Daylight Mafia - Day Phase 1

Author: drafterman
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#151
whiteflame
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@Vader
And I said in this DP that I believe mass hunting for claims is idiotic in this game
We're not talking about a mass claim hunt. Getting one or two claims in DP1 is standard practice. You also talk about how important it is to get behavioral suspicions, but as of right now, you're the most suspicious behaviorally from my view (not saying much since there's little to base behavioral suspicions on at the moment, but that's DP1 in a nutshell). I'm not expecting to get a lot of info this DP, and I'm anticipating that there won't be a lynch given the split nature of the voting up to this point unless there's a scumslip to go by. That being said, the endeavor should be to make the most of this DP, and whether that's by getting claims or simply by putting pressure on people and seeing how they respond, it's worth the effort.
#152
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@whiteflame
There has been a wagon on Speed and now me for a claim. Are you going to look for more claims? Please let me know what part of my behavior has been suspicious. I have remained consistent with the logic that looking for claims unless there's viable suspicious behavior. I have not heard why I am suspicious but that I am suspicious. 
#153
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@Vader
The only thing that doesn't sit right is whiteflame's response to a joke. He pushed a VTL on MisterChris then changed his logic after we called him out, thus changing his view. While Bullish is still pushing it, he isn't pushing a vote on Chris. MisterChris's aggression is weird, but I don't scum read it.
I mean, I guess you can call me out on this, but I read MC's initial post as serious and then re-read it after people drew attention to their perception of it being a joke. I often can't read sarcasm in posts, and I did not initially do so with his post. I didn't change my logic, but it was my goal to understand what he was endeavoring to do, and initially, I thought that was to partially claim and then shift his partial claim. That proved false.
#154
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@whiteflame
I understand that, but it doesn't explain why you put a vote on him. Bullish hasn't put a vote on Chris despite him reading it as serious and he struggles with reading sarcasm and humor as well. I have no issue with that, but my issue comes with the VTL
#155
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@Vader
The only thing that doesn't sit right is whiteflame's response to a joke. He pushed a VTL on MisterChris then changed his logic after we called him out, thus changing his view. While Bullish is still pushing it, he isn't pushing a vote on Chris. MisterChris's aggression is weird, but I don't scum read it.
- Whiteflame "changed his logic" because he didn't realize it was a joke. When we explained it was a joke he was like "wow I missed that oops." That's adjusting to new information.

- Bullish is voting for him and is pushing it?

- Maybe it's just me but I don't think Chris has been aggressive?
#156
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@Vader
There has been a wagon on Speed and now me for a claim. Are you going to look for more claims? Please let me know what part of my behavior has been suspicious. I have remained consistent with the logic that looking for claims unless there's viable suspicious behavior. I have not heard why I am suspicious but that I am suspicious. 
Yes, there has been a wagon on Speed, and I'm uninterested in joining it because I don't see anything that indicates to me that he is scum. If we get a claim out of him anyway, I might change my mind with regards to pursuing more claims. Right now, that's not the case, so here we are.

I think your behavior has been pretty overly defensive, both of yourself in some places and, more so, of MC. The quote I responded to earlier about it being an overreaction to a joke seemed entirely unnecessary to me, as there's no reason why any pursuit of a claim is necessarily wrong at this stage. You've been consistently defensive, yes, but that's reason enough for me to be on you. Also, since you've at least partially claimed (your role will somehow trigger such that it will become obvious in the next DP. You may have good reason not to provide more information, but I'm curious nonetheless why you would provide a partial claim at all if it's so important to hide it.
#157
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@Vader
Wait, I misread your theme split post and made a post where I thought you had taken the opposite position, we're in agreement
#158
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@Vader
I put a vote on him because I thought he had slipped up and adjusted his role. Why is it bad for me to VTL when I think that's what is going on?
#159
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@warren42
He is, let me recheck the VC, because if he is I'm gonna feel dumb. Even so, whiteflame quickly backing off is weird while saying he's got his eye on you, and whiteflame can read my sarcasm fine when I talk to him. I understand Bullish not being able too

