didn't report the allegations to law enforcement because he didn't feel he was required by law to do so
    That is no doubt correct. The duty, in those cases where it exists is on the witness.

    But he appears to have believed  the accusations against these eleven Roman Catholic priests and by his own admission and chose not to go to the police to report their crimes.....  although he does add:

    " I don't think the law then or even now requires me to do it. Would I do it now? Yes. But did I do it then? No.'" 
    So why the change of heart? Why would he do it now? 



    On the other hand this Hubbard was himself accused of sexual abuse. Was he obligated to report to the police that someone was accusing him of a crime when the accuser did not?

    That is more like the reason that "today he would report those other child sexually abusing priests. ' it wasn't me,, but it was them others'.


    I can easily see why he might find accusations suspicious if he himself was falsely accused.

    Indeed and also the reason why he now- today,  believes he should have reported the crimes committed against these children by members of his own priestly brotherhood.
    " I don't think the law then or even now requires me to do it. Would I do it now? Yes. But did I do it then? No.'" 





    The article says:
    [DailyMail] One, David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behavior alleged. Former Bishop of Albany admits covering-up for ELEVEN 'pedophile' priests | Daily Mail Online
    When? What behavior?

    You cannot help yourself can you?  Let me break it down for you. 


    "During the four-day deposition, the Bishop Emeritus named several priests who had been accused of sexual abuse who were referred to treatment and later returned to ministry, without notification to the public. 
    One,  [ OF THE SEVERAL PRIESTS ] David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behaviour alleged.




    [DailyMail] In arguing for the release of the deposition transcript, attorneys for some of the alleged victims had argued that the risk of pre-trial prejudice was no longer valid after Hubbard published an opinion piece in the Albany Times-Union last year in which he defended the diocese's handling of abuse complaints.
    So we don't actually have the transcript, this story is based on what the plaintiff's attorneys told the DailyMail.

    No.  It is the Daily Mail reporting from the courtroom. And we do have the deposition transcript.  And it confirms church hid abuse.  You just don't want to face the facts because you are nothing more than an apologist for the Roman Catholic Church and the rife sexual deviancy of its priests chosen and called by god himself..  

    Shite judge of character isn't he your god?.  How the fk is he going to judge and treat me that hasn't ever committed a crime in my life. Mind you, that didn't stop the vile bastard torturing Job who was blameless in the eyes of god , so I won't be expecting any special treatment.





    ADreamOfLiberty
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    @BrotherD.Thomas
    In your post #5 to me, you seem to be coming to the defense of Catholicism relating to their buggering pedophile priests.  So, the obvious question has to be asked, are you a Hell bound Cathylick?  SCARED to answer this question?
    The question is irrelevant as the answer can only be used for a poisoning the well fallacy.
    YOUR QUOTE OF DESPAIR: “If there is evidence beyond a reasonable doubt of this, that would be a conspiracy to obstruct justice and is a crime almost everywhere (not always called that). Perhaps you should report it.”

    Duh!  The RCC is like its own nation with its own rules
    It is not its own nation outside of the Vatican.  Maybe people should stop spreading rumors like that and more people would report crimes to the police rather than the church.
    furthermore, do you deny that Catholic priests were buggering innocent children? Yes or no?
    No, it inevitably happened to some degree. Just like it is inevitable that Amazon employees or Disney employees buggered innocent children at some point.

    As for me reporting it is laughable because I am just the messenger.
    You're saying your not the mandated reporter huh?

    Conversely, and in the same vein, why aren’t you reporting it? GET IT?”
    Because I am not in the possession of any evidence which could be relevant to an investigation, nor am I acting like I am. You on the other hand seem completely comfortable implying that the Pope is two seconds away from buggering children.

    Listen up, Google about how survivors and experts who work in the field of child sex abuse will tell you there are many reasons why it’s difficult for some to report Cathylick priest sex abuse. Denial, fear and shame, AND jeopardizing your church association, are just a few of the reasons.
    Aside from the jeopardizing association that is par for the course in abuse allegations. So the contention is that the church will seek retribution against someone if they go to the police? Any evidence of this? Mind you it would be "the church" not just a small conspiracy of one or two people in a parish.

