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@JoeBob
You're town-confirmed. Please explain (in your own words or from others) why you want to lynch me.
Invincible Mafia Day Phase 1
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689
BK is blatantly wagon shopping. He's hopped on three different wagons so far with little reasoning behind it.
My role is semi-confirmable but can't be done so without losing most of its utility. I'm not claiming more than this.
I think the overnight discussion between whiteflame and BK makes them move a little further apart in both directions to town and scum, respectively. whiteflame's aggressiveness is almost identical to the last game where he was town.
Maybe it's because I've never played this version before, but I'm not sure how reliable behavioral reads are. Scum could just do whatever they would do if they were town, and suddenly behavioral reads are useless. Getting some amount of information is the only way to catch them in a lie. Maybe we're giving scum information, but we're getting information too. Town needs information to kill scum, scum doesn't need information to kill town. Plus scum already knows the theme and has some idea about how fake claims correlate to characters, so someone giving their role is more useful to us than to them.
Savant's behavioral reads feel manufactured. It's a combination of following the flow of townread players, as well as generic points that he can play off as being a newbie. Like... "behavioral reads are useless" because scum tries to act town? Yeah, that's the whole point of mafia, to find inconsistencies when they try and act town. I think he's smarter than this and he's trying to force out claims for no reason.
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@AustinL0926
Look, 5 players have expressed desire to get your claim, and 3 have already voted you.
If you are not going to claim, then I have no problem lynching you without even getting your claim.
So to put it simply, claim or get lynched.
Reads. I've finally cleared out the null pile, at least.
Locktown:
Joebob
Lean town:
Barney
Vader
Greyparrot
Slight town:
whiteflame
Slight scum:
BK
Savant
Lean scum:
Pie
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@ILikePie5
I find it weird that the literal namesake of the series doesn't even get assigned an active role (Commuter is basically a combination of two passive roles, Bulletproof and Ascetic). It's also an easy claim to explain why you're not getting NKed, as well as explaining any failed investigations and whatnot. This was the exact reason why I fakeclaimed Ascetic in the last game.Commuter can be activatable regardless of which of the three options I am. It’s basically a doctor that can’t be targeted when commuting. -[PIE]
Commuter has nothing to do with being a doctor. Wanna explain this?
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@Best.Korea
I'm not claiming unless at least two players who I townread threaten to vote me and give good reasoning why.
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@AustinL0926
Lol 3 votes in 6 minutes from Pie, Savant, BK. I guarantee that at least two of them are scum, probably Pie + Savant/BK. Y'all are accusing the wagon on Pie of forming too quickly and then you go and pull this.
So BK is a scum doctor? Possible though unlikely with his character claim not being CCed.
Also your entire premise of going after me was manufactured. I clearly pointed that out. I character claimed and role claimed with hesitation because of your manufacturing. You even cherry picked data from Lunatic’s games to support your cause, which I pointed out. You also then say you want Barney’s claim after saying that you townread him for not reading the OP.
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@AustinL0926
BK is blatantly wagon shopping. He's hopped on three different wagons so far with little reasoning behind it.
So you want to lynch a claimed Doctor? Please explain
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@AustinL0926
Commuter has nothing to do with being a doctor. Wanna explain this?
It’s as if I’m being protected at night. Basically I cannot die or be targeted at all when I’m commuting.
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@AustinL0926
I'm not claiming unless at least two players who I townread threaten to vote me and give good reasoning why.
Who’s hesitating to claim now?
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@AustinL0926
I'm not claiming unless at least two players who I townread threaten to vote me and give good reasoning why
You already have JoeBob and Vader who want your claim, who you townread.
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@Savant
Scum could just do whatever they would do if they were town, and suddenly behavioral reads are useless.
Hypothetically yes, but that rarely works in reality. There’s always a difference caused by our goals.
Vader used to do huge gambits, and pull the Chewbacca Defense to get out of trouble (then NK whoever was onto him, and everyone would forget. He’s since evolved.
I used to work way too hard when scum. I too have evolved.
BK gave info,
Unvote
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@Best.Korea
Vader who want your claim, who you townread.
This is incorrect. As I stated in my recent posts, I want no claims at all. My vote is on who I want to lynch. I really don't want anymore claims to give scum more information, but if there's a gun to my head and I had to choose it would be Barney.
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@AustinL0926
Savant's behavioral reads feel manufactured. It's a combination of following the flow of townread players, as well as generic points that he can play off as being a newbie. Like... "behavioral reads are useless" because scum tries to act town? Yeah, that's the whole point of mafia, to find inconsistencies when they try and act town. I think he's smarter than this and he's trying to force out claims for no reason.
I said behavioral reads are useless (or close to useless) if scum do what they would do as town. I buy that catching people in a lie is the point of mafia, but let's be honest and admit that special roles change the whole dynamic. Concrete evidence will always be a better way of catching liars than vibes alone. In Town of Salem, most lynching is done based on actual evidence since people have special abilities and the game is text-based, making it hard to catch liars (humans are bad lie detectors anyway). Forum mafia is closer to TOS than it is to traditional mafia. I go off behavioral reads when there's nothing else, but it will almost always be less effective than actual evidence.
And let's be honest, of the players that have given no information, your behavior makes you the most suspicious. So going after you is based on a behavioral read. I'm almost certain it's you or Pie, so we'll get at least one scum.
It's also odd you would accuse me since I followed you into voting Pie given how certain you were, until he claimed the main character with no counterclaims. Scum cannot afford to sacrifice for their own in 7v2, so if you are town and our certain that Pie is scum, you would have a great reason to believe that I am town. Even if I rely 100% on behavioral reads, your actions don't make sense.
