WHY DID GOD FAIL TO TELL JESUS' MOTHER OF HER SON'S CRULE & VIOLENT DEMISE?

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Stephen
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 God's failure to learn from his own mistakes was one thing but to keep from his mother the cruel and violent demise and failure of her son's mission on earth was nothing short of out-right cruelty.  It does beg the question had god chosen the right "messiah"?

God's promise to Mary mother  "blessed among woman" of Jesus seems clear enough on the surface when we read:

Luke 1:30-38
"Then the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son, and shall call His name Jesus. 32 He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. 33 And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.”

So although the "Blessed among women" Mary " is a bit perplexed by it all she joyfully rushes off to tell her cousin Elizabeth the "good news".
Nice . 🙂
 But apart from the fact the bold underlined above failed to come to fruition it raises the question why didn't god inform the "blessed among women" that her son would have to endure such a violent torturous scourging and be nailed to a cross to suffer an agonising death in front of her own eyes?


John 19:25

"Now there stood by the cross of Jesus His mother, and His mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene". (was every woman called Mary in those days?)

And is it not the Christian belief that the death of Jesus the "messiah" was foretold and prophesised about in the Old Testament? If this was certainly the case, how come Mary Jesus' mother didn't know the fate of her son sent from god?



#2
Bones
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WHY DID GOD FAIL TO TELL JESUS' MOTHER OF HER SON'S CRUEL & VIOLENT DEMISE?
I know. Because Jesus needed "free will" to overcome "hardships" to become the true "messiah", meaning that God was completely okay with watching his son get tortured to death, because this simply a "test of character". Don't ask me what part of getting nails stuck through your arm is a test of you "inner goodness" though. 

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Stephen
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@Bones
WHY DID GOD FAIL TO TELL JESUS' MOTHER OF HER SON'S CRUEL & VIOLENT DEMISE?
I know. Because Jesus needed "free will" to overcome "hardships" to become the true "messiah", meaning that God was completely okay with watching his son get tortured to death, because this simply a "test of character". Don't ask me what part of getting nails stuck through your arm is a test of you "inner goodness" though. 

As is usual with these unreliable scriptures, Bones, your response doesn't fail to raise more questions.

Why would the son of god who Christians also believe to be god need to test his own character? Jesus had already been confirmed at his baptism to be who he was Matthew 3:17 and had already been tested and tempted in the desert by non other than Satan himself.Matthew 4:1-11  How anyone actually knows what was said between these two is a question all on its own considering there were only two present at the time?

And who did Satan think he was that he could test god himself  or the son of god?

But lets stay with the op for now.
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Castin
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Because even gods fear a mother's wrath, obviously. And well they should.
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@Stephen
@Bones


Stephen, the Hell bound Atheist that knows more about the JUDEO-Christian Bible than any inept pseudo-christian upon this forum,

YOUR REVEALING AND EMBARRASSING QUOTE: "But apart from the fact the bold underlined above failed to come to fruition it raises the question why didn't god inform the "blessed among women" that her son would have to endure such a violent torturous scourging and be nailed to a cross to suffer an agonising death in front of her own eyes?"

Your truthful statement above has always given me pause in that Jesus was a wussy God in allowing others to nail him upon a TREE (1 Peter 2:24), or was it a TORTURE STAKE without cross bars (Matthew 27:40 NWT), or an actual CROSS (John 19:19). Within this contradicting situation of which source was used to hang Jesus has also given me pause on which only one source can be correct, and that leaves the door open in other areas of the scriptures where there is contradiction, whereas only ONE NOTION can be true at any given time. The adage of opening up a can of worms relative to the scriptures comes to mind.  

Since the Greek God Zeus was the King of all Gods, therefore over Jesus as well, was worshiped by his followers within the Bible at the time of Jesus, you would think that Jesus would at least "try" to be equal to the mightyus of all Gods ZEUS!  But no, Jesus let the Romans hang him where if Jesus can walk on water, heal the sick, etc., you would think that He would at least put up a fight in not having the Romans hang Him on a tree, or a torture stake, or a cross!

