These are reasons why Kamala needs to win and Trump needs to lose 2024 elections, 3 main points

Author: Best.Korea

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@Savant
it might be reasonable for people to also want to reduce abortion
Abortion rates have reduced greatly over time after abortion was legalized, thanks to education. Isnt that good enough?
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@Best.Korea
Abortion rates have reduced greatly thanks to education.
So do all those other things you want to reduce. No need to legalize abortion when education will just reduce crime anyway.
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@Savant
No need to legalize abortion when education will just reduce crime anyway
Abortion and education reduce death rates of born people more than education alone. Abortion increases liberty and education.

There are plenty of benefits for born people from abortion being legal, thus banning abortion harms born people.
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@Best.Korea
Abortion and education reduce death rates of born people more than education alone.
Banning abortion reduces death rates of unborn people more than education alone.
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@Swagnarok
Every southern plantation owner in the 1800s would've said the same.
So you’re saying that a personal choice by a woman or a girl to not carry a pregnancy to term is the same as enslaving other human beings for profit.

That’s beautiful.

So you stand on the same firm ground of righteousness as abolitionists.

Because a fetus is just as much a human being as a black person. Perhaps even more so, if the fetus is white..


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@Savant
Banning abortion reduces death rates of unborn people more than education alone.
Not by much, but lowers quality of life of born people. Born people are more important than unborn.

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@IwantRooseveltagain
So you’re saying that a personal choice by a woman or a girl to not carry a pregnancy to term is the same as enslaving other human beings for profit.
I'd dare say it's morally worse. At least the slaves, for the most part, were able to have long-ish lives. And they were born into a time when the drudgery of working the soil without the benefit of powered machinery was unavoidable, so their masters definitely made their lives worse but weren't the sole cause of that misery.

Abortion deprives a 21st century American of 70, 80 years of life in 21st century America. The utility robbed of them is much higher than for 18th or 19th century black slaves.

That’s beautiful.
There is nothing beautiful about slavery or abortion. These are among the most heinous crimes committed in the long history of the world. Since 1973 we've holocausted more of our fellow American citizens than the cumulative death toll of WW2. In countries like China, we're talking as many abortions in the last 40 years as there are Americans currently.

So you stand on the same firm ground of righteousness as abolitionists.
It costs me nothing to adhere to my position. It would be vain and vacuous to compare myself to those who risked their lives or took direct action against these evils. I'm typing this on a keyboard from the comfort of my air conditioned home, and after this post is completed I'll go about my pampered everyday life. 74 million Americans have been so utterly desensitized about the topic through decades of forced normalization as to do nothing when there's a Planned Parenthood clinic within driving distance, and I'm one of them. On a sheer emotional level, abortion is to me but one of many hot button issues. I can easily stop thinking about it and have my thoughts dwell on something else.

But rationally speaking yes. Abortion is a crime against humanity becoming of the Ancient Romans, who abandoned their newborns in trash heaps to die of sickness or to be eaten by predators.

Because a fetus is just as much a human being as a black person. Perhaps even more so, if the fetus is white..
I reject the distinction between a fetus and a person. By definition, a fetus is human and by definition a fetus is a person.

It's also telling that you said fetus and not embryo or zygote. A baby 30 minutes from being born is still a fetus. But because it hasn't yet passed through the birthing canal, I suppose that makes it not human in your eyes. Civilized "progressive" logic there.
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@Swagnarok
Abortion deprives a 21st century American of 70, 80 years of life in 21st century America
So does not reproducing, so people who dont reproduce do same thing. So refusing to reproduce is wrong?

Also, many lives in USA are not good, and aborted children are those who would have worse lives.

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@Swagnarok
I'd dare say it's morally worse. At least the slaves, for the most part, were able to have long-ish lives
What are you basing that on? And What was the average life expectancy of a slave?

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@Swagnarok
These are among the most heinous crimes committed in the long history of the world
To call termination of a pregnancy a crime is a lie. It is not a crime, and the Unite States has a lot of laws. You may think it’s immoral, but it’s not a crime and nobody cares what MAGA MORONS think anyway. They are fundamentally immoral people.

