3RU7AL for DebateArt.com President - Official

Author: 3RU7AL

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@Discipulus_Didicit
The wasted vote fallacy applies in real life because voters are not allowed to change their vote if they see their second preferred candidate losing to their least favored candidate. That is unlikely to be the case in the DART presidential election and thus it should not influence the vote of any reasonable person in this matter.
RANKED CHOICE VOTING
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@3RU7AL
No, pretty sure they are going to run it the same way they did the HoF.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
3RU7AL likes to reply big bolded words that get you to search what they mean and understand things, in case you thought that was a suggestion of what the election would be. It's standard communication from 3RU7AL to do so.
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@3RU7AL
What are your stances on free speech within the site?
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@3RU7AL
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
None of this lessens moderation or encourages free speech. Also it's too mathematical isn't it? It doesn't show that you care about the impact of the rules on the userbase, just that they understand them and are applied equally. None of this assuages my worries about moderation. 


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@RationalMadman
I don't get how you expect 3RU7AL to be better with even less of a track record in any department. That user barely interacts with others in a social sense,
Assumptions; no facts.

the main supporter Athias has been a better spoken figure than 3RU7AL himself during this campaign.
I've just been more prone to entertain your nonsense. Another reason 3RU7AL would function better in this office than you or I.


Athias
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@Lunatic
None of this lessens moderation or encourages free speech.
Here is the role of DART President as delineated by SupaDudz:

President’s Role

While not a moderating role, the President does retain limited powers with their position, including:
  • The ability to communicate within a moderation team chat (via Discord) in order to give input on all forms of daily decision-making. Except when completely untenable, the mod team will strive to ensure the President’s viewpoint is heard and honored.
  • The ability to approve or veto permanent ban propositions. Moderation will be required to submit permanent ban propositions to the President for review unless the user in question is a bot or advertising account, the situation is uniquely urgent or severe, the President is absent and/or unreasonably tardy, or the permanent ban proposition targets the President themselves. Vetos may be overridden by a simple majority vote among the moderation team. 
  • The ability to envision and execute community events, pending the approval and assistance of moderation.
In general, the President will spend the vast majority of their time in service observing the ordinary daily tasks of the moderation team and giving counsel as they see fit. 
Point out where in the function of DART President does it list or insinuate that anyone outside of moderation can "lessen moderation"?

Also it's too mathematical isn't it?
No, it isn't. When "3RU7AL" states "QUANTIFIABLE," he means that which is demonstrable as opposed to arbitrary qualifications of "moderator opinion."

It doesn't show that you care about the impact of the rules on the userbase,
How did you formulate such a conclusion?

just that they understand them and are applied equally.
And this is not a benefit?

None of this assuages my worries about moderation. 
No one can be responsible for your worries. Not even the DART President. If you intend to vote for someone because that individual makes you "feel better," that is your prerogative. But if you believe that making you "feel less worried" is a qualification of the office, then you are grossly misinformed. 3RU7AL has enough respect for the member community to not patronize them, pander, and appeal to their emotions--much less wager ad hominem attacks toward his opponents. 3RU7AL had already delineated his intentions to sustain the faith of both the community and the moderation staff:

3RU7AL:
maintaining the full faith of the moderators is just as important as maintaining the full faith of the community

If you want some glorified mouthpiece soliciting the ire of the moderation staff while galvanizing the rabble rousing of this site's contrarians, then the other two options are more suited to you. If however you want someone competent who exhibits discipline, possesses awareness--knowing the extent and limitations of the office's capacity--and maintains immeasurable integrity because that is the example he's set from the very start, then I don't see how one's option would be anyone other than 3RU7AL.


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@Athias
Point out where in the function of DART President does it list or insinuate that anyone outside of moderation can "lessen moderation"?
Easy. 

"The ability to communicate within a moderation team chat (via Discord) in order to give input on all forms of daily decision-making. Except when completely untenable, the mod team will strive to ensure the President’s viewpoint is heard and honored."

The president gets a direct line to communicate with moderation, meaning they can encourage softer bans, or even no bans.

"The ability to approve or veto permanent ban propositions."

The president can veto ban's all together. 

I don't know how you missed all of that.


It doesn't show that you care about the impact of the rules on the userbase,
How did you formulate such a conclusion?

Your presidential candidate is only vying for equal punishment or enforcement, not less. You are assuming the best, based on very little that he has actually said. You are making his case for him. Who cares what the rules do to the community, as long as they are enforced equally.

just that they understand them and are applied equally.
And this is not a benefit?
I didn't say it wasn't, just that he isn't trying to lessen strict moderation, as say someone like wylted is trying to do.

