Instigator / Con

Benjamin

1774

rating

debates

77.55%

won

Topic

#5313

Goku would consider a strong child who beat cancer a worthy opponent.

Status

Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics

Winner

After 1 vote and with the same amount of points on both sides...

It's a tie!

Tags

anime

Parameters

Publication date: 03.05.2024 10:47AM
Last updated date: 03.19.2024 07:06PM
Type: Standard
Number of rounds: 3
Time for argument: One day
Max argument characters: 2,000
Voting period: Two weeks
Point system: Winner selection
Voting system: Open

Contender / Pro

Best.Korea

1233

rating

403

debates

39.45%

won

Description

Please don't accept this debate. You will not be able to support the resolution, as it is a joke. And yes, I am talking to you Best.Korea.

Round 1

Benjamin

03.05.2024 02:07PM

Con

Powerscaling cancer

Everyone has defeated cancer hundreds of times. Most cancer cells are killed on sight by a single Killer-T cell. The immune system is actually in a perpetual state of holding back, because if it went all out in a battle, the body it is protecting would die in less than 5 minutes. The only way cancer cells can ever harm the body is by hiding their identiy and pretending to be healthy cells and stealing nutrients. Cancer is arguably at least country level in terms of overal harm to society. But it terms of powerscaling based on attack potency, speed, durability, battle IQ and Hax, its pathetic and has no relevant feats. Organ level.

Scaling the boy who beat cancer

What does it mean for someone to beat cancer.

1. Beating his own cancer

A normal human child can beat their own cancer if they are lucky. Human level.

2. Beating all cancer cells externally

Assume that all the cancer cells were isolated from their hosts and just lying in a big messy pile. The child is able to destroy the enormous pile with one attack. Bulding level.

3. Beating all cancer cells internally

Assuming that all human cancer cells got teleported into his body at once, and his immune system still kicked their asses, that implies his body's immune system is a few million times more effective than that of a normal human. The most generous assumption here is to grant that this child is just a few million times better in every respect. Normal humans are wall level at most. The strongest recorded punch was 1.420 pounds which is equivalent to 0.00064 tonnes of TNT. Multiply that with a few million and you get a few kilo-tons of TNT, smaller than Little Boy. City level.

4. Defeating all cancer-ridden individuals:

Every human gets a type of zombie cancer that commands them to kill the child. They even launch all the worlds nukes at the child, but he tanks everything. Country level.

Scaling Goku

Even as a child at the very beginning of the story, Goku has blocked moon destroying attacks with one hand, so even if the the child who beat cancer could dish out country level attacks, that is nothing for the super sayin. And from that point Goku has grown exponetionally to the point where he is able to destory universes casually and battle Gods. Universal level.

Conclusion

Goku would not even consider fighting a child a hundred orders of magnitude weaker than him.

Best.Korea

03.05.2024 03:07PM

Pro

Topic:

Goku would consider a strong child who beat cancer a worthy opponent.

Arguments

1. Its up to Goku

The debate is not about if you or me consider, but if Goku considers.

Goku can consider, so it is possible that he would.

2. Overpowered by cuteness

Physical strength is not the only way to defeat someone.

If 5 year old girl beat cancer, but she is really cute and looks at Goku with her cute big eyes, Goku will feel overpowered and commit honorable seppuku.

"Seppuku is a form of taking one's own life that was considered honourable among the feudal Japanese samurai class. Traditionally, the act consisted of stabbing oneself in the abdomen with a short sword to ensure a slow and agonizing death."

https://www.britannica.com/topic/seppuku

3. Goku drunk

Goku can be killed by anyone if he gets drunk or passes out.

4. Goku ignorant

Goku as a baby was stupid, so he thought that 5 year old girl is a worthy opponent.

5. Goku losing power

If Goku dies or is near dying and cant move or loses power, he would consider a 5 year old girl a worthy opponent he cant beat in a fist fight.

6. Moral restrictions

Goku is limited by morality, so he is emotionally unable to fight a 5 year old girl while she is not limited by morality and can fight him, making her the obvious winner in any battle. In fact, he will even serve her and do work for her, so she wins easily while he has to do all the hard work.

