More including Democrats are raising the alarm about election fraud

Author: Wylted
Trump
Biden
Election
fraud

Posts

Total: 133
Topic's author
#1
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11

It looks like more and more people are raising the alarm about the election fraud in the 2020 election.

Big names complicit in the fraud are trying to stop audits of the vote, trying to stop an investigation or audit is as good as a confession in my book btw, honest people want to be investigated and cleared. 

I doubt the election will be overturned, but the more and more time passes, the more evidence of fraud surfaced. 

It looks like the capital hill ruoters may actually have in fact been heroes trying to preserve the integrity of the election.
#2
dustryder
dustryder's avatar
Debates: 5
Posts: 1,080
3
2
4
dustryder's avatar
dustryder
3
2
4
-->
@Wylted
What in your opinion is the strongest piece of evidence that indicates fraud in the 2020 election?

Topic's author
#3
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@dustryder
I just share news stories here. I try to stay put of analysis, but probably the fact that democrats are against audits. For example, some wanted machine databases preserved to audit, and some democrats opposed preserving them. No innocent person tries to destroy evidence. 
#4
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@Wylted
mediabiasfactcheck:

QUESTIONABLE SOURCE
A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for profit or influence. Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source.

  • We rate LifeSiteNews far right biased for story selection that always favors evangelical Christianity and Questionable based on the promotion of conspiracy theories, pseudoscience, and many failed fact checks
Detailed Report
Questionable Reasoning: Conspiracy Theories, Pseudoscience, Failed Fact Checks
Bias Rating: RIGHT
Factual Reporting: MIXED
Country: Canada (16/180 Press Freedom)
Media Type: Website
Traffic/Popularity: Medium Traffic
MBFC Credibility Rating: LOW CREDIBILITY
So, to support your claim "more and more people are raising the alarm about the election fraud in the 2020 election"  you went with a foreign, ultra-right religious site that's been banned from YouTube insisting that coronavirus can't kill you and the pandemic is a global hoax.  Assuming that you'd use non-fake news to support your claim if you could find any non-fake news that might support your claim, I'd call this post a significant setback for you claim that "more and more people are raising the alarm about the election fraud in the 2020 election"

Of the 54 official claims of voter fraud brought before a court of law, all 54 have been dismissed as meritless.  The lawyer responsible for coordinating those suits, Sidney Powell has now stated under oath that "no reasonable person would conclude that the evidence of voter fraud presented by her were truly statements of fact"  The actual horse's mouth- the American in charge of claiming voter fraud on Trump's behalf says that no reasonable person should believe her.  We should note how Trump's persistence in making claims contrary to his position in court reveals Trump's confidence  in the absence of reasoning to be found in his constituency.

Given that the number one distributer of election fraud claims is Russian intelligence I would advise against the use of foreign sources to evaluate the American mood.

The official US Intelligence assessment of the 2020 election warns:


We assess that Russian President Putin authorized, and a range of Russian government organizations conducted, influence operations aimed at denigrating President Biden’s candidacy and the Democratic Party, supporting former President Trump, undermining public confidence in the electoral process, and exacerbating sociopolitical divisions in the US. Unlike in 2016, we did not see persistent Russian  cyber efforts to gain access to election infrastructure

Although 53% of Republican voters still believe Trump's Big Lie, that number is down 5% since March and 17% since November.  So, polling  actually suggests that fewer and fewer people believe that there was any election fraud, millions fewer in just a few months.  That's the opposite of your reports from foreign evangelists.
#5
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Wylted
No innocent person tries to destroy evidence. 

yep.
Topic's author
#6
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@oromagi
Genetic fallacy. You are claiming because the facts are stated by a site ran by conservatives, the facts don't exist. 