None of this assuages my worries about moderation. 
No one can be responsible for your worries. Not even the DART President. If you intend to vote for someone because that individual makes you "feel better," that is your prerogative. But if you believe that making you "feel less worried" is a qualification of the office, then you are grossly misinformed. 3RU7AL has enough respect for the member community to not patronize them, pander, and appeal to their emotions--much less wager ad hominem attacks toward his opponents. 3RU7AL had already delineated his intentions to sustain the faith of both the community and the moderation staff:
Okay you are saying he doesn't care about my vote, well I don't care if he doesn't care either. If he wanted to win my vote or others shouldn't he be trying to answer these questions and be more transparent though? Even if not for me personally, so others can view the discussion and weigh in on this? I am expressing my opinion on why his campaign isn't better, and will continue to do so since he isn't actually addressing those concerns himself. You idolize someone as a candidate who barely speaks for himself. Interesting, me and RM disagree on a lot but that is abundantly clear. You have more faith in your candidate than your own candidate does apparently, otherwise he would be here fighting his own battles. 

maintaining the full faith of the moderators is just as important as maintaining the full faith of the community

If you want some glorified mouthpiece soliciting the ire of the moderation staff while galvanizing the rabble rousing of this site's contrarians, then the other two options are more suited to you. If however you want someone competent who exhibits discipline, possesses awareness--knowing the extent and limitations of the office's capacity--and maintaining immeasurable integrity because that is the example he's set from the very start, then I don't see how one's option would be anyone other than 3RU7AL.maintaining the full faith of the moderators is just as important as maintaining the full faith of the community


I can play that game too.

If you want someone who is okay with over moderation and a dead website, and won't bother to use literally the only useful ability the president has to fix that problem, stick with being the mouthpiece for your candidate who is apparently too noble and valiant to fight his own battles, or really even properly explain what he wants to do. Lucky he has someone like you to psychoanalyze the whole campaign for him since he refuses to do it. :)
Athias
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@Lunatic
Easy. 

"The ability to communicate within a moderation team chat (via Discord) in order to give input on all forms of daily decision-making. Except when completely untenable, the mod team will strive to ensure the President’s viewpoint is heard and honored."

The president gets a direct line to communicate with moderation, meaning they can encourage softer bans, or even no bans.
How does this "lessen" moderation?

"The ability to approve or veto permanent ban propositions."

The president can veto ban's all together. 

I don't know how you missed all of that.
You missed this:

Vetos may be overridden by a simple majority vote among the moderation team. 


Your presidential candidate is only vying for equal punishment or enforcement, not less. You are assuming the best, based on very little that he has actually said. You are making his case for him. Who cares what the rules do to the community, as long as they are enforced equally.
It isn't within the capacity of the presidential office to change the rules. What better can a president do than to advise and counsel for a uniform and quantifiable implementation and enforcement of the rules?

I didn't say it wasn't, just that he isn't trying to lessen strict moderation, as say someone like wylted is trying to do.
The president cannot "lessen" (strict) moderation. The president can certainly counsel for it particularly in areas where it's quantifiable. Therefore it is crucial that the president commands the respect of the moderation team. There's a lot more confidence in 3RU7AL carrying this out, than there is with Wylted.

Okay you are saying he doesn't care about my vote, well I don't care if he doesn't care either.
Once again, how did you formulate this conclusion?

If he wanted to win my vote or others shouldn't he be trying to answer these questions and be more transparent though?
Transparent? What hasn't 3RU7AL been transparent about?

Even if not for me personally, so others can view the discussion and weigh in on this? I am expressing my opinion on why his campaign isn't better, and will continue to do so since he isn't actually addressing those concerns himself.
3RU7AL has expressed every intention he has within the context of the office's capacity. You, RationalMadman and Wylted are overestimating the capacity of the office. Why would he entertain or address that which lies outside the capacity of the office he would presume?

You [respect] someone as a candidate who [speaks when relevant questions are asked.]
Let me fix that for you.

Interesting, me and RM disagree on a lot but that is abundantly clear. You have more faith in your candidate than your own candidate does apparently, otherwise he would be here fighting his own battles. 
It's not a "battle"; it's a conversation. And if you have anything specific you wish to discuss with 3RU7AL, 3RU7AL has already expressed that he's more than willing to indulge:

3RU7AL:
if you would like to discuss a SPECIFIC PROPOSAL i would be more than happy to dissect it

i am more than happy to discuss any SPECIFIC ACTIONS you might have questions about




If you want someone who is okay with over moderation
Please provide a receipt to this statement you allege 3RU7AL made.

and a dead website
Receipt?

and won't bother to use literally the only useful ability the president has to fix that problem,
3RU7AL has already expressed his understanding of the role of President, which you have overestimated and extended beyond an advisory position.

stick with being the mouthpiece for your candidate who is apparently too noble and valiant to fight his own battles, or really even properly explain what he wants to do.
Once again, 3RU7AL has expressed his intentions within the context of the office's capacity.