Chris is being a bit aggressive. Maybe that's his playstyle, idk. 
#160
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@whiteflame
My role can cause town to lose if it isn't used properly. It can be verified, but if not used correctly, it can cause town to lose. If it is better for me to claim, I will claim, but know town will have to use my role wisely
#161
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@warren42
Got it
#162
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@whiteflame
My playstyle is general defensive as scum and as town, so nothing unusual. While I disagree with the assessment of being overly defensive, I will claim only at L-1
#163
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@Vader
I am not against claiming, I just don't think we hunt just to hunt in DP1. We need to analyze behavior extremely and not produced half whim role claims to generate activity

OK cool. So if there is suspicious behavior to a certain threshold, we can & should request claims. We agree with eachother. I'm not for claiming for the sake of activity either. 
#164
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@Vader
MisterChris's aggression is weird, but I don't scum read it.
I... what? Aggression? I asked you a couple questions lol
#165
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@Vader
I understand that, but it doesn't explain why you put a vote on him. Bullish hasn't put a vote on Chris despite him reading it as serious and he struggles with reading sarcasm and humor as well. I have no issue with that, but my issue comes with the VTL

Bullish has been voted for me for a while
#166
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@Vader
#167
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@MisterChris
You took a response to #118 about Bullish not being able to take a joke as me defending Bullish.

You also said why shouldn't we push claims. No where did you imply that it was only for a certain behavior, you said, why shouldn't we push for claims
#168
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@warren42
Oh he has. Well I was wrong then. 
#169
warren42
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Supa do you want to pressure Chris for his "aggressive" behavior?
#170
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@Vader
You also said why shouldn't we push claims. No where did you imply that it was only for a certain behavior, you said, why shouldn't we push for claims

I said:
You're basically repeating "we don't know a lot therefore don't claim" over & over. Tell me, why precisely shouldn't we claim?

I said this because you seemed to put a blanket "no-no" on claiming DP1 and I wanted to know why we shouldn't. You never gave us a real articulated reason until I asked for it. 

You took a response to #118 about Bullish not being able to take a joke as me defending Bullish.

Ultimately if you extrapolated that statement to its logical conclusion it conflicts with the idea that we should scumread Bullish for his behavior so far, hence my "defense." Furthermore, you never said you were responding to #118 ONLY in the post. You wrote that response after I had said I lightly scumread Bullish. There was no reason for me to think you were only talking about #118 in isolation. 
#171
Vader
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@warren42
No because it isn't enough of a behavioral read to try to pressure. If I were to pressure anyone because a gun was to my head, it'd be whiteflame, but I don't have a gun to my head, so I am not
#172
Vader
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@MisterChris
From my knowledge, no action have been taken DP1. It's best to leave mafia guessing versus being informed so we have a better chance of getting mafia.

And this is not true. You put a wiki link about irony humor, and I said Bullish has never been the humorous type, as he get mad over Luna calling me a cunt nugget. In no way was that a defense, in fact, it was more a joking critique, something that you did, yet you are somewhat targeting me, seems a bit hypocritical in my opinion
#173
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@Vader
So what do you want to do? VTNL?
#174
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1. Supa - lean town
3. oro - null
4. Lunatic - null
5. Pie - null
6. whiteflame - null
7. warren - null
8. MisterChris - lean town
9. Bullish - lean town

#175
warren42
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@Vader
So you are very concerned about behavioral reads and accompanying pressure but the person whose behavior you believe is aggressive and therefore abnormal
#176
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@ILikePie5
At the moment, VTNL is the best option unless another option arrives but the primary choice is VTNL
#177
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@warren42
I didn't say it's abnormal, I just am not used to MisterChris's play to determine if it is abnormal or not. 
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#178
drafterman
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Vote Count
Chris - 1/5 - Bullish
Speed - 2/5 - Pie, oro
Supa - 3/5 - Lunatic, whiteflame, warren

#179
warren42
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You referred to it as weird
#180
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Am I being fucking gaslighted? I legit see nothing that can be construed as a joke.

This is ending up like last game where I was confused till the end about how Lunatics role worked. Except in that game he was even weak vig, he lied about it, he was just regular 1x vig.