This would be like me claiming the holocaust is fake, because some rabbi said it was real. 
Topic's author
#7
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@oromagi
I want you to explain why an if there is no fraud, that they are trying to prevent audits. These audits are harmless if they are innocent
Topic's author
#8
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
This is like a murderer claiming they are innocent, and that because you have no evidence, you should not go search for evidence. 
#9
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,322
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Wylted
Oromagi is under the assumption that all these Democrats are lying or compromised by conservatives because of the fact they saw ballots with perfect markings, which all voted for Joe Biden in the most blue counties in Georgia - DeKalb, Fulton, and Cobb. Also the fact that after the judge, a Democrat, announced his decision, the place where ballots were kept was mysteriously broken into. Ofc officials claim nothing happened and nothing happened to the ballots. The same officials that would have had a hand in this voter fraud.
Topic's author
#10
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
Oromagi, address what pue just said. If there is no fraud why did the convenient break in happen? 
#11
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@ILikePie5
In a world where everyone trusts the authority they agree with, there can exist no fraud by definition.
#12
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,322
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Wylted
Oromagi, address what pue just said. If there is no fraud why did the convenient break in happen? 
It was all a set up done by the Proud Boys. Duh
#13
Lemming
Lemming's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 3,440
4
5
10
Lemming's avatar
Lemming
4
5
10
-->
@Greyparrot
@ILikePie5
@oromagi
Didn't a number of Republican officials responsible for their state election results 'already check for fraud?
Found none, and Trump either said they should double check and maybe 'implied they should spin the truth?
But the officials refused to do that, and stated there was no fraud, and ended up being censured by their own party, for telling the truth?
And this ninja company people are talking about aren't following proper procedures?

Is what I've heard anyway, but I also haven't been paying close attention.
#14
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Lemming
Trump had a lot of enemies in both established DC elite parties. It's impossible at this point to fix anything.
#15
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,322
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Lemming
Didn't a number of Republican officials responsible for their state election results 'already check for fraud?
If you’re talking about Arizona and Maricopa County specifically, they were in on it. The Republican dude who won his race against an incumbent barely won. Their “audits” are pretty much shams. 

Anyways, we’re talking specifically about Georgia here, although I suspect the same thing happened in Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin as well. Breaking into a place where they keep the ballots the judge said should be examined doesn’t bring trust into the institution. Neither does career Democratic operatives claiming something fishy was up. The courts can punt all they want, they’re just kicking the can down the road just like Congress did in the later 1700s and early 1800s with slavery.
#16
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,322
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Lemming
What GP said. Establishment GOP also hated Trump. Arizona is establishment GOP country. Such a shame that the state that put Goldwater in the spotlight behaves this way. Although I suspect it has something to do with the Hanoi Songbird - another beauty.
#17
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
-->
@ILikePie5
Also the fact that after the judge, a Democrat, announced his decision, the place where ballots were kept was mysteriously broken into. Ofc officials claim nothing happened and nothing happened to the ballots. The same officials that would have had a hand in this voter fraud.

And what about Georgia's Republican Secretary of State and Republican Attorney General both insisting after many investigations there was no fraud? 



#18
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
-->
@Wylted
Oromagi, address what pue just said. If there is no fraud why did the convenient break in happen? 

That is a fallacious question - an Appeal to Ignorance. This fallacy occurs when you argue that your conclusion must be true, because there is no evidence against it. You are concluding there was a devious break-in (even though you have offered zero proof of that) and asking oromagi to disprove your conclusion which is based on nothing but an assumption. You can't disprove someone's guess.  
#19
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
So because Republican Establishment does not like Trump (even though many ride on the coat tails of his popularity) and Democrats do not like Trump, everything Trump says must therefore be true and lack of evidence doesn't matter because everything is a big conspiracy. You can't trust anyone or anything, especially if they are considered legitimate resources. This is where we are folks, enjoy the ride. 
Topic's author
#20
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@ILikePie5
What GP said. Establishment GOP also hated Trump. Arizona is establishment GOP country. Such a shame that the state that put Goldwater in the spotlight behaves this way. Although I suspect it has something to do with the Hanoi Songbird - another beauty.
It's also where John McCain is from. Remember he is born to an evil man who hated his son enough that he ordered bombing where he thought his son was a POW. He as some of those evil genetics, but Arizona Republicans love him. 
Topic's author
#21
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Unpopular
That is a fallacious question - an Appeal to Ignorance. This fallacy occurs when you argue that your conclusion must be true, because there is no evidence against it. You are concluding there was a devious break-in (even though you have offered zero proof of that) and asking oromagi to disprove your conclusion which is based on nothing but an assumption. You can't disprove someone's guess.  