    Now, for your homework to not embarrass yourself any further upon this topic
    I get the impression shaming others is a tool you reach for quite often but it will be totally useless against me I assure you.
    If you are an attorney, you are LOUSY at your job in not reading about the hell bound RATzinger upon this topic FIRST
    I had a good laugh when I imagined those words being used by a prosecutor. 'Objection your honour the prosecution doesn't know for a fact my client is hellbound.'

    As for your list of people complaining, that only proves this is a widely held belief; not that it is well founded.
    ADreamOfLiberty, now wipe the proverbial egg from your face in now knowing “what you think you knew, YOU DIDN’T!”  If you continue in this vein, Jesus and I will Bible Slap you Silly®️
    Oh boy, a bible slap, wow are you role playing?
    “John Paul, NO, not here, we’ll bring him to your room later tonight!”
    John Paul aswell as Ratzinger, <sarcasm>no this isn't a witch hunt at all</sarcasm>
    ADreamOfLiberty
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    @Stephen
    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .
    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?
    Your question is complex (the fallacy) because it hides the truth in the details:
    No it isn't.  You have offered possible reasons for the RC  church not taking out lawsuits against film makers and investigative journalist. One being the "almost impossibility" of winning.  I asked you in response  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  
    It's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit of that nature (in the USA) because of precedent establishing extremely high bars such as actual malice that are almost impossible to prove. It is not almost impossible because lawyers are just too damn expensive.

    What does it mean to "go up against" the church? PR? Civil suits?
    Stop being so ignorant and disingenuous. Go up against as in -  sue a  powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman Church?  
    Civil suit is an inappropriate response to criminal activity.

    Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.
    So do you believe the thousands of accusations against the RC Church are all a conspiracy? 
    The conspiracy I mentioned is the purported conspiracy within the church to hide evidence of sexual abuse.

    That is not the real issue. The real issue is that this is an extremely criminal matter perpetrated not by "the church" but by specific persons.
    They represent the church and god. 
    So god is part of the coverup now? Well that makes more sense than the church, at least god would certainly have known and certainly could have informed the police or you know repair the priest.

    Why is it that all of these actions against the church only seem to occur well after the statute of limitations expire (there shouldn't be such a thing in such serious cases)?
    You haven't researched this at all have you. The obvious reason appears to be in most cases the CHILDREN don't say a word about their sexual abuse at the hands of these powerful and influential priests until they have grown into adults. 
    I see, then how could there possibly have been an error in church behavior at the time if no allegations existed?
    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).
    That doesn't answer the question. 
    The answer is: Yes, I am suggesting they wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution because that is not how they see themselves.

    So why the change of heart? Why would he do it now? 
    There was no Church policy on it before, there is now.

    The article says:
    [DailyMail] One, David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behavior alleged. Former Bishop of Albany admits covering-up for ELEVEN 'pedophile' priests | Daily Mail Online
    When? What behavior?
    You cannot help yourself can you?  Let me break it down for you. 
    When was the purported admission, not when was the purported deposition.

    And we do have the deposition transcript.
    Ok post it
    Stephen
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    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .
    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?
    Your question is complex (the fallacy) because it hides the truth in the details:
    No it isn't.  You have offered possible reasons for the RC  church not taking out lawsuits against film makers and investigative journalist. One being the "almost impossibility" of winning.  I asked you in response  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  
    It's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit of that nature (in the USA) because of precedent establishing extremely high bars such as actual malice that are almost impossible to prove. It is not almost impossible because lawyers are just too damn expensive.

    You are still avoiding my question. I asked you if that is the case  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  





    What does it mean to "go up against" the church? PR? Civil suits?
    Stop being so ignorant and disingenuous. Go up against as in -  sue a  powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman Church?  
    Civil suit is an inappropriate response to criminal activity.
    Ok but opinion counts for nothing.  Just answer my question.  I asked you  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  




    Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.
    So do you believe the thousands of accusations against the RC Church are all a conspiracy? 
    The conspiracy I mentioned is the purported conspiracy within the church to hide evidence of sexual abuse.

