Africa & Why All Foreign Invaders Should Be Removed Immediately
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After 3 votes and with 11 points ahead, the winner is...
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The title speaks for itself, the title speaks volumes and the African people should rid their land of all foreign invaders who are not native to the land. Though Africa is displayed in the media negatively, this huge vast land is rich in culture as well as rich in people. The most diverse people, some of the most diverse foods and very diverse animals reside here. The problem with Africa comes from the foreign invaders who have come in and caused carnage. The taking of land, colonization, murder and the white-washing of its history has been taking place for hundreds of years.
South Africa & Egypt are ground zero for the hyjacking of African culture and acheivements. Many uneducated people think that Egypt isnt even in Africa because of all the foreign invaders who reside there today. The Europeans in South Africa are mad because the native people of the land want their land back. These theives don't receive much sympathy from outside interests because everyone knows that this is not their homeland.
All fake missionaries should be physically removed immediately because they're not doing so-called God's work. From hunting the natural wildlife to the spreading of diseases, Africa has no choice but to rid all of these leeches before it's too late because the leeches have detsroyed the people & have destroyed all of the great African civilizations. If anyone can come up with a good enough argument on behalf of the bloodsuckers, then you may accept this debate.
Good Luck
My first argument is basically the same as the introduction of this debate.
the African people should rid their land of all foreign invaders who are not native to the land.
this huge vast land is rich in culture as well as rich in people
The most diverse people
The problem with Africa comes from the foreign invaders who have come in and caused carnage.
Many uneducated people think that Egypt isnt even in Africa because of all the foreign invaders who reside there today.
The Europeans in South Africa are mad because the native people of the land want their land back.
All fake missionaries should be physically removed immediately because they're not doing so-called God's work. From hunting the natural wildlife to the spreading of diseases
Africa has no choice but to rid all of these leeches before it's too late because the leeches have detsroyed the people & have destroyed all of the great African civilizations.
If anyone can come up with a good enough argument on behalf of the bloodsuckers
MLK also said, "I've led my people into a burning building by integrating." He also said, "my dream has become a nightmare."... Need I say more?
Yes, deporting people who live in Africa that aren't Black is exactly what I'm saying.
No, I never said anything about disliking someone's skin color.
Africa wouldn't have all of these problems if foreigners never showed up.
I agree with deporting all non-Europeans from Europe as well as deporting all non-Native people from America
If you own 90% of the fertile land and I own 10% of waste land
After you research it, come back and tell me how many Africans were murdered by foreigners.
You aren't making any sense what-so-ever. You said that "Europe unified Africa by dividing it into 54 countries." How can you unify something by dividing it?
So, what about the millions of families that were enslaved and shipped to America over 400 years ago? Didn't they have families?
Africans are some of the oldest people on the planet who doesn't have any issues with reproducing. On the other hand, foreigners are the complete opposite.
You said that you fail to see how culture is important, but at the same time, your people are trying to force their culture onto everyone else.
Word of advice: Everyone isn't in to Paganism.
If Africa isn't diverse, then why are there so many different skin complexions, different eye color, different hair texture and different body types?
I fail to see any diversity in Europeans because you all have pale skin.
You said that "the West brings human rights." Earlier you said that non-Africans make up 20% of South Africa's population. Now, where are the human rights when one group (who is the outside invader) possesses 90% of the wealth as well as 90% of the rich farming land?
So, you being a part of the most genocidal group of people in history is trying to school me on human rights?
So what you're saying is that in Western societies like the US...homosexuals don't get killed?
Have Black people not gotten killed just for having brown skin in the US?
Despite the Bible specifically saying that Egyptians are Black.
All of the other nonsense you're speaking about the Bible, hunting and spreading diseases is nothing more than excuses.
All fake missionaries should be physically removed immediately because they're not doing so-called God's work.
You hunt for sport, (which is not hunting for survival)
You've purposely spread diseases (in which you did to Native Americans & what your eugenics missionaries are doing in Africa).
You speak about the Bible
where MLK is today & who sent him to his current place?
You said that "no African country has a significant amount of foreigners." Since you're not aware, the Chinese are heavily populated in Africa as well as Arabs.
You don't necessarily have to go into statistical figures about the deportation and population because this is just a hypothetical situation.