If you don’t want an abortion, don’t get one. But MIND YOURE OWN DAMN BUSINESS!

We all know God hates divorce. How many MAGA MORONS are divorced? Probably more than half including your dear leader who has been divorced twice and has cheated on his current gold digging wife with a porn star and a playboy bunny. MGAG MORONS are the last people on earth who should be complaining about immorality.

It costs me nothing to adhere to my position
It’s costs you your credibility as a serious adult American citizen.

Ancient Romans, who abandoned their newborns in trash heaps to die of sickness or to be eaten by predators.
Where did you get this from? 

By definition, a fetus is human and by definition a fetus is a person.
That’s just the opinion of an uninformed MAGA MORON. I’ll remind you that a senior Trump aid, Jason Miller, knocked up his mistress and he and Trump tried to get her to have an abortion. When she wouldn’t do it they fired her. Nice hypocrisy 
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To call termination of a pregnancy a crime is a lie. It is not a crime,
In some states, this is correct. You can literally stick a vacuum tube into the head of a 9 month old fetus legally.
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In some states, this is correct. You can literally stick a vacuum tube into the head of a 9 month old fetus legally.
That’s a lie you moron. 

No work today?

At least you don’t have to worry about the availability of planned parenthood because we know that would never be possible in your case.

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@Swagnarok
At the end of the 8th week after fertilization (10 weeks of pregnancy), the embryo is considered a fetus. During this stage, the structures that have already formed grow and develop. The following are markers during pregnancy:
  • By 12 weeks of pregnancy: The fetus fills the entire uterus.
  • By about 14 weeks: The sex can be identified.
  • By about 16 to 20 weeks: Typically, the pregnant woman can feel the fetus moving. Women who have been pregnant before typically feel movements about 2 weeks earlier than women who are pregnant for the first time.
  • By about 24 weeks: The fetus has a chance of survival outside the uterus.
It’s perfectly acceptable to have an abortion after 8 weeks up til about 20 weeks.

Abortions after 22 weeks are extremely rare and involve the life and health of the mother.

As usual, you don’t know what you’re talking about so MIND YOUR OWN DAMN BUSINESS!

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 Migrants

Migrants have lower crime rate than general population. Migrants reduce crime rate, increase workforce, help low birth rates.
This is 110% factually inaccurate. 

Decades past illegal aliens may have committed lower crime rates than the native born, but the fact remains that first generation born to illegals commit a disproportionate amount of crime. As of the last 3-4 years, crime among the illegal population has been increasing exponentially.


Every illegal = a criminal. Yeah, it's an equivalent to a misdemeanor but it is still a criminal offense to violate the sovereignty (the border) of this country.

The fact that the DOJ and other agencies across the nation with liberal democrats in charge are charging less, thereby reporting less crime, are pulling a smoke ad mirrors trick. The news, videos, victim reports all tell a different story. Everyone can see that illegal criminality over the past 3-4 years has been going up. I mean really, an extremely violent Venezuelan gang has taken over an entire apartment complex in Denver, CO. Downtown Denver is incredibly dangerous, as is New York City. So many US cities have turned into 3rd world shit holes. 






Illegal immigrant aliens do NOT reduce the nation's crime rates. Such a bold face fictional lie of pure delusion. 

Illegals do not increase the workforce, since they cannot be legally hired into the "workforce."
Cheap labor drives down wages when paid under the table. 

Adding more illegitimate children to this country isn't the answer. 
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that first generation born to illegals commit a disproportionate amount of crime. 
Another name for these people is American citizens.

Who invited you to this country? How did your ancestors get here? I bet no one was thrilled when they arrived.

What great contributions have you and your ancestors made to this country? Anything? Anything at all? Why should we let you stay?