    "Purported"?  But then you are simply and apologetically dismissing the facts presented by  priests of the RC Church  and the Roman Catholic church itself,
    in your attempts to absolve the Roman Catholic Church. This is simply you in full denial. There is and was a conspiracy to hide  evidence. 


    Why is it that all of these actions against the church only seem to occur well after the statute of limitations expire (there shouldn't be such a thing in such serious cases)?
    You haven't researched this at all have you. The obvious reason appears to be in most cases the CHILDREN don't say a word about their sexual abuse at the hands of these powerful and influential priests until they have grown into adults. 
    I see, then how could there possibly have been an error in church behavior at the time if no allegations existed?

    Who mentioned an error? I am talking about the hidden sexual abuse of children at the hands of servants  of god and the Roman catholic Church. 



    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).
    That doesn't answer the question. 
    The answer is: Yes, I am suggesting they wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution because that is not how they see themselves.

    And I am asking you why they wouldn't defend themselves and the Church against these serious and defamatory accusations if they had nothing to hide and were not true.?




    So why the change of heart? Why would he do it now? 
    There was no Church policy on it before, there is now.

    Why now? The policy had to have been created and put in place for a reason.





    The article says:
    [DailyMail] One, David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behavior alleged. Former Bishop of Albany admits covering-up for ELEVEN 'pedophile' priests | Daily Mail Online
    When? What behavior?
    You cannot help yourself can you?  Let me break it down for you. 
    "During the four-day deposition, the Bishop Emeritus named several priests who had been accused of sexual abuse who were referred to treatment and later returned to ministry, without notification to the public. 
    One,  [ OF THE SEVERAL PRIESTS ] David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behaviour alleged.
    When was the purported admission, not when was the purported deposition.
    You asked what behaviour and when, ffs keep up.
     The piece tell you when it was, see bold underlined above. . I am not going to keep doing all the research for you.  You can keep denying these court stated facts and admissions all you want. But you are failing miserably not only to keep up, but in your poor endeavours to defend the indefensible.




    And we do have the deposition transcript.  And it confirms church hid abuse.  You just don't want to face the facts because you are nothing more than an apologist for the Roman Catholic Church and the rife sexual deviancy of its priests chosen and called by god himself..  
    Ok post it

    Why do you not look for it yourself, like I did. Or are you simply blinded by faith and afraid to accept the truth and the facts of the matter.  



    Stephen
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    @BrotherD.Thomas
    Cathylick priests screwing innocent young children is despicable to say the least, notwithstanding the coverups of same by the RCC church. 

    It is abhorrent Brother D. And what is worse is those that deny the cover up in the face of all the facts and evidence.
    ADreamOfLiberty
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    @Stephen
    Why hasn't the RC Church sued the makers of the film "spotlight" that tells the story of paedophilia in the Roman Catholic Church? And 
    why hasn't the Roman Catholic Church sued the  Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative reporters and  The Boston Globe for writing and publishing false and defamatory accusations? 
    Well one reason could be it's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit against a journalist expressing opinions on public interest topics .
    So how possible do you believe it would be for a child and or his family to go up against a powerful  and extremely wealthy institution such as the Roman Catholic Church and win?
    Your question is complex (the fallacy) because it hides the truth in the details:
    No it isn't.  You have offered possible reasons for the RC  church not taking out lawsuits against film makers and investigative journalist. One being the "almost impossibility" of winning.  I asked you in response  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  
    It's almost impossible to win a defamation lawsuit of that nature (in the USA) because of precedent establishing extremely high bars such as actual malice that are almost impossible to prove. It is not almost impossible because lawyers are just too damn expensive.
    You are still avoiding my question. I asked you if that is the case  what are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?
    The chances of winning a civil suit against the catholic church with the allegation of child sexual abuse is in my opinion significantly higher than the chance of the church winning a defamation suit against a media outlet.

