Instigator / Pro

TheGreatAbe

1490

rating

debates

0.0%

won

Topic

#4031

Modern science shows that the Bible is inaccurate.

Status

Finished

The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.

Winner & statistics

Better arguments

Better sources

Better legibility

Better conduct

After 4 votes and with 22 points ahead, the winner is...

Sir.Lancelot

Tags

Religion

Parameters

Publication date: 01.03.2023 01:45AM
Last updated date: 02.08.2023 04:13PM
Type: Standard
Number of rounds: 3
Time for argument: Three days
Max argument characters: 10,000
Voting period: One month
Point system: Multiple criterions
Voting system: Open

Contender / Con

Sir.Lancelot

1587

rating

182

debates

55.77%

won

Description

Definition of terms

Science - the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation, experimentation, and the testing of theories against the evidence obtained.

Bible - the Christian scriptures, consisting of the Old and New Testaments.

Round 1

TheGreatAbe

01.03.2023 04:54AM

Pro

Thank you Sir. Lancelot for this debate.

Accuracy of Earths history

First off I would Like to look into Genesis 1 and 2 where the creation of earth is stated. Christians believe that god created the earth in what is known as the 7 days of creation. The activities that took place on days 1-6 can found in genesis 1. Here is a brief outline of the 7 days of creation:

Day 1: Light

Day 2: Sky/heavens

Day 3: Land, seas, plants

Day 4: Sun, moon, stars

Day 5: Birds and sea animals

Day 6: Land animals and humans

Day 7: The Sabbath (rest day for god)

At first this process seems like it makes logical sense but after looking a bit closer at each individual day, the accuracy of this process seems questionable to say the least. For example in Genesis 1:25 it states that god made humans and all land animals on the same day:

And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Animal Fossil Records

This statement can be completely debunked using modern science. Fossils of land roaming millipedes have been estimated to be over 400 million years old. Species such as Kampecaris obanensis have even been found to be around 425 million years old. The oldest human fossil ever found has been estimated to be around 233,000 years old. If humans and all other land animals were created in one day, why are there no million year old human fossils? Many cyanobacteria remains have even been estimated to be as old as 3.5 billion years old.

Creation of non animal/plant organisms

On day 3 god created plants, day 5 he created birds and animals, and day 6 he created all other land animals including humans. However the creation of non plant/animal life was left out in the 7 days of creation. No where in genesis 1 or 2 does it mention god creating fungi, microorganisms, or bacteria in the 7 days of creation. These organisms are essential parts of life so I find It strange that they ate not included.

Sources:

https://www.bibleinfo.com/en/questions/what-are-7-days-of-creation

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/ot/gen/1?lang=eng

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01646-5

https://ucmp.berkeley.edu/bacteria/cyanofr.html

https://www.npr.org/2022/01/13/1072867405/scientists-determine-age-of-some-of-the-oldest-human-bones

Sir.Lancelot

01.03.2023 03:53PM

Con

Preamble:

I will argue my case with five arguments, each of which provide evidence of a God.

Burden of Proof:

Since my opponent is making the claim that science contradicts the Bible, he is therefore required to demonstrate proof for it. Whereas I only have to refute this claim. My opponent wins should he prove this statement true and I win if I show it to be false.

l. Motion

Since it logically follows that everything moving has a force which is moving them. This then begs the question, who or what constructed this cycle? The only reasonable explanation is God.

ll. Cause and Effect

Something cannot come from nothing.
Without a cause, there could be no effect.
There must be a cause that has not been affected by anything.

The only conclusion is there must be a God.

lll. Necessary Existence

Since products of existence must have had a cause, and matter/energy cannot be created or destroyed, then there must exist a source prior to the birth of the universe that is independent of the former two rules.

lV. Complexity

Since the universe consists of things which exist abominations to systems are perfectly designed, there exists a hierarchy in which standards of perfection can be compared. God provides an objective foundation for perfection.

V. Function and Objective

Since every process in this universe has a particular objective, like all colonies of ants building an ant hill or humans constructing skyscrapers, the intricately designed mechanics of our universe must therefore require an intelligent designer.

Rebuttals:

"Animal Fossil Records

This is how I will respond. Here is a quote from St. Augustine.:

"For the second day, the third, and the rest are not other days; but the same one day is repeated to complete the number six or seven, so that there should be knowledge both of God's works and of His rest." 54 The creation is divided in the account into six days, he says, because, according to the inner nature of numbers, 55 six is the first perfect (or complete) number, that is, it is the first number which is made up of the parts which exactly divide it added together (1+2+3), "and in this number of days God finished His work." Some may be unimpressed by this kind of interpretation, but "we must not despise the science of numbers, which in many passages of Holy Scripture is found to be of eminent service to the careful interpreter." 56

The bible isn't always literal and shouldn't be taken at face value. When speaking of days, the concept of time is irrelevant and simply a figurative analogy.

"Creation of non animal/plant organisms

If a creator with infinite power has the ability to miraculously speak these things into existence, then it stands to reason he also possesses the ability to allow the survival of certain creatures without needing to depend on resources. Such is the case before Eve ate from the Forbidden Tree, none of these things were required, so it would have been pointless to create them in the chronological order you are demanding.

This is not a contradiction. Next.

Sources: St. Augustine and Cosmology | Villanova University

Round 2

TheGreatAbe

01.06.2023 03:53PM

Pro

Forfeited

Sir.Lancelot

01.06.2023 03:54PM

Con

He forfeited.

I extend my arguments from Round 1. I won't make any new arguments until those are addressed.

Round 3

TheGreatAbe

01.09.2023 03:54PM

Pro

Forfeited

Sir.Lancelot

01.09.2023 04:13PM

Con

Aaaaaaaand.......Finish.

rayhan16

01.18.2023 10:40PM

Criterion

Pro

Tie

Con

Points

Better arguments

3 point(s)

Better sources

2 point(s)

Better legibility

1 point(s)

Better conduct

1 point(s)

Reason:

Forfeit. Wish we had less of these.

K_Michael

01.09.2023 06:31PM

Criterion

Pro

Tie

Con

Points

Better arguments

3 point(s)

Better sources

2 point(s)

Better legibility

1 point(s)

Better conduct

1 point(s)

Reason:

"by the choice of one side to miss at least 40% of the debate, the requirement [to consider arguments] ceases."

Barney

01.09.2023 05:17PM

Criterion

Pro

Tie

Con

Points

Better arguments

3 point(s)

Better sources

2 point(s)

Better legibility

1 point(s)

Better conduct

1 point(s)

Reason:

Forfeiture

RationalMadman

01.09.2023 04:22PM

Criterion

Pro

Tie

Con

Points

Better arguments

3 point(s)

Better sources

2 point(s)

Better legibility

1 point(s)

Better conduct

1 point(s)

Reason:

FF .