Lucky he has someone like you to psychoanalyze the whole campaign for him since he refuses to do it. :)
No psychoanalysis necessary; just some good ol' fashioned reading comprehension and deduction.

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Still no answer to my question from the candidate 
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@ILikePie5
What are your stances on free speech within the site?
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
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@Lunatic
None of this lessens moderation or encourages free speech. Also it's too mathematical isn't it? It doesn't show that you care about the impact of the rules on the userbase, just that they understand them and are applied equally. None of this assuages my worries about moderation. 
perhaps you'd like to make a specific proposal ?
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@3RU7AL
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
That wasn’t my question. I’ll ask you the same question I asked RM.

Should a white supremacist advocating for the inferiority of African Americans with facts and sources be banned?
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@ILikePie5
Should a white supremacist advocating for the inferiority of African Americans with facts and sources be banned?
how do you know, QUANTIFIABLY, if someone is, in-fact, "a white supremacist" or not ?
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@3RU7AL
how do you know, QUANTIFIABLY, if someone is, in-fact, "a white supremacist" or not ?
He makes derogatory comments about African Americans with facts as well. Should they be banned?
Discipulus_Didicit
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@3RU7AL
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
So, basically Proposition 1?
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@Athias
Easy. 

"The ability to communicate within a moderation team chat (via Discord) in order to give input on all forms of daily decision-making. Except when completely untenable, the mod team will strive to ensure the President’s viewpoint is heard and honored."

The president gets a direct line to communicate with moderation, meaning they can encourage softer bans, or even no bans.
How does this "lessen" moderation?
Use that reading good ol' fashion reading comprehension you boast about and you should know.

You missed this:

Vetos may be overridden by a simple majority vote among the moderation team. 
Key word "May". The mod team is a group that works together and discusses actions prior to taking them. The president will essentially be part of that team and will be influencing their decisions. The only reason they would veto a decision is if the decision was unreasonable and couldn't be agreed upon by the rest of the mod team.

Your presidential candidate is only vying for equal punishment or enforcement, not less. You are assuming the best, based on very little that he has actually said. You are making his case for him. Who cares what the rules do to the community, as long as they are enforced equally.
It isn't within the capacity of the presidential office to change the rules. What better can a president do than to advise and counsel for a uniform and quantifiable implementation and enforcement of the rules?
Ragnar has confirmed that he has the ability to use discretionary modding and applying of rules in our conversations before. Giving the president a direct line to communicate with the mod team opens the avenue for discretion in applying said rules when it comes to making decisions. If this was automatically being done the right way, their would be no need for the role. Mods are seeking to use the president role as a way to put a community elected offical in the team to help guide decisions. If you or your candidate don't see this as an oppertunity, 3RU7AL is completely wasting his oppertunity here.

I didn't say it wasn't, just that he isn't trying to lessen strict moderation, as say someone like wylted is trying to do.
The president cannot "lessen" (strict) moderation. The president can certainly counsel for it particularly in areas where it's quantifiable. Therefore it is crucial that the president commands the respect of the moderation team.
You are trying to argue semantically here, when we are essentially saying the same thing. Your rigid interpretation of text doesn't change the meaning of the bolded. 

There's a lot more confidence in 3RU7AL carrying this out, than there is with Wylted.
Airmax is better than both individuals at this.

Okay you are saying he doesn't care about my vote, well I don't care if he doesn't care either.
Once again, how did you formulate this conclusion?
"No one can be responsible for your worries."

The person that wants to earn the most votes listens to the voterbase and their concerns if they wish to win. It is in your candidates best interest do the same. 

If he wanted to win my vote or others shouldn't he be trying to answer these questions and be more transparent though?
Transparent? What hasn't 3RU7AL been transparent about?
Absolutely anything. Most of this information that had to come about from asking him questions, should have already been present in the OP of his thread. He gives the absolute bare minimun response in just about every answer, and has you as his henchman doing all the heavy lifting. What about any of that is transparent?

Even if not for me personally, so others can view the discussion and weigh in on this? I am expressing my opinion on why his campaign isn't better, and will continue to do so since he isn't actually addressing those concerns himself.
3RU7AL has expressed every intention he has within the context of the office's capacity. You, RationalMadman and Wylted are overestimating the capacity of the office. Why would he entertain or address that which lies outside the capacity of the office he would presume?
You are extermely under valuing the capacity of the position. The fact that you don't see this as an opertunity for site reform shows little vision, and I guess with such little vision I can see why you would vote for one of the least visionary candidates. 