Stephen, when ever you bring up the notion of Jesus being hung, no pun intended, it reminds me in how much a wussy God He was.  :(





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BrotherDThomas
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@Castin
@Stephen
@Bones


Castin, 

Your forgot that the woman's only place within the scriptures and now, was to bear children and be ruled over by the superior man, tsk, tsk, tsk!  Furthermore, as the Bible states, there will be NO WOMAN in heaven, because the man understands we had to put up with these Sisters of Eve while upon earth. praise! 

“  But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ  and the head of the woman is man. For the man is not of the women; but the woman of the man.” (1Corinthians 11: 3,8 ) 

“But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp the authority over the man, but to be in silence.” (Timothy 2:12) 

“I find more bitter than death the woman who is a snare, whose heart is a trap and whose hands are chains. The man who pleases God will escape her, but the sinner she will ensnare.” (Ecclesiastes 7:26)

“It is better to live in a corner of the housetop than in a house shared with a quarrelsome wife.” (Proverbs 25:24)


PRAISE JESUS' TRUE TEACHINGS ABOUT THE 2ND CLASS WOMAN!

#7
Polytheist-Witch
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Again because there isn't some paragraph written in the Bible saying and God said unto Mary Jesus will suffer a horrible and painful death it must have never been discussed with her ahead of time. Obviously if God comes to you and impregnates you without you having sex there's pretty much anything you're probably going to accept from God. Because you know that your son was immaculately conceived and is not going to die no matter how he physically dies and since Christ knew how he was going to die well beforehand there's a good chance he discussed it with her. But again Stephen assumes if there isn't a specific paragraph saying this was discussed then he implies it was never addressed in any way shape or form because he is a Bible literalist just like a fundamentalist.
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Castin
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@BrotherDThomas
Well, I was sort of joking, but obviously representation of women in the Bible is not five stars. It was written thousands of years ago.

“But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp the authority over the man, but to be in silence.” (Timothy 2:12) 
Paul did not write Timothy; it's pseudepigrapha.
#9
ethang5
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Maybe God didn't read your memo making it a sin not to tell Mary what YOU think He should have.

Or maybe he did tell her and you just unreasonably expect everything God told Mary to be written down.

Who knows?
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@Castin

Love it. A+1

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@Polytheist-Witch
Stephen assumes if there isn't a specific paragraph saying this was discussed then he implies it was never addressed in any way shape or form.

And you believe that what is NOT written in the bible gives the likes of you and other bible ignorant dunces licence to inject your own interpretations and present them as fact. Well it doesn't!

 If I was to start to invent conversations that do not appear in the bible you would among the first  to scream  for me to show you where in the bible something is said or something happened. 


Did you know that a very human priest of god named Gabriel raped the young maiden Mary and took her against her will?
Tick tock, tick tock, tick tock.
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@ethang5
Who knows?

You certainly don't.

You are nothing more than a jumped up bible dunce and sex pest #17 that prefers to answer for others and that would rather create conflict on a thread than to actually discuss its content.

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Stephen
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@BrotherDThomas
Your truthful statement above has always given me pause in that Jesus was a wussy God in allowing others to nail him upon a TREE (1 Peter 2:24), or was it a TORTURE STAKE without cross bars (Matthew 27:40 NWT), or an actual CROSS (John 19:19). Within this contradicting situation of which source was used to hang Jesus has also given me pause on which only one source can be correct, and that leaves the door open in other areas of the scriptures where there is contradiction, whereas only ONE NOTION can be true at any given time. The adage of opening up a can of worms relative to the scriptures comes to mind.  

Indeed. How did a god manage to allow his enemies to take hold of him to do such a thing there-by cutting off and stopping his mission on earth in its tracks?
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zedvictor4
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@Stephen
Was that his Mother or his surrogate Mother?......Virgin birth and all that tosh.

The God character probably didn't give a toss about her, readers were probably left to assume that gullible Joe looked after his missus.

Though you're really best asking the men who concocted such stories....They probably just didn't consider it necessary to the plot.

No one here on Dart is actually going to know.
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Stephen
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@zedvictor4
Was that his Mother or his surrogate Mother?......Virgin birth and all that tosh.

 You are not far off the mark with that comment  ,Vic lad.  The Mesopotamians called them "vestal virgins". They were chosen to be the vestals that carry the seed of high priests and kings. The tradition was carried over by Abraham when he left Mesopotamia.



