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@TheRealNihilist
I'm not sure what you are asking here. By accepting a standard like Celsius we can communicate the temperature to one another.
Morality in a Perfect World
Posts
Total:
77
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@bsh1
Given the reality of the human condition. Is it actually possible to be truly objective.
Isn't an objective opinion/decision always going to be resultant of a subjective process.
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@secularmerlin
You said you go by convenience and I am asking why.
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@secularmerlin
What ought you do?
If you love The Truth, there is really only one way. The right way. Our inability to perfectly execute the right way in no way compromises the perfection of The Truth.
What ought we do?
Abide in The Truth. Align our hearts and mind to it. If you love The Truth, respect nature as coming from it. See man as being made in the image of it. Love. Let that love purify you to be even more effective at it.
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@bsh1
"Can morality and perfection coexist?
Yes as complementaries.
1} Perfection is metphysical-1, mind/intellect/concept ex a perfect circle or sphere does not exist only closer and closer approximations of perfection.
2} Morality is cause and effect ergo detereministic, occupied space judgement ergo an action based on circumstances and all actions are tainted properties that have;
charge{ ex emotion plus or minus }, color, taste, spin, temperature, complexity, direction and magnitude.
If yes, must they always coexist?"
Yes, occupied space and concepts are eternally complementary to each other in general, not in every specific special-case.
Ex we have existence of a macro-infinite non-occupied space and the concept such a space, whereas we do not have an infinite set of occupied space dogs, automobiles numbers etc, yet we can have the concept ---talking point-- of such and this is known as a fiction { falsehood/false narrative }.
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@TheRealNihilist
You said you go by convenience and I am asking why.
So that I can communicate with others. Standards like Celsius allow us to import more precise information about the temperature but only if both parties recognize it as a valid system for measuring temperature.
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@Mopac
I know your trying to seem pithy but you don't come off as pithy to me when you use so many words to say essentially nothing you come off as vacuous.
I have no intention of engaging you further I just thought you might appreciate some constructive criticism.
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@secularmerlin
I don't see constructive criticism. I see someone trying to appear pithy but coming off as unjustifiably arrogant and condescending.
I understand you interpreting my words as meaningless is consistent with your nihilism.
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@Mopac
Oranges are pithy.
And meaningless words are meaningless if they are not relative to something that can be given meaning to.
We can all relate to temperature.
Whereas we cannot all relate to a self contained hypothesis that is not externally verifiable.
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@zedvictor4
What exactly do you find difficult about this?
What ought you do?If you love The Truth, there is really only one way. The right way. Our inability to perfectly execute the right way in no way compromises the perfection of The Truth.What ought we do?Abide in The Truth. Align our hearts and mind to it. If you love The Truth, respect nature as coming from it. See man as being made in the image of it. Love. Let that love purify you to be even more effective at it.
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@zedvictor4
Well statedOranges are pithy.And meaningless words are meaningless if they are not relative to something that can be given meaning to.We can all relate to temperature.Whereas we cannot all relate to a self contained hypothesis that is not externally verifiable.
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@Mopac
What exactly do you find difficult about this?What ought you do?If you love The Truth, there is really only one way. The right way. Our inability to perfectly execute the right way in no way compromises the perfection of The Truth.What ought we do?Abide in The Truth. Align our hearts and mind to it. If you love The Truth, respect nature as coming from it. See man as being made in the image of it. Love. Let that love purify you to be even more effective at it.
This
we cannot all relate to a self contained hypothesis that is not externally verifiable.
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@secularmerlin
The order thst can be discerned externally is proof of a unifying reality that binds all things. I do not believe this is an extraordinary claim.
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@Mopac
The order thst can be discerned externally is proof of a unifying reality that binds all things. I do not believe this is an extraordinary claim.
This is not your entire claim. When you pretend that this is all you are saying you are being disingenuous. It is when we get past the 'reality exists and so something seems to be holding it together' and start speculating on what that might be that I ask you to demonstrate your position.
