Presidential Immunity

Author: Double_R

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#151
Double_R
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@3RU7AL
have they even done any surveys to determine if this stormy daniels thing would have made any difference whatsoever ?
That's irrelevant to whether it's a crime. We have campaign finance laws for a reason and many politicians have faced severe penalities for violating them.

But setting that aside, anyone who remembers 2016 and the aftermath of access Hollywood would definitely recognize that this very well could have turned the election. We might find it hard to imagine today given how in the tank the republican party is for Trump but they were not there yet at that time. The republican speaker of the house cancelled every campaign event with him and republicans everywhere were calling for him to step out of the race.

He was paying to conceal pertinent information from the American people right before they were to decide whether he whould be the man to lead their country. However the legality of that act works out, it's not hyperbolic to emphasize the seriousness of that offense.
#152
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@Double_R
it's not hyperbolic to emphasize the seriousness of that offense.
The charge may be serious, but this particular case is not. The amount of hoop diving required to get from point A to point B in this case is ridiculous and unprecedented. It's why this case is regarded as a legal "Hail Mary" for the Democrat party. We have a check from Cohen to Stormy. No other evidence of campaign violations.

#153
ADreamOfLiberty
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@Double_R
you don't know anything if you choose not to look.
That's called an audit,
Yep, nothing illegal about demanding audits.


It is illegal, read the law
Your claim, your homework.
The prosecutors already did it when they filled the indictment. Read it.
I'll remind you that you dropped the point if you rely on it again.


There is no process for challenging election results. People have just used civil suits in lieu of congressional debate and it is an ill fitting mechanism indeed.
Civil suits is the process.
It is a process that has been used. It is not the process. The process is for congress to reject electors.


So he can wield it even if it's not his to wield?
It's called lying and intimidating. Not a difficult thing to understand, if you were actually trying to.
Not a very effective tactic if there was no credible fear he could carry through.


CNN didn't tell them what to do
If there was any communication it would be them telling CNN what to do.


Second and more importantly, they didn't say it was Russian disinformation, they said it has all of the hallmarks of Russian disinformation. Those are two completely different things. 
So do you have a straight face when you type these things?


The funniest part was the call was illegally recorded. "this is the way the law works" rofl... clown
As usual, you have no idea what you're talking about. The recording was legal, Georgia is a one party consent state. Google it.
The person who recorded it was not in Georgia. Google it.

#154
3RU7AL
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@Double_R
That's irrelevant to whether it's a crime. We have campaign finance laws for a reason and many politicians have faced severe penalities for violating them.
well

the "falsifying records" thing is a MISDEMEANOR

unless

it is in the service of a FELONY

so they had to invent a FELONY


which is the "conspiracy to defraud the american voter"


which is obviously complete bullshit


so, yeah

not even slightly "irrelevant"
#155
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@ADreamOfLiberty

Second and more importantly, they didn't say it was Russian disinformation, they said it has all of the hallmarks of Russian disinformation. Those are two completely different things. 
So do you have a straight face when you type these things?
bingo
#156
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Well, when you are a star you can do anything.
#157
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@FLRW
All politicians are stars.
#158
IwantRooseveltagain
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We have a check from Cohen to Stormy. No other evidence of campaign violations.
False. We have a check from Trump to Cohen. If Trump directed and paid Cohen to commit a crime then he is also responsible for that crime. 

And it wasn’t legal fees for the Trump Organization. That too was a crime. If Trump had Cohen go out and buy him some groceries, and paid him back, is that legal fees for the Trump Organization? According to Trump he did this to protect Melania, which has nothing to do with the Trump company.

#159
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I'll leave that to the "experts" who think you need a body to convict someone of a murder.
Not what I said genius. I said you need a body to initiate a murder investigation. No doubt these cases began as missing persons investigations.



#160
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And here’s why genius, in the first U.S.  case cited by Wikipedia:

Farmhand Colvin went missing in 1812. Brothers Jesse and Stephen Boorn had been seen arguing with him before he disappeared and some of his personal effects were found buried in a cellar on the Boorn farm alongside bones claimed to be human but later found to be animal. Both made contradictory confessions to the crime, although Jesse recanted his. The brothers were sentenced to death for the alleged crime, but were pardoned the following year after Colvin was found alive in Dover.[115]
#161
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Lol, you already embarrassed yourself thoroughly today with the whole "you need a body to convict someone of murder."

The rest of your unoriginal analysis is just as humorous.
#162
IwantRooseveltagain
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“you need a body to convict someone of murder."
lol, as usual you are lying. Never said you need a body to convict someone of murder. You are lying. You lie here every day.

This is typical MAGA MORON behavior. Using a kernel of truth to fabricate a story with the other MAGA MORONS. 

And then your own citation from Wikipedia illustrates why the authorities should have a body before convicting someone of murder. But as usual you don’t read your own citations. You should stick to YouTube clips. That’s more your level of comprehension ability 

#163
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There are no murder investigations without a body. Perhaps a missing person investigation, but murder? No.
-some unoriginal and confused poster...
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#164
Double_R
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@Greyparrot
We have a check from Cohen to Stormy. No other evidence of campaign violations.
Sure, of you pretend the rest of it doesn't exist, like the precise repayments from Trump to Cohen, the witness testimony, and oh yeah, Trump being recorded telling Cohen how to make the payments.

And even if we didn't have all of that, you're suggesting what - that personal attorney decided to take out a loan against his home to cover up his bosses sexual affair and his boss, a well known micro manager, had absolutely nothing to do with it? Are these the kinds of favors your personal attorneys do for you?