No one here on Dart is actually going to know.

But shouldn't the "blessed among woman" have known what was going on? It seems that she was all perplexed at the idea.



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@Stephen
Ah.

But was she formerly blessed amongst women...Or was that more like a Catholic type re-write of the plot?

We were led to believe that she was just a pregnant woman traipsing about the Arabian Peninsular on a Donkey looking for an Inn....Did they have Inns back in the day?....Or was that yet another European postscript?

Old Abe will be turning in his grave.
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@zedvictor4

Ah.

But was she formerly blessed amongst women...

It depends of what tribe and what  status she was. Egyptian princesses for instance were held in high regard and used to make unions with foreign nations. Abraham ("a prince of god") is believed to have had an Egyptian "slave" that he whipped a bit of seed into but it was more likely a case of that she was of minor or lower in the ranks in the Egyptian royal family. This practice was also used to infiltrate other royal families and bring them down from the inside, Trojan horses so to speak.





#18
Tradesecret
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@Stephen
opinion. Not a shred of evidence. 
#19
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@Stephen
Begs the question. 
#20
Wylted
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At first I thought you were honestly perplexed by some of these things. This is so stupid though, that there is no way you aren't trolling. There is no possible way that you are this low IQ, to think this is an honest criticism.  

Jesus is the king of the jews and will physically sit on the throne after the beast loses the final battle. He was also constantly mentioning his imminent death. Mary knew. 

Also Jesus did not fail his mission. Every extra day it takes him to return, you should be thankful, because it gives you an opportunity to accept his non gay, and also fatherly love of you and the sacrifice he made so you can have eternal life
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@Castin
Well, I was sort of joking, but obviously representation of women in the Bible is not five stars. It was written thousands of years ago.
Representation is a stupid concept.  The only black mentioned in the Bible is Cain, and the only white is Caesar. 

Yet women were heroes in many bi le stories. We have the redeemed prostitute that let the jews into her window so they could conquer an enemy city that was surrounded by walls. I'm not going to mention all of them, because the names are lost to me at the moment and it would require Google.

They are there though. The first story, eve played a major part in. She was Adam's companion and equal in every way. She is made superior to him after the "fall of man", because she his made his servant.  

Jesus constantly brought up that there is nothing greater than serving. Those who serve will be highest in heaven. 


Proverbs talks a lot about how a man cannot be successful, unless he has the support of a good woman. 

The o ly negative shit you can say about women in the Bible is that they are supposed to serve man, and it isn't even a negative. Did you see man's punishment? It isn't to serve the person you love, which is actually awesome and something men feel inclined and love to do, but it is to live off of your blood and sweat. He is sentenced to a life of hard manual labor. This was a Jewish man. You know how much jews hate manual labor. 
#22
Deb-8-a-bull
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I believe being religious.
No

I believe that people that grew up with religion stop loving their mother to quick. 
Three maybe four years to soon. 
It's debatable 

Now back on topic. 
Andddddddddd Women dont really  count.
But This one comes down to what flavor Christian you are.  So many groups differ on Mary mother of christ. 
They either love her or don't really care about her. 
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Stephen
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@Deb-8-a-bull
They either love her or don't really care about her. 

And the New Testament pushes the "blessed among women" to the back ground once she has given birth. And Joseph his "father" seems to disappear from the scene altogether.
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@Wylted
There is no possible way that you are this low IQ, to think this is an honest criticism. 

 [A] Well Jesus certainly  didn't inherit the throne of David as his mother Mary was promised he would.  And being hung on a cross with nails driven through your writs with a view over-looking the Kidron valley sounds to me like a failed mission to unite the tribes of Israel and bring peace to the earth.

Jesus is the king of the jews .................. He was also constantly mentioning his imminent death.

I agree. Jesus was a Jew that believed himself to be the King of the Jews. 

and will physically sit on the throne after the beast loses the final battle.

I see.   And the final battle will be when? There is no throne to inherit and not even a temple that he promised to rebuild and failed.


Mary knew. 