    Without evidence of actual malice the defamation suit would be thrown out by a judge. However in the case of sexual abuse allegations a simple majority of jurors could easily be so moved that the mere accusation is sufficient.

    Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.
    So do you believe the thousands of accusations against the RC Church are all a conspiracy? 
    The conspiracy I mentioned is the purported conspiracy within the church to hide evidence of sexual abuse.
    "Purported"?  But then you are simply and apologetically dismissing the facts presented by  priests of the RC Church  and the Roman Catholic church itself,
    in your attempts to absolve the Roman Catholic Church. This is simply you in full denial. There is and was a conspiracy to hide  evidence. 
    and yet whenever you look into it, it reads like "we should have done better", because they think they're responsible for the actions of priests just like you do. But I don't. Failing to act is not the same thing as a coverup. For a coverup to exist there must be evidence available only to the church that was intentionally withheld.

    Why is it that all of these actions against the church only seem to occur well after the statute of limitations expire (there shouldn't be such a thing in such serious cases)?
    You haven't researched this at all have you. The obvious reason appears to be in most cases the CHILDREN don't say a word about their sexual abuse at the hands of these powerful and influential priests until they have grown into adults. 
    I see, then how could there possibly have been an error in church behavior at the time if no allegations existed?
    Who mentioned an error? I am talking about the hidden sexual abuse of children at the hands of servants  of god and the Roman catholic Church. 
    The OP and myself. Try to keep up.

    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).
    That doesn't answer the question. 
    The answer is: Yes, I am suggesting they wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution because that is not how they see themselves.
    And I am asking you why they wouldn't defend themselves and the Church against these serious and defamatory accusations if they had nothing to hide and were not true.?
    No that is not what you asked, full context reproduced above. You asked if I was suggesting something, didn't like my clarifying answer, so I gave you "yes" and now you're trying to rewrite history.

    I already gave you two reasons why they might not seek defamation redress, I see no reason to go through that cycle again you may review post #13 "Well one reason could be it's a...."

    In the general interest of justice you should refrain from conflating silence with an admission of guilt.

    So why the change of heart? Why would he do it now? 
    There was no Church policy on it before, there is now.
    Why now? The policy had to have been created and put in place for a reason.
    People like yourself have mistakenly identified the church as a detective agency, so after decades of being consistently branded with the most deplored label currently in existence it seems that the church leadership have decided to make the obvious explicit.
    You asked what behaviour and when
    I asked when the admission of the suspect was made and I wanted more specific than "sexual abuse", and you did not post the answer. I've now read the relevant parts of the deposition and the details of the abuse were not mentioned.

    I did not go and find it because I had the BoP I was curious. Taken at face value it still seems incredible to me. In the case of Bentley, not only the parents, not only the bishop, but also social workers? All failed to report the matter to police?

    I can't imagine why Hubbard would lie, but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police.

    [Questioner:] But you never reported any of these to police that we have talked about so far, correct?
    [Hubbard:] No. I didn't report it, but they [police or prosecutor] did report to me and asked me to do something about it.
    W.... T.... F....?!

    The police... asked a bishop.... to do something about child sexual abuse.

    Does anyone here believe that? If you do, then I present to you the problem.
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    @ADreamOfLiberty
       What are the possibilities of a child winning a lawsuit against a powerful and extremely wealthy organisation such as the Roman church?  
    The chances of winning a civil suit against the catholic church with the allegation of child sexual abuse is in my opinion significantly higher than the chance of the church winning a defamation suit against a media outlet.

    And your opinion is based on what exactly?  Do you have any legal training or experience.. at all.


