I left, the Democratic Party, to vote for Trump.

Author: YeshuaBought
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#181
HistoryBuff
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@ILikePie5
There’s also a big difference between saying you’re non partisan while preaching fake news. For the media it’s all a ratings game. Fox simply does it better because of openly conservative people like Sean Hannity. Both CNN and Fox engage in “lying” behavior. I’m not defending Fox, just saying it has better ratings. You on the other hand seem to be defending CNN. Is this true?
I didn't defend CNN. They present the facts with a distinct bias. Their opinion sections are often full of opinions that aren't supported by facts.

However, Fox is in a whole different league. They lie constantly. Whether it is the "news" team or the opinion people, it is all far right wing nonsense filled with lies, half truths and constantly kissing trumps ass no matter how wrong he is or how many people he is hurting and/or killing. 

They lying, corrupt, sycophants. 


#182
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
sure as I said hindsight is 20/20 and mistakes or missteps will always happen, nothing I read in that post is gross negligence imo,  I'm really only interested in actual outcomes not the stuff that Trump says which to this day still makes me cringe, I can't stand it, but that's a different topic.

“To be fair, the United States was one of the first Western countries to impose any kind of formal travel restriction against China,” Kiernan told us. “With the exceptions of the Czech Republic (suspended visas seven days after U.S. implemented restrictions) and Italy (suspended flights two days before U.S. implemented restrictions), the EU did not impose travel restrictions against China specifically. Australia imposed its entry ban on travelers from China, which was quite similar to the United States’, one day before the United States acted. New Zealand and Israel imposed their travel bans on the same day as the United States.”


“Taking this all together, what this data shows is that the United States was neither behind nor ahead of the curve in terms of imposing travel restrictions against China,” Kiernan said.
that to me pretty much settles the issue of timing with the China travel ban.

the respirators is a non issue as no state ran out, not even close

the p.p.e. however is/was a legitimate concern and there's plenty of finger pointing to be had, but again not gross negligence.  The resupply effort etc was very good.

anything else you can think of that I/we may have missed?

#183
ILikePie5
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@ATroubledMan
Exactly, it was in reference to this comment you made. I brought up some stats on peoples trust in the media, thought it would have been interesting for you to read considering you said "Majority of Americans"

Exactly. I said media as a whole. Not individual networks.


#184
ILikePie5
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@ATroubledMan
That's a fair statement, I'm not sure who has better ratings, but I would have to ask if you think ratings is equivalent to valid reporting of news?
Not necessarily. But people you have to take into account this: people are more likely to mistrust you if you claim to be non-partisan but spew liberal talking points compared to if you openly admit your beliefs. Personally I don’t look at opinion pieces. I look at facts but I do watch Hannity for people like Sara Carter who in my opinion is an excellent investigative reporter.

As well, do you think it's appropriate for a president to say things like this?

“Don Lemon, the dumbest man on television (with terrible ratings!).” 
Yes. He like every American has the right to free speech. It’s appropriate to exercise his first amendment right.
#185
ILikePie5
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@HistoryBuff
I didn't defend CNN. They present the facts with a distinct bias. Their opinion sections are often full of opinions that aren't supported by facts. 
Glad we agree!


However, Fox is in a whole different league. They lie constantly. Whether it is the "news" team or the opinion people, it is all far right wing nonsense filled with lies, half truths and constantly kissing trumps ass no matter how wrong he is or how many people he is hurting and/or killing. 
I would actually disagree. There are numerous objective reporters on Fox like Neil Cavuto. Name me one such person on CNN?

They lying, corrupt, sycophants. 

Compared to CNN, definitely not. CNN on a whole bunch of levels is worse than Fox News.
#186
ATroubledMan
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
 nothing I read in that post is gross negligence imo
But, it was gross negligence, especially for a president. 

Gross negligence is a conscious and voluntary disregard of the need to use reasonable care, which is likely to cause foreseeable grave injury or harm to persons, property, or both.