Subsidizing etc., can be easily paid for since they're virtually living on the richest expansion of real estate in the world.
Nelson Mandela was nothing more than a proxy. He was sent to prison for all those years (by foreigners) and he was released for specific purposes.
Now you're bringing up single mothers, which is irrelevant. Africa isn't America, and most of the men are present because their aren't racist laws to put them in prison.
If you don't believe me, then look at the (1994 Crime Bill) that was written by Joe Biden. Blacks tend to be addicted to crack while whites tend to be addicted to cocaine. One crack rock could get you up to 15 or more years in prison while hundreds of grams of powder cocaine will get you sent to rehab...
You said "that the land is disproportionate because farmers tend to own more land than city dwellers"...You do know that Africans have been in Africa for thousands of years so they pretty much know how to grow food.
Nope, I'm judging the character of the group rather than judging the group by their identity.
Yet again, your hypocrisy is shining through because this is exactly what white people have done for hundreds of years.
You said that "anyone who murders someone should get life in prison or the death penalty." You're being a hypocrite once again.
You also boasted about the West having the best Human Rights, but we see innocent black people getting murdered by racist cops.
Well, since you spoke so highly of the Bible, why don't we follow what the Bible actually says? The scriptures state that "you will be judged by the sins of your forefathers." Well...…
...Slavery started with the taking of males...So, how is that not breaking up families? I'll wait...….
Yep.. By the way; families were separated during American slavery if you didn't know.
There's one fact that no one can refute and it's that foreigners want Africa's natural resources.
Every other race try's to speak negatively about Africa, but you know what...………..Every other race can't seem to stay out of Africa.
This is the same guy who said that America isn't Pagan anymore, but he hasn't even realized that he celebrates Pagan holidays every year...Wow!
The same guy who's quoting MLK word for word, but it was his race of people who killed him.
The same guy who's babbling about statistical numbers on population and costs of deportation after I told him that this was a hypothetical idea/solution.
He asked "if Africa is so rich, then why doesn't Africa use the resources?"
All of the other nonsense ain't worth addressing, but at least South Africa has put the process of removing the invaders from their land.
Pro has the burden proof here. To start off with pro doesn’t really define the terms. He uses the word invaders, and foreigners interchangeably, and is using definitions more on the grounds of being emotive than to elaborate on what he means. Con picks this up.
I’m going to analyze this purely in terms of harms.
Pro argues that there is no benefit of having foreigners present. This is not in itself a reason to deport them.
Cons primary harm shown (appeal to fairness is not imo a harm, nor is whataboutism), is mostly arguing that it would constitute breaking 2 million families that themselves did nothing wrong.
Pro continues with exploring some of the unfairness in South Africa specifically, but doesn’t really link this to any benefit of
Deporting foreigners. At best it’s implicit. Talking about historical wrongs and murders is largely non-topical. It all could be true but wouldn’t change whether or not it’s better to deport non whites.
In his response; con goes back and forth on the irrelevant tangents pro raised.
However, con does point out that it is unfair for punishment to be levied on individuals just because they’re the same race. This is a follow on from his initial harm.
In round 3/4/5, pro and con both continue with the points that neither show harm in allowing foreigners to remain, or benefit in departing them. Rehashing grievance is not a harm, and going back and forward debating the harms of colonialism or deportating black people from the US is meaningless.
It all boils down to one harm on each side. Pro argues that effectively removing foreigners will give resources to black people, con argues that’s wrong because they haven’t done anything wrong themselves.
While I’m sympathetic to the overall inequality and colonial repercussion: pro clearly opts for an extreme solution, which seems to be on balance harmful.
Pro and con spent the overwhelming majority of the debate arguing about unrelated and non topical points, imo, and as such, I have maybe two reasonable sentences that really were relevant in the decision. However, cons argument was more intuitive, more objective and more quantifiable - and as such I must award him arguments
Pro's main arguments:
1. Missionaries and invaders are spreading diseases, raping, killing, and ruling most of the country.
Con's Response: modern statistics against all above claims.
2. The crimes of the past and of individuals condemns all whites.
Con's Response: Extends logic to make all races rapists and murderers.
3, Europeans have no genetic diversity.