    Without evidence of actual malice the defamation suit would be thrown out by a judge. However in the case of sexual abuse allegations a simple majority of jurors could easily be so moved that the mere accusation is sufficient.
    Well I am sure that any powerful organisation such as The Roman Catholic Church defending themselves against any  false accusations of Child Sex Abuse in their ranks would get their ducks in a row  and demand that their accusers face them in a courtroom in the case of the  -  film makers of "Spotlight" and the Pulitzer prize winning investigative reporters at the Boston Globe and their own investigation reporting on Child sex Abuse in the Roman Catholic Church, and would want to face their accusers and clear their name and for the good of the RC Church..

    Boston Globe Investigation Into Child Sex Abuse in the Roman Catholic Church

    "Spotlight" a Hollywood movie about Paedophile Priests in the Roman Catholic and the Cover Up.

     You have simply been clutching at straws. And not for the first time on this thread.




    Demanding settlements? But that is exactly what has been happening, the 'losses' of the church in that regard form the basis of your evidence of a conspiracy.
    So do you believe the thousands of accusations against the RC Church are all a conspiracy? 
    The conspiracy I mentioned is the purported conspiracy within the church to hide evidence of sexual abuse.
    "Purported"?  But then you are simply and apologetically dismissing the facts presented by  priests of the RC Church  and the Roman Catholic church itself,
    in your attempts to absolve the Roman Catholic Church. This is simply you in full denial. There is and was a conspiracy to hide  evidence. 
    and yet whenever you look into it, it reads like "we should have done better",

      Does it?  Better that what? Better at hiding the Child Sex Abuse in their ranks or stamping it out?



    because they think they're responsible for the actions of priests just like you do.

    And so does any level headed person of the planet. 



    But I don't [think the Roman Catholic Church is responsible]

    I think we know that by now and in the face of all the fkn GLARING evidence too. Your a sycophant that refuses to face facts pointing to a clear cover up ADIMTTED to by many of the RC clergy saying " instead [ of reporting it, he] kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret out of concern for 'scandal and the respect of the priesthood.' https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10657343/Ex-Albany-bishop-acknowledges-covering-abuse-allegations.html

     Looking after his won is what any decent law abiding person would call it.



    Failing to act is not the same thing as a coverup.

     Clutching at very thin straws in a vain attempt to absolve The Roman Catholic Church.  You have failed. 



    For a coverup to exist there must be evidence available only to the church that was intentionally withheld.


     But the evidence has been revealed on many occasions, you just don't want to face it and the fact that your church is riddled with paedophile Priests. 


    then how could there possibly have been an error in church behavior at the time if no allegations existed?
    Who mentioned an error? I am talking about the hidden sexual abuse of children at the hands of servants  of god and the Roman catholic Church. 

    The OP and myself. Try to keep up.
    Stop telling lies. The OP doesn't even mention the word "error". 



    And are you suggesting that the RC Church with nothing to hide and church members to lose (as they have over this and other scandals) wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution?
    Well they don't see themselves as blameless, I do. Their greatest mistake in all of this was to give the slightest impression that they were responsible or equipped to handle potential crime "in house" (as the FBI/jury/you put it).
    That doesn't answer the question. 
    The answer is: Yes, I am suggesting they wouldn't want to defend their reputation as a stand up, blameless and moral sinless institution because that is not how they see themselves.
    And I am asking you why they wouldn't defend themselves and the Church against these serious and defamatory accusations if they had nothing to hide and were not true.?
    No that is not what you asked, full context reproduced above.


     Stop with  your barrel scraping bullshite. The question I asked hasn't changed. You have even gave your "opinion",  hoping it served as an answer. It didn't.




    So why the change of heart? Why would he do it now? 
    There was no Church policy on it before, there is now.
    Why now? The policy had to have been created and put in place for a reason.
    People like yourself have mistakenly identified the church as a detective agency,

     Nope, the Roman Catholic Church claims many times to have conducted their own investigations into these accusations of Child Sex Abuse in their ranks,  AND THEN DECIDED TO HIDE THEIR FINDINGS. . HERE>>> " instead [ of reporting it, he] kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret out of concern for 'scandal and the respect of the priesthood.' https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10657343/Ex-Albany-bishop-acknowledges-covering-abuse-allegations.html




    You asked what behaviour and when
    I asked when the admission of the suspect was made and I wanted more specific than "sexual abuse",
    This is what you asked .