If we look at possible motives and take into account how convenient the break in was for democrats, I think it is a fair question to ask. I am asking what other motive would exist for the break in? If there are multiple motives than maybe it can be dismissed as an unrelated coincidence 
#22
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Wylted
You have to wonder if the majority of Americans are under some Stockholme delusion after generations of getting fucked by elites in Washington DC.
Topic's author
#23
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Unpopular
everything Trump says must therefore be true and lack of evidence doesn't matter because everything is a big conspiracy. You can't trust anyone or anything, especially if they are considered legitimate resources. This is where we are folks, enjoy the ride. 
It you were in Nazi Germany and some Jew was taken to a concentration camp on trumped up charges you would say the following

everything Goldstein says must therefore be true and lack of evidence doesn't matter because everything is a big conspiracy. You can't trust anyone or anything, especially if they are considered legitimate resources by the nazi government and nazi controlled media. This is where we are folks, enjoy the ride. Next they'll be saying the political prisoners are being genocided.

Topic's author
#24
Wylted
Wylted's avatar
Debates: 34
Posts: 5,754
3
4
11
Wylted's avatar
Wylted
3
4
11
-->
@Greyparrot
You have to wonder if the majority of Americans are under some Stockholme delusion after generations of getting fucked by elites in Washington DC.
genocides. Are under Stockholm syndrome. I just heard the political prisoners fromJanuary 6th were singing "God Bless America" in prison. 

The people that America has screwed over when they defended the integrity of the election, were singing "God Bless America" both the left and right have issues with this
#25
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Wylted
All 500 of those people arrested are political prisoners.
#26
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
-->
@Greyparrot


In a world where everyone trusts the authority they agree with, there can exist no fraud by definition.

Trump supporters like Ashli Babbit have shown they are willing to confront law enforcement and die for him, cloak themselves, their homes and their vehicles in Trump paraphernalia while chanting for him at rallies and parades like he's some kind of Kim Jung Un, devote themselves to supporting him and defending him unconditionally even at their own expense... but tend to mock other people's allegiance to authority and groupthink which I find very funny. 

These so called "anti authority" "free thinkers"  emphatically endorse anything Trump says as gospel (and insist the lack of evidence for what he says actually proves he is correct.... ha). They mock other people's obedience to politicians and authority while promoting Trump as THE supremely righteous and premier authority. That is the irony of people still complaining about the election fraud they have never been able to produce any evidence for. 

#27
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Unpopular
Trump is decidedly anti-authority. Every Elite in DC was his enemy.
#28
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
-->
@Wylted
If we look at possible motives and take into account how convenient the break in was for democrats, I think it is a fair question to ask. I am asking what other motive would exist for the break in? If there are multiple motives than maybe it can be dismissed as an unrelated coincidence 

You can ask a question about motives without setting it up as a fallacy where you expect someone to disprove something for which you have provided  no evidence for. If oromagi can't rely on the genetic fallacy, you shouldn't pat yourself on the back for relying on an appeal to ignorance regardless of how logical you think your point is. I'm sure oromagi thinks it's logical to discount the "news" stories from right wing sources like the ones referenced in the OP, but it's still fallacious. 

To be honest, I have not heard the news about someone breaking in so I cannot comment on alternative motives or possibilities, but I do know that lack of evidence for something is not proof that something occurred, and neither is motive alone. What happened with the break-in? The last I heard, a judge in GA agreed to another audit.  
#29
Unpopular
Unpopular's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 98
0
1
3
Unpopular's avatar
Unpopular
0
1
3
-->
@Greyparrot
Trump is decidedly anti-authority. Every Elite in DC was his enemy.

Trump loves authority, order, and hierarchies, and resents everyone who feels he is not or was not the supreme authority on everything. 
#30
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 26,288
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@Unpopular
Trump loves authority, order, and hierarchies, and resents everyone who feels he is not or was not the supreme authority on everything. 

Bullshit. Name one policy that stripped away freedoms from Americans that originated from Trump alone.