You cant know even from analyzing the creation, because we have no idea why things were created.
I suppose some people could have superior knowledge to mine, yet you have no idea if your knowledge is truly correct. How could you?
It is presumptuous to think you know anything about God.
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@janesix
You cant know even from analyzing the creation, because we have no idea why things were created...How could you?
How? Simple. The set-up is given in the very account of the creation [Genesis], and is concluded by the purpose in Matthew.
Genesis 1: 26. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Matthew 25: 20 And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
Matt 25: 21. His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
Earth was created to give us dominion for a wise purpose to allow our growth in understanding how that dominion ought to be practiced - a talent to be gained in a literal sense. Having learned how proper dominion is practiced by investing our time, energy, and talents [yes, that could be, as is demonstrated by the parable of the talents, an investment of money in addition to time and energy], the Creator invites our participation with him in dominion over many more things; not just Earth.
The knowledge of these things is acquired by reading, studying, pondering, and the prayer of faith. Faith is not merely belief, but is an act performed to demonstrate to God our willingness to learn from him. James 1: 2-8 describes the dedication to faith required. Without the application of faith, we are, as said, tossed and not expected to learn anything from the Lord.
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@janesix
Welcome to Humanism.
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@949havoc
How do you know that the people who wrote the bible knew anything about god?
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@949havoc
How do you know that the people who wrote the bible knew anything about god?
This.
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@FLRW
How is this humanism?
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@Sum1hugme
By following the advice of James, as cited. Act of faith, which is not the complete synonym of belief. It is much more, and depends on much more dedication than mere belief, as James describes. James 1, the entire chapter, is a worthy read to understand all the implications of applying faith to what is not currently known. Don't knock it without trying it. And keep trying, God wants to know you really want to know. It isn't a casual conversation.
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@janesix
As said to Sum1hugme in my #7
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@janesix
No, you should embrace Humanism, because we have no idea what created this simulation ( you know like 2D strings).
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@FLRW
humanism: an outlook or system of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanist beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs, and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems.
The discovery of truth can be obtained by empirical means, which would align with humanist philosophy, but it is also obtained direct from God by revelation by strictly ultra-human effort. Got to know how to prepare for, and make the sincere effort to ask without doubting an answer is forthcoming.
It is presumptuous to think you know anything about God.
I don't believe it is. You know more about God then you would probably ever accept simply because you are very much a part of God. You may not trust your intuition about God because of the frailty and weakness of your limited existence in this world.
You cant know even from analyzing the creation, because we have no idea why things were created.
It's not that complicated. God is creative by nature and that is because consciousness by nature desires to express itself through creative work and experiences. Humans continuously create and express themselves almost endlessly in many different ways because the same is true for them, consciousness by nature will always find avenues of expression. You could say then, that creation is God's canvas of expression...an outlet for creativity and experience.
I suppose some people could have superior knowledge to mine,
Possibly but only in terms of experience and or freedom of thought and mind, you have the same access anyone else has....but to be honest all information and knowledge are at our disposal, we have a vast available body of facts and information in the form of endless works of literature and observations. Of course it would be more like sifting through an infinite puzzle but all the pieces are there. The fun part is putting the puzzle together. That is part of your individual journey.
yet you have no idea if your knowledge is truly correct. How could you?
There isn't an easy answer for that because there are so many factors involved at each conscious observation, choice and belief. It just depends upon the proposition and what we are considering as a candidate for what is true.
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@janesix
I suppose some people could have superior knowledge to mine, yet you have no idea if your knowledge is truly correct. How could you?
If we can't test someone's knowledge for veracity, is it really knowledge?
BTW: I'm glad you are feeling better!
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@FLRW
There is nothing really wrong with humanism, in my opinion. I just think (have faith I suppose) that there is a God,and for some reason I believe He is at least somewhat benevolent.
There are things I don't really think humans are capable without divine intervention. One thing is creativity. EVERYONE says it is at least inspired by something bigger than they are. And we need a lot of help with our ethical growth. We have to put in effort though, or nothing happens.
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@EtrnlVw
I think you are over-confident in your beliefs.
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@SkepticalOne
If we can't test someone's knowledge for veracity, is it really knowledge?
That's hard to figure out.
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@janesix
If we can't test someone's knowledge for veracity, is it really knowledge?That's hard to figure out.
Knowledge is "justified true belief". If someone can not show their belief is true, then it is not justified or knowledge.
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@SkepticalOne
How do you show something to be true?
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@janesix
That may be your perception which is fine. But I'm no more confident about what I believe than anything else I know is true. Would you rather people just remain in the dark about God because they think they can't know anything? what purpose would that serve when all knowledge can be known? what reasons do you have to believe that we can't know anything?
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@janesix
It is presumptuous to think you know anything about God.
It is.