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@Swagnarok
At the end of the 8th week after fertilization (10 weeks of pregnancy), the embryo is considered a fetus. During this stage, the structures that have already formed grow and develop. The following are markers during pregnancy:
  • By 12 weeks of pregnancy: The fetus fills the entire uterus.
  • By about 14 weeks: The sex can be identified.
  • By about 16 to 20 weeks: Typically, the pregnant woman can feel the fetus moving. Women who have been pregnant before typically feel movements about 2 weeks earlier than women who are pregnant for the first time.
  • By about 24 weeks: The fetus has a chance of survival outside the uterus.
It’s perfectly acceptable to have an abortion after 8 weeks up til about 20 weeks.

Abortions after 22 weeks are extremely rare and involve the life and health of the mother.

As usual, you don’t know what you’re talking about so MIND YOUR OWN DAMN BUSINESS!
Never thought I'd ever say this, and it pains me to even post this...

But this is the first thing actually intelligent and on point I have ever seen you post here on DART, and I agree with all of it. 
Best.Korea
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Amber,

I am not interested in random stories. I prefer statistical research that includes all numbers, like this one:

"Today, immigrants are 30 percent less likely to be incarcerated than are U.S.-born individuals who are white, the study finds. And when the analysis is expanded to include Black Americans — whose prison rates are higher than the general population — the likelihood of an immigrant being incarcerated is 60 percent lower than of people born in the United States."


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So you’re pro-choice but you support that idiot Trump?
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@IwantRooseveltagain
that first generation born to illegals commit a disproportionate amount of crime. 
Another name for these people is American citizens.

Who invited you to this country? How did your ancestors get here? I bet no one was thrilled when they arrived.

What great contributions have you and your ancestors made to this country? Anything? Anything at all? Why should we let you stay?

Amber is TWS in drag.
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a few states have more permissive laws that allow third-trimester abortions under broader circumstances:

  • Colorado: Colorado has no specific gestational limits on abortion, meaning that third-trimester abortions can  be performed on demand, though they are usually  in cases involving serious health concerns or fetal abnormalities.
  • New Mexico: New Mexico also does not have laws restricting abortion at any stage of pregnancy, allowing third-trimester abortions on demand, although, in practice, these are rare and often involve medical or severe circumstances.
  • Oregon: Oregon has no gestational limits on abortion, so third-trimester abortions are legal and can be performed on demand, although they typically involve significant medical issues.
  • Vermont: Vermont permits abortion at any stage of pregnancy without specific restrictions, allowing third-trimester abortions on demand, though they are usually performed for serious reasons related to the mother's health or fetal abnormalities.
  • Washington, D.C.: The District of Columbia does not impose gestational limits on abortion, making third-trimester abortions legal on demand, although they are generally done for compelling reasons.

  • To call termination of a pregnancy a crime is a lie. It is not a crime, in these states.
    Best.Korea
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    @Greyparrot
    a few states have more permissive laws that allow third-trimester abortions
    Third-trimester abortions are different, are rare, and morally questionable, and often happen because woman was denied abortion before.
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    “People seeking abortion services are disproportionately poor and are more likely experiencing disruptive life events like losing a job,” said Caitlin Knowles Myers, an economics professor at Middlebury College. “It is the most vulnerable of an already vulnerable group that will no longer have access.”
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    To call termination of a pregnancy a crime is a lie. It is not a crime, in these states.
    And no legit doctor would do one where it is a crime. So to recap, abortions that happen in the Union States are not crimes and it is nonsense to say this is common or approved by the authorities or the Democratic Party 

     But MAGA MORONS thrive on nonsense.

    Swagnarok
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    @IwantRooseveltagain
    What are you basing that on? And What was the average life expectancy of a slave?
    A few decades at least. Compared to less than 9 months for an aborted fetus.

    To call termination of a pregnancy a crime is a lie.
    It is a crime in the moral sense, in the same way that the killings at Dachau or Auschwitz were crimes despite the Nazi "legal code" (if it could be said to have one) deeming them legal. A fundamental principle of human law is that it's merely the codification of a higher law, be its source God or abstract morality. If you do not believe this to be true, then it follows that you would idly sit by and support any genocidal action by the US government so long as it were made legal first. If this is the case, then I feel sorry for you.