Given that you've accused everyone except Barney, and he's avoided voting for you, I highly suspect the two of you.
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@Barney
Only fair to tag you since I said I suspect you.
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@Vader
@whiteflame
@JoeBob
A lot of behavioral reading has been done into Best.Korea, despite him being a known troll. How seriously does he take these games, and how much can we really gather from his behavior?
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@Savant
A lot of behavioral reading has been done into Best.Korea, despite him being a known troll. How seriously does he take these games, and how much can we really gather from his behavior?
He’s either a policy lynch or we treat him like Greyparrot and ignore him for the most part
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@AustinL0926
Also, you are trying to direct lynch to someone else, but let me tell you that at this point, you do not get to lead any lynch when you refuse to claim.
I think we all figured out that this is a game based mostly on confirmable town roles, and we must all claim in dp2 or dp1, because we cant afford to have 2 or 3 players unclaimed at start of dp3, as all roles need to be confirmed by dp3 and then scum will be obvious as its almost impossible for scum to have a confirmed role.
Also, by claiming, we prevent role theft. I know that its possible that scum has power to steal roles when they kill, because they lack actual fake claim, so we can prevent that as well by claiming until we find the odd one.
So claim, or you are just anti town.
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@Savant
I said behavioral reads are useless (or close to useless) if scum do what they would do as town. I buy that catching people in a lie is the point of mafia, but let's be honest and admit that special roles change the whole dynamic. Concrete evidence will always be a better way of catching liars than vibes alone. In Town of Salem, most lynching is done based on actual evidence since people have special abilities and the game is text-based, making it hard to catch liars (humans are bad lie detectors anyway). Forum mafia is closer to TOS than it is to traditional mafia. I go off behavioral reads when there's nothing else, but it will almost always be less effective than actual evidence.
I 100% agree that hard trumped evidence outweighs behavior in this game. But I want you to consider a few things first before you stick by this notion a lot.
1) Town of Salem has only a 3 minute talking phase and like a 2 minute voting phase. Forum mafia has almost 72 hours. You are more likely to get a proper behavior analysis from someone in a game that is 72 hrs versus 3 minutes.
2) Town of Salem is based on solely evidence, and not behavior. I haven't played Town of Salem in god knows how long, but I don't know if they have the amount of manipulation roles in the game that forum mafia does. Mafia can manipulate results, lie, and do different tasks to fuck with the results. Blindly believing all results is not the best way to operate, especially if someone who has a scumread claims "oh I'm a cop and I copped x innocent."
3) Right now we are in Dp1 which means we have to look at the little evidence provided that is minuet details.
I don't think you are wrong that at some point we need to look harder into actual evidence, but you also have to know that results can be easily manipulated. I can think of countless times where this has happened in mafia.
I don't think you are wrong that at some point we need to look harder into actual evidence, but you also have to know that results can be easily manipulated. I can think of countless times where this has happened in mafia.
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@Savant
A lot of behavioral reading has been done into Best.Korea, despite him being a known troll. How seriously does he take these games, and how much can we really gather from his behavior?
I only played 2 games with him for the most part so I don't have enough insight besides my reads.
Official Vote Count:
Austin- 3/5- iLikePie5, savant, Best.korea
iLikePie5- 1/5- Austin
Vader- 1/5- GP
Barney- 1/5- Vader
Whiteflame ??? (Antagonist)
Vader
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@JoeBob
Vigilantes should always shoot the first night, because they statically have better odds of hitting scum than a lynch.
I’d like to apply this same thing to you. Pick someone for us to lynch. They can try to talk their way out of it, but others should not. And ultimately, we should only hammer a wagon started by you.
(Everyone else should probably unvote to clear the field).
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@ILikePie5
So BK is a scum doctor? Possible though unlikely with his character claim not being CCed.Also your entire premise of going after me was manufactured. I clearly pointed that out. I character claimed and role claimed with hesitation because of your manufacturing. You even cherry picked data from Lunatic’s games to support your cause, which I pointed out. You also then say you want Barney’s claim after saying that you townread him for not reading the OP.
Good job completely dodging my point regarding the speed of the wagon. I didn't cherry-pick data, not sure why you keep pushing on that - finding evidence for a pattern is hardly cherry-picking. My townread on Barney was pretty weak, I even mentioned that "I townread him slightly". Failing to read the OP is a towntell but lurking for almost 24 hours was far scummier.
So you want to lynch a claimed Doctor? Please explain
I find his behavior anti-town, but he's not my top scumread at the moment. I also think Doctor is a pretty easy fakeclaim considering few characters in the show that I know of have healing powers.
Who’s hesitating to claim now?
I don't claim because scum is pressuring me, I claim because town is pressuring me. If Joebob, Barney, Vader, GP, and maybe whiteflame gives convincing reasons, then I will claim.
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@Barney
@Vader
@whiteflame
@AustinL0926
@JoeBob
Everyone else should probably unvote
Right now Barney and Austin are both on the chopping block. We know zero about their roles, and their behavior has been generally suspect, for whatever that's worth. Now Barney comes up with a convenient excuse to get everyone to unvote when Austin has 3 votes against him. Seems like they could both be scum but trying not to seem like they're defending each other.
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@AustinL0926
You're town-confirmed. Please explain (in your own words or from others) why you want to lynch me.
Well let’s see. Barney is more aggressive then when he is scum, makes me think he is town. Whiteflame is playing the same way he did last game, when he was town. Those two are the only others than haven’t full claimed. Which leaves you.