7. Almighty God as a child

Its possible that almighty God is a child and that he had cancer which he beat, so obviously thats a worthy opponent and not something which can be regarded lightly.

8. Goku tricked by child

Child can pretend to be in danger and lure Goku into a trap and defeat him by trap. Goku would feel moral need to save a child, but he would die in a trap.

Counter arguments

-I reject all of your arguments.

-You said this is a joke debate, but you are not really telling jokes or saying anything close to funny, really, so I guess I win by default.

Conclusion

Child would win!

Resolution upheld!

Round 2

Benjamin

03.05.2024 05:14PM

Con

Powerscaling is fun. PRO is just not able to appreciate it.

Worthy opponent: Someone who can put up a decent fight against you even at your best and in your most powerfull forms.
Unworthy opponent: Someone who requires at least one unfair advantages to be able to battle you evenly.

A worthy opponent is someone who fights you, and then you throw your best attack, he dodges or blocks. Then the protagonist says "ah, you are a worthy opponent, I have to take you seriously" and then he powers up to one of his strongest forms. Alternatively, the power of the adversary is clearly demonstrated by him blitzing another character or destroying a mountain or something. Maybe even just stated by side characters or read from the power level counter. Or they just feel the powerfull aura. Goku would never declare a random person to be a worthy opponent unless he had adequate evidence. My argument is that beating cancer does not constitute such evidence.

Its up to Goku

PRO conceedes that neither of us can know what know what Goku WOULD do or think.
That means he can never prove that Goku WOULD consider something, only that he COULD which does not fullfill his BoP.

Overpowered by cuteness

Goku only recognizes strenght when evaluating potential opponents.
PRO says that Goku would commit seppuku. That demonstrates his ignorance.

Goku is not a samurai, and does not adhere to their honor code
He also does not carry around a classic Japanese sword
But even if he did, no Japanese short sword could harm his skin that is as durable as entire galaxies.

If Goku was overpowered with cuteness, then he would want to protect the 5 year old girl against the future villains, so he would need to stay alive to accomplish that.

Goku ignorant

If Baby Goku was that stupid then he would not understand what "worthy opponent" even means.
Plus, the Dragon Ball Manga literally starts with kid Goku, not baby Goku, and he was able to tank moon-destroying attacks from the very beginning.

Moral restrictions

If Goku thinks that he could easily kill the child if they were to fight, and therefore elects not to fight, then he does not consider him a worthy opponent.

Almighty God as a child

The Gods in Dragon Ball are all adults, and in real life there are no Gods with physical bodies who go around fighting each other. This argument is wack.

I extend all R1 arguments. PRO fails his BoP so far.

Best.Korea

03.05.2024 05:55PM

Pro

I reject your definitions.

Worthy opponent is someone who can beat you or who you cant beat. Simple.

All of your arguments are false, except the ones supporting my case.

My case

1. Goku going insane

Insanity is quite common, especially as Goku ages. So he would think that 5 year old girl is a worthy opponent due to his insanity.

2. Goku dreaming

He would at some point dream that he is fighting a child and losing, so he would think that child is worthy opponent. Dreaming of fighting is quite common, especially in childhood.

3. Goku drugged

Drug abuse is very common, and causes people to have different thinking. Goku would be drugged to think that 5 year old girl is a worthy opponent.

4. Goku beaten by someone else first

Goku would get beaten badly by someone, then at the point where he has no strength left, even a 5 year old can beat him.

5. Goku made weak by an all powerful God

All powerful God would take away all Goku's strength so even a child can beat him.

6. Giant 5 year old girl

There would be a giant 5 year old girl existing that can beat up Goku, just hidden or not shown in dragon balls anime. If Goku faced her, he would think she is a worthy opponent.

7. Goku's first time seeing a child

When Goku was a baby, first time seeing a child, he would think that child could beat him or that he couldnt beat that child. Baby's thoughts are often strange.

8. Goku's imagination

Goku has at some point imagined that there exists a child strong enough that he cant beat it.

9. Goku as his own opponent

Goku is the opponent of Goku, because he is different person than he was before and than he will be after.

So he as a 5 year old who beat cancer would consider himself at age 6 a worthy opponent.

