White privilege is not a problem that we have in the USA today.
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
After 2 votes and with 6 points ahead, the winner is...
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Standard
- Number of rounds
- 4
- Time for argument
- One week
- Max argument characters
- 30,000
- Voting period
- Two weeks
- Point system
- Multiple criterions
- Voting system
- Open
Definitions:
White Privilege: inherent advantages possessed by a white person on the basis of their race in a society characterized by racial inequality and injustice.
Problem: a matter or situation regarded as unwelcome or harmful and needing to be dealt with and overcome.
Both definitions come from Oxford Dictionary.
I (Pro) will be arguing that white privilege, is not a problem that we have in the USA today.
You (Con) will be arguing that white privilege is a problem that we have in the USA today.
Rules:
One forfeit is equivalent to a loss. This is not the official DART standards, but this is a personalized debate, so you must agree to this in order to debate.
If my opponent wishes for one forfeit without losing, then they must PM me to talk about it.
At its core pro is arguing that white privilege in its current form is mischaracterized, not resulting in "inequality and injustice" as the usual definition implies. It's something of a K to his own topic but I'll allow it. Con suffers a bit of scope creep and related confusion with closely connected matters of white supremacy.
Con yielded a lot of ground in R1 and R2, but came back in R3 to secure his victory.
In the end I'm left with the impression that the problem exists even if frequently overstated, and some factors such as increased educational access are beginning to mitigate it.
...
Pro argues it exists, but is not problematic. He supports this with slavery ending in 1865, in 1870 blacks began being elected into congress, and in 1964 a law was passed to give black people the same rights as white people "and everyone was treated equally as human beings, with the same rights and consequences."
Con argues that in present day "ignorance and indifference" associated with white privilege cause harms.
1. The Law (pro)
Pro successfully argues that the law as written is not inherently racist.
2. Police Brutality
Con uses the example of white police targeting a black teacher and being violent against her on the basis of how violent they believed her skin color to make her.
Pro challenges for a lack of statistically significant evidence (not sure the point of half defending the officer in question here; even while agreeing he was needlessly cruel).
Con brings up a few more examples, but misses pro's point and theme which extends throughout.
3. Racial Sentencing
Con argues black people are given decades when accused of rape, whereas white people are given only months for the same crime. This is particularly effective due to pro's line "the same rights and consequences." Con also mentions drugs, but without a comparison to how whites are sentenced it falls a little flat. Further, there is a difference in sentencing based on race (that source could have been much better utilized, a single line from it doesn't get across half what the graphs showed).
Pro defends that Turner is an isolated case, not indicative of a pattern; and further white people have also been wrongly accused of crimes. He defends that the rate of executions are solely in proportion to rate of capital crime occurrence.
Con argues that sentencing differences are "Institutionalized Discrimination." Further, that the differing crime rates are due to "Socio-economic disadvantages."
Pro asserts that it is impossible for the law to do this...
4. Stereotypes
Con argues that white people are more likely to commit violent crimes, but black people suffer centuries of profiling for the few of them which do likewise.
Pro challenges the ratios.,
Con backs down, and blames income inequality.
Pro leverages this with information on the education system which all other things being equal would result in African Americans doing better than White Americans.
Con says this is self defeating (I actually see why, due to the imbalance proving enough other things are not equal to create the situations already discussed; but con would have been well to talk a little more about this).
5. Systemic Racism vs Individual Racism
Con's weakest point. It feels like an assertion that racism is worse based on the color of the racist.
Pro defends and argues for dismissal due to lack of relevance.
The following are Pro's and Con's argument reviews:
Con's first constructive argument of police brutality was refuted. Pro deconstructs it most likely by mentioning the restrictions officers have and pointing out Con's inadequate evidence.
Pro half-way concedes on Con's second main argument. He provides some examples to counteract Con's about the racial biases in sentencing, but then agrees with Con's point about how Black and Latino people are more likely to be sentenced than white people but attempts to counter by arguing the crime rate proportions of Black and Latino communities vs white.
Con's third argument about stereotypes is only partially refuted by Pro. He acknowledges that black communities face more rumors of violence but says certain individuals are exempt. This doesn't actually disprove my claim about innocent black people more likely to be profiled which is why I simply can't give the point to Pro here.
Con's fourth argument about how systemic racism affects people of color doesn't get refuted at all. Pro tries to undermine the significance by claiming it affects everyone equally, but this simply just isn't the case due to research I have done nor does this address the main argument.
It's important to know that Con is not talking about White Supremacy. He does make references to racism, but this version doesn't necessarily imply superiority, this version of it is more based on fear and it's so suppressed, that it's subconscious.
It is my opinion that Con wins with more convincing arguments.
Yeah I’m down for that. I’m working 15
Hours a day with no days off right now so I may be responding to the debates a little late, but I’m down to do it.