Con's Response: shows diversity of different Europeans. (Note: Phenotypes are the expressions of genotypes. If people look different, they have genetic diversity. There is a HUGE difference between Irish, Italian, and Russian Europeans.)
Argument of Con: Countries with more whites have a higher GDP. Pro does not refute this as far as I can tell.
imo, arguments to Con.
(Note: "If you don't have a problem with benefiting from what your race did, then you shouldn't have a problem with accepting the crimes."
This was a comment Pro made in an attack against whites for having slaves over a hundred years ago. The obvious problem with this is that the native tribes of Africa fought and enslaved each other.)
Pro was literally racist the whole time.
"[Whites] are simply struggling to reproduce."
"you people have reverted back to "Dark Age" behavior....not that you ever stopped"
"whites do not practice what they preach"
Conduct to Con
Context plays a crucial role in interpreting debates. The resolution is technically true, if there’s people invading Africa right now (or anywhere else), they should be removed. However, this is not what the arguments proved to be about.
Gist:
Pro never attains BoP to show an actual benefit even for people who would be living in the content of African after all the human rights violations (their loved ones being kidnapped and deported, and a bunch of strangers who have just been kidnapped and imported from the rest of the world suddenly showing up). Nor even that there are any active invasions.
1. Tourists
I think this was pro trying to show a problem, which is vital for a problem needing to be solved.
Pro argues that Africans should get rid of any tourists (anyone visiting but not born in Africa) because such people are not contributing, they bring no money or other “tangibles” with them.
Con ties this back to the resolution by suggesting the related word of invader was intended, and showed the low likelihood of undocumented invasions happening right now; so turn suggested the word “occupier,” but then suggested that isn’t an active problem right now (at least not from those outside of Africa itself).
Con protests that he never mentioned skin color: “No, I never said anything about disliking someone's skin color. ... Yes, deporting people who live in Africa that aren't Black is exactly what I'm saying.” He then insists any black individuals living (and likely native) in places outside Africa, should be forced to relocate (kidnapped?) to Africa... Con goes on to make various racist Gish Gallops, including against blacks (apparently they breed like rabbits and will be too busy doing that to have any emotion about deported family members...).
2. Human Rights
Con interprets that pro wishes to deport people not based on if they were born in Africa, but instead based on if they have certain skin colors. He wisely used MLK as a source for authority against this racism. Mention of gay murders and acid attacks with the assertion of them being no problem (or less of a problem?) in South Africa where the European cultural influence is stronger.
The source on Cannibalism was from a /questionable/ site to say the least. Please don’t pull that ever again.
3. Rwandan genocide
Brief mention by pro, along with the UN stopping it. I expected con to do lovely things with this thread, given the history that lead to this, but the point was dropped leaving it actually in con’s favor...
4. Burden of Proof
Glad someone brought this up early... It gets the heart of what was missing across very well.
5. Vampires
Awesome. I wish pro was correct on this, and I am quite uncertain why con would want to refute it.
6. Egypt
I haven’t a clue why this kept coming up. Assuming pro is correct about people being that bad at geography, where was this point supposed to lead? The AND is missing.
7. Unification
One asserts that it is bad, the other that it is good. Strangely the person asserting that it is bad, is the one who wants to unify Africa by getting rid of anyone not pure enough...
8. Pagan Holidays
Not sure what this has to do with the debate.
9. Zimbabwe
Con brought this up in the final round, it would have been a seriously powerful point any time earlier in the debate, as it shows the damage done by the same brand of racism to which pro subscribes.
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Arguments: con
See above review of key points. Pro did not prove a benefit to the proposal, and con proved massive harm.
Sources: tied
Both sides executed this poorly. Once when pro was trying to spam some quick links, he included one on Africans committing human rights violations as proof of African society being better than the oppressive rest of the world. Con used a source to which the website used a modified swastika for its icon...
Conduct: con
Pro accuses con of having personally murdered hundreds or thousands of people: “So, you being a part of the most genocidal group of people in history is trying to school me on human rights?”
I am trying to make sense of it in my head, but I think it goes back to the vampire point (did con could serve under Hernán Cortés? ... Or using the genocides listed in the debate, most happened so long ago that con is unlikely to be alive if human after partaking; the most brutal of these being the Rwandan, which was carried out by black people in the name of race against black people).
