Fallible writers of the bible

Author: RoderickSpode

Posts

Total: 13
Topic's author
#1
RoderickSpode
RoderickSpode's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,044
2
2
2
RoderickSpode's avatar
RoderickSpode
2
2
2
Could fallible humans successfully produce the message God intended for man in the form of literatute?

Fallible humans built the great pyramid, from the bond servant who placed the last brick in the wall, to the authority figure who commanded it's construction. Does anyone have any complaints about the great pyramid? Is there any imperfections that cause you to do a face palm when thinking on that 7th wonder of the world?
#2
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,074
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@RoderickSpode
Well.  Humans are neither 100% fallible or infallible....But what's this got to do with theistic literature per se....The question is fact or fiction, not the failings and/or abilities of it's authors.

And laying huge stones upon each other to build a structure is an achievable reality....Back breaking work for some poor bastards and the whims of self importance for others...Same as it ever was and as it still is.

Fact or fiction?....Same as it ever was and same as it still is.


Topic's author
#3
RoderickSpode
RoderickSpode's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,044
2
2
2
RoderickSpode's avatar
RoderickSpode
2
2
2
-->
@zedvictor4
Their seems to be a number if people who make issue of the bible being written by fallible men. 

Maybe one or some of them will answer that question for both of us in this thread.

Wouldn't that be neat?
#4
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,436
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@RoderickSpode
That is a great thought. Fallible men wrote the bible. I totally agree. 


#5
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,074
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@Tradesecret
@RoderickSpode
Yep. I agree also.

Though I prefer to say that fallible men compiled the Christian biblical hypothesis. over a long period of time.

And as a logical and sensible hypothesis, the "bible" was eventually found to fall way short of the mark.

Nonetheless, old habits of fallible people die hard.
#6
Stephen
Stephen's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 8,615
3
2
2
Stephen's avatar
Stephen
3
2
2
-->
@RoderickSpode
Their seems to be a number if people who make issue of the bible being written by fallible men. 

Yes, men. Who tell us it was all the word of god or gods word,  who isn't supposed to be fallible. Or are you disagreeing with the many here who are adamant that the bible is the word of god?


Topic's author
#7
RoderickSpode
RoderickSpode's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,044
2
2
2
RoderickSpode's avatar
RoderickSpode
2
2
2
-->
@zedvictor4

Yep. I agree also.

Though I prefer to say that fallible men compiled the Christian biblical hypothesis. over a long period of time.

And as a logical and sensible hypothesis, the "bible" was eventually found to fall way short of the mark.

Nonetheless, old habits of fallible people die hard.
The idea to my understanding is that since fallible men wrote the Bible, it can't ultimately be the divine message from God. If someone doesn't believe God exists, I'm not sure what significance that would have anyway.

What grounds are you claiming that the "bible" was eventually found to fall way short of the mark? It seems like an odd statement considering the extreme popularity of the book worldwide.

The fact that there are critics to it's validity wouldn't render the book short of the mark. I would argue that it strengthens it.

Whether one embraces the bible, or opposes it, the attention given to it speaks volumes.
#8
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,074
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
-->
@RoderickSpode
The book is a book.....And the transfer of data is the transfer of data.....Or brainwashing, depending how you choose to look at it.

Which ever way you look at it, it's nonetheless an inevitable process.

Though, the hypothesis itself falls short of the mark, in the light of evolved knowledge.

The biblical compilers were rendered fallible by their own ignorance.
#9
Tradesecret
Tradesecret's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 3,436
3
2
6
Tradesecret's avatar
Tradesecret
3
2
6
-->
@RoderickSpode
The idea to my understanding is that since fallible men wrote the Bible, it can't ultimately be the divine message from God. If someone doesn't believe God exists, I'm not sure what significance that would have anyway.
I am not sure what your point is here. My view is that the bible is written by fallible men but that it is also breathed out by an infallible God.  Like Jesus - it is both divine and human.  The infallible God used fallible men to write his word to us - using their fallible tools and minds but nevertheless speaking the mind and word of God.  

Hence the bible is both infallible and inerrant.  It is divine and totally perfect.  It is its own measuring tool - making it inerrant. 



Topic's author
#10
RoderickSpode
RoderickSpode's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 1,044
2
2
2
RoderickSpode's avatar
RoderickSpode
2
2
2
-->
@Tradesecret

I am not sure what your point is here. My view is that the bible is written by fallible men but that it is also breathed out by an infallible God.  Like Jesus - it is both divine and human.  The infallible God used fallible men to write his word to us - using their fallible tools and minds but nevertheless speaking the mind and word of God.  

Hence the bible is both infallible and inerrant.  It is divine and totally perfect.  It is its own measuring tool - making it inerrant. 
That's a mirror image of my view.

The post of mine in question, like the OP, is simply an invitation for those who believe the bible is fallible because it's written by fallible men, to explain why fallible authors must result in a fallible Word of God.
#11
SkepticalOne
SkepticalOne's avatar
Debates: 9
Posts: 1,720
3
3
7
SkepticalOne's avatar
SkepticalOne
3
3
7
-->
@RoderickSpode
Could fallible humans successfully produce the message God intended for man in the form of literatute?
I don't know (and neither do you). We don't have the original manuscripts. We can only guess how far the texts deviate from the originals. What is indisputable is that there most certainly are deviations. 

Fallible humans built the great pyramid, from the bond servant who placed the last brick in the wall, to the authority figure who commanded it's construction. Does anyone have any complaints about the great pyramid? Is there any imperfections that cause you to do a face palm when thinking on that 7th wonder of the world?
In fairness the great pyramid is the result of a learning process of which the "bent pyramid" is a part. This structure is an early experiment in pyramid building that is less than perfect. The point being, the pyramids are not a great example to prove inerrancy/perfection is possible from fallible beings.
#12
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@RoderickSpode
Could fallible humans successfully produce the message God intended for man in the form of literatute?
Provided there some god(s) exist humans could write anything it was possible to communicate to humans. The trouble then becomes discerning any given work of fiction or mythology from a genuine message from some god(s).
Fallible humans built the great pyramid, from the bond servant who placed the last brick in the wall, to the authority figure who commanded it's construction. Does anyone have any complaints about the great pyramid? Is there any imperfections that cause you to do a face palm when thinking on that 7th wonder of the world?
Are you suggesting that some god(s) were involved? If not than I'm not sure what pur ability to manipulate physically objects and perform mathematics and feats of engineering has to do with any supernatural thing or even how that could be seen as a demonstration that any supernatural thing can or could exist. 
#13
secularmerlin
secularmerlin's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 7,093
3
3
3
secularmerlin's avatar
secularmerlin
3
3
3
-->
@zedvictor4
Well.  Humans are neither 100% fallible or infallible....But what's this got to do with theistic literature per se....The question is fact or fiction, not the failings and/or abilities of it's authors.

And laying huge stones upon each other to build a structure is an achievable reality....Back breaking work for some poor bastards and the whims of self importance for others...Same as it ever was and as it still is.

Fact or fiction?....Same as it ever was and same as it still is.
Well stated.