You can't be serious.
Topic's author
#165
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Yep, nothing illegal about demanding audits.
Correct, there is not. Unfortunately for your delusion, calling up the secretary of state and telling him to "find" one more vote than you lost by is not "demanding an audit".

Not a very effective tactic if there was no credible fear he could carry through.
The effectiveness of the tactic is irrelevant to whether it is illegal. But to the point of effectiveness, every single person who has been the subject of Trump's public attacks can tell you about the death threats they receive daily. Anyone in their right mind would consider that pretty effective.

Second and more importantly, they didn't say it was Russian disinformation, they said it has all of the hallmarks of Russian disinformation. Those are two completely different things. 
So do you have a straight face when you type these things?
Do you? Or do I need to explain to you again basic English, comminution, and logic?

Do you understand the difference between "be cautious before accepting X as factual, and here's why", and "X is false"?

The person who recorded it was not in Georgia. Google it.
Sure.

"While there were rumors about a possible lawsuit against Raffensperger for recording the conversation without Trump's consent, the telephone call recording laws for both locations where this conversation was held, namely the state of Georgia and District of Columbia, only require "one-party consent", meaning any participant of a phone call can legally record it without another party's consent.[56][57][58]"
#166
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Can anyone explain to GP Colvin the difference between an investigation and a conviction?

dot dot dot
#167
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@Double_R
like the precise repayments from Trump to Cohen,
Not a campaign violation. Trump is free to spend his own money whenever he wants to.
#168
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Not a campaign violation. Trump is free to spend his own money whenever he wants to.
Wrong again. If you spend money on your campaign you have to report it to the FEC. But in this case, David Pecker and Michael Cohen made the financial contributions to Trump's campaign and Trump was part of that conspiracy. He conspired with them to make the contributions. Do you know what a conspiracy is?
Pecker got immunity in exchange for his cooperation. Cohen was convicted and went to jail. 

When people engage in a conspiracy to commit a crime it becomes a more serious violation of the law. Because organized crime is a threat to society.

Topic's author
#169
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so, yeah

not even slightly "irrelevant"
You asked me whether anyone did surveys to tell if the Stormy Daniels story would have made a difference.

So yeah, entirely irrelevant.

so they had to invent a FELONY


which is the "conspiracy to defraud the american voter"


which is obviously complete bullshit
How? That's exactly what they did.

I have no opinion and have made no argument regarding the illegality of Trump's actions. The legal theory here is complicated and ambiguous. What's not is the fact that this whole thing was clearly wrong. He did falsify business records, he did so to conceal information from the voters, and it very well could have changed enough minds to alter the results.

If you want to debate the legality of this have at it, I just find that conversation mostly useless here where no one actually gives a shit. We're only paying attention to this because this man may very well be our next president and because half the country has accepted him as their cult leader. Whether lawmakers in NY had the imagination to cover this in their crafting of the law is just pure distraction.
Topic's author
#170
Double_R
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@Greyparrot
like the precise repayments from Trump to Cohen,
Not a campaign violation. Trump is free to spend his own money whenever he wants to.
This is yet another example of normal basic everyday ideas suddenly becoming unrecognizable to MAGA cultists.

If I give my boy "Fresh" $10k to blow at the casino cause I got it like that, that's me spending my own money on whatever I want. If I hand him that $10k to kill someone, that's me taking part in a murder.

What you intended to get in return for your money determines whether it is a crime and how serious that crime was.
#171
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There are no murder investigations without a body. Perhaps a missing person investigation, but murder? No.
-some unoriginal and confused poster..

#172
IwantRooseveltagain
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yes, go back to your security blanket - the repeat tactic. Lol 

I believe you have been reprimanded for that in the past. Reported! #163 repeated. SPAM

#173
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There are no murder investigations without a body. Perhaps a missing person investigation, but murder? No.
-some unoriginal and confused (and previously banned) poster..


#174
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Maybe you can be like Orangemanbad and get double impeached?
#175
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@Double_R
Yep, nothing illegal about demanding audits.
Correct, there is not. Unfortunately for your delusion, calling up the secretary of state and telling him to "find" one more vote than you lost by is not "demanding an audit".
Demanding an audit and then pointing out that you only need to find one more than the purported margin to change the outcome is.


Not a very effective tactic if there was no credible fear he could carry through.
The effectiveness of the tactic is irrelevant to whether it is illegal.
It's illegal to point out things that are illegal? I'd say that's a novel theory but we're rewriting history to get Trump so you'd just ignore it.


The person who recorded it was not in Georgia. Google it.
Sure.

"While there were rumors about a possible lawsuit against Raffensperger for recording the conversation without Trump's consent, the telephone call recording laws for both locations where this conversation was held, namely the state of Georgia and District of Columbia, only require "one-party consent", meaning any participant of a phone call can legally record it without another party's consent.[56][57][58]"
Google harder.
#176
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@Double_R
The legal theory here is complicated and ambiguous. What's not is the fact that this whole thing was clearly wrong.
...
Whether lawmakers in NY had the imagination to cover this in their crafting of the law is just pure distraction.
You don't care that they are trying to imprison a man for an invented felony because you're just so sure it's wrong.

It's pure distraction to point out there is no broken law...

So uh.... you're the "rule of law" guy here? You're the one whose mind remains untwisted by cult-thinking?
#177
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@Greyparrot
Don't look now, but IWRA has a theory about a conspiracy!

Do you know what a person who has theories about conspiracies is?
#178
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I am still astounded by his "murder" gaffe. Even Biden cringes at that one.
#179
IwantRooseveltagain
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 MAGA MORONS cling to each other. There’s strength in numbers, even for stupid liars.
#180
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Yawn, unoriginal insults.

no body required to solve this one Danno.