Pro even turned R4 into a string of Ad Hominems (earlier he was at least directing his attention to arguments, rather than the person making them).
The worst action of con was a certain link, which was in all likelihood accidental (and as he was not making the claims of that site, it goes to affect the reliability of sources, rather than his own conduct).
The hypocrisy is the comment section is unreal.
Yeah I don't think taking land away from people based on their race is good. It's textbook racism.
It's basically taking land away from people of the wrong skin pigment... This includes vital farm land, without any skilled managers to replace them.
For a recent example: https://www.dw.com/en/zimbabwe-between-land-ownership-and-food-security/a-49056618
I don't know enough about Zimbabwe's land redistribution to debate about it. Maybe that's even a good idea. What I'm against is deporting all non-Africans from Africa.
A decent topic might be "Zimbabwe: land redistribution is a good policy"
Just come up with a similar topic. I don't want to use the same title for the second debate.
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Vote Reported: TheAtheist // Mod Action: Removed
Points awarded: 7 points to con
RFD: Pro's argument was flawed and was essentially removing all non-blacks from Africa.
Reason for mod action: In order to be eligible to vote, Accounts must have read the site's COC AND completed at least 2 non-troll debates without any forfeits OR posted 100 forum posts
The voter should review the COC here: https://www.debateart.com/rules
The voter should also review this: https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/346?page=1&post_number=4
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Yeah, I’m ready. You can make the debate and challenge me.
Yeah, that's cool. Whenever you get ready, just let me know.
Could we have a debate on the same topic? I’d like do give some of my own arguments and hopefully change your mind.
Ok, I see what you're saying.
Ok, Thanks man.
A debate I suggest studying is "Fetuses as a replacement for the USD" (https://www.debateart.com/debates/866)
While that debate was [no comment], the extreme scale of the proposal is similar. Note the big areas pro focused on in R1: Justification, followed immediately by Practicality.
ayyyyy, Milo, he got censored
I'm in R3, and a debate this length should not take this long to read. For future debates, please use better organization: http://tiny.cc/DebateArt
Reason for decision.
No problem, that's cool.
What's an RFD?
The organization in this debate has finally made me go write a formatting guide for debates here...
That said, I've starting writing a RFD, but am only a round in. I have a pub crawl to attend tonight, so I'll probably publish a vote tomorrow.
No one has voted yet.
Bump.
It's more complicated than this, but a reminder about blind nationalism: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7tvauOJMHo
How much time do you want as a buffer to determine if they would vote on it?
If no one votes on this, remind me.
Care to vote on this debate?
I actually have sources, you've provided none. Do your own research.
Are you even aware that a guy sent in one of those genealogy tests to Ancestry.com and he used dog saliva? Ancestry.com said his results were 30% Native-American & 70% European. Yes, the story is all over the internet and television if you don't believe me.
One group huhh? You may want to do some actual research on missionaries in Africa.
So melanin is more important than what country? DNA tests can distinguish Welsh from English, Austrian from German.
"The only difference between the Australian, British, Irish, German, Russian etc., are Accents." <-- BS
I found nothing on the Internet about smallpox being spread to Africans through blankets.
I did find an article that says only one group, a band of Swiss mercenaries, ever did this to Native Americans. No missionaries or settlers were involved.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2668906/
https://www.historynet.com/smallpox-in-the-blankets.htm
Does smallpox-infected blankets ring a bell?
Illegal/legal hunting was never the argument...but killing is killing.
Nordic - a geographical region/culture
Slavic - Russians, Ukrainians, Poles, Czechs etc., Nothing more than different nationalities
There is some race mixing, which gives them the classification of Indo-European, but the majority are typical Caucasians who have different accents.
You can't be too bright if you think black is an eye color. Africans have green, hazel, dark brown etc. as well...blue on occasions.
Italians with olive skin tone. Yeah, some do and that came from race mixing with the African Moors, which is why Italians weren't even considered white for the longest period of time. Did you not know that?...Dude, I'm black & I have freakin' freckles...White doesn't have a variation because it lacks melanin.
NO, I DESTROYED you.
"The only difference between the Australian, British, Irish, German, Russian etc., are Accents."