    If you don’t want to own a slave, don’t buy one. But MIND YOURE OWN DAMN BUSINESS!
    Fixed.

    I’ll remind you that a senior Trump aid, Jason Miller, knocked up his mistress and he and Trump tried to get her to have an abortion. When she wouldn’t do it they fired her. Nice hypocrisy 

    Non sequitur. Every movement has a few hypocritical individuals, including the progressive causes you believe in. And it has a non-hypocritical majority. Save I guess for climate change, since 100% of climate activists are polluters.

    At the end of the 8th week after fertilization (10 weeks of pregnancy), the embryo is considered a fetus.
    Okay, so pregnancy has stages of development. I and every other American adult knew this already, and it doesn't change anything I've said, because fetal right to life isn't contingent on stage of development. You yourself are unconscious every time you fall asleep, much like a fetus, but that doesn't justify someone breaking into your house and blowing your brains out so long as they succeed in doing it without waking you up first.

    Abortions after 22 weeks are extremely rare and involve the life and health of the mother.

    So a woman at week 21 might have second thoughts about becoming a mother, but it never happens after week 22? Yeah no, that's a load of crock and you know it. If abortions after week 22 are "extremely rare", then it's only because of laws restricting it.
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    @Swagnarok
    So a woman at week 21 might have second thoughts about becoming a mother, but it never happens after week 22? Yeah no, that's a load of crock and you know it. If abortions after week 22 are "extremely rare", then it's only because of laws restricting it.K
    Yes genius, if you want a doctor to do an abortion after 22 weeks, there needs to be a medical necessity for it or else the doctor won’t do it. He is prohibited from doing it at that point and would be risking his license to practice.


    Amber
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    that first generation born to illegals commit a disproportionate amount of crime. 
    Another name for these people is American citizens.
    And yet they are not American citizens. 






    Amber
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    @Best.Korea
    Amber,

    I am not interested in random stories. I prefer statistical research that includes all numbers, like this one:

    "Today, immigrants are 30 percent less likely to be incarcerated than are U.S.-born individuals who are white, the study finds. And when the analysis is expanded to include Black Americans — whose prison rates are higher than the general population — the likelihood of an immigrant being incarcerated is 60 percent lower than of people born in the United States."


    "Today, immigrants....."
    Date of source?
    Amber
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    BK,

    Amber,

    I am not interested in random stories

    Denial. How remarkable. 
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    @Sidewalker
    Amber is TWS in drag.
    Paranoid much? 

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    @Best.Korea
    Abortion reduces crime rates, improves quality of life, reduces prison population, increases equality, increases liberty, increases body rights.
    It seems unlikely that a Harris presidency would make a substantial difference to abortion. Trump seems to want to moderate on abortion, and Dobbs isn’t about to be overturned anytime soon (even with enough Supreme Court vacancies).

    Regardless, the Donohue–Levitt hypothesis (that legalised abortion significantly reduced crime in America) is almost certainly false. As The Economist notes, “It was, however, wrong. Later researchers found a coding error and pointed out that Mr Levitt had used the total number of arrests, which depends on the size of a population, and not the arrest rate, which does not. Others pointed out that the fall in homicide started among women. No-fault divorce, rather than legalised abortion, may have played a bigger role.” 

    Migrants have lower crime rate than general population. Migrants reduce crime rate, increase workforce, help low birth rates.
    They lower the crime rate by increasing the population. But the US should prioritise the interests of Americans, so that’s simply an illusion in the data. Additionally, current migrants are less likely to commit crimes, but this is potentially endogenous to current levels of migration.

    Anyway, I’m pretty uncertain about immigration. On the one hand, it likely helps the economy. At the same time, there is compelling evidence that it reduces social cohesion and trust, and makes societies less politically stable. I’m happy to be convinced in either direction on this question. 

    Reducing debt is crucial to save economy and reduce inflation, and to reduce poverty, and solve trade deficit.
    It is not obvious to me that Trump would be better at deficit reduction. Republicans like cutting taxes and Democrats like increasing spending. I doubt either Harris or Trump is going to deviate from the recent trend of running high deficits year-on-year.