Instigator / Pro
0
1233
rating
403
debates
39.45%
won
Topic
#5824
Military principles of Zvezda are better than military principles used by US military
Status
Finished
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
Winner & statistics
Winner
0
1
After 1 vote and with 1 point ahead, the winner is...
bellagraceeee
Parameters
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Standard
- Number of rounds
- 3
- Time for argument
- Two weeks
- Max argument characters
- 10,000
- Voting period
- One month
- Point system
- Winner selection
- Voting system
- Open
Contender / Con
1
1500
rating
3
debates
66.67%
won
Description
Zvezda is a secret society from "World Conquest Zvezda Plot" anime.
Have fun.
Round 1
Pro
#1
Zvezda Plot anime is probably the most advanced anime on the strategies of war. I will now list strategies used by Zvezda which will turn out to be even above modern war strategies.
1. Attack if you are strong and enemy is weak
A quite simple one. If there is a time when enemy is weak and you are strong, or if there is a place where enemy is weak and you are strong, you are supposed to attack.
The additional strategy linked to this one is waiting for enemy to become weak, and attacking then.
2. Retreat if you are weak and enemy is strong
Another very common sense strategy. If you are at a place or time when you are weak and enemy is strong, you are supposed to retreat.
This strategy is used even in games like Smite and LoL where people are supposed to retreat if they are much weaker than enemy to regain power and attack again.
These two principles work in combination. When you are weak, you retreat to gain strength and wait for enemy to become weaker, which is when you attack.
3. Avoid pointless battles
The thing I noticed in Zvezda's strategies is that in the anime, there were few battles they could easily win, yet they avoided them. This made their enemies think that Zvezda is defeated, which is just few moments before Zvezda used surprise and attacked enemy's leadership and defeated all enemies in one moment.
4. Protect the group and the leader - hiding and avoiding
Whats interesting about anime is that most of the time, group spends time in hiding, using stealth to avoid the enemy. This is very useful, because Zvezda always knows where enemy is, but enemy doesnt know where Zvezda is. Thus, group was mostly protected from attacks while enemy was suffering attacks.
5. High movement ability - mobility
Group isnt really bound to one place, which enables group to be anywhere, and move anywhere, thus attack anywhere while not being forced to defend specific place.
6. Restore strength
The group doesnt spend time in constant fight, but it rests, retreats to restore power and build greater power instead of just blindly constantly attacking.
7. Mass of effects
The group uses many effects to defeat enemy, from various weapons and abilities, draining enemy's power, making enemy's forces spread and thus making enemy weaker, while group itself performs only "all united" attacks on enemy, using all resources and all members attacking together against enemy's separated group.
8. Wait for right moment to attack
The anime pretty much recognizes the need for waiting for correct time. The group which fights in final battle is basically the same as group formed at start, but their enemy is exposed and weakened.
9. Make speeches
Despite seeming as pointless, leader's speeches in anime did not just motivate the group, but also served to crush the will of enemies and even make enemies join their side.
10. Maintaining bonds with people
The group constantly works on building bonds with not just members, but all people, even their enemies.
11. Respecting enemies
The group is not bloodthirsty in any sense of the word. While seeming like they have lust for battle, a lot of battles happen with constant respect for enemies and a lack of degrading of enemies. In fact, the enemy is sometimes even praised as means to goal.
12. Persistence in everything
The anime very much teaches persistence, but in literally everything. Group tries to constantly become stronger in every way, from technology to driving abilities, challenging themselves all the time and working to achieve goals all the time.
13. Building loyalty
The group in many ways works to build loyalty, which later becomes useful, as group leader is considered by many to be someone who is supposed to be followed even in difficult times.
14. Listening to experts
Despite being a leader, Kate listens to experts and isnt actually a know it all dictator, but someone who knows that other people have useful knowledge too.
15. Increase number of allies to greatest
The group constantly seeks to convert people to their side, even offering benefits to many people so they support the group. Even a great number of enemies at the end join Zvezda, which increased group's power to the greatest. Kate always seeks to make enemies join her instead of destroying them.
16. Unite people against the enemy
A simple strategy, but when enemy's people are united against an enemy, then enemy is in much more difficult position.
17. Reject no one
Despite being centered around ideals, the group has members who dont even share its ideals, who are just there because they feel accepted. The group accepts those rejected by others. In fact, most of the main members of a group are those rejected by society.
18. Improve all
The main strategy of a group is to improve all its members. The constant work for improvement seems pointless at start, but later as members grow in knowledge, they are able to act better and inspire others.
19. Build great supplies and resources, spread resources
Even after Zvezda's main base was destroyed, they still had resources everywhere else which enabled them to continue the fight.
20. Be morally superior to your enemy
Probably a crucial strategy for Zvezda's victory. Many enemies at the end start agreeing with Zvezda and disagreeing with their own leaders, because Zvezda was morally correct while its enemies seemed cruel and heartless. This essentially destroyed enemy's will to fight. Zvezda never harmed those who arent its enemies, even acted to protect innocents, which is what made them seem superior to enemies who had no respect for anything.
We see that these strategies are better than principles of US military, because US military doesnt recognize the importance of uniting people, doesnt reduce harm to civilians, fights for mostly bad leaders instead of seeking to unite all, and fights many pointless battles with no clear goal other than fighting for the purpose of fighting. US military often fights too much where enemy is strong, which leads to drain on resources and casualties of US soldiers. Also, US military often exposes itself, which enables its enemies to attack it. This caused a much weaker militaries to inflict huge damage on US military historically, because while enemy always knows where US soldiers are, US soldiers dont always know where enemy is. In fact, surprise attacks on US soldiers happened often as a result of US soldiers moving in dangerous way and attacking at places where they didnt even know where enemy is.