HAH! Slavic, Nordic, Gaelic, Latin, and Aborigine don't mean anything to you, do you?
"If Africa isn't diverse, then why are there so many different skin complexions, different eye color, different hair texture and different body types? I'm going to take a wild guess. I bet you think Europeans are diverse. I fail to see any diversity in Europeans because you all have pale skin."
Last I checked, in native Africans there are only two natural eye colors, brown and black, as opposed to Europe's blue, green, brown, and hazel.
Italians have a olive skin tone, Irish have freckles, Norwegians have their shade of white. Not exactly identical Caucasian groups.
Missionaries have never intentionally spread disease, but when two isolated cultures meet, at least one will get sick from it. The native Americans had a similar experience with Europeans.
I don't have anything against immigration, despite your assumptions. And my stance on this topic, that non-Africans should be able to stay in Africa, is also an open stance.
Hunting isn't illegal, and such camps are either run with government sanction or directly by the government. Shooting a cheetah to save your cattle IS illegal.
Trying to go against the topic of this discussion tells me everything that I need to know about your stance.
Hunting is still killing. Protecting cattle isn't the same as breeding camps and poaching.
You said, "prove that missionaries spread diseases (in this generation)." So, that means you're aware of missionaries spreading diseases in the past...Am I right?? Thank you, you just proved my point without even knowing it.
That wasn't a debate. It was more so a monologue. I teach while you sit quietly and listen. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hey,you want to continue my debate about gun control that you accepted? If not,then tell me,because my time is being wasted. I'll start a new one.
Alec I will admit something, you actually have proper skill at debating. This is genuinely artistic right-wing propaganda and I am not even being sarcastic.
We just got in a debate
"Now compare your question to American's situation with Hispanic immigrants. It's a sob story when whites have to go, but it's justice when other races have to go. I'm going to pre-empt your strike by saying "all immigrants aren't illegal," but many legal immigrants have been deported from the US."
You assume to know my stance on Mexican immigration. Don't assume.
"Do foreigners not go to Africa just to kill the wildlife that were bred at breeding camps?"
Yes, but said breeding camps are specifically for hunting. The tourists legally pay to shoot a gazelle or whatever. Poachers do it illegally and even normal farmers will shoot predators and prey alike to protect their cattle and eliminate competition.
"Take a look at the missionaries' track record in Africa. From purposely spreading diseases to raping young children."
Prove that missionaries have purposely spread disease in this generation. Continue to assert "truths" without proof or evidence, and I will continue to ignore them.
It's much more joyful to play in the game than to cheerlead from the sideline.
1. Now compare your question to American's situation with Hispanic immigrants. It's a sob story when whites have to go, but it's justice when other races have to go. I'm going to pre-empt your strike by saying "all immigrants aren't illegal," but many legal immigrants have been deported from the US...Yes, the white child can be a legal citizen, but his grand parents & great-great grand parents helped to create the issues of owning 90% of the fertile land while the original natives deal with 10% of waste land. Case in Point: America-Natives & their wastelands of reservations.
2. There are white poachers also. Do foreigners not go to Africa just to kill the wildlife that were bred at breeding camps? Yes, you've been proved wrong.
Take a look at the missionaries' track record in Africa. From purposely spreading diseases to raping young children.
Smart move
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, and I'm an older sibling, so I'm capable of simplification if not.
True, but mairj23, wont understand he dumb
1.What qualifies as an invader? If a white child was born in South Africa to a couple of missionaries or medical students or something who had become citizens, then he is LEGALLY just as much an African as the boy next door whose parents and grandparents and great, great, great grandparents had all been born in Africa. The caucasian boy would miss his home, Africa, just as much as his neighbor. Is that boy an invader? Are his parents? Would HIS children?
2. " From hunting the natural wildlife to the spreading of diseases, Africa has no choice but to rid all of these leeches"
A. The majority of poachers in Africa are native Africans and Arabs, as far as I know. Prove me wrong and this point will be valid.
B. Europeans aren't giving Africans diseases that they have no immunity to anymore.
No disrespect, but I'm fairly confident in what I speak about.
Here's a forum you might want to comment on: https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/1057?page=6
There are no African colonies left dumbass
What African country are you from?