    ADreamOfLiberty, wrote:The article says:
    [DailyMail] One, David Bentley, admitted to Hubbard that he had engaged in the behavior alleged. Former Bishop of Albany admits covering-up for ELEVEN 'pedophile' priests | Daily Mail Online

    When? What behavior?



    and I broke it down for you. HERE>>#20

    You then shifted this to the confession  and attempted to redefine the word confession.  I showed you that too. 



    I did not go and find it because I had the BoP I was curious.

     No you just didn't want to see it for yourself and have to face the facts.


    I can't imagine why Hubbard would lie, but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police.

     That's because Hubbard hasn't lied about the priest David Bentley admitting he has sexually abused children.. read it for yourself.  AND THEN ADMITTED TO HIDING IT.


    but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police.

     That's because Hubbard admitted to covering it all up and THEN lying about the cover up. Are you a dumb as you are making out to be.  READ THE COURT DEPOSITION THAT THE DEFENCE LAWYERS DIDN'T WANT TO DISCLOSE. or would you like me to show you that too.

    Here you go you lazy, bone idle, apologetic sycophant.

    Read this first, you apologetic clown..


    ...and then read this


     Read it slowly and I hope you fkn weep.  But you won't, you have no fkn conscience whatsoever.. In my opinion you are no better than those that committed these godawful crimes against children.

     And don't bother me again. You are not interested in facts or evidence. 







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    @FLRW
    @BrotherD.Thomas
    Dear Oh dear Oh dear.

    John Geoghan was a Boston priest whose career spanned 30 years in six different parishes. He was also a serial child rapist who had 150 boys came forward to accuse him of sexual abuse during his time in the Catholic Church.

    John Geoghan was a Boston priest whose career spanned 30 years across Massachusetts.
    He was also a serial child rapist who would meet a grisly death in jail.




     I don't doubt for a second that the apologist for the Roman Catholic Church will have us believe that the Jury was fixed and this paedophile Roman Catholic Priest should have been found guilty on the evidence presented, and accuse all 150 boys of being all born liars. Such is the nature of the fawning sycophantic apologist blinded by faith.
    BrotherD.Thomas
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    @ADreamOfLiberty


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    ADreamOfLiberty.

    Addressing your post#21 to me at your expense;

    MY REVEALING QUOTE TO YOU: “In your post #5 to me, you seem to be coming to the defense of Catholicism relating to their buggering pedophile priests.  So, the obvious question has to be asked, are you a Hell bound Cathylick?  SCARED to answer this question?”

    YOUR PITIFUL AND RUNAWAY RESPONSE TO ME: “The question is irrelevant as the answer can only be used for a poisoning the well fallacy.”

    Oh, oh, we have another little boy RUNAWAY where ADREAMOFLIBERTY like I said would be to SCARED to answer a very simple question of whether he was a Cathylick, but instead, he had to use the ol’ worn out excuse of “Poisening the Well” fallacy to try and save more embarrassment to himself! LOL!!!

    Logic 101 precludes that if you can’t answer your division of religious faith when questioned, and in this case ADREAMOFLIBERTY in being a Cathylick, then you obviously are a Cathylick but you don’t want to admit it for obvious reasons of your embarrassing churches misdeeds!  2+2=4.

    This is what Jesus thinks of the Bible fool ADREAMOFLIBERTY and the ramifications thereof: For whoever is ashamed of me and of my words, of him will the Son of Man be ashamed when he comes in his glory and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels.” (Luke 9:26)


    ADREAMOFLIBERTY, your empty response above is as empty as your totally embarrassing profile that equally shows absolutely NOTHING!  Therefore, Jesus and I are going to have a lot of fun in easily batting you around like a little toy in showing this esteemed DEBATEART Religion Forum in what you truly are, a pseudo-christian at best, that slaps Jesus in the face by remaining silent to your faith!