10. Goku having poor eyesight

Goku loses sight as he ages, so he would confuse a 5 year old girl for a worthy opponent.

11. Goku as a kid

Goku when he was a kid thought that there is a child who can beat him.

Conclusion

Opponent's arguments are negated.

My arguments stand

My arguments are funnier.

Resolution upheld!

Round 3

Benjamin

03.05.2024 06:41PM

Con

PRO literally conceeded in round 1 that Goku would have moral qualms about fighting a child. That goes against the very concept of WORTHY OPPONENT as someone you can go all out on.

Worthy opponent is someone who can beat you or who you cant beat. Simple.

Goku can definately beat the child who beat cancer. Beating cancer does not make you powerfull enough to survive attacks that destroy entire universes.

Just because Goku wouldn't want to beat a child in battle, it does not mean that he would be unable to do so extremely easily.

The child who beat cancer cannot beat Goku, because even as a child Goku can survive concentrated energy blasts powerfull enough to destroy the moon.

So even an unconscious Goku should be able to tank any attack the child can dish out.
Plus, killing Goku while he sleeps or tries to protect you from danger, even if possible, would not be a worthy vitory in battle, but totally unworthy murder.

PRO says that Goku could go insane or become drugged or some other bullshit. But PRO says that Goku is incredibly dumb. If that is true then he cannot simultaniously be smart enough to think of all of those niche situations PRO claims he could be killed in, and would blindly assume his raw strenghts makes him invincible to the likes of us humans.

The child who beat cancer

PRO assumes that the question is "could any type of child kill Goku in at least one circumstance" which is ridiculous. This debate is about whether Goku would view beating cancer as evidence that the child can give him a run for his money in an all out fight. The answer to that is no. Even the most ridiculous interpretations of "beating cancer" don't constitute feats even close to Goku's level. There are specific devices in Dragon Ball that measure the strenght of the people Goku and his friends plan on fighting. That would tell Goku that the kid who beat cancer is not strong enough to even have a chance at beating Goku. But even if Goku did not bring that device, he would slowly test out the strenght of the child. If the child could tank every casual attack, such that he had to become serious, first then would he consider him a worthy opponet. That is how the Dragon Ball Story works.

Conclusion:

The Goku from the manga has none of these ridiculous hypothetical disadvantages that PRO keeps pulling from his ass. Goku would never consider a mere child his equal.

Best.Korea

03.05.2024 07:06PM

Pro

My opponent again tries to impose his made up definitions and use made up circumstances.

Same way as resolution "I would eat a banana" wouldnt mean "I eat banana every moment all the time for my whole life", I dont need to prove that every child can beat Goku at any point, but I did that too.

I reject my opponent's definitions in favor of mine.

I reject all of my opponent's arguments as false except those which support my case. My opponent's arguments against my position are just unproven assumptions, unproven logic and false reasoning.

All my arguments are true.

Extend all my arguments.

My case

1. Goku lives in anime

Since Goku lives only in anime, he cant at any point fight or beat a child from non-anime world. He is aware of non-anime world, and he knows he is powerless against it.

2. Goku cant beat all children because he cant beat himself as a child

Goku was a child. Past tense. So he cannot beat himself from the past or any other child from the past. He also cant beat those who will exist after he dies. He knows this, so he considers them worthy opponents, worthy opponents being the ones he cant beat.

I could go on, but this is already more arguments than enough to prove resolution true.

Conclusion

My arguments are true and funny. My opponent's arguments are not funny. My opponent's arguments are not true unless they prove my position true.

Resolution upheld!

Best.Korea

03.05.2024 12:39PM

-->

@Benjamin

There is no unwinnable debate, because truth is subjective.

Awo Awoo

Benjamin

03.05.2024 12:15PM

Best.Korea is apparently like a cat, he will do what one explicitly tells him not to do. But he is also like a dog, he will bark at animals way larger than himself. Like accepting unwinnable debates.

7000series

03.13.2024 01:59AM

Criterion

Con

Tie

Pro

Points

Winner

1 point(s)

Reason:

If I take PRO's definitions as true, the PRO wins.
If I take CON's definitions as true, the CON wins.
Neither side brought out a dictionary, so it's a tie!