If we assume Trump's gross negligence was not conscious or voluntary, can we assume he's got mental disorders?
#187
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
what, specifically do you see as gross negligence?
what was unreasonable?  "which is likely to cause foreseeable grave injury or harm"

if that's the standard then travel bans should(should have been) be permanent unless mandatory and comprehensive health screens are done prior to entry.  the potential for some new virus or bacterial is always a possibility as is the spread of flu and other illnesses.
#188
HistoryBuff
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@ILikePie5
I would actually disagree. There are numerous objective reporters on Fox like Neil Cavuto. Name me one such person on CNN?
i don't really watch much CNN, so I honestly don't know many of them. 

They lying, corrupt, sycophants. 

Compared to CNN, definitely not. CNN on a whole bunch of levels is worse than Fox News.
such as? Fox lies constantly. They fawn over every trump ally and toss them the softest of soft balls. They refuse to make even the weakest criticism of trump and viciously attack anyone who dares to. They are the very worst of the liars and sycophants. 
#189
ATroubledMan
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
what, specifically do you see as gross negligence?
I outlined some of that in post #177. As well, there's more in those links I posted earlier, where some of it was copy and pasted by another member here. 

#190
ATroubledMan
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@ILikePie5
This part from that Gallup poll was interesting to note.

Republicans became increasingly mistrustful of the media in 2016 when Trump was campaigning for president and was sharply critical of the media's coverage of him. Between 2015 and 2016, Republican trust in the mass media fell 18 points to its historical low of 14%, where it remained in 2017. Following a seven-point boost last year, it has returned to 15%. For their part, Democrats have consistently been more trusting of the media than Republicans but rallied around the press and became even more trusting when Trump took office in 2017.

I think that speaks volumes for when Trump started his campaign and was blurting out, "Fake News" whenever possible, and Republicans took notice, but for long, they eventually came back quite a bit. Seems Trumps bleating of "Fake News" was short lived.
#191
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@fauxlaw
Democrats literally called it racist when he took the few early steps he did. First they called the chinese travel ban racist. then they tried to spin the europe ban as racist. A lot of liberal politicians were insinuating that people were racist for social distancing early on when they were avoiding chinese markets where recent flights from wuhan were most likely to spend time. 

Now that Democrats have decided the outbreak makes trump look bad, they want to extend social distancing indefinitely. I heard a health figure in charge of the response in Ohio say "We can't Let Up". This is insane to say we can't let up. At some point we need to let up and saying to never ever ever let up like she did is dangerous

#192
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
I read it, there was nothing substantial that I read, bunch of opinions but nothing specific

can you give one, just one example of gross negligence, even in your own words is fine because I'm just not seeing it, actual actions or inactions, not Trump said this, said that, that's just nonsense.  There is not one thing in post 177 that points to gross negligence by Trump that I can see, perhaps you can point it out?

it's a whole lot of opinion and the few facts do not point to any gross negligence by Trump.

I'm constantly asking you to point things out and for specifics yet you don't provide any, just opinion pieces, if you don't have any that's fine, let's move on then.

in my post #182 the response timing of the U.S. and other countries were compared and a conclusion was made, those are specific facts.

The stockpile of ventilators was depleted, who makes up the number needed for the stockpile?  when was it depleted and why?  again, not one person who needed a ventilator went without one.  (specific facts)
#193
ATroubledMan
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
"can you give one, just one example of gross negligence, even in your own words is fine because I'm just not seeing it"

That is absolutely shocking. Are you sure you read the definition I put of gross negligence? Do you actually know what it means?

Even, when Trump said that the virus would magically disappear by April was well beyond gross negligence, that should be impeachment material.

it's a whole lot of opinion
Lol. No, it's a whole lot of gross negligence. 

I'm constantly asking you to point things out and for specifics yet you don't provide any, just opinion pieces
No, they're not opinion pieces. You seem to just want to dismiss everything out of hand and I'm getting tired of trying to get through to someone who can't see the forest for the trees. 

The stockpile of ventilators was depleted, who makes up the number needed for the stockpile?  when was it depleted and why?  again, not one person who needed a ventilator went without one.  (specific facts)
Funny how our version of facts is contrary to what's actually going on.

