Instigator / Pro
16
1420
rating
396
debates
43.94%
won
Topic
#2456
Atheists are religious.
Status
Finished
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
Winner & statistics
After 4 votes and with 12 points ahead, the winner is...
seldiora
Parameters
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Standard
- Number of rounds
- 4
- Time for argument
- Two days
- Max argument characters
- 10,000
- Voting period
- One week
- Point system
- Multiple criterions
- Voting system
- Open
Contender / Con
28
1417
rating
158
debates
32.59%
won
Description
Disclaimer : Regardless of the setup for voting win or lose, The aim of this interaction, Is for those that view it, Learn and or take away anything that will amount to any constructive value ultimately. So that counts as anything that'll cause one to reconsider an idea, Understand a subject better, Help build a greater wealth of knowledge getting closer to truth. When either of us has accomplished that with any individual here, That's who the victor of the debate becomes.
So , atheists are or can be very religious. There's absolutely no doubt to not believing that this is controversial. This topic statement is so true particularly within a certain time of our history, it was really made so.
Now no spoilers, I don't want to give too much away. I'm hoping somebody will come along thinking they have an argument against the topic statement.
You can send a question for more information but it most likely won't be much more than what was said here.
Round 1
Now I'm going to give you a chance with trying to prove the topic statement false.
Now with a topic statement such as this, if you read it too fast without giving much thought to it, it can be saying something you think it's saying but really is not.
So I'm going to guide you on the right path with this statement.
First off , what kind of statement is it? It's a broad statement. It doesn't give a specified number in a group. It mentions a group and something that applies within that group.
But how about the application to each individual? What does it come down to making a judgment there?
Secondly, you can swap out "atheists" with the term "people". The topic statement would still remain non-fallacious.
That's it for now. Just think about how can this be true of a statement. What is out there that we know of in which makes this statement true?
Think about it first, see what you come up with.
From Merriam Webster, Atheist: a person who does not believe in the existence of a god or any gods : one who subscribes to or advocates atheism
Religious: relating to or manifesting faithful devotion to an acknowledged ultimate reality or deity
Because atheists do not believe in a deity, they are not religious. Case closed.
Round 2
"Because atheists do not believe in a deity, they are not religious. Case closed."
Why didn't you think beyond the conventional setup and definition?
Whenever something appears to be simple in what's supposed to be a very critical, elaborate platform, be very cautious.
Atheists are religious. That's a true statement according to the following at least. The Laveyan Satanists are a religious group of people. People that are atheists, hence atheists are religious.
Now, case closed.
Satanist are only one group of people. They do not consist of all existing atheists. Therefore you cannot apply the statement to all atheists.
Round 3
"Satanist are only one group of people. They do not consist of all existing atheists. Therefore you cannot apply the statement to all atheists."
You're a 1000% right. That's why I was very careful in not saying all atheists are religious.
The problem lies in the resolution. It's stated that atheists are religious, and offers no exceptions. Even if Mall can prove that atheists can simultaneously be religious, the amount that straddle this absurd line are few and far in between, as it is practically impossible to believe in no god and believe in a god. Even Satanists is highly up to interpretation. A site notes "Satanist is a broad and varied category: some are theistic and believe in the existence of a literal Satan, while others use Lucifer as the original symbol of resistance and bringer of enlightenment to humankind. " (https://library.bc.edu/answerwall/2020/03/09/what-exactly-are-satanists/)
But since atheist once again means that they do not believe in a deity, that means they only believe in the set of belief that Satan offers, not Satan himself. As you can see there's the clear difference, and atheists are not religious. The very definitions contradict each other.
Round 4
I'll put it this way so not to complicate and add unnecessary things.
Atheist = singular
Atheists =plural
The "s" on the end only indicates more than one atheist upon speaking of the noun.
So this does not say all . To specify an all-inclusive nature , the context would have to say so or the statement has to specify somewhere in there.
This is just like when you say people drive cars or people ride the bus. The context is well known that not all people do one or the other or both. When say people, we mean more than one. There's no specified number.
So it's the same when phrasing the noun as atheists.
When you say there are people in the building or at the park or outside my house, don't assume all people of the planet.
So that includes Laveyan Satanism. Laveyan Satanism is a religion.
So the topic statement was just a broad way of speaking or making a generalization.
It would be incorrect if the statement said this applies to each person. But it disregards the exceptions to apply a truth to an inexact number in a group or subject.
So Laveyan Satanists are religious people due to joining a religion and they are atheists. So therefore , we do have a such thing as religious atheists.
If you just throw out the thought of application to each person, you can follow this quite well .
Pro has given zero sources while I have proved two types of satanism that put a hole in his argument. Remember his argument must apply for most if not all atheists. If I said humans run faster than 25 mph there are only a handful of people who fit that description and is a misleading representation of average human running speed. As self proclaimed atheists who believe in a deity are self contradictory and nearly nil, atheists are not religious.
I have completed the debates, there voting periods just aren't up.
How can you vote when you completed no debates?
Rather, what I read is not what others read.
I guess the opposing argument is , don't believe what you read. Don't even believe the founder of the religion's book.
According to those that think so, Laveyan Satanism is not a religion involving Atheists.
I guess what I read online and in dictionaries is not others read.
Doesn't make it any less than true.
"Atheists are religious. " but then "So , atheists are or can be very religious."
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