How do you know? There is not a single verse that even indicates that Jesus mother would have to suffer the spectacle of watching here son undergo a vicious and vile scourging and a violent "death" by crucifixion.  It was all joy and happy days as far as she was concerned.
 Mind you, she did eventually come to believe he was insane.  


Also Jesus did not fail his mission.

He certainly did see [A] above.


Every extra day it takes him to return, you should be thankful, because it gives you an opportunity to accept his non gay, and also fatherly love of you and the sacrifice he made so you can have eternal life.


I'll take my chances on that being utter bullshit, if you don't mind. 

#25
FLRW
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This is from The Bible is Fiction: A Collection Of Evidence
By Daniel Miessler


Jesus’s Story is an Obvious Rehashing Of Numerous Previous Characters
Perhaps even more compelling is the story of Christ himself. As it turns out it’s not even remotely original. It is instead nothing more than a collection of bits and pieces from dozens of other stories that came long before. Here are some examples.
  1. asklepios healed the sick, raised the dead, and was known as the savior and redeemer.
  2. hercules was born of a divine father and mortal mother and was known as the savior of the world.
  3. dionysus was literally the “Son of God”, was born of a woman who had not had sex with a man, and was depicted riding a donkey. He was a traveling teacher who performed miracles, and was killed and resurrected, after which time he became immortal.
  4. osiris did the same things. He was born of a virgin, was considered the first true king of the people, and when he died he rose from the grave and went to heaven.
  5. Osiris’s son, horus, was known as the “light of the world”, “The good shepherd”, and “the lamb”. He was also referred to as, “The way, the truth, and the life.” His symbol was a cross-like symbol.
  6. mithra‘s birthday was celebrated on the 25th of december, his birth was witnessed by local shepherds who brought him gifts, had 12 disciples, and when he was done on earth he had a final meal before going up to heaven. On judgment day he’ll return to pass judgment on the living and the dead. The good will go to heaven, and the evil will die in a giant fire. His holiday is on Sunday (he’s the Sun God). His followers called themselves “brothers”, and their leaders “fathers”. They had baptism and a meal ritual where symbolic flesh and blood were eaten. Heaven was in the sky, and hell was below with demons and sinners.
  7. krishna had a miraculous conception that wise men were able to come to because they were guided by a star. After he was born an area ruler tried to have him found and killed. His parents were warned by a divine messenger, however, and they escaped and was met by shepherds. The boy grew up to be the mediator between God and man.
  8. buddha‘s mother was told by an angel that she’d give birth to a holy child destined to be a savior. As a child he teaches the priests in his temple about religion while his parents look for him. He starts his religious career at roughly 30 years of age and is said to have spoken to 12 disciples on his deathbed. One of the disciples is his favorite, and another is a traitor. He and his disciples abstain from wealth and travel around speaking in parables and metaphors. He called himself “the son of man” and was referred to as, “prophet”, “master”, and “Lord”. He healed the sick, cured the blind and deaf, and he walked on water. One of his disciples tried to walk on water as well but sunk because his faith wasn’t strong enough.
  9. apollonius of tyana (a contemporary of Jesus) performed countless miracles (healing sick and crippled, restored sight, casted out demons, etc.) His birth was of a virgin, foretold by an angel. He knew scripture really well as a child. he was crucified, rose from the dead and appeared to his disciples to prove his power before going to heaven to sit at the right hand of the father. He was known as, “The Son of God”.
The problem, of course, is that these previous narratives existed hundreds to thousands of years before Jesus did.


#26
BrotherDThomas
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@Stephen
@Tradesecret

TRADESECRET, whose gender went from a woman to a man, and then to unknown, and then back to a man, and then went to unknown again,  the Debate Runaway on Jesus' true MO,  Bible denier of Jesus being the Trinity God in the OT, the runaway to what division of Christianity he/she/unknown follows, the pseudo-christian that has committed the Unpardonable Sin, the number 1 Bible ignorant fool regarding Noah's ark, the pseudo-christian that says kids that curse their parents should be killed, states there is FICTION within the scriptures, and is guilty of Revelation 22:18-19 and 2 Timothy 4:3, AN ADMITTED SEXUAL DEVIANT, and obviously had ungodly Gender Reassignment Surgery, Satanic Bible Rewriter, an embarrassed LIAR of their true gender, and goes against Jesus in not helping the poor, has turned into a HYPOCRITE, and a LIAR, teaches Christianity at Universities in a “blind leading the blind” scenario, and is a False Prophet, says that Jesus is rational when He commits abortions and makes His creation eat their children, and that Jesus is rational when He allows innocent babies to be smashed upon the rocks, has now changed genders 5 TIMES in their profile page, 


YOUR LAUGHABLE AND CONTRADICTING QUOTE POST #18 TO STEPHEN: “opinion. Not a shred of evidence. 