'Scotch tape and baling wire': How some hospitals and companies are responding to meet America's ventilator shortage.


This was written last year, did the government do anything? Yes, Trump fired all kinds of experts at the CDC and cut their funding. Again, gross negligence.

In a severe influenza pandemic, hospitals will likely experience serious and widespread shortages of patient pulmonary ventilators and of staff qualified to operate them. Deciding who will receive access to mechanical ventilation will often determine who lives and who dies.


Then, there's this serious piece of gross negligence when Trump decided this little gem, because Trump "had a feeling"

Trump Rejects New York’s Plea For Ventilators: ‘I Don’t Believe You Need’ That Many

I have a feeling that a lot of the numbers that are being said in some areas are just bigger than they’re going to be,” Trump told Fox News’ Sean Hannity


Of course, I expect you to just dismiss all this out of hand. 
#194
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
ah you had to reach back to last year, gotcha, and that wasn't the responsibility of that state yup ok sure thing

Even, when Trump said that the virus would magically disappear by April was well beyond gross negligence, that should be impeachment material.
Gross negligence is a conscious and voluntary disregard of the need to use reasonable care, which is likely to cause foreseeable grave injury or harm to persons, property, or both.

what he said was likely to cause foreseeable grave injury or harm?  um you have some proof for that?

Trump Rejects New York’s Plea For Ventilators: ‘I Don’t Believe You Need’ That Many

I have a feeling that a lot of the numbers that are being said in some areas are just bigger than they’re going to be,” Trump told Fox News’ Sean Hannity

Cuomo wanted 30,000!!!   ROFL how can it be gross negligence when he was right?!?!?!?!  They got some, had some in stock and no one hasn't been without one so.....  LOL wow you are off your rocker

that is why I dismiss, because it should and deserves to be

you are just blinded by hate.
#195
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@Singularity
Pelosi Lunches in SF Chinatown, Lending Support to Businesses Amid Coronavirus Fears  (Feb 24th)

Azar declared a public health emergency for the novel coronavirus on Jan. 31, and announced the travel restrictions to and from China, effective Feb. 2. 
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/

wait? what?
#196
ATroubledMan
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
you are just blinded by hate.
You're blinded by willful ignorance.


#197
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
not at all, I looked up specifics and examples, you have not, best you can do is post that Trump said bad stuff with no tie to any direct outcome

do you deny there was and have been enough ventilators?

do you deny any of the links and quotes I have pulled from them?

#198
Dr.Franklin
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
I smell a troll...
#199
ATroubledMan
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@Dr.Franklin
Yes, he does appear to be trolling me.
#200
ATroubledMan
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
 best you can do is post that Trump said bad stuff with no tie to any direct outcome
Yes, I know you are ignoring what I've provided you.

do you deny there was and have been enough ventilators?
I just posted one article of which there are many that there aren't enough ventilators. You ignored it.

I can only conclude you're trolling.

#201
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@ATroubledMan
I just posted one article of which there are many that there aren't enough ventilators. You ignored it.
wow I have no idea how I could have possibly missed something like that, how many were they short?  How many people didn't get ventilators that needed them?  I didn't see any figures in your article but I may have missed it so help me out and point it out if you would be so kind, thanks.
#202
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@Dr.Franklin
Cuomo just said they had extra ventilators and is sending some to 2 different states, but maybe he's a liar too, dunno.
#203
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@YeshuaBought
Why can you not be in the Democratic Party and vote for Trump?


It's a bit like saying I walk therefore I cannot ride a bicycle.
#204
Dr.Franklin
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
yeah
#205
Greyparrot
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@TheDredPriateRoberts
Anderson Cooper gets paid $50,000 dollars a day to make sure you are experiencing to proper levels of panic. 

You know he really cares a lot more about you than $50,000 dollars a day.

Trust me on this.
#206
TheDredPriateRoberts
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@Greyparrot
I hope people will get tired of that reality tv and tune out and they can go to the unemployment line.