    NEXT BIBLE FOOL LIKE ADREAMOFLIBERTY IN BEING TO EMBARRASSED OF HIS RELIGIOUS FAITH TO TELL US IN WHAT IT IS, WILL BE …?


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    ADreamOfLiberty
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    @Stephen
    And your opinion is based on what exactly?  Do you have any legal training or experience.. at all.
    Based on legal commentary I've heard over my lifetime, I have no experience or training. It's pretty disingenuous to ask a question, insist on an answer twice, and then impeach the qualifications of the person you asked when you get an opinion... especially when the question and answer are irrelevant to my point.
    Well I am sure that any powerful organisation such as The Roman Catholic Church defending themselves against any  false accusations of Child Sex Abuse in their ranks
    You are shifting the goalposts. I never denied that there was child sex abuse by clergy, I denied that it's the church's responsibility investigate or keep records of it. I also doubted that there was ever any policy in place designed to coverup crimes or protect pedophiles.

     You have simply been clutching at straws. And not for the first time on this thread.
    You've confused yourself, my points stand.

    and yet whenever you look into it, it reads like "we should have done better",
    Does it?  Better that what? Better at hiding the Child Sex Abuse in their ranks or stamping it out?
    Better at preventing it or punishing it because they [as epitomized by Ratzinger],  like so many, seem to think it's their job.

    because they think they're responsible for the actions of priests just like you do.
    And so does any level headed person of the planet. 
    Then those level headed persons would apply the principle consistently. They do not. When there is a pedophile judge they do not declare that government a pedophile organization (well the level headed ones don't). When there are some pedophiles found at Disney they do not declare Disney to have a pedophile agenda (well the level headed ones don't).

    Failing to act is not the same thing as a coverup.
     Clutching at very thin straws in a vain attempt to absolve The Roman Catholic Church.  You have failed. 
    Not in my opinion.

    The OP and myself. Try to keep up.
    Stop telling lies. The OP doesn't even mention the word "error". 
    That doesn't mean the OP didn't invoke the concept. There are such things as synonyms and implications. The lack of error is perfection, does the brother D claim the church is perfect?
     Stop with  your barrel scraping bullshite.
    The record stands for the objective observer to review.

    Nope, the Roman Catholic Church claims many times to have conducted their own investigations into these accusations of Child Sex Abuse in their ranks,  AND THEN DECIDED TO HIDE THEIR FINDINGS. . HERE>>> " instead [ of reporting it, he] kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret out of concern for 'scandal and the respect of the priesthood.' https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10657343/Ex-Albany-bishop-acknowledges-covering-abuse-allegations.html
    See last.

    and I broke it down for you. HERE>>#20
    Post #20 does not contain the precise or approximate date on which Bentley is purported to have admitted to sexual abuse.

    I did not go and find it because I had the BoP I was curious.
     No you just didn't want to see it for yourself and have to face the facts.
    See last
    I can't imagine why Hubbard would lie, but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police.
     That's because Hubbard hasn't lied about the priest David Bentley admitting he has sexually abused children.. read it for yourself.  AND THEN ADMITTED TO HIDING IT.
    See last

    but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police.
    That's because Hubbard admitted to covering it all up and THEN lying about the cover up. Are you a dumb as you are making out to be.  READ THE COURT DEPOSITION THAT THE DEFENCE LAWYERS DIDN'T WANT TO DISCLOSE. or would you like me to show you that too.

    Here you go you lazy, bone idle, apologetic sycophant.

    Read this first, you apologetic clown..
    I can tell you did not read the relevant parts of the transcript or else you would have recognized that I quoted from it in post #25. Thus I did read it. If you had read post #25 you would have also seen:
    I've now read the relevant parts of the deposition and the details of the abuse were not mentioned.
    So either you're too lazy to read my post while demanding I go read 680 pages of deposition, or you're being dishonest by intentionally pretending I didn't read it and needed to be given a link.

