Chess Mafia DP1

Author: AustinL0926

Posts

Read-only
Total: 304
Lunatic
Lunatic's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 8,964
3
3
6
Lunatic's avatar
Lunatic
3
3
6
-->
@Vader
This feels a bit like a flip flop from post 147/149 where you were thinking pie was going too hard on joebob and 159 where you had referred to him as over aggressive (several posts said this) and now you are essentially echoing all of pies talking points in regards to joebob. Can you explain what made you change your opinion on this issue between last night and tonight so quickly?
Barney
Barney's avatar
Debates: 53
Posts: 3,463
5
9
10
Barney's avatar
Barney
5
9
10
-->
@JoeBob
Rereading, you gave in to Pie for a full claim way too easily.
Pie had not even given a soft claim, so how push was without teeth... Well, at least until you outed that you've been reduced to more or less vanilla.

This isn't a winning argument, but the type of argument you should be making is for VNTL. Such as...

9 players, assume 2 scum.

DP1: 7/2
DP2: 5/2
DP3: 3/2 MISO

If skipping a lynch
DP1: 7/2
DP2: 6/2
DP3: 4/2 MISO

If skipping 2
DP1: 7/2
DP2: 6/2
DP3: 5/2 <- Lynch now for 2 days intel.
DP4: 3/2 MISO
Again, people are very opposed to no lynch, so it wouldn't work. But it'd at least be putting another option in front of us.

JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@Barney
Rereading, you gave in to Pie for a full claim way too easily.
I guess so 
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Lunatic
This feels a bit like a flip flop from post 147/149 where you were thinking pie was going too hard on joebob and 159 where you had referred to him as over aggressive (several posts said this) and now you are essentially echoing all of pies talking points in regards to joebob. Can you explain what made you change your opinion on this issue between last night and tonight so quickly?
I caught this too, very interesting 
whiteflame
whiteflame's avatar
Debates: 27
Posts: 4,887
4
6
10
whiteflame's avatar
whiteflame
4
6
10
After reading through the DP again, I haven't changed my thoughts substantially, but I'll add to my post from last night:

Savant: Suffice it to say that, while I don't want to pursue a full claim right now, I'll be looking to fill in the gap in his role next DP. He says it can't confirm him, but I'd like to at least get the info for the purpose of understanding the justification (i.e. what makes the Pawn and role relate), given that he's admitted that the Miller is not all that great of a match. I'm not currently sussing him, but while I'm lightly townreading his claim so far, the missing element makes me nervous.

Pie: The aggressive behavior he has displayed so far falls in line with what I'd expected whether he's town or scum. I usually (as with last game) have trouble reading Pie this early based on behavior alone, and that's no different here. He's null to me.

Moozer: One of the two people I'm townreading most so far, though both aren't strong reads. If he's scum, he's on a team with someone who has been scum before and they at least would know that it's a mistake to out their role without pressure, particularly in the absence of any fake claims. He hasn't contributed enough that I can say anything about him beyond that, but it's enough for now.

JoeBob: My read of him hasn't changed. Either this is a thrown together fake claim that is perplexing or it's one derived by Austin that seems purpose-built to be frustrating. Even if he hadn't outed his role, we'd have to hope that he draws the NK just to give town information from his Tracking... that took place in previous NPs. I don't think we stand to gain a lot of information from this role regardless of what we do, though as Barney pointed out, it's possible that he could use this role twice before we're effectively forced to lynch him. There may be value in that, but getting people onboard for two VTNLs with this information seems unlikely and includes its own risks. Top of my scum pile atm based chiefly on his claim and how he has responded to being sussed over it.

Lunatic: Luna has come off as pretty methodical so far. I haven't seen anything that stands out from his posts so far, and his reasons for pushing on JoeBob make sense. Slight townread.

Vader: I'm of a similar mind with Luna that it's odd how much pushback Vader was exhibiting against the behavioral reads on JoeBob before deciding he was the most viable lynch target. Beyond that, I don't think Vader's said anything that looks particularly off and I think he's had some decent insights, but this decision to change tactics did stand out to me. Slight scum read.

Barney: Not a lot of contribution early on. I largely agree with what he said in this post, both with regards to Savant and JoeBob's claims, though much of his thoughts on the latter is largely repetitive of what was said before. Null.

Earth: Tricky to read him right now. All of his posts have been pretty short and not very insightful. He's pushed back on sussing JoeBob several times now, largely on the basis that it's a complex role and therefore not one that he would come up with himself. Speaking as someone who has worked with JoeBob as scum, I did help him with his fake claim in that game, even if it was largely for the sake of clarifying a fake role claim given to us. It is a little of a complicated role, but he has had ample time to clarify it by now, and it didn't come off obviously in those first few posts. Also, weird that he offered to softclaim and just never did. I do find this behavior a little off, but I also have trouble seeing him as a scum partner for JoeBob. 