Also nah Lancelot I think I’m done shit talking you lol, just a little too much to deal with tbh.
I’ll take responsibility for baiting him, but his decision to escalate into personal attacks was his own choice.
Which I don’t care about really, but he bears the burden of that alone. If he tells me to stop, I’ll stop. But I’m comfortable if he wants to continue.
Meh, a case could be made for deliberate provocation. But I do see your justification.
https://www.debateart.com/debates/4004-lancelot-should-not-be-president-sry
Comment #18
Isn’t that right?
Linkie to comment pls.
I have the receipts.
Mps1213 started the shit-talking, so he can handle it. I only perpetuated it.
Sure.
I’ve invested myself in the George Floyd death being a cocktail of illicit drugs that killed him vs the the knee on the neck, and not the psychoactive drugs subject.
I’ve already started doing research and preparing a
Draft intro for a new thread in the forum section to challenge MPs with. I’m sticking with that unless everyone agrees on jumping on that wagon too? At least there you can tag team with him, and anyone else can feel free to chime in as well. Then we will really see how it plays out.
Since I'll be challenging you on this account (I think a 2v2 is allowed as long as its unrated), I'll have a chance to filter out the worst bits of trash talk... hopefully.
Outcome won’t make a difference though.
Me and Mps will still shit-talk eachother after.
Whoever else joins in is just collateral.
Great, now we just have to wait for the other two.
I accept.
A 2v1 isn't exactly fair... someone has to stick up for Mps. IMO he is someone who has a lot of knowledge, and is confident of that. From my conversations with him, I can tell that although his tone may come off as condescending, he doesn't mean it - he's simply self-assured.
I propose a fair debate to settle this once and for all. Mps and I vs Lancelot and TWS, on the topic of either psychoactive drugs or climate change. Mps will provide the knowledge and research, I'll provide the structure, sourcing, and formality. Do ya'll accept?
Don’t forget to make that callout thread in the forums. It’s gonna take him off-guard.
There have been many others here who just exude the Dunning Kruger Effect, but damn, you take the cake.
Your sophomoric hypocritical banality just knows no bounds.
You lost that debate badly.
But don’t feel ashamed. Your ignorance can’t match my superior understanding of science.
I don’t have to take a more knowledgeable approach… because I’m winning the debate lol. And haven’t reported a vote and never will.
Aight mate can’t talk to you anymore. Later.
If you want to debate Global Warming again we can. You can go first and try to take a different, more knowledgeable approach.
I specifically instructed people to vote for you on that debate because I knew your sad little ego couldn’t handle losing that debate.
That’s probably why Mike took away your ability to report votes.
The amount of sore loser, sour puss, retards on this site is astounding. You guys should go to school and do something constructive with your life lol. I’m in a position where I can say stuff like that. I make more money in 2 months than you guys do in a year. And it’s because of my education and knowledge. So go do something with yourselves instead of boosting your childish ego by trolling people.
Yeah I just checked, not a single vote in your favor on our global warming debate.
Also thank you guys for talking to me, it makes me feel so good about myself knowing I’m not a complete idiot, who gets entertainment out of trolling people on a debate website lol. Y’all are hilarious, thanks guys it made my day.
Again, I have never defriended, reported a vote, or blocked anyone on this site ever. That is all you. You trolling like this is hilariously childish. You’re an idiot mate.
I don’t think you have a single vote for you in the global warming debate. You were the one claiming the effects were over exaggerated. You sir are an idiot or a troll, both are equally as embarrassing. I wouldn’t be surprised if both of the accounts I’m arguing with is you.
No you nerd I stopped responding because I had an hour long drive to the hotel from the oil spill site.
Yeah I can comprehend you TWS, what I’m saying, which apparently you can’t comprehend, is that I would have a debate with you on this topic, in the debate section, not in the forum.
This guy also thinks Global Warming is fake.
When I debated him, he got absolutely destroyed and I still won, despite forfeiting.
Yeah, loser.
Forum. Not debate section. Reading comprehension matters.
Did you stop responding because I hurt your feelings THAT bad?
So you’re a hypocrite.
I correctly predicted you would report votes against you, so I had Mike fix that problem.
Just don’t rage and start blocking and defriending people like you probably do normally when they vote against you.
You can easily go look if I’ve ever reported a vote, takes about 5 minutes.
I never have and never will. You however, have done that. Stop projecting and being a blatant hypocrite you fool. I would never report a vote because it’s absolutely embarrassing.
You probably would report votes against you because you’re a sore loser.
No dumb ass, I know you are going to report the first vote against you. I would never report any vote, because I’m not a child lol
Well I’ve never reported a vote, never blocked someone, never removed anyone from a friends list lmao. Because I respect peoples right to voice their opinion without it being removed. I will combat the vote with arguing with them, but I would never report it. I have no cares about Mike removing that ability because I would’ve never used it. It’s like taking a picture calendar away from a blind man, pointless.