And Christians like to presume much about a god. Indeed, they are prone to write things into scripture that they often presume, guess and assert what god said or done or meant.
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@Stephen
Not just christians, but Jews and Muslims too. Probably other religions as well.
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@janesix
How do you show something to be true?
Starting to ask some really interesting questions! It depends on what you're trying to demonstrate as being true, I think. For example, I can say "In 1936, I believe Lou Gehrig won the Triple Crown for the Yankees." This is a claim I can check pretty easily: see if Gehrig led the league in average, homers and RBI in 1936. If someone else wants to know if it's true, I can show them the reference materials I used. Don't believe the baseball encyclopeida? Okay, no problem: we can go back to the daily box scores of each game in which Gehrig played in 1936 and add up all his stats, and see if the baseball encyclopedia is correct. Once we do that, we can then say "this encyclopedia is accurate", which would then lead us to believe that other claims in it about Lou Brock stealing bases or Tony Gwynn's batting titles, without then having to do the same exercise (though that exercise remains available, you have what's called justifiable confidence in the truth of the encyclopedia, should you decide to challenge it).
So, then how would we know anything about god or gods? We'd have to have some way to confirm anything, which is to your point. I wouldn't say "I know beyond reasonable doubt that Lou Gehrig won a triple crown in 1936 because my parents told me, and a couple of other people have said he did. I don't care to check if that's true." They might be right, but there's a couple of ways to find out if that's the case. Not so with the supernatural.
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@EtrnlVw
That may be your perception which is fine. But I'm no more confident about what I believe than anything else I know is true. Would you rather people just remain in the dark about God because they think they can't know anything? what purpose would that serve when all knowledge can be known? what reasons do you have to believe that we can't know anything?
Because tomorrow might bring something different from what you thought you knew. We can never have enough information. Maybe God can though.
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@ludofl3x
What if you woke up one morning,and some facts were different from what you had previously known? what would you assume happened,and what would you then believe? The new fact, the old fact,or something else entirely? Such as that reality is mutable.
This i s a serious question, I have reasons for asking it to a skeptic.
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@janesix
How do you show something to be true?
Evidence and reason.
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@janesix
Because tomorrow might bring something different from what you thought you knew. We can never have enough information. Maybe God can though.
My beliefs are not rigid, they are flexible and grow all the time. That doesn't mean that what I learned previously deserves no confidence. I never claimed we know all things at one time, I said knowledge is very much like a puzzle....perhaps the puzzle is more complete from person to person IDK, but there is no reason for me to accept I can't know anything about a Reality I was created from. That would be nonsense.
I mean come on, if I thought for one second that you could never know anything about God and be confident in that I would just say "yep, you're screwed and I'm screwed oh well lol. Sorry Jane, we're just in the dark and there's nothing we could ever learn about this so good luck on your journey"... but that would be completely contrary to my whole life's experience and I cannot assert such baloney.
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@janesix
Can you give me an example?
If God created everything including us then we are God.
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@EtrnlVw
Reality changes on a weekly basis for me lately. I should be insane by now but I'm not. Somehow I and others keep skipping to new realities that are similar but different from the last. This week, whales now have nostrils instead of a normal single blowhole. Lst week, tigers now have white spots on their ears. China lost half of it's entire East Coast. Alaska keeps warping. The human skull used to be three fused bones, now it is double that. Eyes now have bones behind them where it used to just be muscle then the brain. Kidneys moved upwards under the ribcage and towards the front. Where do you land a kidney punch? It's supposed to be in the lower back. 22 million Americans have disappeared, and china and India have lost millions as well. In my original timeline, there were 350 million Americans at this time. Now there are less than 330 million. I have personally changed in many ways. The type of galaxy we live in is different even,and we have moved 27000 light years from the Sagitarrius arm to the orion spur. The list goes on.
I should be scared, but I am not currently. I was at first.
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@Polytheist-Witch
A part of God maybe.
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@ludofl3x
Reality changes on a weekly basis for me lately. I should be insane by now but I'm not. Somehow I and others keep skipping to new realities that are similar but different from the last. This week, whales now have nostrils instead of a normal single blowhole. Lst week, tigers now have white spots on their ears. China lost half of it's entire East Coast. Alaska keeps warping. The human skull used to be three fused bones, now it is double that. Eyes now have bones behind them where it used to just be muscle then the brain. Kidneys moved upwards under the ribcage and towards the front. Where do you land a kidney punch? It's supposed to be in the lower back. 22 million Americans have disappeared, and china and India have lost millions as well. In my original timeline, there were 350 million Americans at this time. Now there are less than 330 million. I have personally changed in many ways. The type of galaxy we live in is different even,and we have moved 27000 light years from the Sagitarrius arm to the orion spur. The list goes on.
I should be scared, but I am not currently. I was at first.