    Now since you claimed to be relying on the contents of the deposition for an argument it was your job to post when challenged in the first place, it's good you got around to it.

    Now to the meat of the issue, no Hubbard did not admit to lying to anyone about Bentley and he certainly did not use the word "coverup", he said he didn't report it. That's all he said. Look at my question that you claim to answer "but I also can't imagine why a social worker would call a diocese and not the police." and you said "because Hubbard admitted to covering it up and then lying about the coverup".

    That explains nothing, if you believe the testimony of Hubbard, the social commissioner called him, but the police never did. There is no evidence of a police investigation at that time (in the deposition). Now if the social worker knows they brought in the bishop, and they called the police, how is it that the police never asked Hubbard a question? The only possibility is that the social commissioner person called only the bishop and not the police. How could Hubbard have possibly have caused that to happen, how can you describe that as a coverup?

    That's like saying the police called you and told you to 'handle' a murder, and since you didn't report it back to FBI you're covering it up. Cue:

    You also ignored a very important part of the deposition I posted in #25
    [Questioner:] But you never reported any of these to police that we have talked about so far, correct?
    [Hubbard:] No. I didn't report it, but they [police or prosecutor] did report to me and asked me to do something about it.
    You may not care about this in the context of whatever strawman you're beating up, but it is extremely relevant to my original and consistent point. It either brings his entire testimony into question or it is exactly what I said in post #7
    [ADOL:] No I hadn't heard the name before. Was he [John Geoghan] charged? If he wasn't charged but the evidence was brought to the police then clearly the police are part of the conspiracy and they are the real problem since they (unlike church officials) are subject to democratic power.

    And don't bother me again. You are not interested in facts or evidence. 
    I will continue to respond as long as you continue to post things that could ever been seen by a reasonable person as an argument. You can shut me up by increasing the insult percentage to 100%, it appears to be on an exponential curve so it shouldn't take long.



    BrotherD.Thomas
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    @ADreamOfLiberty


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    ADreamOfLiberty.

    Addressing your post#21 to me at your expense


    YOUR QUOTE IN POST #21 THAT GOES NOWHERE AGAIN: “It is not its own nation outside of the Vatican.  Maybe people should stop spreading rumors like that and more people would report crimes to the police rather than the church.”

    Uh, what part of the following statements I made to you relative to your quote above didn’t YOU understand?

    I will REPEAT the following once again for the last time, to wit:

    Google about how survivors and experts who work in the field of child sex abuse will tell you there are many reasons why it’s difficult for some to report Cathylick priest sex abuse. Denial, fear and shame, AND jeopardizing your church association are just a few of the reasons. Remember, the mind set of Hell bound Cathylicks is that the priest is always right, he was sent by Jesus to herd the flock in believing whatever the priest says is correct.

    “A Cathylick priest has a unique position in society in general. They enjoy an exalted position where they were trusted more than anyone if you are a Cathylick. The flock were taught if you say anything bad about a priest it’s a sin and God will punish you and so priests were held up on a high platform.”

    The parents, often times, if the kid said something to them, parents would not believe them! “Father would never do that, you must have misunderstood in what He did to you.” Or Jesus forbid, the parents would punish their children for saying what they did about the priest which was even worse and that was common as well. The innocent buggered kids wouldn’t say anything because they were intimidated by the priest and family!

    Buggered by priest kids in younger years were totally confused and stunned by what was happening to them because they knew nothing about sex. They knew that whatever was happening was being done by a priest and so they were totally confused because priests don’t sin! And it is said a great number of victims who were sexually violated didn’t report it to anyone!

    DO NOT MAKE ME REITERATE TO YOU AGAIN, UNDERSTOOD?!


    NEXT BIBLE FOOL LIKE ADREAMOFLIBERTY THAT EMBARRASSINGLY STEPS IN THE PROVERBIAL POO AGAIN BECAUSE HE DIDN’T GAIN THE KNOWLEDGE THAT I REFERENCED FOR HIM IN THE FIRST PLACE, WILL BE …?

    .