You don’t even have the ability to report anymore.
So how could you report someone else for voting against me?
More importantly, why would you?
I’m very excited to see the first vote against you on that debate get reported though. Can’t wait for that lol
yes, you are.
why else would Mike take your reporting abilities away?
And if you think I’d value this idiots vote on something he knows nothing about, you’re wrong lol. That simple, I don’t value opinions from people who have no knowledge in a particular topic. Just like I wouldn’t expect someone to value my political opinion, or my opinion on anything other than pharmacology and climate change, because I am insanely uneducated in just about everything else.
I wouldn’t report the vote anyway lol, because I’m not an insecure child like yourself Lancelot.
I had Mike take away Mps’s ability to report votes, so he won’t be able to report you.
When you get your voting qualifications, would you like to vote on this debate just so Mps can see just how badly he got destroyed?
https://www.debateart.com/debates/4145-all-psychoactive-substances-should-be-legalized-for-adults-to-purchase-possess-and-use
No see, I do know what you don’t know. Because you are making claims that are patently false and don’t hold up to scrutiny and you’re willing to die on that hill. Which tells me you have very little knowledge on this topic. Which is why you have yet to counter anything I’ve said with data or evidence. Invite me to a debate, I will settle it with you there.’other than that, I have worked 15 hours today at an oil spill and simply don’t have the energy to argue with ignorance anymore.
Since you are so confident in your ability to understand this complicated situation. Send me an invite to a debate on this specific topic.
See, there’s that insecurity again with yet another superfluous retort full of drivel. Not to mention a lot of unsubstantiated subjective claims about what you think I know vs what you think you know.
If you want to debate this, take it to the forum where we can properly reply with “quotes” and use hyperlinks.
Again you can say that all you’d like, however only one person in that debate had empirical evidence and data to support their claim. The other forfeited a round and made very ignorant claims that they had no evidence for. I’m sure you know which one is which. So take pride in being ignorant in a topic, just like rational madman did, and he lost the debate, and he performed better kn the debate than you did.
See man, you have presented nothing to prove me wrong. You have cited coroner and toxicology reports, sure, but you don’t know how to read them. I’ve stated explicitly why those reports don’t mean what you think they mean, and you’ve yet to counter.
Also there is no such thing as a “lethal dose” as if there’s a dose that every person would die from. It changes dramatically with weight and tolerance. Which is why LD50’s are listed in the unit of mg PER kg. Meaning as the weight of the subject increases, the lethal dose for the average person that weight, will increase.
People you have out argued know just as little about pharmacology and toxicology as you do.
Believe me I’m not flustered by what you’re saying, I’m a little embarrassed for you because I would hate to be arguing something I know nothing about. It’s very Fox News and CNN esque. Also I never said anything about political beliefs besides saying people who claim other people are brainwashed are usually brain washed by the beliefs they hold. You completely proved my point when you pointed the finger a political orientation and called them all sheep. That was exactly what I was saying, that you think you’re not a sheep, even though you lack the ability to consider other view points from people who disagree with you. Which makes you a close minded ignorant person. The YouTube algorithm and modern American politics has ruined your ability (and many other peoples) ability to critically think about anything. It’s just you vs them, no matter the other side says you will disagree with. That should be a problem to you, but you’re brainwashed so you don’t see it. That simple fact is also why you lack the ability to talk about scientific topic in a nuanced, careful, and objective way. It’s only what your side argues, they could argue he died from anything drug related and you’d jump on it regardless of whether the evidence supports it or not.
And you can call me whatever you please, however, you know nothing about this topic, which is why you haven’t addressed anything I’ve said about what that toxicology report actually means besides saying I’m drinking the Kool-aid. You have presented 0 empirical evidence to support that he had a fentanyl overdose, besides highly uneducated takes like “he had enough in his system to kill twelve people” what is your evidence for that? Is it the coroner saying they’ve seen death caused with as little as 2 nano grams per milliliter and that he had 22 in his system?
If that’s the case you haven’t looked into this enough, because that low of a lethal dose is usually indicative of a very small person (like a baby) ingesting a drug. Or that someone had an allergic reaction. You are over simplifying this subject because you have to. You don’t know enough about this topic to have an intricate understanding and conduct deep research, which is why people who have the knowledge, education, and ability to do those things disagree with you. It’s not because we are drinking the kool-aid or trying to promote the idea of racist cops. It’s because we know more about this topic and you are simply wrong.
Also ao have no political affiliation with any group, and refuse to, because people who argue and engage in politics are wasting their time and their life because it is a pointless topic with no right answers. It’s ok that you don’t know anything about this topic, which you have repeatedly proven. Just stop arguing about it with someone who does know about it.
Mps sure is a lot of bark and no bite.
I’d enjoy seeing you wipe the floor with him/her/it a second time on the subject matter.