Unless someone has a better choice that isn't just pushing on another player for inactivity, I'm leaning toward lynching JoeBob right now, though I'd like to at least see Vader's response to Luna before committing.

AustinL0926
AustinL0926's avatar
Debates: 33
Posts: 2,236
3
5
9
AustinL0926's avatar
AustinL0926
3
5
9
VOTECOUNT:

Barney (1/5): Joebob
Joebob (3/5): Lunatic, Pie, Vader


Chess is both beauty and tragedy.


AustinL0926
AustinL0926's avatar
Debates: 33
Posts: 2,236
3
5
9
AustinL0926's avatar
AustinL0926
3
5
9
The DP ends in about 12 hours.


Earth
Earth's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 3,103
3
4
8
Earth's avatar
Earth
3
4
8
Okay, I don't want the day to end in a no lynch so I'll VTL Joebob.
AustinL0926
AustinL0926's avatar
Debates: 33
Posts: 2,236
3
5
9
AustinL0926's avatar
AustinL0926
3
5
9
VOTECOUNT:

Barney (1/5): Joebob
Joebob (4/5): Lunatic, Pie, Vader, Earth


Proof that chess is not correlated with intelligence...

JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@AustinL0926
school blocked reddit:(
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@Earth
Okay, I don't want the day to end in a no lynch so I'll VTL Joebob.
thats not a very good reason in my opinion
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Vader
Please answer the question Lunatic posed 
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Moozer325
Any thoughts on what is happening?
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
Tomorrow I would like Earth and Barney to full claim
Vader
Vader's avatar
Debates: 30
Posts: 14,984
5
8
11
Vader's avatar
Vader
5
8
11
-->
@Lunatic
@ILikePie5
Can you explain what made you change your opinion on this issue between last night and tonight so quickly?
It wasn’t “quick” it was an 13 hour time differential between the two and I read more into JoeBob where he posted more and outted his role. I wasn’t even fully caught up by the time I wrote 147 and when I explained by being very aggressive on him. To be clear I voted from behavioral analysis and role utility and likelihood of scum and not because of some stupid grammar mistake that 80% of the world makes. I also know town has outted enough info to potential scum at this point so I think out of all the people to lynch in DP1, JoeBob is who I consider the most scummy. I even had him as a scum read in my original analysis. I can go deeper if you’d like
Vader
Vader's avatar
Debates: 30
Posts: 14,984
5
8
11
Vader's avatar
Vader
5
8
11
If we assume everyone who claimed told the truth… that’s a lot of claims we assume mafia can work with
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@Vader
JoeBob is who I consider the most scummy.
Why?
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@whiteflame
@Savant
@Moozer325
Can we hammer
whiteflame
whiteflame's avatar
Debates: 27
Posts: 4,887
4
6
10
whiteflame's avatar
whiteflame
4
6
10
-->
@ILikePie5
Yeah, I’ll just hammer. At this point, I see no better options and, even given how perplexed I am that either scum or Austin would come up with this particular role, just the fact that the cat’s already out of the bag about it makes the information we could garner from it pretty weak and only accessible by wasting a future lynch, which we can ill afford to do. If he flips town, it’s not a substantial loss, but he does come off as scummy in a way no one else does.

VTL JoeBob
whiteflame
whiteflame's avatar
Debates: 27
Posts: 4,887
4
6
10
whiteflame's avatar
whiteflame
4
6
10
At minimum, we can at least get some insight into potential theme splits based on the flip.
Savant
Savant's avatar
Debates: 23
Posts: 2,017
3
7
6
Savant's avatar
Savant
3
7
6
Hammer time

VTL JoeBob
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@JoeBob
Confess
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@ILikePie5
am town
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
:/ 
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@JoeBob
am town
If you’re telling the truth, Austin is an asshole for giving you a shitty role like that
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@ILikePie5
same thing with the heros of olympus thing. i was lynched cuz of my role and behavior, and was town
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@AustinL0926
day ended, was lynched
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@JoeBob
same thing with the heros of olympus thing. i was lynched cuz of my role and behavior, and was town
Ur role was legit there. Austin literally made up roles for this game. Emissary fit with Nico perfectly. This role is that dumb and only works really if scum kill you NP2. It’s weak af. 
JoeBob
JoeBob's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 1,598
3
3
7
JoeBob's avatar
JoeBob
3
3
7
-->
@ILikePie5
he said he made up this role to fit the game
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,215
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@JoeBob
he said he made up this role to fit the game
Sigh, it’s annoying when we can’t rely on real roles and mechanics and we’re left guessing. Anyways even when you full claimed later you’d look scummy af. In a game where after 2NPs the game can end, it makes zero sense to include your role