Con
#2
Introduction
Comparing Zvezda's fictional military strategies to real-world tactics shows that while fictional approaches may seem ideal, they often overlook the complexities of modern warfare. Historical examples demonstrate the critical differences between these strategies and real-world military operations.
1. Real-World Application vs. Fictional Strategies
Zvezda’s strategies, built on fictional scenarios, lack the real-world adaptability needed in modern warfare. The U.S. military’s strategies are grounded in decades of experience, with a focus on real-time intelligence, international alliances, and technological advancements. While Zvezda’s approaches may seem strategic in theory, they ignore the unpredictable dynamics and real-world challenges the U.S. military faces on the ground.
2. Avoiding "Pointless Battles"
Zvezda often avoids conflict, but the U.S. military engages in combat for geopolitical reasons, to prevent larger threats, and to maintain global stability. Not every military action is about territorial gain; many are about preserving peace, as seen in humanitarian missions.
Example: The Korean War (1950-1953)
The U.S. intervention in Korea, though costly, was essential in halting the spread of communism and preserving South Korea’s sovereignty. This conflict shows that sometimes the U.S. military engages not to "win" land but to secure long-term peace and stability.
3. Protecting the Leader & Hiding
Zvezda's strategy of hiding and avoiding combat is unrealistic in modern warfare, where satellite imagery and drones track enemy movements. U.S. strategies rely on intelligence to contain threats swiftly, and hiding isn’t feasible in the global political environment.
Example: Operation Enduring Freedom (2001-present)
In Afghanistan, the U.S. used stealth and precision airstrikes to target key Taliban leaders without engaging in prolonged combat. This approach minimized risk while maintaining strategic objectives.
4. Respecting the Enemy
While respecting the enemy is honorable, Zvezda’s strategy depends on moral superiority, which may not be sustainable in real-world warfare. The U.S. military respects international laws, such as the Geneva Conventions, but also understands when direct action is necessary.
Example: The Gulf War (1990-1991)
During the Gulf War, U.S. forces allowed Iraqi soldiers to surrender without fear of retaliation, demonstrating respect for their enemies while achieving military objectives. This approach minimized casualties and upheld international law.
5. Morally Superior Approach
Zvezda's approach of convincing enemies to join their side through speeches lacks realism in modern conflicts. In contrast, the U.S. military uses precision strikes and works with humanitarian organizations to reduce civilian harm while achieving military goals.
Example: The Iraq War (2003-2011)
In Iraq, the U.S. employed precision-guided munitions to minimize civilian casualties while targeting strategic military sites. The U.S. also collaborated with international aid groups to assist affected civilians, balancing military objectives with moral responsibility.
6. Building Alliances & Mobilization
The U.S. military excels in forming international coalitions, giving it a strategic edge in global conflicts. Unlike Zvezda, which relies on converting enemies into allies, the U.S. strengthens alliances through organizations like NATO.
Example: NATO Intervention in Kosovo (1999)
The U.S. led NATO’s intervention in Kosovo to prevent ethnic cleansing. NATO's cooperation provided essential military support, making the intervention successful and enhancing global legitimacy for the operation.
7. Focus on Clear Objectives
Zvezda’s tendency to avoid battles can lead to greater instability. The U.S. military’s strength lies in its ability to pursue clear strategic objectives, such as counterterrorism, through clear missions and international cooperation.
Example: Operation Neptune Spear (2011)
The mission to capture or kill Osama bin Laden had a clear objective, using precise, well-coordinated operations. This focused approach demonstrates the U.S. military’s ability to achieve clear goals while minimizing collateral damage.
8. Strategic Mobility & Readiness
While Zvezda emphasizes stealth, the U.S. military’s mobility is its true strength. U.S. forces can quickly deploy air, sea, and land capabilities, making it a formidable force in global conflict situations.
Example: The Invasion of Grenada (1983)
During Operation Urgent Fury, U.S. forces rapidly deployed to Grenada to restore order after a coup. The swift, multi-domain deployment showcased U.S. strategic mobility and readiness to respond to global threats.
9. Dealing with Stronger Enemies
The U.S. military is equipped to deal with enemies of varying strengths, using asymmetric tactics, technological advantages, and intelligence to weaken stronger opponents.
Example: The Vietnam War (1955-1975)
Despite technological superiority, the U.S. struggled with unconventional warfare tactics employed by the Viet Cong and North Vietnamese Army. The U.S. responded by leveraging air superiority, precision strikes, and counterinsurgency operations to weaken the enemy’s capabilities.
Conclusion
Zvezda’s strategies, while idealistic in a fictional context, don’t align with the complexities of real-world warfare. The U.S. military’s approach is grounded in experience and constantly adapts to new threats. By focusing on clear objectives, building alliances, and maintaining technological superiority, the U.S. military's strategies are more realistic, adaptable, and effective in achieving long-term stability and minimizing harm.
Round 2
Criterion
Pro
Tie
Con
Points
Winner
1 point(s)
Reason:
Prime reason is Pro concession,
But even without that, many of the tactics Pro argues for in round 1 'are used by America by degrees and situations.
Though Con focuses on rebutting Pro's arguments and giving tactics and historical examples contrary to Pros.
. . .
Possible suggestion I might have made, is if there were two 'explicit sources in the description of the debate for each side stating the principles followed on each side.
You can google "US military principles" if you dont know what they are.
As for Zvezda's military principles, you will learn them either in round 1 either by watching the anime.