OMG, once again you remove one foot to insert the other in front of the membership!!! When Stephen states his knowledge about a topic, you can be sure it is true without having to give citations of proof as shown ad infinitum within this forum, understood?

 Dear, remember when I easily called you out upon only giving “opinions” in your initial post of your ever so B-O-R-I-N-G thread of the Resurrection within the Jewish System, where you had your ass handed to you again by the membership? The link in question is shown below:

When viewing said link above, you did not give any citations, biblical or otherwise, to your Twilight Zone “perceived knowledge” upon your  topic, but ONLY OPINIONS that went ever so wanting, remember?

Then as shown in this link below at your embarrassing expense, Jesus and I had to “school you” relative to your post above, of which, YOU RAN AWAY FROM, therefore telling the forum that you did not have citations: https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/6542-the-implicit-resurrection-within-the-jewish-system?page=1&post_number=7

JESUS' INSPIRED WORDS RELATIVE TO YOUR POSTS WITHIN THIS RELIGION FORUM ARE AS FOLLOWS: "A fool takes no pleasure in understanding, but only in expressing his opinion." (Proverbs 18:2)


Now, go wipe the proverbial egg from your face AGAIN as usual, and when you make subsequent stupid Bible mistakes, you can be rest assured that Jesus and I will be there to correct you, AGAIN!  LOL


NEXT?

#27
Castin
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@Wylted
Well, I was sort of joking, but obviously representation of women in the Bible is not five stars. It was written thousands of years ago.
Representation is a stupid concept.  The only black mentioned in the Bible is Cain, and the only white is Caesar. 

Yet women were heroes in many bi le stories. We have the redeemed prostitute that let the jews into her window so they could conquer an enemy city that was surrounded by walls. I'm not going to mention all of them, because the names are lost to me at the moment and it would require Google.

They are there though. The first story, eve played a major part in. She was Adam's companion and equal in every way. She is made superior to him after the "fall of man", because she his made his servant.  

Jesus constantly brought up that there is nothing greater than serving. Those who serve will be highest in heaven. 


Proverbs talks a lot about how a man cannot be successful, unless he has the support of a good woman. 

The o ly negative shit you can say about women in the Bible is that they are supposed to serve man, and it isn't even a negative. Did you see man's punishment? It isn't to serve the person you love, which is actually awesome and something men feel inclined and love to do, but it is to live off of your blood and sweat. He is sentenced to a life of hard manual labor. This was a Jewish man. You know how much jews hate manual labor. 
When they banned you this place was like South Park without Cartman.
#28
FLRW
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@Castin
When they banned you this place was like South Park without Cartman.
OMG, is Wylted's first name Kenny?
#29
BrotherDThomas
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@Stephen
@Tradesecret

.
Stephen, the hell bound Atheist that knows more about the JUDEO-Christian Bible than any pseudo-christian upon this forum,

Literally, for Christs sake, when will Tradesecret ever learn that they do not belong in this well known Religion Forum, because "her," "he," "unknown," "he," and "unknown" not only embarrasses Christianity because of their Bible stupidity, but also Tradesecret embarrasses this Religion Forum as well by again in being Bible stupid, as we and others have pointed out ad infinitum!

Within your thread, I had to "school" again Tradesecret in this link: https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/6718/post-links/288682

I have given Tradesecret links too many Christian "Children Forums" in the past, but they haven't taken advantage of them where they would be more at home where the "kids" would be equal to Tradesecret's inept Biblical knowledge!  


#30
Wylted
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@Castin
When they banned you this place was like South Park without Cartman.
I feel like you contribute a lot here as well. Glad to see you are active right now.