Interesting, me and RM disagree on a lot but that is abundantly clear. You have more faith in your candidate than your own candidate does apparently, otherwise he would be here fighting his own battles. 
It's not a "battle"; it's a conversation. And if you have anything specific you wish to discuss with 3RU7AL, 3RU7AL has already expressed that he's more than willing to indulge:
Yet it was you who chose to debate with me based on a statement I made. It is you who I am now discussing things with. Not him. You are carrying the mantle here and doing the legwork of his campaign, not him. 

If you want someone who is okay with over moderation
Please provide a receipt to this statement you allege 3RU7AL made.

and a dead website
Receipt?
Where is the reciept for him saying otherwise? You are the one saying the president's power is pretty insignificant, so if thats the case and all your current candidate wants to do is make sure things stay the same but are enforced equally, then over moderation and a dead website is just more of the same. It's not what he said, it's what he is not saying. 

and won't bother to use literally the only useful ability the president has to fix that problem,
3RU7AL has already expressed his understanding of the role of President, which you have overestimated and extended beyond an advisory position.
You must underestimate what adivsors are capable of. Shall I refer you to the King of Rohan? That's a joke before you respond literally. But I stick to the point, that you really are devaluing how strong an advisory position actually is here. 

stick with being the mouthpiece for your candidate who is apparently too noble and valiant to fight his own battles, or really even properly explain what he wants to do.
Once again, 3RU7AL has expressed his intentions within the context of the office's capacity.
You seem to be assuming a lot of what your candidate intends do to where he hasn't made that abundantly clear himself. You are seeing what you want to see in him, none of it based on reality. 

Lucky he has someone like you to psychoanalyze the whole campaign for him since he refuses to do it. :)
No psychoanalysis necessary; just some good ol' fashioned reading comprehension and deduction.
Meanwhile other candidates don't require deduction to understand their platforms. This shouldn't be a puzzle where we have to try and figure out if the person running has good intentions with their role. 
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@3RU7AL
perhaps you'd like to make a specific proposal ?
I don't have anything to propose. Advice I could offer would be to outline a specific campaign detailing exactly and specifically what you plan to do, how you plan to communicate with moderation and what specific changes you want to see them implement in order to achieve fairness in the enforcement. 
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@Discipulus_Didicit
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
So, basically Proposition 1?
Proposition 1 is riddled with rather obvious loop-holes.
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@ILikePie5
how do you know, QUANTIFIABLY, if someone is, in-fact, "a white supremacist" or not ?
He makes derogatory comments about African Americans with facts as well. Should they be banned?
the term "derogatory" is QUALITATIVE

CAN YOU BE SLIGHTLY MORE SPECIFIC ?
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@Lunatic
perhaps you'd like to make a specific proposal ?
I don't have anything to propose. Advice I could offer would be to outline a specific campaign detailing exactly and specifically what you plan to do, how you plan to communicate with moderation and what specific changes you want to see them implement in order to achieve fairness in the enforcement. 
if you refuse to offer specifics, i believe my current position is clear

my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
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@3RU7AL
if you refuse to offer specifics, i believe my current position is clear

my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules
It's not my campaign. It's on you to sell yourself here if you want votes. You need to offer specifics to what you are trying to accomplish. Repeating the same thing over and over again isn't doing you any justice. 
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@Lunatic
my primary focus is on insuring all moderation decisions are based on QUANTIFIABLE and transparent rules

if this is not what you expect from the "DebateArt.com President" then you should vote for someone else
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@3RU7AL
you should vote for someone else
Happily.
 
VOTE AIRMAX!!!!
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@Lunatic
It's not my campaign. It's on you to sell yourself here if you want votes. You need to offer specifics to what you are trying to accomplish. Repeating the same thing over and over again isn't doing you any justice.
No, you want someone to kiss your ass and lie to you about things they can't do. If that makes you content, then godspeed, sir.

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@Athias
You are actually accusing the mods of lying. They are directly saying they want to give the position the ability to influence moderation decisions and you and your candidate lack the vision and motivation to capitalize on the one good thing to come out of the job. Missed opportunity to say the least.

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@Lunatic
You are actually accusing the mods of lying. They are directly saying they want to give the position the ability to influence moderation decisions and you and your candidate lack the vision and motivation to capitalize on the one good thing to come out of the job. Missed opportunity to say the least.
"Influencing" moderator decisions, and "lessening" moderation are not the same. And as 3RU7AL has already informed you, his platform is clearly spelled-out. If his platform provides you little to no confidence in his prospects, then by all means, it is your prerogative to choose someone else. Good luck with that.

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@Athias
"Influencing" moderator decisions, and "lessening" moderation are not the same
Yes they are, LOL
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@Wylted

Yes they are, LOL
Explain.


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@Athias
Moderators currently over moderate. So by influencing them to moderate less, you lessen the amount of moderation.  

Whether the influence be from persuasion or from New policies.