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@secularmerlin
It is really quite the opposite. I say The Ultimate Reality is what it is and admit that God's essence is unknowable, as is the position of the church.
You think that The Ultimate Reality must be equated to something else, like say a theory of how things are or some other thought.
We know that The Ultimate Reality is incomprehensible, and so any claim to circumscribe God with the intellect must be some form of prelest.
The concept of a perfect world has driven many a terrorist and tyrant in history. The moment you even begin thinking about it, you will begin to enter a vigilant mindframe. It's best to dispell the urge for utopia entirely from your psyche, since to even bear it in mind dulls the enjoyment and efficiency with which one operates in this imperfect reality.
The 'perfect' reality wouldn't require morality, that's true. The perfect reality is one in which nothing at all exists, since to exist is to have flaws.
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@RationalMadman
Well stated. Is this yours? I must admit I'm impressed.The concept of a perfect world has driven many a terrorist and tyrant in history. The moment you even begin thinking about it, you will begin to enter a vigilant mindframe. It's best to dispell the urge for utopia entirely from your psyche, since to even bear it in mind dulls the enjoyment and efficiency with which one operates in this imperfect reality.
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@secularmerlin
What do you mean is it mine?
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@RationalMadman
Are you quoting someone or did you write this? I love it.
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@secularmerlin
I'm probably not the first to realise that both extreme rebel leaders and the leaders of the regimes they were fighting against have parallels in their otherwise opposite personas and psyche.
It was written from my own fingers and brain, yes, but it probably is a concept already expressed beforehand by philosophers and psychologists.
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@RationalMadman
Fair enough
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@secularmerlin
I would thank you for the compliment but I am aware of how quickly you become sarcastic and dismissive in elongated interaction.
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@RationalMadman
It is not my intention to be either. In fact sarcasm doesn't translate well into static posts and I find it is better to say what you mean.
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@secularmerlin
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@RationalMadman
I recall you didn't like the idea that you could not be right about a hypothetical boxes contents but sometimes that's how hypothetical boxes are.
Moral concepts {metaphysical-1 } are based in action. I think there is some buddhist teachings or sayings in those regards,
right action, right livelyhood, right thoughts{ think good thoughts } etc.
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Yes as complementaries.
1} Perfection is metphysical-1, mind/intellect/concept ex a perfect circle or sphere does not exist only closer and closer approximations of perfection.
2} Morality is cause and effect ergo detereministic, occupied space judgement ergo an action based on circumstances and all actions are tainted properties that have;
charge{ ex emotion plus or minus }, color, taste, spin, temperature, complexity, direction and magnitude.
If yes, must they always coexist?"
Yes, occupied space and concepts are eternally complementary to each other in general, not in every specific special-case.
Ex we have existence of a macro-infinite non-occupied space and the concept such a space, whereas we do not have an infinite set of occupied space dogs, automobiles numbers etc, yet we can have the concept ---talking point-- of such and this is known as a fiction { falsehood/false narrative }.
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@secularmerlin
If you don't bet on it being purple, in your scenario, you are not playing optimally.
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@RationalMadman
There is no optimal play. You simply cannot know what is in the box. Ever. This is not sarcasm or dismissiveness it is actually a parameter of the thought experiment.
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@bsh1
To answer your question:
"Can morality and perfection coexist? If yes, must they always coexist? What implications might this have for discussions of heaven and hell, for example."
Yes, and yes. A person's moral character is intertwined with the concept of "a perfect person." If a person is amoral or immoral, then they aren't as great, for example, as an identical person who is also morally good. Maximal greatness is the same thing as perfection.
Morality can co-exist in a perfect world if people choose to do good. Perhaps those who chose to do God's will here on Earth will be guaranteed a perfect world in Heaven and their "choice" was made during their years on Earth.
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@Fallaneze
There is a lot to unpack here so let's start with "perfect person". Perfect is a subjective standard to begin with. Moral perfection and physical perfection are not the same thing and mean different things do different people anyway.